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      07-21-2018, 09:16 PM   #23
codylikerice
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Interesting discussion, I'm new to track driving, have only done one day so far in my M2, but really didn't go too hard while I learned the track.

Can I ask if most people use Traction(MDM) mode on track, what's the point of sport plus mode?

Assuming you want to have some of the stability controls still on (meaning prefer not to use DSC off), sounds like you guys say MDM is the way to go, sounds like you never use sport plus?
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      07-22-2018, 10:17 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by codylikerice View Post
Interesting discussion, I'm new to track driving, have only done one day so far in my M2, but really didn't go too hard while I learned the track.

Can I ask if most people use Traction(MDM) mode on track, what's the point of sport plus mode?

Assuming you want to have some of the stability controls still on (meaning prefer not to use DSC off), sounds like you guys say MDM is the way to go, sounds like you never use sport plus?
Sport+ is too jerky, MDM is much smoother and meant for track driving. Once you find the limits of the car, you’ll find it’s easy to drive with DSC off.
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      06-30-2019, 03:14 AM   #25
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Whats is Euro MDM code? Is it different from normal MDM?
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      07-02-2019, 04:05 AM   #26
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Anyone know if it's possible to somehow code the throttle mapping in Sport+ to make it same as Sport?

Taking the car on it's first track day in a couple of weeks, want MDM with Sport throttle. I normally drive Sport+ but tried Sport last couple of days and it's so much smoother, even the manual gear shifts are smoother. Traction/MDM won't be any good, aside from the weak throttle mapping it doesn't engage the extra cooling. At least for now I'm not interested in DSC off as I have the less intrusive M2C MDM via iStep update and I like the rev matching (I know )
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      07-02-2019, 08:37 AM   #27
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Originally Posted by David.m View Post
Anyone know if it's possible to somehow code the throttle mapping in Sport+ to make it same as Sport?

Taking the car on it's first track day in a couple of weeks, want MDM with Sport throttle. I normally drive Sport+ but tried Sport last couple of days and it's so much smoother, even the manual gear shifts are smoother. Traction/MDM won't be any good, aside from the weak throttle mapping it doesn't engage the extra cooling. At least for now I'm not interested in DSC off as I have the less intrusive M2C MDM via iStep update and I like the rev matching (I know )
Do the different drive modes really affect how the cooling system works?
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      07-02-2019, 02:54 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by Neutrino View Post
Do the different drive modes really affect how the cooling system works?
Well, in my experience it only makes a difference during daily driving on regular roads, where you don't push it to the limits. On a track, where you take it to the edge with full throttle accelerations it will be equally hot in all driving modes. There the main cooling factor is the ambient temperature since the fluid temps will go over the thermostats' limits anyway.
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      07-02-2019, 06:05 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by Tano View Post
Well, in my experience it only makes a difference during daily driving on regular roads, where you don't push it to the limits. On a track, where you take it to the edge with full throttle accelerations it will be equally hot in all driving modes. There the main cooling factor is the ambient temperature since the fluid temps will go over the thermostats' limits anyway.
Sorry but I'm still confused, are you are indeed confirming that the car's cooling system will behave differently based on the driving mode?

If yes what does it do? Spin up the coolant pump for more flow, open the thermostat earlier or something else?

The reason I'm confused is because I've not known any car to do that ...
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      07-02-2019, 06:10 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tano View Post
Well, in my experience it only makes a difference during daily driving on regular roads, where you don't push it to the limits. On a track, where you take it to the edge with full throttle accelerations it will be equally hot in all driving modes. There the main cooling factor is the ambient temperature since the fluid temps will go over the thermostats' limits anyway.
I haven't seen this before - do you know how each of the different modes affects the cooling? Since DSC off defaults to sport mode would there also be an effect with it off? Assuming like you said that on the track it wouldn't make a difference but definitely interesting to know.
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      07-02-2019, 06:11 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Neutrino View Post
Do the different drive modes really affect how the cooling system works?
Switching to Sport, Sport+ or DSC OFF modes activates additional oil/coolant cooling (I think the smaller radiators), normal driving it equates to roughly 25-30 deg C lower operating temp. I say roughly as I've rarely driven in either Comfort or Traction once oil is warm, from memory in those modes oil runs around 120C compared to 90C in Sport etc.

In light of what Tano is saying above it must also be that the additional cooling comes on at a pre-determined engine temp (which would be logical). I find sustained hard driving in Sport+ gets oil temp to 120C or more.

I would still like to somehow have Sport throttle with MDM

Edit: Worth knowing that staying in Comfort or Traction from a cold start will get oil to operating temp a lot quicker than going straight to Sport etc, I find roughly 30% less time to get oil up to 80-90C.

Last edited by David.m; 07-02-2019 at 06:21 PM..
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      07-03-2019, 04:01 AM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David.m View Post
Switching to Sport, Sport+ or DSC OFF modes activates additional oil/coolant cooling (I think the smaller radiators), normal driving it equates to roughly 25-30 deg C lower operating temp. I say roughly as I've rarely driven in either Comfort or Traction once oil is warm, from memory in those modes oil runs around 120C compared to 90C in Sport etc.

In light of what Tano is saying above it must also be that the additional cooling comes on at a pre-determined engine temp (which would be logical). I find sustained hard driving in Sport+ gets oil temp to 120C or more.

I would still like to somehow have Sport throttle with MDM

Edit: Worth knowing that staying in Comfort or Traction from a cold start will get oil to operating temp a lot quicker than going straight to Sport etc, I find roughly 30% less time to get oil up to 80-90C.
Thanks for the info.

