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      10-20-2018, 05:01 AM   #1
D CHOI
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Exclamation CEL on FS Downpipe!!

Got my 1st CEL @ 17,500 miles. Only performance mod is the Fapspeed downpipe with over 10k miles on it.

P0420 - Cat System Efficency Below Threshold Bank 1


I reset it and it came back on within a few days. I just reset it again one more time but it doesn't look promising.

What's my best option moving forward? I haven't been active on the forum for a few months so I'm not up to date on this CEL or new downpipes I can consider as replacement for worse case scenario?
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      10-20-2018, 10:07 AM   #2
TheHaze
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I'd get a hold of Fabspeed directly. They guarantee no check engine light with their sport cat downpipes, so they should hopefully be able to do something for you.
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      10-20-2018, 12:22 PM   #3
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I had a CEL with fabspeed DP once, about 10k miles ago. It went away after about 20 miles driving, and has been gone for last 10k miles.
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      10-22-2018, 12:15 PM   #4
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Same, it never came back for me either. However it did happen at one point shortly after install.
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      10-23-2018, 10:04 AM   #5
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Got this response from Fabspeed.

The code you are getting could be caused by different things other than the catalytic converter.

Please view the below requirement on out warranty page:
Fabspeed products containing catalytic converters are protected by a 2-Year Limited Warranty against failure or defects in material and construction. This Warranty does not apply if the product(s) has been installed on a vehicle that has been run with leaded race fuel or fuel additives.

In order for Fabspeed to replace a catalytic converter under warranty, the following conditions and requirements must ALL be met:

1. Catalysts must not show any physical damage or signs of abuse. Signs of abuse include, but are not limited to, motorsport or on-track use, leaded fuel, fuel additives, etc.
2. Catalysts must be no more than two years in age from original purchase date.
3. There are no visible exhaust leaks anywhere in the exhaust system upstream of the catalysts.
4. Two ECU printouts showing catalyst inefficiency faults. After the first printout the ECU fault memory is cleared. If the fault returns, a second printout should be made and submitted for warranty approval. *Printouts must include operating conditions and vehicle hours.
5. No other faults which will alter the OEM or Fabspeed ECU tune air/fuel calibration should be present on the printouts for catalytic inefficiency (for example: codes for fuel trim, O2 sensors, MAF sensor, etc.)
6. A graph of the oxygen sensors before and after the catalyst must be supplied. This graph should show the oxygen sensors in operation on a fully warm vehicle in closed loop operation.


Currently waiting to put more miles on to see if CEL will return the 2nd time around.

Last edited by D CHOI; 10-23-2018 at 09:29 PM..
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      10-23-2018, 10:32 PM   #6
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Am I reading that right? Usage on track is considered abuse?
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      10-23-2018, 11:06 PM   #7
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If it doesn't go away on it's own I'd swap the 02 sensor before moving forward with a claim or replacement
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      10-24-2018, 10:34 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewc89 View Post
If it doesn't go away on it's own I'd swap the 02 sensor before moving forward with a claim or replacement
Why? Are the O2 sensors known to go bad? And if it's the downpipe, why should OP spend his money diagnosing other stuff? Especially when his only mod is the dp and the car has so little miles on it.
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      10-24-2018, 10:37 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anthony1s View Post

Why? Are the O2 sensors known to go bad? And if it's the downpipe, why should OP spend his money diagnosing other stuff? Especially when his only mod is the dp and the car has so little miles on it.
Yes, o2 sensors are known to go bad and cause these faults and they are much cheaper/easier to replace then catalytic converters so it's definitely worth a shot in my opinion to rule it out as a possible cause.
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      10-24-2018, 10:37 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D CHOI View Post
Got this response from Fabspeed.

4. Two ECU printouts showing catalyst inefficiency faults. After the first printout the ECU fault memory is cleared. If the fault returns, a second printout should be made and submitted for warranty approval. *Printouts must include operating conditions and vehicle hours.

6. A graph of the oxygen sensors before and after the catalyst must be supplied. This graph should show the oxygen sensors in operation on a fully warm vehicle in closed loop operation.

So how does the average consumer get the graphs and printouts necessary?
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      10-24-2018, 11:11 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewc89 View Post
Yes, o2 sensors are known to go bad and cause these faults and they are much cheaper/easier to replace then catalytic converters so it's definitely worth a shot in my opinion to rule it out as a possible cause.
Right but in my case the DP is under warranty so they will replace it for free. As for the instructions goes it asked to test the 02 sensors and show graphs. I'm not familiar with how this process works but the shop should be able to tell if it's bad right away right? Or are 02 sensors tricky to diagnose?
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      10-24-2018, 11:15 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D CHOI View Post

I'm not familiar with how this process works but the shop should be able to tell if it's bad right away right? Or are 02 sensors tricky to diagnose?
I'n not sure I've always just replaced them and you can tell that way immediately. It's a $75 part.
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      10-24-2018, 02:58 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by andrewc89 View Post
Yes, o2 sensors are known to go bad and cause these faults and they are much cheaper/easier to replace then catalytic converters so it's definitely worth a shot in my opinion to rule it out as a possible cause.
Sounds like BMW should recall them if they are going bad at 15,000 miles. Quick google search says they last 100,000 or longer. But kinda hard to do that if you have an aftermarket downpipe installed. Just seems like getting a downpipe is a huge PIA when something goes wrong.
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      10-24-2018, 04:19 PM   #14
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Sorry Guys. I have been on vacation. I am looking into this as we speak.
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      10-24-2018, 04:31 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fabspeed Motorsport View Post
Sorry Guys. I have been on vacation. I am looking into this as we speak.
How many miles are expected for the usable life of the sport cat? The warranty I understand is 2 years but for cars, time is not a very good indicator for usage compared to mileage
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      10-25-2018, 03:16 AM   #16
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Good news is the CEL hasn't come back on after being driven for longer than the 1st reset. Not sure how long it takes computer to reset and fully adapt but over 100 miles seems like a decent amount of time.
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      10-25-2018, 08:48 AM   #17
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Sorry, I was away on vacation. I would love to talk to you about this issue.
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      10-26-2018, 04:51 PM   #18
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Glad to hear that the CEL has not come Back on. Seems to be good to go!
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      10-26-2018, 06:30 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fabspeed Motorsport View Post
Glad to hear that the CEL has not come Back on. Seems to be good to go!
No response about mileage longevity?
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      10-27-2018, 04:24 AM   #20
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Still no CEL! I'm thinking it could be a bad tank of gas at some random chevron/shell station I filled up at. Maybe they mixed the regular into premium?
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      10-27-2018, 09:08 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nioh_lbbm2 View Post
No response about mileage longevity?
Isn’t it safe to say that all downpipes will cause a cell eventually. A aftermarket sooner than later when compared to OEM.
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      10-27-2018, 09:30 AM   #22
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Phil from Fabspeed here.
Eventually, yes catalytic convertors will fail and cause a CEL. The milage that it takes for the cats to fail is really dependant on the type of cat and quality of cat material. It should also be noted that how the car is used ie type of gas, street or track, tuned or not, will all play a factor into how long the cat lasts. If your vehicle is tuned and you are running race fuel on the track that will significantly change the longevity of the cat over running premium on the street having "fun" with your vehicle. I hope this helps I have seen and heard about HJS cats lasting over 100,000 miles.
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