09-20-2019, 06:06 PM | #67 | |
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So it was easiest for them to just throw the s55 in there and call it a day. |
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09-20-2019, 07:57 PM | #70 |
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09-20-2019, 08:32 PM | #71 | |
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09-20-2019, 08:59 PM | #72 |
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09-20-2019, 09:39 PM | #73 |
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They were going do always do the S55 but it was supposed to go in the CS only. Emissions messed up their plans and it was easier to just put the S55 in the base M2 so they did and called it the Competition while charging pennies for an upgrade that was supposed to cost tens of thousands. A gift for those who waited, never to happen again I am sure.
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09-20-2019, 11:21 PM | #74 | |||
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And actually, over here you were sitting on the front row witnessing how some things went back and forth via the M2 Competition development rumors thread (here). Quite symbolically, the thread was locked on the day of the M2 Competition press launch (Apr 17, 2018). It served no further purpose anymore from that day onwards. Digging up the past to check how was looked into the future back then: for an idea of how information leaks back in April 2017 showed a pattern: see below. With what we know by now (Sep 2019) you may recognize that plans have definitely taken a turn later on in 2017-2018. Engine output figures were already accurate back then and things got delayed: Quote:
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And as akkando suggested, the M2 Competition was/is a bargain. It was not supposed to happen that way. To owners who regret the M2 Competition exhaust sound (OPF): think again, because thanks to those EU regulations BMW surrendered and gave the CS goods away at an extraordinary competitive price. And so the forthcoming M2 CS (2020) will have one big 4-seater competitor: the M2 Competition, costing about 65% of the M2 CS price (price rumors range from €90K to €95K for Germany, which is 45% to 50% extra compared to the M2 Competition price).
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09-20-2019, 11:46 PM | #75 | |
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3450 vs 3600lbs in US trim with a manual transmission. Is that better? Not sure I follow your point on seats. I don’t race, but I do track my street M2 ~20 days per year. Harnesses make a big difference and can’t be run with the OE seats in the M2C due to the integrated headrest. One size fits some sounds like a downgrade from a more adjustable seat that can comfortably accommodate a range of driver sizes and builds, and not just "average" ones. I said the N55 sounds better than the S55. You said the S55 IS better than the N55. I think we’re stating different opinions. The OG M2 is a superior package, with minimal additional cost, as a dual duty street/track car, especially in the US. Sorry. Last edited by bentom2; 09-21-2019 at 12:05 AM.. |
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09-21-2019, 06:18 AM | #76 | |
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I guess "sound" means more to me than I thought... |
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09-21-2019, 06:45 AM | #77 |
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I think there are a couple things going on that have kind of been touched on. First, like the 1 Series M (BMW was careful not to call it and actual M car), the OG M2 is really just the entry level car with some upspecced M parts in it. While they both were fun to drive and great performers, they are honestly a bit of frankensteins for their respective day. The M2C now has an S coded engine, but of course BMW hobbled it a little so it wouldn’t have the same output as the M3/4. Which is why the M2CS is coming. And everyone knows the real M car is the M3 that started it all. All the reviews in the world that say the M2 is the real M3 doesn’t change the badge the factory put on it. So in some sense the M purists probably look at M2 owners as posers to some extent.
The other part of it is like the 911/Cayman comparison. When you say 911, everyone knows you have a Porsche, that’s all you have to say. They know what it looks like and that it’s an incredible car. If you say Cayman, half the time you have to then explain its a Porsche to some people. And others know if you had the money, you probably would have gotten the 911 instead of the Cayman. I own a 718 and love it but can tell you there’s even snobbery within the Cayman crowd saying the 718 is terrible due to going back to flat four. It doesn’t matter that my car outperforms all previous Cayman before it. |
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09-21-2019, 07:25 AM | #78 | |
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Is there something simple I'm missing? |
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09-21-2019, 10:48 AM | #80 | ||
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As to the exact science for what turns a regular series car into an M it's hard to go by anything but how the car feels, and how it performs. Often to make the car feel and perform more like true performance car suspension needs changing, the car needs to be lighter and weight balanced closer to 50/50, the seats need to hold the driver in place, the wheels and tires wider and the body needs to accommodate the larger size, the drive train needs to be able to put the power to the road, the transmission responsive, the brakes to hold up to repeated use, the cooling to allow the car consistent performance which might mean body updates to help keep air flowing to the right places, the engine will also need to be strong enough to be run hard regularly for extended lengths of time. I guess the short version is an M car needs to meet some minimum level of responsiveness to driver inputs for extended periods of time. Where the m2 starts to fall short to me is in the cooling department, because the intercooler heat soaks rather quickly resulting in a lot of power and engine feel to be lost when the needle approaches redline. Previous M cars have had their deficiencies too. For example the e9X m3 brakes are known to not be up to the task when driven hard for extended periods of time. |
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09-21-2019, 11:40 AM | #81 | ||
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M235i < OG M2 < M2C Not an M < Kind of an M < True M? |
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09-21-2019, 12:53 PM | #82 |
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09-21-2019, 01:24 PM | #83 |
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Great commercial.
