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      07-10-2017, 01:42 PM   #1
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M2 vs M4 vs 1M, also vs Porsche, need advise

I've been lurking around the forums to research about M cars. In my country, M cars are extremely limited, very expensive, and generally 60-100% higher than US MSRP. Please let me share my situation as this will actually be my first BMW and first M car if ever...

I'm choosing between a new M2, an almost new M4 with 1500 miles, and maybe an opportunity to buy a slightly used 1M. By the way, all M cars are generally very rare here so it's unlikely that the 1M will appreciate in value unlike elsewhere. Here are my pros and cons so far between the 3...

M2
+ almost all possible options included (Comfort Access, Park sensors + camera, Harman Kardon, etc)
+ as its in DCT, it can be an occasional city car and will be the most comfortable to use (I've live in a very congested country and even our weekend traffic is A LOT worse than weekdays in many other countries).
- I'm unsure if the M2 is sort of a compromised M car as interior seems more "ordinary"
- since it's brand new, for sure I will take a big hit when it's time to sell (depreciation alone will be enough to buy something like a mid sized sedan)

M4
+ Looks and feels quite premium even if it's a bare model
+ Price is almost same as the new M2 so might be best in terms of value
+ Most powerful on paper
- maybe a little bit too big?
- performance figures seems too close to M2
- bare model meaning it is in M/T (I lean towards DCT a bit but I don't mind an M/T), cloth/leather interior, no electric seats, basic sound system, but at least has the Adaptive M Suspension and in 19" rims

1M
+ classic M car and highly regarded around the world
+ I'm almost sure that I can sell with almost zero depreciation
- I actually like the exterior but interior feels very dated
- with the car's age, parts probably needs replacement soon especially due to our extreme hot weather conditions

I'm not looking for a daily driver as I have other cars for that purpose. But as this will be my first M car and I would like to keep it for a while, I want a BMW car that represents the best M "driver's car" in terms of feel and fun.
Something that will stay still be fun as the car ages that's why modern interior tech options, while appreciated, are not too necessary.

I'm tempted with the M4 mainly because while it's the most expensive, it seems the best value for money and mechanically most high tech. But I've been reading many good reviews on the M2 lately and with DCT and all the modern features in the package, it might be the most "practical". The 1M is sort of a 3rd choice for me as honestly speaking, I'm more attracted to it mainly due to its reputation as a collector's car.

For M2 owners who have driven an M4, would you say that M2 is actually more fun? My only complaint on the M2 interiors, while having most of the modern features, feels not premium enough.

By the way, I do have a purely weekend car, a Porsche 997 Turbo S which is a rocket ship to drive (although you can hardly hear the engine sound). I hope I do not offend anyone but to M owners who also have own Porsches, respectfully, would you say that the M cars represent more of a different feel? And in terms of driving pleasure, it is not a step down right?

Thank you very much for sharing in advance!


p.s. I'm reposting my inquiry in the M4 forums to hear M4 owners' point of view also

Last edited by jagged; 07-10-2017 at 02:19 PM.
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      07-10-2017, 02:20 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jagged View Post
I've been lurking around the forums to research about M cars. In my country, M cars are extremely limited, very expensive, and generally 60-100% higher than US MSRP. Please let me share my situation as this will actually be my first BMW and first M car if ever...

I'm choosing between a new M2, an almost new M4 with 1500 miles, and maybe an opportunity to buy a slightly used 1M. By the way, all M cars are generally very rare here so it's unlikely that the 1M will appreciate in value unlike elsewhere. Here are my pros and cons so far between the 3...

M2
+ almost all possible options included (Comfort Access, Park sensors + camera, Harman Kardon, etc)
+ as its in DCT, it can be an occasional city car and will be the most comfortable to use (I've live in a very congested country and even our weekend traffic is A LOT worse than weekdays in many other countries).
- I'm unsure if the M2 is sort of a compromised M car as interior seems more "ordinary"
- since it's brand new, for sure I will take a big hit when it's time to sell (depreciation alone will be enough to buy something like a mid sized sedan)

