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      07-24-2021, 03:05 PM   #1
Oeb36
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Difference between the m2 n55 and 335 n55

So what are the differences between the n55 engine in the m2 and the n55 engine in the 335?

What has been upgraded in the m2 n55
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      07-24-2021, 06:53 PM   #2
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I believe..
1. Forged crankshaft
2. Forged connecting rods
3. M3 M4 pistons
4. Cast-iron sleeves
5. Better oil cooling
There could be more,not sure
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      07-24-2021, 10:08 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wheats1 View Post
I believe..
1. Forged crankshaft
2. Forged connecting rods
3. M3 M4 pistons
4. Cast-iron sleeves
5. Better oil cooling
There could be more,not sure
Oh wow ok . So it does have forged rods .
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      07-25-2021, 05:39 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oeb36 View Post
So what are the differences between the n55 engine in the m2 and the n55 engine in the 335?

What has been upgraded in the m2 n55
Do a search for BMW M2 technical training manual. All differences in there.
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      07-25-2021, 04:32 PM   #5
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All EWG equpped N55s (started the 2014 model year) have the following:

S55 forged connecting rods
S55 main and connecting rod bearings


The EWG N55 used the M235 has a forged crank


The EWG N55 in the M2 has all of the above plus:

S55 oil pump and baffle system
Different hypereutectic pistons
Different turbo manifold
S55 spark plugs
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      07-25-2021, 08:33 PM   #6
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I made a comparison sheet across N55 variances as below. Hope it helps.
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      07-26-2021, 01:27 AM   #7
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Borrowed from ///M TOWN

Quote:
Originally Posted by ///M TOWN View Post
Yes indeed‼️

"To give the N55 new purpose, BMW started from the ground up with it. Starting from the block and rotating assembly, BMW gave the N55 a forged crankshaft, forged connecting rods and newer piston rings. It also received a rehsaped oil pan and a new oil drain pump, to allow for better circulation during more extreme circumstances than it was normally put under. Additional oil coolers have also been fitted to insure that, during the sort of driving that the M2 is capable of, there's no loss in power. "Because if your oil temperature and coolant temperature are running so hot, it's inevitable to have reduced power. You can't have that." According to Jose Guerrero, BMW Product Manager for the M2"

"The BMW M2's N55 has also had its spray-on cylinder liners replaced with cast-iron ones, which are necessary for the M2. Guerrero claims that the spray-on liners are fine for a normal street car, "But lap after lap, if you know a car will be high-revving on racetracks, you need that. You don't want engine failure."

'The M2 also gets a new exhaust manifold and intake plumbing for its N55 engine, allowing for better airflow. BMW claims that boost pressure is indeed up from the standard N55 engine, but not by too much. It's not surprising, though, as there are people who can tune a standard BMW 335i's N55 engine up to almost 400 hp with nothing but software tweaks. What BMW has done to the N55 for M2 duty is make it sturdier, more durable and more stable, as well as more powerful, to insure that it can take the sort of beating M2 owners will likely give it.
As BMW fans, we love the N55 engine, in all applications. It was just such an incredible engine, one that was powerful, torquey, silky smooth and made a great sound. When the M3/M4 debuted the S55 engine, everyone was impressed by its power and performance, but disappointed that it lacked the character of the N55. With the BMW M2, the N55 lives on and proves it's one of the all-time best Bavarian engines.

The new B58 engine has a lot to live up to"

There you go.
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      07-26-2021, 02:20 PM   #8
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Thanks fellas
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      07-27-2021, 12:29 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wheats1 View Post
I believe..
1. Forged crankshaft
2. Forged connecting rods
3. M3 M4 pistons
4. Cast-iron sleeves
5. Better oil cooling
There could be more,not sure
Quote:
Originally Posted by SeanWRT View Post
I made a comparison sheet across N55 variances as below. Hope it helps.
Didn't think the rods were forged, but then upon looking at the pictures I can see a somewhat wide parting line down the side of the rod which would be indicative of forging, but it is hard to tell if it is indeed a forged rod as the pictures don't do it justice without having something to compare it to unlike the crankshaft where you can see the difference between a cast and forged crank shaft's parting lines. Where the m2 and m235i's crank shaft show the extremely wide parting line and rounded counter weights proving they are indeed forged.

So at the current moment I still am unsure if I believe they are fracture forged rods.


