BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read
BMW M2 Forum > BMW M2 Competition Model > Drag race: BMW M2 Competition vs BMW M2 vs Alfa Romeo 4C vs Lotus Exige 350 Sport

Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      11-30-2018, 06:44 PM   #1
ChrisK
Major General
ChrisK's Avatar
United_States
3088
Rep
6,844
Posts

Drives: '19 M2C
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Chicagoland (West)

iTrader: (6)

Garage List
2015 BMW X1  [0.00]
2017 BMW M2  [0.00]
2015 Porsche Macan S  [0.00]
Drag race: BMW M2 Competition vs BMW M2 vs Alfa Romeo 4C vs Lotus Exige 350 Sport

BIMMERPOST
     Featured on BIMMERPOST.com
Drag race: BMW M2 Competition vs BMW M2 vs Alfa Romeo 4C vs Lotus Exige 350 Sport

__________________
www.ReTuneTheDeTune.com
2019 M2 Competition (Sunset Orange)
Appreciate 14
      11-30-2018, 07:05 PM   #2
Poochie
Luxury at the redline :)
Poochie's Avatar
United_States
1263
Rep
1,516
Posts

Drives: 2016 M2
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: NYC

iTrader: (1)

The M2C is faster, big surprise there..

Seriously, it is, you can actually see the extra power propelling the car forward..

But take into consideration it's manual vs a DCT, for what that's worth..

Great test video, confirms that there are very few street vehicles that could keep up with the M2C..
Appreciate 0
      11-30-2018, 07:09 PM   #3
cntzl
Brigadier General
cntzl's Avatar
United_States
3624
Rep
3,081
Posts

Drives: 2019 M2C 6MT
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: San Mateo, CA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Poochie View Post
The M2C is faster, big surprise there..

Seriously, it is, you can actually see the extra power propelling the car forward..

But take into consideration it's manual vs a DCT, for what that's worth..

Great test video, confirms that there are very few street vehicles that could keep up with the M2C..
There were 2 OG M2s in the video (DCT and MT) and an M2C (DCT I believe). So it was apples to apples (DCT vs DCT) IMO :
Appreciate 1
HS_M2C111.50

      11-30-2018, 07:17 PM   #4
Poochie
Luxury at the redline :)
Poochie's Avatar
United_States
1263
Rep
1,516
Posts

Drives: 2016 M2
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: NYC

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by cntzl View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Poochie View Post
The M2C is faster, big surprise there..

Seriously, it is, you can actually see the extra power propelling the car forward..

But take into consideration it's manual vs a DCT, for what that's worth..

Great test video, confirms that there are very few street vehicles that could keep up with the M2C..
There were 2 OG M2s in the video (DCT and MT) and an M2C (DCT I believe). So it was apples to apples (DCT vs DCT) IMO :
I guess another manual M2C wasn't in the budget or available..

But logic would dictate that it would be right above the DCT M2, maybe even neck and neck..

A manual can't shift and modulate power as fast as the computer can.. But I still would take the manual.. #Compromises
Appreciate 2
HS_M2C111.50
Brake_Late1252.00

      11-30-2018, 07:21 PM   #5
Protatomonster
First Lieutenant
184
Rep
391
Posts

Drives: Kia Stinger 2018
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Orlando FL

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Poochie View Post
I guess another manual wasn't in the budget or available..

But logic would dictate that it would be right above the DCT M2, maybe even neck and neck..

A manual can't shift and modulate power as fast as the computer can.. But I still would take the manual.. #Compromises
Agreed, I went with the manual transmission but I'm 22 I don't wanna never own a manual transmission, I've had a Corvette Manual but that was a shared vehicle I went half and half with my father on since it was both of ours first real sports car. Having owned a Dodge Charger and the Kia Stinger 3.3TT they both were automatics and I'm itching to shift manually!
Appreciate 3
HS_M2C111.50
tetsuo111685.00
kamek197.00

      11-30-2018, 07:50 PM   #6
chris719
Colonel
1305
Rep
2,016
Posts

Drives: '08 M Roadster
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: NJ

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Poochie View Post
The M2C is faster, big surprise there..

Seriously, it is, you can actually see the extra power propelling the car forward..

