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      06-21-2020, 05:36 AM   #89
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The new BMW M2 CS Racing is due to ride the first stage of the VLN Endurance at the Nürburgring on June 27th. It will be interesting to compare it with the M235 Cup and Cayman GT4 under the same conditions and on the same race track.
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      06-21-2020, 09:17 AM   #90
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Damn, haven't been here for a week and this

The 718 GT4 and CS weren't timed on the same day and by different drivers so I would take the ranking with a grain of salt.

Between the 2, personally I would recommend track rats to take the CS (C is even better for bang for the buck and leave the change for mods) as there are easily more things one can do to it to go faster without breaking the bank. Consumables are much cheaper as well.
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      06-21-2020, 09:42 AM   #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Davil View Post
That's because it is a racing car. Racing involves many laps. The CS is a road car that can do track days. I have never been to a track day where you do "dozens of laps" in a stint. Have you?
Some of the track event organizers here in the US do have open track days, lap all you want basically. Others have a 1h long session at the end of the day. So in fact I have driven dozens of laps at HPDE.
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      06-21-2020, 09:47 AM   #92
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Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow View Post
Glad to help

I don't understand why someone likes car X but spends time in the forum of car Y complaining about car Y. Rennlist is waiting for them with open arms!
Get your 4 cylinder 100k crap and go to Rennlist! It seems so simple

The best part is when you do actual racing at AER and every single one of the HPDE Porsche fanboys shows up in an M3... shouldn't they be driving a 986 Cayman or something? One of those magical dedicated sports cars?
You certainly don't see me doing AER with a Mustang or something.
After all the talk about 'Porsche would hold up better than M', then you go to a 8h endurance race and the Porsche guys are all running BMWs! How does that make sense exactly?

The real world is so hilariously different than all these Porsche apologist comments. In the real world, a 997 911 is a Class 4 car at AER, the same class as 1997 E36 M3s US-spec which were neutered by BMW.
With all respect due to the PCA, I don’t think they are the fastest boys around. They’re just the ones with the most money. At the Chin events there are some very fast drivers (in all sorts of cars, Camaros, Porsches, Corvettes, BMWs etc). These people run 2 seconds flat or less at VIR and I think that would translate to around the same time at WGI. I’ll report back after my July event there...
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      06-21-2020, 12:35 PM   #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Karmic Man View Post
Damn, haven't been here for a week and this

The 718 GT4 and CS weren't timed on the same day and by different drivers so I would take the ranking with a grain of salt.

Between the 2, personally I would recommend track rats to take the CS (C is even better for bang for the buck and leave the change for mods) as there are easily more things one can do to it to go faster without breaking the bank. Consumables are much cheaper as well.
Just watched the video for the first time on my TV. My impression is that there is a lot of headroom if one starts with a CS to make improvements, but folks would be better suited to start with the C if tracking more than DD. The CS clearly needs more front spring rate, however it's done with the adaptive suspension. But, this would likely compromise comfort.

Tracking more than DD

Buy a C 55k, lightweight wheels 7k, aero front/rear 4k, AP racing brakes 9k, front seats 2k. suspension 5k. 82k +12k carbon roof and hood 94k, no roll cage

Buy CS if DD more than tracking. Softer suspension, nicer interior, carbon bits to impress your friends, capable out of the box with no additions, 85k. + 16k for AP racing, new seats, suspension, 102k, no roll cage

CS racing 95k no use in street

In my opinion you can mod both to about the same point for similar price.

Does anyone really run their cars at 9/10 with no roll cage? As I became faster in HPDE events my mortality started becoming more of a concern. In stock form the C is already in territory that I'd want a cage if going full tilt at the limit of the cars capability. Sure the magazines do it, but with professional driver's very familiar with the tracks.

* My cost numbers above are my perceived estimates with parts and labor. Actual cost could be significantly higher or lower.
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      06-21-2020, 10:07 PM   #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by medphysdave View Post
Just watched the video for the first time on my TV. My impression is that there is a lot of headroom if one starts with a CS to make improvements, but folks would be better suited to start with the C if tracking more than DD. The CS clearly needs more front spring rate, however it's done with the adaptive suspension. But, this would likely compromise comfort.

Tracking more than DD

Buy a C 55k, lightweight wheels 7k, aero front/rear 4k, AP racing brakes 9k, front seats 2k. suspension 5k. 82k +12k carbon roof and hood 94k, no roll cage

Buy CS if DD more than tracking. Softer suspension, nicer interior, carbon bits to impress your friends, capable out of the box with no additions, 85k. + 16k for AP racing, new seats, suspension, 102k, no roll cage

CS racing 95k no use in street

In my opinion you can mod both to about the same point for similar price.

