[dmboone25]

Originally Posted by Dackelone

North of 370 Hp(maybe 380ish), so I am told.

Jesus - this thing is gonna be a rocket.

Weight savings planned as well I am assuming ??

EDIT - so perhaps ~100 KGs less then ??

[Dackelone]

Originally Posted by dmboone25

Jesus - this thing is gonna be a rocket.

Weight savings planned as well I am assuming ??

EDIT - so perhaps ~100 KGs less then ??

I would think more.

[bimmer4life24]

Originally Posted by dmboone25

Jesus - this thing is gonna be a rocket.

Weight savings planned as well I am assuming ??

EDIT - so perhaps ~100 KGs less then ??

Around 50lbs according to the F8x plan...thats not much

I feel BMW will work harder on this car to make it something special. I'm sure they will shed more than 50lbs...maybe around 100lbs

[MadMoose]

I just hope they keep the price in check. It's getting awfully close to m3/m4 pricing. Exciting stuff though it should be coming out in the timeframe I'm looking to buy

[dmboone25]

Originally Posted by Dackelone

I would think more.

That's 160 pounds! US curb weight is 3500...this would be in the 3350 or lower range...wow!

Originally Posted by bimmer4life24

Around 50lbs according to the F8x plan...thats not much

I feel BMW will work harder on this car to make it something special. I'm sure they will shed more than 50lbs...maybe around 100lbs

100 pounds versus KG is even less...I had said initially 100 KGs...the more they try, the more we all win.

[BMW269]

Another M without M engine. Typical BMW, they make their cars just good enough to sell. A shame, because the RS3 will have the most special/bespoke engine in this class.

[IZAGLO]

Originally Posted by Levi

Another M without M engine. Typical BMW, they make their cars just good enough to sell. A shame, because the RS3 will have the most special/bespoke engine in this class.

No problem there...Your just gonna have to buy the RS3.....with a paddle shifting auto. I'll take my M2 6/M/T at 370hp gladly...will be one more M2 for someone here....Maybe the N55 is not a M engine in your book but it will be tweaked for the M2..plenty fast...possibly BMW's fastest small coupe ever but mark my words the M2 when released will be BMW's finest "SMALL "enthusiast coupe. It will be a knockout. Enjoy your Audi.

[bradleyland]

Originally Posted by dmboone25

That's 160 pounds! US curb weight is 3500...this would be in the 3350 or lower range...wow!

A number around 3350 has been circulating for a while based on extrapolations from the weight savings in the F8x M program. I think it's a good guess.

[dmboone25]

Originally Posted by bradleyland

A number around 3350 has been circulating for a while based on extrapolations from the weight savings in the F8x M program. I think it's a good guess.

I am just imagining my car with 150 less pounds...40 or so more BHP...roughly the same amount of additional torque...wider rubber and hips...better suspension...better brakes...holy mother of god it will be good...

[DC52E55]

Originally Posted by dmboone25

I am just imagining my car with 150 less pounds...40 or so more BHP...roughly the same amount of additional torque...wider rubber and hips...better suspension...better brakes...holy mother of god it will be good...

I just can't wait for this new M2. can't come soon enough.

[IEDEI]

Originally Posted by Levi

Another M without M engine. Typical BMW, they make their cars just good enough to sell. A shame, because the RS3 will have the most special/bespoke engine in this class.

oh you mean the RS3 engine that's shared with the TT-RS and RSQ3 and is soon heading for the next A5/S5 as well?

who cares.....the 1M was sensational and the M2 will be sensational too....you don't need a 'bespoke' engine to make a great car.

[IS3andME]

Originally Posted by IEDEI

oh you mean the RS3 engine that's shared with the TT-RS and RSQ3 and is soon heading for the next A5/S5 as well?

who cares.....the 1M was sensational and the M2 will be sensational too....you don't need a 'bespoke' engine to make a great car.