M4
+ Looks and feels quite premium even if it's a bare model
+ Price is almost same as the new M2 so might be best in terms of value
+ Most powerful on paper
- maybe a little bit too big? (my original dream car was the E46 M3)
- performance figures seems too close to M2
- bare model meaning it is in M/T (I lean towards DCT a bit but I don't mind an M/T), cloth/leather interior, no electric seats, basic sound system, but at least has the Adaptive M Suspension and in 19" rims

1M
+ classic M car and highly regarded around the world
+ I'm almost sure that I can sell with almost zero depreciation
- I actually like the exterior but interior feels very dated
- with the car's age, parts probably needs replacement soon especially due to our extreme hot weather conditions

I'm not looking for a daily driver as I have other cars for that purpose. But as this will be my first M car and I would like to keep it for a while, I want a BMW car that represents the best M "driver's car" in terms of feel and fun.
Something that will stay still be fun as the car ages that's why modern interior tech options, while appreciated, are not too necessary.

I'm tempted with the M4 mainly because while it's the most expensive, it seems the best value for money, most high tech, and represents M as a driver's car. But I've been reading many good reviews on the M2 lately and with DCT and all the modern features in the package, it might be the most "practical". The 1M is sort of a 3rd choice for me as honestly speaking, I'm more attracted to it mainly due to its reputation as a collector's car.

For M2 owners who have driven an M4, would you say that M2 is actually superior and more fun? Or if M4 manual vs M2 DCT, M2 will actually be the better performing (and versatile) choice?

By the way, I do have a purely weekend car, a Porsche 997 Turbo S which is a rocket ship to drive (although you can hardly hear the engine sound). I hope I do not offend anyone but to M owners who also have own Porsches, respectfully, would you say that the M cars represent more of a different feel? And in terms of driving pleasure, it is not a step down right?

Thank you very much for sharing in advance!


p.s. I'm reposting my inquiry in the M4 forums to hear M4 owners' point of view also
What is the purpose of this car if you already have a Porsche for a weekend car? A second weekend car? Just to have an M car? I don't understand how you intend to use this new car.
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      07-10-2017, 02:39 PM   #3
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Yes, my purpose is to have a second weekend car for variety. And also, yes, I would like to experience having an M car. My Porsche is a 997 which is sort of "old school" in steering feel so having a more modern one might be be nice too.
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      07-14-2017, 11:36 AM   #4
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I think you will find a modern M car to feel incredibly disconnected and lazy in comparison to your 997. That's a given.

As for the M4 vs M2 I can comment on this. I initially visited my local dealership convinced I'd leave with an M3. I took it for a test drive and was really taken aback by how much I disliked it. The size is very, very noticeable. Inputs are numb. And the noise is absolutely horrendous. In my case it actually legitimately gave me a headache in cruising state. I wasn't a fan of the way the motor built its power either.

Enter the M2, I didn't find it to be night and day different, but different enough that it overcame my gripes with the M3. I hate the ASD, but it is genuinely a better sounding car. Sound, to me, is pretty important. Furthermore I found all the inputs to be a little more responsive. In terms of ride feel, the smaller package is noticeable. Is it compromised by having less bespoke components? Not from a numbers perspective, but certainly from a "specialness" perspective. The lack of a CF roof, M mirrors, and M seats really is depressing and detracts from the uniqueness of the car. Depreciation will be the least out of any current M car IMO due to the long lead times and low volumes.

I don't think the 1M is worth the hype and the asking price for the out-of-warranty high mileage 1Ms are a little ridiculous. But I guess if resale is a metric, the 1M certainly has that.

FWIW in any case I still wouldn't go DCT. Just do leg day and you'll be fine in traffic
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      07-15-2017, 02:17 PM   #5
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      07-18-2017, 12:33 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stefan View Post
I think you will find a modern M car to feel incredibly disconnected and lazy in comparison to your 997. That's a given.

As for the M4 vs M2 I can comment on this. I initially visited my local dealership convinced I'd leave with an M3. I took it for a test drive and was really taken aback by how much I disliked it. The size is very, very noticeable. Inputs are numb. And the noise is absolutely horrendous. In my case it actually legitimately gave me a headache in cruising state. I wasn't a fan of the way the motor built its power either.