But take into consideration it's manual vs a DCT, for what that's worth..

Great test video, confirms that there are very few street vehicles that could keep up with the M2C..
It lost to an Alfa 4C. There are plenty of street cars that can keep up. Like every single new Mustang GT and Camaro SS. Just sayin.
Appreciate 5
Robin_NL4018.00
tetsuo111685.00
rjdnyy224946.50
mcc3456253.50

      11-30-2018, 07:55 PM   #7
Protatomonster
First Lieutenant
184
Rep
391
Posts

Drives: Kia Stinger 2018
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Orlando FL

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by chris719 View Post
It lost to an Alfa 4C. There are plenty of street cars that can keep up. Like every single new Mustang GT and Camaro SS. Just sayin.
Yeah tons of cars will beat it on the street in the price range especially straight line, it's the track that cars in the same price range will have a harder time, camaro and a few others can do it.
Appreciate 0
      11-30-2018, 08:14 PM   #8
Poochie
Luxury at the redline :)
Poochie's Avatar
United_States
1263
Rep
1,516
Posts

Drives: 2016 M2
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: NYC

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by chris719 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Poochie View Post
The M2C is faster, big surprise there..

Seriously, it is, you can actually see the extra power propelling the car forward..

But take into consideration it's manual vs a DCT, for what that's worth..

Great test video, confirms that there are very few street vehicles that could keep up with the M2C..
It lost to an Alfa 4C. There are plenty of street cars that can keep up. Like every single new Mustang GT and Camaro SS. Just sayin.
You have to look at the big picture; you're getting a German engineered M vehicle, that can efficiently and comfortable get up to 60mph in 4 seconds and stop the action just as quick..

I'll take that anyday over a Chevy or Ford..

Folks that work on those American-made vehicle reveal that they are made with plastic, cheap, throwaway parts and the engineering as not as thought-of as their German counterparts.. Yes, they can haul ass due to their gas-guzzling, larger displacement motor.. If they weren't fast, what would they be?

Or the Alfa with its limited dealer network and niche acceptance the US, I wouldn't exactly classify those an average street car..

When is last time you seen an Alfa in the 'hood?
Appreciate 3
      11-30-2018, 08:23 PM   #9
OGM2C
Private
OGM2C's Avatar
146
Rep
75
Posts

Drives: '19 M2C
Join Date: Sep 2018
Location: WA

iTrader: (0)

__________________
'19 BMW M2 Competition | BSM | DCT | Exec Pack | GC Camber Plates | Acexxon Reflectors
'15 Nissan GT-R Premium | FBO 650hp/600tq
Appreciate 0
      11-30-2018, 08:36 PM   #10
Karmic Man
Captain
Karmic Man's Avatar
Australia
720
Rep
883
Posts

Drives: M2C (Pending delivery)
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: World

iTrader: (0)

That 4C is modded…

A standard 4C does the quarter mile in around 12.8 which is around the same time as a standard 6MT M2

Here you can see it keeps on pulling...

The M2C is faster than I thought against the M2...can really see the S55 hauling the car forward
Appreciate 1
Davil910.50

      11-30-2018, 08:52 PM   #11
Karmic Man
Captain
Karmic Man's Avatar
Australia
720
Rep
883
Posts

Drives: M2C (Pending delivery)
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: World

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Poochie View Post
I guess another manual M2C wasn't in the budget or available..

But logic would dictate that it would be right above the DCT M2, maybe even neck and neck..

A manual can't shift and modulate power as fast as the computer can.. But I still would take the manual.. #Compromises
In the video the M2 6MT beat the M2 DCT (Race 1 by a clear margin and Race 2 by half a neck)...it all comes down to the driver really between 6MT and DCT
Appreciate 0
      11-30-2018, 09:24 PM   #12
D22M2
Second Lieutenant
282
Rep
284
Posts

Drives: 2017 m2
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: Dublin , CA

iTrader: (0)

Thought M2c wouldve been a lot faster that - for sure faster than the OGM2 but not by much (bummed)

That 4c is a bad ass...I don’t like the looks though
Appreciate 0
      11-30-2018, 09:36 PM   #13
mikeahso
Private
New Zealand
284
Rep
75
Posts

Drives: various
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: New Zealand

iTrader: (0)

Light year difference in reaction times from the M2 drivers.