Quite true, you don't need one. But, the question is, does it seem like the M faithful are accepting that they will not get a "bespoked" engine? Like if mcDonald's changed the Big Mac or fish sandwich for the worse, and said "you are going to like it!", but they counted on people ACCEPTING it, because some view that they have no other choice, and because they know people are easily tricked into accepting things.
BMW knows that there will be a few complaints, but like local drug dealer, they know that those and others will come back for more. Just to say or be associated with the M Division.
Would be nice to see M Division do their magic on a turbo 4, say 380 hp, just to best Mercedes.

Out of the three Germans, it seems that Mercedes tends to have the more "bespoked" engines...and they sound better as well.

[element241]

Originally Posted by IS3andME

Quite true, you don't need one. But, the question is, does it seem like the M faithful are accepting that they will not get a "bespoked" engine? Like if mcDonald's changed the Big Mac or fish sandwich for the worse, and said "you are going to like it!", but they counted on people ACCEPTING it, because some view that they have no other choice, and because they know people are easily tricked into accepting things.
BMW knows that there will be a few complaints, but like local drug dealer, they know that those and others will come back for more. Just to say or be associated with the M Division.
Would be nice to see M Division do their magic on a turbo 4, say 380 hp, just to best Mercedes.

Out of the three Germans, it seems that Mercedes tends to have the more "bespoked" engines...and they sound better as well.

I don't understand the McDonald's analogy. BMW isn't taking an existing product and making it worse. They're just using some of the same parts to make a new product (assuming the tuned N55 rumor is true).

As for me, I don't care about bespoke engines. The M2 can share an engine with any other car; I just want it to be properly balanced in all aspects and incredibly fun to drive around a track.

[IS3andME]

Originally Posted by element241

I don't understand the McDonald's analogy. BMW isn't taking an existing product and making it worse. They're just using some of the same parts to make a new product (assuming the tuned N55 rumor is true).

As for me, I don't care about bespoke engines. The M2 can share an engine with any other car; I just want it to be properly balanced in all aspects and incredibly fun to drive around a track.

The McDonald's anology is not about them making things worse...you missed the point. It's about them changing something that the public liked and were known for. But, they hedge their bets that people will only complain, they'll be back in line.

And that is the point I was making, you don't care, nor others---"just give me a product."
Just like the Active Sound...there are people who complain, and then there are those (the majority) who don't care. And that is what BMW counts on.
It's a slippery slope...the more people don't mind, the more corp/businesses get away with...and they market it as "progress".

If you don't care about "bespoked" engines...then what engines were M Division known for? Owners on here trumpet and herald the S54, S85, S65. These are the engines that M is known for in the 21st century.
And then the "no dogmas" era came.
And people say, "oh we are fine with that. I don't care. Just give me something that will handle."

Makes me wonder what will happen when Mercedes starts producing it's inline 6 cylinder engines again. And what will AMG do with those...who will make the better I6, BMW/M or Merc/AMG?

[BimmerMat135]

That 4 vs 6cyl still going! I would prefer any BMW AG 6cyl over a M 4cyl. I don't want a fart sounding engine with major turbo lag, unknown reliability and rougher power delivery under the hood of the M2. I haven't heard many negative review of the 1m's engine performance, sound and power delivery so far. As a 1M owner I can tell that it is not pulling as strong past 6500rpm but with all the torque who never need to go there anyway. This issue seem to be solved on N55 too.

[IS3andME]

Originally Posted by BimmerMat135

That 4 vs 6cyl still going! I would prefer any BMW AG 6cyl over a M 4cyl. I don't want a fart sounding engine with major turbo lag, unknown reliability and rougher power delivery under the hood of the M2. I haven't heard many negative review of the 1m's engine performance, sound and power delivery so far. As a 1M owner I can tell that it is not pulling as strong past 6500rpm but with all the torque who never need to go there anyway. This issue seem to be solved on N55 too.

Well, remember how people complained about the fart sounds gen listening to the F10 M5 when it first came out? And when we heard clips of the F8X M3?
Face it, with BMW, the fart sounds are here to stay...

I understand your worries about unknown reliability...

