[BruceM]

Got it. Is BMW of Seattle still a Dinan dealer, do you know?

Never mind, it is. That one, and Strictly. Yes, I have the full Stage 4 kit on the car now...

[Saanen]

I am in California so with the new smog regulations being implemented this platform will be a challenge. With the Dinantronics Stage 4 my car should pass a smog check as the harness is very OEM in appearance and with the piggyback turned off they should not be able to "see it" as it is not on the ECU. Where as with the flash I would need to go to the dealer and pay to have it removed, have it smog checked and then go back to the dealer and pay again to have it re flashed.
Is this correct or is there another way we can run your Stage 2 flash in California and still pass our smog checks?
I really like the Dinantronics tune (I prefer its OEM, but more power feel, ie over the BM3 tune) and have been happy with the Dinan "Big Turbo" intercooler, intake set up...but I am bummed it is not easier to install and remove the new Stage 2 Flash.

[nioh_lbbm2]

Originally Posted by Saanen

I am in California so with the new smog regulations being implemented this platform will be a challenge. With the Dinantronics Stage 4 my car should pass a smog check as the harness is very OEM in appearance and with the piggyback turned off they should not be able to "see it" as it is not on the ECU. Where as with the flash I would need to go to the dealer and pay to have it removed, have it smog checked and then go back to the dealer and pay again to have it re flashed.
Is this correct or is there another way we can run your Stage 2 flash in California and still pass our smog checks?
I really like the Dinantronics tune (I prefer its OEM, but more power feel, ie over the BM3 tune) and have been happy with the Dinan "Big Turbo" intercooler, intake set up...but I am bummed it is not easier to install and remove the new Stage 2 Flash.

Dinan has long abandoned CARB compliance as a feature with their offerings. You can see that even their FMIC and intake aren't CARB compliance. Doubt they'll do anything for the ECU tune

[Dinan_Engineering]

Originally Posted by Saanen

I am in California so with the new smog regulations being implemented this platform will be a challenge. With the Dinantronics Stage 4 my car should pass a smog check as the harness is very OEM in appearance and with the piggyback turned off they should not be able to "see it" as it is not on the ECU. Where as with the flash I would need to go to the dealer and pay to have it removed, have it smog checked and then go back to the dealer and pay again to have it re flashed.
Is this correct or is there another way we can run your Stage 2 flash in California and still pass our smog checks?
I really like the Dinantronics tune (I prefer its OEM, but more power feel, ie over the BM3 tune) and have been happy with the Dinan "Big Turbo" intercooler, intake set up...but I am bummed it is not easier to install and remove the new Stage 2 Flash.

At present that is a pretty accurate assessment. Until the flash has a CARB EO tied to it you would be stuck with a less then ideal un-install/re-install process when it comes time for smog. The alternative, currently, is to not flash at all or go the DINANTRONICS route.

[Dinan_Engineering]

Originally Posted by nioh_lbbm2

Dinan has long abandoned CARB compliance as a feature with their offerings. You can see that even their FMIC and intake aren't CARB compliance. Doubt they'll do anything for the ECU tune

Couldn't be futher from the truth. As a whole, the Holley group, has invested a ridiculous amount of capital into emissions testing at our facilities. Across the group we have 4 dedicated emissions dyno cells (one being at our facility in AL). Every single product is subjected to our own internal emissions testing before it ever is released so we can ensure federal compliancy. This testing is then submitted along with our product applications to CARB for a CARB EO. Sometimes they require additional testing, sometimes they simply take our own. All this testing sucks from a marketing/sales standpoint simply becuase it delays possble releases but it is one of the most important items in our business model and to our investors. As an example we have had an intake stuck in testing for nearly 2 years as we try to get approvals for reasoning from CARB and tweaks to the design so it ran cleaner and passed this testing. Trust me when I say we would have loved to beat the rest of the market 2 years ago. Would have been great for the bank account but emissions are beyond important to the company. Probably moreso then ANY other aftermarket automotive group. Regardless, anything that emissions affected runs through our own testing and then over to CARB. The biggest problem is CARB is extrememly backed up so that process is becoming longer and longer before items are approved and receive an EO.