Does anyone really run their cars at 9/10 with no roll cage? As I became faster in HPDE events my mortality started becoming more of a concern. In stock form the C is already in territory that I'd want a cage if going full tilt at the limit of the cars capability. Sure the magazines do it, but with professional driver's very familiar with the tracks.

* My cost numbers above are my perceived estimates with parts and labor. Actual cost could be significantly higher or lower.
I would skip the AP racing brakes (the 400mm M BBK is good enough) and carbon roof on the C...saves tons

Just wider wheels front and rear, R compound tyres, front + rear aero, pads and KWV3 and it's already a weapon. Carbon bonnet if one still has spare change to throw around.
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      06-22-2020, 08:01 PM   #95
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Worth the watch since we all P-car fans.



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      06-22-2020, 08:57 PM   #96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by medphysdave View Post
Worth the watch since we all P-car fans.



Dave

Now I know why I enjoy reviving my beast out and living in 2nd and 3rd gears going 80 mph on open roads . . . more than I would going 150 mph on a track. 🤣🤣🤣

A little twitch and things went south pretty damn fast.

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      06-22-2020, 09:16 PM   #97
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ///AVM View Post
Dave

Now I know why I enjoy reviving my beast out and living in 2nd and 3rd gears going 80 mph on open roads . . . more than I would going 150 mph on a track. 🤣🤣🤣

A little twitch and things went south pretty damn fast.

///AVM
It was crazy! Thank god he was in an actual racecar. It actually seemed like a pretty gentle landing. Track days are fun, but these cars can get to speeds, that in my opinion, are too dangerous without a cage or at least a harness and proper seats.
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      06-23-2020, 09:01 AM   #98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by medphysdave View Post
It was crazy! Thank god he was in an actual racecar. It actually seemed like a pretty gentle landing. Track days are fun, but these cars can get to speeds, that in my opinion, are too dangerous without a cage or at least a harness and proper seats.
I don't even understand what happened there! He's maybe got the tiniest bit of off right hand steering fed in (.1 on the g meter) and then the car is just gone from under him. It also doesn't slow down worth a dang in the spin, usually you drop off speed a lot quicker ( I realize down hill there). Yeesh.

There's been discussion about the paper tiger nature of these cars. After the death of the customer and instructor out in vegas in the exotic - these cars get up to crazy speeds, and aren't really any higher for safety structure than a Civic - do you want to put a civic into the wall at 150?

Part the reason I want to retire my E36 in the next couple of years and build a caged up car etc shortly after. Thinking maybe a 135 or 335 that I go a bit nutso on.
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      06-23-2020, 10:05 AM   #99
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A Corvette overheated and dropped coolant.
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      06-23-2020, 10:14 AM   #100
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A Corvette overheated and dropped coolant.
Ahh... That'll do it. Also why I always run insurance for track days. I know enough to run within my limits, doesn't mean that something out of my control (like that) can't happen and end my car and my day badly. I look at it as another "consumables cost" for the day. If I'm going to eat hundreds in brakes and tires, another couple hundred in insurance is worth it.
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      06-23-2020, 02:18 PM   #101
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“At 1.54.8 minutes, he undercuts the lap time of the M2 Competition by 3.1 seconds”

am i the only one who's not impressed by the laptime at all? CS has ~40 more HP, and much stickier cup 2 tires. cup 2 tiers along would give 2-3 seconds on a 1:50 track easily.
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      06-24-2020, 07:56 AM   #102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow View Post
Don't worry too much though, eventually some of these Porsche lovers save up their banana peels by eating ramen noodles and finally afford a used GT3 and think it's God's gift to mankind. And I crush them at Watkins Glen.
For reference, this is the red (fastest) run group at PCA in a club which is so snobby that if you try to attend their track day with a BMW they tell you 'we are sorry but due to the high driving level of XXX club we are concerned you cannot keep up'. The only meaningful reason for the video posting is it's the fastest 991 GT3 we've run into. The rest get blown away like flies hitting a windshield.

Worth watching the video just for the glorious sound of that V8 hitting 8k RPM.
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      06-24-2020, 09:55 AM   #103
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After Hockenheim, a test at the Nürburgring is due out. The new July issue will most likely have a fast lap on M2 CS.
I hope so.
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      07-16-2020, 11:02 PM   #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seis-speed View Post
The video said the M2 CS as tested DCT with CCB = 3500 lbs

It weighed 94.7 lbs less than the M2 Competition.

Anyone know the weight savings with manual vs DCT on M2 Comp?
The M2C in lightest spec is 3417. That means no DCT, no sunroof. Executive package for some reason makes no difference in weight. Heaviest spec is around 3650 with every single mainstream factory opinion such as sunroof, dct, and exec package.
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