[BimmerMat135]

Originally Posted by IS3andME

Well, remember how people complained about the fart sounds gen listening to the F10 M5 when it first came out? And when we heard clips of the F8X M3?
Face it, with BMW, the fart sounds are here to stay...

I understand your worries about unknown reliability...

You are right about the sound of the f10 m5 and f80 m3 but the m235i doesn't seem to have that farting sound. So If they make the M2 with the N55 and a nice exhaust I don't think it will sound like the M3 does.

[Dackelone]

Originally Posted by BimmerMat135

You are right about the sound of the f10 m5 and f80 m3 but the m235i doesn't seem to have that farting sound. So If they make the M2 with the N55 and a nice exhaust I don't think it will sound like the M3 does.

All of BMW's new engines with the automatic fart when they shift. Heck even the new turbo Golf farts. lol

[IS3andME]

Originally Posted by Dackelone

All of BMW's new engines with the automatic fart when they shift. Heck even the new turbo Golf farts. lol

But does it's farts smell like Roses, like the BMW's farts do (due to the Active Smell function)?

[bradleyland]

Originally Posted by BimmerMat135

You are right about the sound of the f10 m5 and f80 m3 but the m235i doesn't seem to have that farting sound. So If they make the M2 with the N55 and a nice exhaust I don't think it will sound like the M3 does.

Have a listen here (specifically, at 4:55):

You can hear the fart sound pretty clearly. I test drove one, and you can definitely hear it. I'm not 100% certain, but I think this is a consequence of a specific engineering decision.

When you shift gears, you can't simply leave the engine operating at full power, because it will shorten the life of the transmission. The traditional solution to reducing engine power during shifts in road cars is to cut the throttle, which reduces the amount of air flowing through the engine, and consequently reduces power.

However, with a turbocharged engine, you want to keep the turbo spinning as much as possible. Closing the throttle has two consequences:

• It cuts the air supply to the turbine portion of the turbocharger.
• It causes a back-pressure spike in the intake.

Both of these have significant negative effects on turbocharger RPM.

The solution used in modern turbocharged road cars is to cut the fuel supply during the shift, but leaving the throttle open. This allows air to continue to flow through the engine, adding a slight cooling effect, but most importantly, it doesn't interrupt the turbocharger nearly as badly as closing the throttle.

The fart sound you're hearing is the sound of air flowing through the engine without fuel/ignition. It sounds a little bit like the engine brake on a semi, but not as pronounced (an engine brake is much louder because the valve timing changes during operation).

A similar solution has been employed in racing engines for quite some time, however, they often rely on ignition cut alone, rather than fuel-supply. That's why you see such huge flames shooting out the exhaust on shifts. That's unacceptable on a road car for emissions and safety reasons.

Disclaimer: I'm no engineer, so this is my understanding from what I've read on the internet, which is often untrustworthy. I welcome correction from anyone with more specific knowledge.

[bladeomatic]

Originally Posted by IS3andME

But, the question is, does it seem like the M faithful are accepting that they will not get a "bespoked" engine? .

M faithful? So it is a religion...

I'm a long-time car buff, former mechanic and former racer, but 1st time Bimmer owner. I'm amused at how much chatter there is on whether this is an M, or that isn't an M. Did the M division design, build or just suggest each piece? Did M engineers actually touch a part or merely point at it? Did they use a capital "M" in it's distinction or a lowercase "m"?

I'm in love with the M235i. It's one of the baddest, most fun cars I've driven in a long time. Virtually all of the reviews of this car by people that have driven it are very positive. If the M badge was removed from all 16 places, it would still be one trick ride.

BMW may build a version of this car that's lighter, with a more powerful motor, a tighter suspension and fatter tires that will further improve the already ridiculous specs on this puppy. That's awesome. You can squeeze another 50+ hp out of an already brilliant engine? Bring it.

I could care less which division touches which part, as long as the results are amazing.

[Jockey]

I could care less about a "bespoke" engine. If it performs well, matches the car beautiful, and is overall a pleasure to drive, that's what I care about.

The M-division is more than just making special engines, they make special cars. It's their special cars that has made reputation.