As far as the FMIC and CAI specifically... all of or FMIC's have an EO (M2 IC included). Intake manufacturers are all in the same boat when it comes to BMW and why you see NO ONE with an EO for an intake on a BMW that comes with a carbon filter trap. CARB simply doesn't have a test to test the effectiveness of that carbon trap so when it is removed with an aftermarket intake they can't test if its better or worse then stock. Hence no EO's... for anyone. We have been working with SEMA, CARB, and countless other entities on this very test/problem since 2013 but until a test is approved/authorized by CARB intakes are simply in CARB limbo. What I can say is that at least all the released Dinan intakes have passed our own internal emissions testing and thus comply with federal emissions laws.

[nioh_lbbm2]

Originally Posted by Dinan_Engineering

Couldn't be futher from the truth. As a whole, the Holley group, has invested a ridiculous amount of capital into emissions testing at our facilities. Across the group we have 4 dedicated emissions dyno cells (one being at our facility in AL). Every single product is subjected to our own internal emissions testing before it ever is released so we can ensure federal compliancy. This testing is then submitted along with our product applications to CARB for a CARB EO. Sometimes they require additional testing, sometimes they simply take our own. All this testing sucks from a marketing/sales standpoint simply becuase it delays possble releases but it is one of the most important items in our business model and to our investors. As an example we have had an intake stuck in testing for nearly 2 years as we try to get approvals for reasoning from CARB and tweaks to the design so it ran cleaner and passed this testing. Trust me when I say we would have loved to beat the rest of the market 2 years ago. Would have been great for the bank account but emissions are beyond important to the company. Probably moreso then ANY other aftermarket automotive group. Regardless, anything that emissions affected runs through our own testing and then over to CARB. The biggest problem is CARB is extrememly backed up so that process is becoming longer and longer before items are approved and receive an EO.

As far as the FMIC and CAI specifically... all of or FMIC's have an EO. Intake manufacturers are all in the same boat when it comes to BMW and why you see NO ONE with an EO for an intake on a BMW that comes with a carbon filter trap. CARB simply doesn't have a test to test the effectiveness of that carbon trap so when it is removed with an aftermarket intake they can't test if its better or worse then stock. Hence no EO's... for anyone. We have been working with SEMA, CARB, and countless other entities on this very test/problem since 2013 but until a test is approved/authorized by CARB intakes are simply in CARB limbo. What I can say is that at least all the released Dinan intakes have passed our own internal emissions testing and thus comply with federal emissions laws.

Be that as it may you guys currently have no offering that will pass California smog even if your products meet federal guidelines in metrics. If a Cali owner can't pass a visual it doesn't matter how much data you have to back up the claims if you aren't legally registered with the state. Sad state of affairs but it is what it is.

[Zeese]

Originally Posted by nioh_lbbm2

Be that as it may you guys currently have no offering that will pass California smog even if your products meet federal guidelines in metrics. If a Cali owner can't pass a visual it doesn't matter how much data you have to back up the claims if you aren't legally registered with the state. Sad state of affairs but it is what it is.

Installed ...

Intercooler
https://ww3.arb.ca.gov/msprog/afterm...o/d-176-51.pdf
Big Turbo
https://www.arb.ca.gov/sites/default...o/d-176-49.pdf


This? EO pending...
Tuning Box
https://www.dinancars.com/products/s.../D440-1649-ST4

[Dinan_Engineering]

Originally Posted by Zeese

Installed ...

Intercooler
https://ww3.arb.ca.gov/msprog/afterm...o/d-176-51.pdf
Big Turbo
https://www.arb.ca.gov/sites/default...o/d-176-49.pdf


This? EO pending...
Tuning Box
https://www.dinancars.com/products/s.../D440-1649-ST4

DINANTRONICS Elite is pending. Have an EO for an earlier application list prior to the M2 but the revised application list with all the years/models/stages of the OG DINANTRONICS Elite is still pending. Has been for a quite some time. Same goes for DINANTRONICS Sport.