If this is correct it means that BMW never intended MDM for track duty.
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      07-03-2019, 08:45 AM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Neutrino View Post
Thanks for the info.

If this is correct it means that BMW never intended MDM for track duty.
Yeah that's my question. Comfort and MDM modes definitely allow the engine to run hotter than the Sport settings, and that's the last thing you want on track. Unless the extra cooling kicks in on track at some point.
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      07-03-2019, 03:12 PM   #34
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Eventually it will kick in at a certain temp threshold.
Here is a good description about the cooling system.
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      07-03-2019, 05:14 PM   #35
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Had my oil change done today and asked the bmw tech about this. He said there is only one engine cooling mode and it is not affected by the driving mode chosen (Sport/+/MDM/DSC Off).

I also asked my tuning shop about this and they said that engine cooling may be impacted by oil viscosity. 0W 20 engine oil may not have the same cooling properties of a thicker or oil, such as 5W 40 for example.
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      07-03-2019, 07:40 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by landapanda View Post
Had my oil change done today and asked the bmw tech about this. He said there is only one engine cooling mode and it is not affected by the driving mode chosen (Sport/+/MDM/DSC Off).

I also asked my tuning shop about this and they said that engine cooling may be impacted by oil viscosity. 0W 20 engine oil may not have the same cooling properties of a thicker or oil, such as 5W 40 for example.
Your BMW tech doesn’t know what he’s talking about.

And, my oil temps dropped 10F by going from BMW oil to Motul 300V.
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      07-04-2019, 08:39 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZM2 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by landapanda View Post
Had my oil change done today and asked the bmw tech about this. He said there is only one engine cooling mode and it is not affected by the driving mode chosen (Sport/+/MDM/DSC Off).

I also asked my tuning shop about this and they said that engine cooling may be impacted by oil viscosity. 0W 20 engine oil may not have the same cooling properties of a thicker or oil, such as 5W 40 for example.
Your BMW tech doesn't know what he's talking about.

And, my oil temps dropped 10F by going from BMW oil to Motul 300V.
What!? Certified BMW tech doesn't know the ins and outs of engine cooling mechanism?! Blasphemy!
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      07-10-2019, 12:52 AM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by landapanda View Post
What!? Certified BMW tech doesn't know the ins and outs of engine cooling mechanism?! Blasphemy!
It's funny, but it's true. If you go for an easy drive in comfort, you'll notice the engine temps are a steady 230 vs. 200 in sport/sport+ (guesstimating the numbers here). The reason I've heard is that it's more efficient for the engine to be hotter. Obviously the downside is increased chance of knock (aka the ECU will pull timing).

Either way, on track the temps get pretty hot compared to street, so I'm not sure if any of the modes will behave any differently at those temperatures.
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      07-10-2019, 02:02 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eeyang92 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by landapanda View Post
What!? Certified BMW tech doesn't know the ins and outs of engine cooling mechanism?! Blasphemy!
It's funny, but it's true. If you go for an easy drive in comfort, you'll notice the engine temps are a steady 230 vs. 200 in sport/sport+ (guesstimating the numbers here). The reason I've heard is that it's more efficient for the engine to be hotter. Obviously the downside is increased chance of knock (aka the ECU will pull timing).

Either way, on track the temps get pretty hot compared to street, so I'm not sure if any of the modes will behave any differently at those temperatures.
Will check this out. Have not noticed this behavior yet...
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      07-14-2019, 07:13 AM   #40
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Tried this today. Both in town and on freeway. NO hard driving.



Hovering roughly around 105 degrees celsius in these two modes:

- Comfort
- MDM/Traction



Hovering roughly around 80 degrees celsius in these three modes:

- Sport
- Sport+
- DSC off
(and incidentally aggressive throttle mapping on all these three... duh!)



When on track the cooling systems will, as already been said, probably be working full time anyway in all modes so the difference should be small/smaller. But I'm very very curious to know what the differences are, if any, on track in MDM/Traction compared to DSC off!
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      07-15-2019, 07:46 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MagnusT View Post
Tried this today. Both in town and on freeway. NO hard driving.



Hovering roughly around 105 degrees celsius in these two modes:

- Comfort
- MDM/Traction



Hovering roughly around 80 degrees celsius in these three modes:

- Sport
- Sport+
- DSC off
(and incidentally aggressive throttle mapping on all these three... duh!)



When on track the cooling systems will, as already been said, probably be working full time anyway in all modes so the difference should be small/smaller. But I'm very very curious to know what the differences are, if any, on track in MDM/Traction compared to DSC off!
You are right, there is a difference. Took these
Pics on the way to the track. The modes are coded on the pictures. Temps were taken at approx 70 mph in 70F weather.

No code = Comfort
S = Sport
S= Sport +
T = MDM
M = DSC Off

So, Sport/Sport+/DSC off kept coolant temps lowest. Another interesting thing is that the coolant temps dropped 40-50 degrees F almost instantaneously when selecting one of the above modes. That effective cooling for ya.
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      07-16-2019, 05:06 PM   #42
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Fantastic info landapanda! Thanks for that.

(Off-topic, but will any old OBD bluetooth dongle be able to get that kind of data?
And what app did you use?)
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      07-24-2019, 08:51 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bosozoku View Post
Fantastic info landapanda! Thanks for that.

(Off-topic, but will any old OBD bluetooth dongle be able to get that kind of data?
And what app did you use?)
Any OBD reader will get you this data. I read this through the Track Addict app. Some hardware comes with their own apps, but those readers cost generally a bit more.
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      07-25-2019, 06:32 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tano View Post
Eventually it will kick in at a certain temp threshold.
Here is a good description about the cooling system.
Great info. Thanks!
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