Does anyone have any technical documents from bmw to actually prove it?
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      07-28-2021, 12:40 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by F87source View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wheats1 View Post
I believe..
1. Forged crankshaft
2. Forged connecting rods
3. M3 M4 pistons
4. Cast-iron sleeves
5. Better oil cooling
There could be more,not sure
Quote:
Originally Posted by SeanWRT View Post
I made a comparison sheet across N55 variances as below. Hope it helps.
Didn't think the rods were forged, but then upon looking at the pictures I can see a somewhat wide parting line down the side of the rod which would be indicative of forging, but it is hard to tell if it is indeed a forged rod as the pictures don't do it justice without having something to compare it to unlike the crankshaft where you can see the difference between a cast and forged crank shaft's parting lines. Where the m2 and m235i's crank shaft show the extremely wide parting line and rounded counter weights proving they are indeed forged.

So at the current moment I still am unsure if I believe they are fracture forged rods.


Does anyone have any technical documents from bmw to actually prove it?
Forged rod has been pretty common and basic really. Doesn't even necessarily take a performance turbocharged engine to have it.
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      07-28-2021, 12:53 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SeanWRT View Post
Forged rod has been pretty common and basic really. Doesn't even necessarily take a performance turbocharged engine to have it.
Well just because it is common doesn't mean a car has it. I keep seeing that the rods are casted and can't 100% verify if they are forged based on the parting line.
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      07-28-2021, 06:29 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by F87source View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by SeanWRT View Post
Forged rod has been pretty common and basic really. Doesn't even necessarily take a performance turbocharged engine to have it.
Well just because it is common doesn't mean a car has it. I keep seeing that the rods are casted and can't 100% verify if they are forged based on the parting line.
I don't think the N55 or S55 uses forged rods. S58 does as it takes directly from S63.
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      07-28-2021, 10:42 PM   #13
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Guys, see below. The same rod has been shared across N54/N55/S55 dated way back.

There're various sources to confirm forged rod for the M2/M3/M4. The same goes for the rest.

Forged rod has been very common for turbocharged engine for a long time.
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      07-28-2021, 11:45 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SeanWRT View Post
Guys, see below. The same rod has been shared across N54/N55/S55 dated way back.

There're various sources to confirm forged rod for the M2/M3/M4. The same goes for the rest.

Forged rod has been very common for turbocharged engine for a long time.
You're incorrect.

1) real OEM uses chassis service dates from the date that the chassis was introduced to the date it was decompressioned regardless of engine changes. So you must be careful about comparing engine parts based on chassis info because it doesn't factor in all the engine types.

For ex in this case only the n55 and s55 shared rods, n54 is not included despite real OEM saying a 2009 e9x car was there. What it actually means was the n55 in the E series shared the same rod but the system included the entire service date of the chassis which is a mistake.


https://www.realoem.com/bmw/enUS/par...&q=11247586491

11247586491 - the n54's connecting rod part number and it's different.


2) I don't see a single source verifying that the m2 has forged rods, if you have them in a bmw technical document not some advertising review (they're known to be wrong just like when they said the m2 had a closed deck block) then I would love to see it.


3) I wouldn't say turbo cars commonly have forged rods. While some more high end cars do have forged rods for the factory most cars do not. They have cast fractured split rod caps, most turbo cars don't have forged rods or cranks because of the cost to make them. Maybe on more expensive cars or performance cars sure but it is not extremely common.
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      07-29-2021, 12:08 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by F87source View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by SeanWRT View Post
Guys, see below. The same rod has been shared across N54/N55/S55 dated way back.

There're various sources to confirm forged rod for the M2/M3/M4. The same goes for the rest.

Forged rod has been very common for turbocharged engine for a long time.
You're incorrect.

1) real OEM uses chassis service dates from the date that the chassis was introduced to the date it was decompressioned regardless of engine changes. So you must be careful about comparing engine parts based on chassis info because it doesn't factor in all the engine types.

For ex in this case only the n55 and s55 shared rods, n54 is not included despite real OEM saying a 2009 e9x car was there. What it actually means was the n55 in the E series shared the same rod but the system included the entire service date of the chassis which is a mistake.


https://www.realoem.com/bmw/enUS/par...;q=11247586491

11247586491 - the n54's connecting rod part number and it's different.


2) I don't see a single source verifying that the m2 has forged rods, if you have them in a bmw technical document not some advertising review (they're known to be wrong just like when they said the m2 had a closed deck block) then I would love to see it.


3) I wouldn't say turbo cars commonly have forged rods. While some more high end cars do have forged rods for the factory most cars do not. They have cast fractured split rod caps, most turbo cars don't have forged rods or cranks because of the cost to make them. Maybe on more expensive cars or performance cars sure but it is not extremely common.
Here is WardAuto's report on the M2 engine which for seemingly the last time (please don't start an argument if it's not the last time) the N55 had won 10 best engine award.

https://www.wardsauto.com/test-drive...gine-new-again

They mentioned forged internal if you look closely. Applying to the rest of n55.