The new flashes went a slightly different route then normal in an effort to see if a different path was more expedient (so far it does not appear to be) but they are in the overall process, albeit earlier in it, as well.

[E90convert]

Dinan_Engineering

How does the S1 flash perform for track use on an otherwise stock car? Is this power gain good for a flying lap then the heat from the added boost pulls all the gains out? Would Dinan recommend or require the intercooler for track use? Finally, any other modifications to improve reliability for track use with the S1 tune?

[Dinan_Engineering]

Originally Posted by E90convert

Dinan_Engineering

How does the S1 flash perform for track use on an otherwise stock car? Is this power gain good for a flying lap then the heat from the added boost pulls all the gains out? Would Dinan recommend or require the intercooler for track use? Finally, any other modifications to improve reliability for track use with the S1 tune?

For track duty you really want to add an intercooler. On an otherwise stock car it will be good for short stints but under prolonged load its going to heat up pretty quickly and will pull back power after a bit. Depending on course length a lap or 2 is likely all you would get out of it. With the intercooler that will be extended a fair amount.

As far as other power/engine modifications specifically -- charge pipes are never a bad idea if you plan to track often. Fuel pumps would be the other consideration and is quite honestly the biggest limitation of the N55 M2. Can be a bit expensive/labor intensive but well worth it if you plan to be at full tilit for extended periods. Outside of those things -- suspension, lots of glorious suspension to make any track day much more enjoyable. =)

[E90convert]

Originally Posted by Dinan_Engineering

For track duty you really want to add an intercooler. On an otherwise stock car it will be good for short stints but under prolonged load its going to heat up pretty quickly and will pull back power after a bit. Depending on course length a lap or 2 is likely all you would get out of it. With the intercooler that will be extended a fair amount.

As far as other power/engine modifications specifically -- charge pipes are never a bad idea if you plan to track often. Fuel pumps would be the other consideration and is quite honestly the biggest limitation of the N55 M2. Can be a bit expensive/labor intensive but well worth it if you plan to be at full tilit for extended periods. Outside of those things -- suspension, lots of glorious suspension to make any track day much more enjoyable. =)

Thanks for the quick response. I assume the Dinan intercooler and drop-in fuel pump upgrade is what you recommend? Is the drop-in fuel pump upgrade an actual upgraded pump? Or just the tee and hoses from the DIY kit pre installed? What about the fuel pump upgrade makes it non-compliant for emissions?

Lastly - do you have a recommended charge pipe? Thanks!

[Dinan_Engineering]

Originally Posted by E90convert

Thanks for the quick response. I assume the Dinan intercooler and drop-in fuel pump upgrade is what you recommend? Is the drop-in fuel pump upgrade an actual upgraded pump? Or just the tee and hoses from the DIY kit pre installed? What about the fuel pump upgrade makes it non-compliant for emissions?

Lastly - do you have a recommended charge pipe? Thanks!

Dinan intercooler would be preferred but anything would be an improvement. The Dinan fuel pump offered is the in tank LPFP which assists in alleviating issues with fuel pickup between the saddle tanks when under a half tank or so and commanding greater than stock power output. In a track environment you come across this fairly frequently but it only assists in those very specific circumstances. The difference between the 2 options is simply that the modification has been done for you with the full kit versus the DIY one. The pump itself is the same as factory. A HPFP is going to be a more universal upgrade in all situations. As far as emissions -- its just never been tested as its meant for "race" applications and the volume small so spending multiple thousands of dollars on emissions certifications just wasn't practical. Have no doubt it would pass an emissions test if it underwent one though.

No specific reccommendation on charge pipe. Anything is better then the OE plastic for extended abuse and better durability.