Enter the M2, I didn't find it to be night and day different, but different enough that it overcame my gripes with the M3. I hate the ASD, but it is genuinely a better sounding car. Sound, to me, is pretty important. Furthermore I found all the inputs to be a little more responsive. In terms of ride feel, the smaller package is noticeable. Is it compromised by having less bespoke components? Not from a numbers perspective, but certainly from a "specialness" perspective. The lack of a CF roof, M mirrors, and M seats really is depressing and detracts from the uniqueness of the car. Depreciation will be the least out of any current M car IMO due to the long lead times and low volumes.

I don't think the 1M is worth the hype and the asking price for the out-of-warranty high mileage 1Ms are a little ridiculous. But I guess if resale is a metric, the 1M certainly has that.

FWIW in any case I still wouldn't go DCT. Just do leg day and you'll be fine in traffic
Thanks for the feedback! Decided to get the slightly used M4 as I find it a bit more special plus it's in M/T. Hopefully, it will complement my 911 in PDK. It will actually be my first BMW and M car and excited to bring it home soon.
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      07-19-2017, 01:10 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jagged View Post
I've been lurking around the forums to research about M cars. In my country, M cars are extremely limited, very expensive, and generally 60-100% higher than US MSRP. Please let me share my situation as this will actually be my first BMW and first M car if ever...

I'm choosing between a new M2, an almost new M4 with 1500 miles, and maybe an opportunity to buy a slightly used 1M. By the way, all M cars are generally very rare here so it's unlikely that the 1M will appreciate in value unlike elsewhere. Here are my pros and cons so far between the 3...

M2
+ almost all possible options included (Comfort Access, Park sensors + camera, Harman Kardon, etc)
+ as its in DCT, it can be an occasional city car and will be the most comfortable to use (I've live in a very congested country and even our weekend traffic is A LOT worse than weekdays in many other countries).
- I'm unsure if the M2 is sort of a compromised M car as interior seems more "ordinary"
- since it's brand new, for sure I will take a big hit when it's time to sell (depreciation alone will be enough to buy something like a mid sized sedan)

M4
+ Looks and feels quite premium even if it's a bare model
+ Price is almost same as the new M2 so might be best in terms of value
+ Most powerful on paper
- maybe a little bit too big?
- performance figures seems too close to M2
- bare model meaning it is in M/T (I lean towards DCT a bit but I don't mind an M/T), cloth/leather interior, no electric seats, basic sound system, but at least has the Adaptive M Suspension and in 19" rims

1M
+ classic M car and highly regarded around the world
+ I'm almost sure that I can sell with almost zero depreciation
- I actually like the exterior but interior feels very dated
- with the car's age, parts probably needs replacement soon especially due to our extreme hot weather conditions

I'm not looking for a daily driver as I have other cars for that purpose. But as this will be my first M car and I would like to keep it for a while, I want a BMW car that represents the best M "driver's car" in terms of feel and fun.
Something that will stay still be fun as the car ages that's why modern interior tech options, while appreciated, are not too necessary.

I'm tempted with the M4 mainly because while it's the most expensive, it seems the best value for money and mechanically most high tech. But I've been reading many good reviews on the M2 lately and with DCT and all the modern features in the package, it might be the most "practical". The 1M is sort of a 3rd choice for me as honestly speaking, I'm more attracted to it mainly due to its reputation as a collector's car.

For M2 owners who have driven an M4, would you say that M2 is actually more fun? My only complaint on the M2 interiors, while having most of the modern features, feels not premium enough.

By the way, I do have a purely weekend car, a Porsche 997 Turbo S which is a rocket ship to drive (although you can hardly hear the engine sound). I hope I do not offend anyone but to M owners who also have own Porsches, respectfully, would you say that the M cars represent more of a different feel? And in terms of driving pleasure, it is not a step down right?

Thank you very much for sharing in advance!


p.s. I'm reposting my inquiry in the M4 forums to hear M4 owners' point of view also
Having owned a 997.2 GTS with PDK myself, I think you should have gone with the M2 with a 6MT as a nice contrast to your Turbo S.
Hopefully you enjoy the M4
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      07-20-2017, 06:34 AM   #8
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I've driven the M4 DCT and that thing is a beast when it comes to power compared with my 6MT M2. Both cars are fun in their own ways but overall the M2 is the better driver's car as it has the best balance out of all the M cars. (not sure compared to 1M)

The newer M4 with the LCI updates are quite nice especially the CS in the grey or purple color they have. However I still prefer the M2 as it's a better overall car vs the M4 is where it's highlight is their power on a straight line. As you mentioned you wanted a driver's car that has feel and fun. Then the M2 is the perfect car as less car means more fun.