I have no time nor internet derail further from the N55 topic.
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      07-29-2021, 12:15 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SeanWRT View Post
Here is WardAuto's report on the M2 engine which for seemingly the last time (please don't start an argument if it's not the last time) the N55 had won 10 best engine award.

https://www.wardsauto.com/test-drive...gine-new-again

They mentioned forged internal if you look closely. Applying to the rest of n55.

I have no time nor internet derail further from the N55 topic.
Yeah forged crankshaft which is confirmed and you can accurately see the characteristic traits (wide parting lines from the mould and the rounded counter weights) of a forged crankshaft from the engine tear downs.


However it's still not a primary source (either bmws tech ical document, or a tear down confirming it) so it doesn't mean anything. Reviews literally don't mean anything because they just regurgitate marketing from bmw, that's what journalists do best - hence why for the longest time they thought the m2 had a closed deck block.


I've looked at alot of n55 rods and I have a really hard time judging the parting line, it's border line too thin to be forged but a bit too thick to be cast. So it's so hard to tell for sure. The images I've been looking at don't help because no one likes to take side profile pictures of rods it's always the flat side which makes it super hard to look at the parting line. The best way to know for sure is if I had a rod to actually hold in my hand and look for the parting line and if it follows all the way through to the cap as well. Of course having a cast one and a forged one made for the same engine side by side to compare would be ideal - just like comparing a cast and forged cranks counter weights and parting lines. But I don't think it's possible because we don't even have confirmation of a forged rod.


Overall I'm still really curious to see if it does have forged rods - if it does that would be so nice. If it doesn't well that sucks but not a deal breaker since it's quite stout.
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      07-29-2021, 12:39 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SeanWRT View Post
Here is WardAuto's report on the M2 engine which for seemingly the last time (please don't start an argument if it's not the last time) the N55 had won 10 best engine award.

https://www.wardsauto.com/test-drive...gine-new-again

They mentioned forged internal if you look closely. Applying to the rest of n55.

I have no time nor internet derail further from the N55 topic.
Btw your article still states that the m2 had a closed deck block. So that should show the quality of the source you presented. So you may not have time for internet derailing of this thread, neither do I. So make sure you do a better job with your information otherwise the same talking points will have to be rehashed. Because your real OEM info was wrong and your review article doesn't seem so trust worthy.


I'm not trying to start some crazy argument I'm trying to see if the m2 really does have forged rods and I personally really don't think it does - and I really hope I'm wrong.

Edit - that article also says the m235i has a standard iron crank shaft implying that isn't forged.... So yeah a pretty crappy source imo.
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      07-29-2021, 01:57 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by F87source View Post
Btw your article still states that the m2 had a closed deck block. So that should show the quality of the source you presented. So you may not have time for internet derailing of this thread, neither do I. So make sure you do a better job with your information otherwise the same talking points will have to be rehashed. Because your real OEM info was wrong and your review article doesn't seem so trust worthy.


I'm not trying to start some crazy argument I'm trying to see if the m2 really does have forged rods and I personally really don't think it does.
You seem to be trying to do exactly that?
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      07-29-2021, 02:03 AM   #19
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Quote:
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You seem to be trying to do exactly that?
Not really....

I wanted to see if the m2 and n55 really did have a forged connecting rod, and asked for sources.

When confronted with inaccurate information or garbage sources I will debunk it or address it, I'm not going to let inaccurate information or weak "sources" stay there and cause more misinformation.


If anything it is better to address inaccuracies or skepticisms immediately before it spreads around like it is the truth. Then you'll have huge arguments like if the car has a closed deck block or not.
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      07-29-2021, 03:05 AM   #20
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Some of us clearly have training in critical appraisal skills and some do not. I always find it fascinating watching the two battle.

Thing is when you don't have these skills you don't know it and are open to misunderstanding at different levels.
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      07-29-2021, 04:05 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oeb36 View Post
So what are the differences between the n55 engine in the m2 and the n55 engine in the 335?

What has been upgraded in the m2 n55
I forgot to mention that the n55 in the m2 uses the plastic diverter valve from the N20 instead of the standard rubber diaphragm diverter valve found in all other N55's. This means the m2's diverter valve is not susceptible to leaking over time so you aren't going to be in a rush to replace that part, and the only gain you will get from upgrading that is better throttle response.
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      07-29-2021, 04:58 PM   #22
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Extra Grist to your Mill: The rods on the M2 are used on the M235i Racing, and the M4 GT4 (where they replace the earlier design). Two hypotheses arise from this, that require testing with physical evidence: 1. BMW is fitting the cheapest parts possible in the knowledge that race teams will replace them with items that are fit for purpose. 2. They are fit for purpose as is (and, that might mean they are forged, but might not).

In the meantime, hopefully the knowledge that someone on the internet is WRONG, isn't keeping you awake...
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