For the M2C to reign that in and then pull away says a lot about the difference between OG and M2C
Appreciate 6
ChrisK3088.00
cntzl3623.50
Davil910.50
Robin_NL4018.00

      11-30-2018, 09:36 PM   #14
JustinHEMI
Private
United_States
66
Rep
58
Posts

Drives: M2 Comp TBD
Join Date: Apr 2016
Location: Pittsburgh

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Poochie View Post
You have to look at the big picture; you're getting a German engineered M vehicle, that can efficiently and comfortable get up to 60mph in 4 seconds and stop the action just as quick..

I take that any day over a Chevy or Ford.. Folks that work on those American-made vehicle reveal that they are made with plastic, cheap, throwaway parts and the engineering as not as thought-of as their German counterparts.. Yes, they can haul ass due to their gas-guzzling, larger displacement motor.. If they weren't fast, what would they be?

Or the Alfa with its limited dealer network and niche acceptance the US, I wouldn't exactly classify those an average street car..

When is last time you seen an Alfa in the 'hood?

Which is why I'm going from the one on the right to one like on the left.

Appreciate 3
Poochie1263.00

      11-30-2018, 09:36 PM   #15
ChrisK
Major General
ChrisK's Avatar
United_States
3088
Rep
6,844
Posts

Drives: '19 M2C
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Chicagoland (West)

iTrader: (6)

Garage List
2015 BMW X1  [0.00]
2017 BMW M2  [0.00]
2015 Porsche Macan S  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by D22M2 View Post
Thought M2c wouldve been a lot faster that - for sure faster than the OGM2 but not by much (bummed)

That 4c is a bad ass...I don't like the looks though
The M2C has more top end. It would continue to pull away.

Bottom line, the M2 is a fast car. Let's not take 4s cars for granted. Both the M2 and M2C are frickin brilliantly engineered cars.
__________________
www.ReTuneTheDeTune.com
2019 M2 Competition (Sunset Orange)
Appreciate 2
Robin_NL4018.00

      12-01-2018, 05:51 AM   #16
as7920
Colonel
as7920's Avatar
United Kingdom
307
Rep
2,118
Posts

Drives: MG M2 LCI DCT
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: UK

iTrader: (0)

Boy did that Lambo Performante sound awesome.
Appreciate 0
      12-01-2018, 07:12 AM   #17
fusionchicken
Captain
155
Rep
765
Posts

Drives: C6 Z06, Z4M Roadster
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: socal

iTrader: (0)

To really observe the difference in acceleration among the 3 M2s in the video they should have also included a rolling start race so the cars and do the work (I believe another YouTube channel with a bunch of drag races always include standing and rolling start races)

From a launch driver skills and reaction time play too much of a factor. Regardless it's clear the M2C is significantly quicker
Appreciate 1
Robin_NL4018.00

      12-01-2018, 07:38 AM   #18
CSBM5
Lieutenant Colonel
CSBM5's Avatar
979
Rep
1,924
Posts

Drives: 2019 M2 Comp, 2011 M3, etc
Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Raleigh, NC

iTrader: (1)

Quote:
Originally Posted by fusionchicken View Post
To really observe the difference in acceleration among the 3 M2s in the video they should have also included a rolling start race so the cars and do the work (I believe another YouTube channel with a bunch of drag races always include standing and rolling start races)

From a launch driver skills and reaction time play too much of a factor. Regardless it's clear the M2C is significantly quicker
That's the problem with all these "races." Basic physics. Trying to launch a car at exactly the same time and get a perfect hookup on both cars (or three at a time) is extremely difficult for 99% of drivers. Now put them on a strip and put pro-level drag racers behind the wheels, and we'll get some consistency going. Just look at the first couple of races where the blue M2 launches way ahead of the other two cars. These aren't actual races of the cars as much as examples of the driver's abilities to launch on time (not too early, not too late) and being able to hook hard off the line.

The same thing happens in roll-on comparisons. For whatever reason (well, it's a standard human bias actually), the majority of people don't understand time versus distance versus velocity when they see it in action. They let their eyes fool them into what they think is obvious but in fact 100% false.