One of the best reviews on the M2. Check out the link at 6:35 in.



Here is his 1M review


Here is his M4GTS review

Last edited by D CHOI; 07-20-2017 at 06:41 AM.
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      07-28-2017, 12:19 PM   #9
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I like the M2 looks but unfortunately, there aren't pre-owned deals on the M2 yet plus it's also not available in manual transmission where I'm from. M2 in manual would have been super nice!

So I was actually able to get an M4 in manual for considerably less than an M2 in DCT.

Thanks for the feedback!
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      07-28-2017, 01:50 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jagged View Post
I like the M2 looks but unfortunately, there aren't pre-owned deals on the M2 yet plus it's also not available in manual transmission where I'm from. M2 in manual would have been super nice!

So I was actually able to get an M4 in manual for considerably less than an M2 in DCT.

Thanks for the feedback!
Good call. MT or bust.
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      12-11-2018, 02:51 AM   #11
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Just found an old thread I started. Since then, I've had quite a number of cars.

The M4 didn't last long in my garage as I found the car too big (feels boaty) but the worst part was I couldn't really get comfy enough as the clutch reach was too deep for me (no good for vertically challenged people).

Interestingly, the M2C was recently launched and was being offered in the specs that I wanted which is in M/T but with most of the nice options available for the car model. Interestingly, it even costs slightly lower than the original M2.

I've only driven 500+ km on the M2C but what I can say for now is that it is what the M4 should have been in the first place. Even though M2C and M4 seems to weigh similar on paper, the M2C sure feels much more nimble and playful. The M2C's manual gearbox seems an improvement over the M4 as well although I'm unsure if BMW still invests in updating their manual gearbox since fewer buyers are choosing it nowadays.

The only thing that I miss on the old M4 was the HUD but it is just icing as driving dynamics is what I really look forward to.
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      12-29-2018, 11:58 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jagged View Post
Just found an old thread I started. Since then, I've had quite a number of cars.

The M4 didn't last long in my garage as I found the car too big (feels boaty) but the worst part was I couldn't really get comfy enough as the clutch reach was too deep for me (no good for vertically challenged people).

Interestingly, the M2C was recently launched and was being offered in the specs that I wanted which is in M/T but with most of the nice options available for the car model. Interestingly, it even costs slightly lower than the original M2.

I've only driven 500+ km on the M2C but what I can say for now is that it is what the M4 should have been in the first place. Even though M2C and M4 seems to weigh similar on paper, the M2C sure feels much more nimble and playful. The M2C's manual gearbox seems an improvement over the M4 as well although I'm unsure if BMW still invests in updating their manual gearbox since fewer buyers are choosing it nowadays.

The only thing that I miss on the old M4 was the HUD but it is just icing as driving dynamics is what I really look forward to.
Yea, the m2c is pretty perfect imo...as compared to the other bmw models. I wouldn't mind nicer leather, cf roof option, and HUD though. Maybe they did this on purpose to attract more sales on the next m2c?
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      12-30-2018, 07:07 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nomoracin View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by jagged View Post
Just found an old thread I started. Since then, I've had quite a number of cars.

The M4 didn't last long in my garage as I found the car too big (feels boaty) but the worst part was I couldn't really get comfy enough as the clutch reach was too deep for me (no good for vertically challenged people).

Interestingly, the M2C was recently launched and was being offered in the specs that I wanted which is in M/T but with most of the nice options available for the car model. Interestingly, it even costs slightly lower than the original M2.

I've only driven 500+ km on the M2C but what I can say for now is that it is what the M4 should have been in the first place. Even though M2C and M4 seems to weigh similar on paper, the M2C sure feels much more nimble and playful. The M2C's manual gearbox seems an improvement over the M4 as well although I'm unsure if BMW still invests in updating their manual gearbox since fewer buyers are choosing it nowadays.