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09-21-2019, 02:07 PM | #84 | |
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People have different things that turn them on. If you care about exclusivity and want extended Corinthian Leather to feel you have something special, the M2 will not do it for you. Then there are people that care more about the car itself. If you bought the M2 for affirmation from others it will be a tough road. The M2 is a great car, but it has a few things going against it. While being a great car it is just not that different from the M4. When I see one from far away, it takes some squinting to see if M3, M4, M5, M2, M2C, M2Cs, M2... It comes in auto and manual like all the other BMWs, it has iDrive like all other BMWs, it looks close and weighs pretty much what the current M3 weighs. So the delta between all current BMWs is just much narrower than when the 1M came out. It was drastically different than the M3 in 2011. It as only offered in manual, with fixed suspension, no sunroof, first production car with air curtains used by every other car today, it was quicker from a rolling start than the heavier M3 and it came with two turbos. Not tooting 1M horn, just trying to illustrate that it was radical, controversial departure from before. The M2 is more evolution and sizing of all current BMW offerings so while it is in my opinion the best M car today (to my old school boy racer ethos) it is kinda just one of many current overlapping BMW options. Appreciation is not always instantaneous too. I remember in 2011 I was going buy an E90 M3 before the 1M came out and many were blasting the 1M for having a normal motor....it was just a 135i with a tune. While I agonized the choice online I had to listen to the 135 crowd blast the 1M as just an overpriced 135 and from the M3 crowd saying that it's for people that can't afford an M3. For me the M3 was beautiful and V8 was amazing but it was too heavy, bloated, compromised. I wanted something purer and closer to the M cars I grew up loving. I made the difficult choice on my own because I valued the smaller, lighter, more nimble, manual only, slick-top only ethos of the 1M. I remember being at the Welt waiting for my car to be delivered. I watched a young BMW rep deliver several M cars including loaded M3s and expensive M cars for about an hour before my time came. Then I walked down the stairs as he opened the car door for me and he excitedly said in his German accent.... "This is the one I would get!" I looked at him puzzled after he just delivered a million dollars worth of M cars and I said to him chuckling, "is that part of the delivery script?" And he replied a little offended......"no, no, truly....this is the one I would get for me above all the other ones." It sounded sincere and it was comforting after wanting an M3 for many years and switching to 1M basically at the last minute. I get that validation is nice but I get the joy from the car not from validation. You are lucky to have a truly great M car... enjoy it! |
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09-21-2019, 02:52 PM | #85 | |
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(source: here - 16 Dec 2015 - interview with former BMW M boss Frank van Meel)
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09-21-2019, 04:05 PM | #86 | ||
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Driving fun.... period. Notice it's not a timed event, no Nürburgring Time, no radar gun, not beating another car or all the usual stuff just a dude and riotous car! As good as it gets for us small bmw owners. Thanks for posting Artemis. |
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09-21-2019, 05:09 PM | #88 |
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N55 engine is what I like. Sounds great, reliable and lighter. 1M and M2 use it, so I like it for what it is. M2C is a good car, I am sure. I Just like mine better. That's why I bough OG M2 instead of the M2C. If I want to spend 10k, 20k or 30k more, I will get a P car.
Debating about the definition of M is stupid. BMW labelled it a M2, so it's a M car. You can disrespect or disagree all you want. M2 is a M car. Period. M3 and M4 are too big a vehicle for my liking. I want a compact sport car with tons of fun driving it. M2 fits well. Very well.
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