Take two absolutely identical cars, with everything exactly identical and driven absolutely identically. Put them in a roll-on battle. The driver in car A hits the throttle 0.2 seconds quicker than car B. Off they go. What happens? Car A will continually open up the gap between the two cars as they accelerate. Most watch and proclaim car A is "faster". I mean, LOOK! It continually increased the gap between itself and car B!! How can it not be faster?

Because it's not. They're identical and accelerating identically. The difference is the initial time gap to start the acceleration run. It's within typical human reaction time too. The cars will always be 0.2 seconds apart since they are accelerating identically but starting with a different initial condition.

By 60mph, car A will be 17.6' ahead of car B. By 120 mph, car A will be 32.2' ahead, and at 155mph car A will be 45.5' ahead. All in attendance will proclaim car A the "faster car" (even though they are absolutely identical).

The same thing happens on a track when even announcers proclaim how one car "pulls away" from the other behind it only to be "almost caught" in the next corner. These cars are likely near identical too and driven very well, so in fact there isn't any "faster car down the straights" but instead the car in front will *always* be on the throttle ahead of the 2nd one exiting the turn onto the straight. The identical cars doing identical laps times will *always* show the car in front "pulling away" from the car behind as velocity increases on a straight. Always...since they are doing exactly the same lap times, the time gap between them remains constant, so the distance between them will always vary as a function of velocity (assuming they are doing exactly the speed at every point in their lap time, i.e. perfectly identical cars/drivers). The net of it is that what needs to be evaluated is the time gap between the two cars, not the distance gap. Eyes see distance gap differences and trick the brain into making false conclusions.

Whew! Sorry for the brain dump here...two cups of coffee will do that.
__________________
Current Stable:
2019 F87 M2 Competition 6MT, LBB, slicktop, exec pkg
2011.5 E90 M3 6MT Silverstone II, slicktop, Dinan/Eibach, Apex 9.5/10.5x19 with PS4S
2006 E90 330i 6MT Electric Red, ZSP (M2C will replace this one )
2007 E91 328i Silver, slushbox, Eibach fr/E93 M3 rear sway bars, 219Ms
Appreciate 12
bri1042757.00
cptobvious1274.00
mikeahso283.50
Maggers36.50
Davil910.50
BlkSVT183.50
CanAutM38932.50
ewohar10.50

      12-01-2018, 10:22 AM   #19
cptobvious
Lieutenant
cptobvious's Avatar
United_States
1274
Rep
572
Posts

Drives: M2C HS DCT
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: San Diego, CA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by CSBM5 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by fusionchicken View Post
To really observe the difference in acceleration among the 3 M2s in the video they should have also included a rolling start race so the cars and do the work (I believe another YouTube channel with a bunch of drag races always include standing and rolling start races)

From a launch driver skills and reaction time play too much of a factor. Regardless it's clear the M2C is significantly quicker
That's the problem with all these "races." Basic physics. Trying to launch a car at exactly the same time and get a perfect hookup on both cars (or three at a time) is extremely difficult for 99% of drivers. Now put them on a strip and put pro-level drag racers behind the wheels, and we'll get some consistency going. Just look at the first couple of races where the blue M2 launches way ahead of the other two cars. These aren't actual races of the cars as much as examples of the driver's abilities to launch on time (not too early, not too late) and being able to hook hard off the line.

The same thing happens in roll-on comparisons. For whatever reason (well, it's a standard human bias actually), the majority of people don't understand time versus distance versus velocity when they see it in action. They let their eyes fool them into what they think is obvious but in fact 100% false.

Take two absolutely identical cars, with everything exactly identical and driven absolutely identically. Put them in a roll-on battle. The driver in car A hits the throttle 0.2 seconds quicker than car B. Off they go. What happens? Car A will continually open up the gap between the two cars as they accelerate. Most watch and proclaim car A is "faster". I mean, LOOK! It continually increased the gap between itself and car B!! How can it not be faster?

Because it's not. They're identical and accelerating identically. The difference is the initial time gap to start the acceleration run. It's within typical human reaction time too. The cars will always be 0.2 seconds apart since they are accelerating identically but starting with a different initial condition.

By 60mph, car A will be 17.6' ahead of car B. By 120 mph, car A will be 32.2' ahead, and at 155mph car A will be 45.5' ahead. All in attendance will proclaim car A the "faster car" (even though they are absolutely identical).