The only thing that I miss on the old M4 was the HUD but it is just icing as driving dynamics is what I really look forward to.
Yea, the m2c is pretty perfect imo...as compared to the other bmw models. I wouldn't mind nicer leather, cf roof option, and HUD though. Maybe they did this on purpose to attract more sales on the next m2c?
My guess it was easier to swap out seats and from the M3/4 more so than changing the dash design to offer up HUD. The CF to me is due to money and maybe would also trigger some new crash tests?
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      12-31-2018, 08:18 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nomoracin View Post
Yea, the m2c is pretty perfect imo...as compared to the other bmw models. I wouldn't mind nicer leather, cf roof option, and HUD though. Maybe they did this on purpose to attract more sales on the next m2c?
BMW is very "German" about these things. They will not put anything on any 2 series that violates their feature hierarchy. If the next 2er gets a HUD, then it'll be offered on the M2.
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      01-02-2019, 06:10 PM   #15
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As I waited (...and waited...and waited...) for delivery, I thought about possible de-contenting and downgrading being irritating on the M2C to keep proper hierarchy in BMW's mind. But, after having driven mine for a ~week, I almost feel like the materials feel more "proper" given what I expect in a small, fun car with some correctly-placed rough edges. I like the bits of rawness much more than I thought I would.

After all, I don't feel like i can argue with any sense of integrity that "the car weighs too damn much" , and then on the other hand complain about leather quality, lack of very definitely luxury-oriented features and such. The level of content and detail feels about right for what I want and what the M2C is IMO
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      01-02-2019, 08:20 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jagged View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by stefan View Post
I think you will find a modern M car to feel incredibly disconnected and lazy in comparison to your 997. That's a given.

As for the M4 vs M2 I can comment on this. I initially visited my local dealership convinced I'd leave with an M3. I took it for a test drive and was really taken aback by how much I disliked it. The size is very, very noticeable. Inputs are numb. And the noise is absolutely horrendous. In my case it actually legitimately gave me a headache in cruising state. I wasn't a fan of the way the motor built its power either.

Enter the M2, I didn't find it to be night and day different, but different enough that it overcame my gripes with the M3. I hate the ASD, but it is genuinely a better sounding car. Sound, to me, is pretty important. Furthermore I found all the inputs to be a little more responsive. In terms of ride feel, the smaller package is noticeable. Is it compromised by having less bespoke components? Not from a numbers perspective, but certainly from a "specialness" perspective. The lack of a CF roof, M mirrors, and M seats really is depressing and detracts from the uniqueness of the car. Depreciation will be the least out of any current M car IMO due to the long lead times and low volumes.

I don't think the 1M is worth the hype and the asking price for the out-of-warranty high mileage 1Ms are a little ridiculous. But I guess if resale is a metric, the 1M certainly has that.

FWIW in any case I still wouldn't go DCT. Just do leg day and you'll be fine in traffic
Thanks for the feedback! Decided to get the slightly used M4 as I find it a bit more special plus it's in M/T. Hopefully, it will complement my 911 in PDK. It will actually be my first BMW and M car and excited to bring it home soon.
Hey congrats. It was a win win with whatever you were going to pick. I've never driven the M4 but I had a 1M and now have a 18 M2. I also owned a 09 M3. Only my M2 is Dct.

Seeing your post made me reflect on the 3 M cars I've had and to be honest I love them all but they're so different. So if I had to pick, I would pick all 3

Enjoy
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      01-11-2019, 08:48 AM   #17
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I've been deadset on the M4 w/Comp+Exec+Full Leather+6spd since about 1.5yrs ago, with most of the same pros as OP...better interior, better bang for your buck, etc etc. My only dilemma was lease vs buy at that point.

With the M2C that dropped last year, threw a whole wrench in the plans and was constantly flip-flopping between the two cars but am firm on buying.

I'm still up in the air but after reading through the comments in here, I'm very much leaning towards a M2C. I think I can live with the interior being "inferior" as long as the car is fun to drive (which every owner has raved about on here).

Cheers for this thread, OP pretty much typed out all the pros/cons for the M2 vs M4 for me.
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      01-21-2019, 12:58 PM   #18
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I honestly would lean toward a Cayman S/GTS or a nice used 911 if you need backseat space. If you want something larger, you need a sedan or maybe a Macan. The BMWs are all very nice cars, have great seating positions, but the Porsches are just a cut above IMO. I understand the differences aren't so stark so can see why there is a struggle making a decision.
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