The same thing happens on a track when even announcers proclaim how one car "pulls away" from the other behind it only to be "almost caught" in the next corner. These cars are likely near identical too and driven very well, so in fact there isn't any "faster car down the straights" but instead the car in front will *always* be on the throttle ahead of the 2nd one exiting the turn onto the straight. The identical cars doing identical laps times will *always* show the car in front "pulling away" from the car behind as velocity increases on a straight. Always...since they are doing exactly the same lap times, the time gap between them remains constant, so the distance between them will always vary as a function of velocity (assuming they are doing exactly the speed at every point in their lap time, i.e. perfectly identical cars/drivers). The net of it is that what needs to be evaluated is the time gap between the two cars, not the distance gap. Eyes see distance gap differences and trick the brain into making false conclusions.

Whew! Sorry for the brain dump here...two cups of coffee will do that.
This is AWESOME. I was a physics major, and it never occurred to me that this is what was going on. The power of cognitive biases and illusions! But after your explanation, makes perfect sense!
Appreciate 4
bri1042757.00
CSBM5978.50
csbear827.50
ewohar10.50

      12-01-2018, 10:31 AM   #20
Stage IV
F8SE7EN
Stage IV's Avatar
United_States
2098
Rep
1,280
Posts

Drives: 2017 M2L
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Downingtown, PA

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2017 M2  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Karmic Man View Post
That 4C is modded…

A standard 4C does the quarter mile in around 12.8 which is around the same time as a standard 6MT M2

Here you can see it keeps on pulling...
Exactly, just looked up C&D 2015 review....13s @ 107....11s to 100. Slower than an OG M2.
__________________
'17 BSM 6MT M2|Fabspeed DP|DINAN P2|UUC SSK|7.5 lbs/hp|295/30 rears
Appreciate 0
      12-01-2018, 04:36 PM   #21
Poochie
Luxury at the redline :)
Poochie's Avatar
United_States
1263
Rep
1,516
Posts

Drives: 2016 M2
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: NYC

iTrader: (1)

You don't need a technical thesis to explain which car is faster..

The M2 has a more top-loaded tune which allows it to pull ahead of the M2C but it blows its load sooner and runs out of breath by the time the M2C starts pulling ahead, at full boost..

It doesn't matter who had the better launch, there is enough distance to accommodate for error and for each car to stretch their legs, showing who has the most endurance, i.e. faster..

As far as the Alfa C, it's 1,000 pounds lighter than the M2C and possible tune, so that explains its advantage on it pulling ahead.

I have a N55 motor and I know exactly when it runs out of breath due to its single turbo and lack of fuel supply..

The N55 is great motor but the S55 parallel turbo and dual fuel pump set up is always going to trump a single turbo. No race needed to confirm that..
Appreciate 0
      12-01-2018, 05:02 PM   #22
cntzl
Brigadier General
cntzl's Avatar
United_States
3624
Rep
3,081
Posts

Drives: 2019 M2C 6MT
Join Date: Mar 2015
Location: San Mateo, CA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Poochie View Post
You don't need a technical thesis to explain which car is faster..

The M2 has a more top-loaded tune which allows it to pull ahead of the M2C but it blows its load sooner and runs out of breath by the time the M2C starts pulling ahead, at full boost..

It doesn't matter who had the better launch, there is enough distance to accommodate for error and for each car to stretch their legs, showing who has the most endurance, i.e. faster..

As far as the Alfa C, it's 1,000 pounds lighter than the M2C and possible tune, so that explains its advantage on it pulling ahead.

I have a N55 motor and I know exactly when it runs out of breath due to its single turbo and lack of fuel supply..

The N55 is great motor but the S55 parallel turbo and dual fuel pump set up is always going to trump a single turbo. No race needed to confirm that..
Maybe I missed... In which part of the video exactly did the M2 pull ahead of M2C? Do you mean the start of first two races where both DCT M2 and DCT M2C drivers were sleeping and reacted decades later than the 6MT M2 driver?
Appreciate 3
Robin_NL4018.00
JeremyDFW293.00
chris7191305.00

Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:31 AM.




m2
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST