06-04-2022, 11:05 AM | #1 |
Private
57
Rep 52
Posts |
At the track yesterday I got my first "Engine overheating" and "Engine overheated" warnings after about 2 years of track days. This was my 2nd day here in CO but all of my previous days have been in NC, mostly at VIR. I'm running a custom stage 2 tune with all supporting mods and have never come close to overheating, even during longer (45 min) sessions.
My question is, what triggers this warning? I saw my oil temp was 255F and my coolant was 240F (running in traction mode) which didn't seem too out of the ordinary from what I've previously seen. It occurred a couple times throughout the session but only during WOT on the back straight. Edit for more info: I did recently have the condenser replaced due to a leak, as well as the oil changed. This happened during the 5th session of the day after lunch and 4 sessions in the morning.
__________________
Cary Jordan 91 Oct Tune~ CSF FMIC, DCT Cooler~ VRSF Chargepipe~ MST Turbo Inlet Pipe~ Fabspeed Sportcat Downpipe~ Turbosmart BV~ Ohlins R&T~ do88 Oil Cooler, Radiator, Remote Radiator~ Girodisc Rotors
|
06-04-2022, 11:41 AM | #2 | |
Brigadier General
3989
Rep 3,409
Posts |
Quote:
If that doesn't get you there, time to upgrade coolers. The hot dry air is really problematic on cooling effectiveness and IATs.
__________________
Not a Doctor, those are just my initials.
|
|
Appreciate
1
OG Shark4692.50 |
06-04-2022, 11:56 AM | #3 |
Private
57
Rep 52
Posts |
Gotcha, yeah I definitely noticed with the brake heat as well (discounting the braking differences between tracks).. front calipers went from slightly discolored to dark green/black after 1 session
When you say "cooler", which part(s) are you referring to?
__________________
Cary Jordan 91 Oct Tune~ CSF FMIC, DCT Cooler~ VRSF Chargepipe~ MST Turbo Inlet Pipe~ Fabspeed Sportcat Downpipe~ Turbosmart BV~ Ohlins R&T~ do88 Oil Cooler, Radiator, Remote Radiator~ Girodisc Rotors
|
Appreciate
0
|
06-04-2022, 02:07 PM | #4 | |
Brigadier General
3989
Rep 3,409
Posts |
Quote:
__________________
Not a Doctor, those are just my initials.
|
|
06-05-2022, 07:48 PM | #5 | ||
Lieutenant
541
Rep 489
Posts |
Quote:
|
||
06-05-2022, 08:39 PM | #6 | |
BimmerPost Supporting Vendor
4693
Rep 2,542
Posts |
Quote:
Ethanol might be a consideration depending on how far you want to go down the rabbit hole. Fueling has been catching up the last couple of years to allow for higher ethanol contents as well. Will help keep power from being pulled as IATs increase. Brakes - yeah as you increase power & grip on these cars the oem setup can definitely start to struggle. When you start getting into that real dark green to black we figure here that you are pushing towards their threshold. Just keep on the lookout for signs of fade. One thing might have happened - have you been running DSC completely off at your previous tracks? And this being your first time at this one DSC or MDM on while learning it? If so that might account for some of the extra heat in the braking system. |
|
Appreciate
1
grinchmas56.50 |
06-06-2022, 11:41 AM | #7 | |
Private
57
Rep 52
Posts |
Quote:
I'll keep ethanol in mind but would prefer to stay on regular 91 oct for the time being. Yep, definitely was in traction mode for the first day so that was a contributing factor. Also my previous track, VIR, had way more time in between hard braking zones than I do here at High Plains so they were able to vent heat better
__________________
Cary Jordan 91 Oct Tune~ CSF FMIC, DCT Cooler~ VRSF Chargepipe~ MST Turbo Inlet Pipe~ Fabspeed Sportcat Downpipe~ Turbosmart BV~ Ohlins R&T~ do88 Oil Cooler, Radiator, Remote Radiator~ Girodisc Rotors
|
|
Appreciate
0
|
06-06-2022, 12:27 PM | #8 | ||
Brigadier General
3989
Rep 3,409
Posts |
Quote:
__________________
Not a Doctor, those are just my initials.
|
||
Appreciate
0
|
06-06-2022, 01:16 PM | #9 |
Private
57
Rep 52
Posts |
It's a fun time! Admittedly I was bit skeptical coming from VIR but the two times I've been out have been a blast. It's not as fast but I've been enjoying working through the turns to find which lines work best.
__________________
Cary Jordan 91 Oct Tune~ CSF FMIC, DCT Cooler~ VRSF Chargepipe~ MST Turbo Inlet Pipe~ Fabspeed Sportcat Downpipe~ Turbosmart BV~ Ohlins R&T~ do88 Oil Cooler, Radiator, Remote Radiator~ Girodisc Rotors
|
Appreciate
1
DRLane3988.50 |
06-07-2022, 08:04 AM | #10 | |
BimmerPost Supporting Vendor
4693
Rep 2,542
Posts |
Quote:
Yeah DSC/MDM as much as they can be useful can also bite back a bit with the brakes. Just keep a close eye on them. I would hit up DRLane about the levels of brakes stress at the tracks on that side of the country. The characteristics of the OG F87 & E9x are similar enough that the E9x can provide a decent barometer of what to eventually expect with the OG M2 (imo).
__________________
|
|
Appreciate
1
DRLane3988.50 |
06-07-2022, 06:14 PM | #11 |
Second Lieutenant
120
Rep 217
Posts |
You mentioned that your tune is custom. Who created it for you? How aggressive is it compared to the AA track tune?
__________________
2017 F87 M2: MGM, 6MT, AA Tune, Eibach Pro-Kit, Fabspeed Catted Downpipe, Evolution Racewerks FMIC+Chargepipe, Autosolutions SSK, CDV Delete, Vorshlag Plates, PFC-08 pads, Apex EC-7 18x9.5"
2013 E92 328i M-Sport: BSM, 6MT, 3IM+AA Tune, BMW PE, M3 control arms, Eibach Pro-Kit, Bilstein B8, BMW SSK, CDV Delete, Apex EC-7 18x9" |
Appreciate
0
|
06-08-2022, 09:11 AM | #12 |
Captain
433
Rep 753
Posts |
+1 to fleetfoot's question. Also, since you moved from the east coast, I am guessing your tune is optimized for 93 octane. Since you didn't have issues there, it is possible that 91 octane is causing the ECU to pull a lot of timing to protect the engine from knock events and generating heat. A cheap test is to throw some Boostane or Racegas octane additive to raise the blended octane level to 94-95 and see if it helps. The elevation of HPR (5000 ft vs 400 ft for VIR) is likely also making the motor work harder - thinner and less oxygen rich air. If this helps, May be worth getting a 91 octane tune.
|
Appreciate
0
|
06-08-2022, 09:19 AM | #13 | |
Captain
433
Rep 753
Posts |
Quote:
|
|
Appreciate
0
|
06-08-2022, 09:22 AM | #14 | |||
Private
57
Rep 52
Posts |
Quote:
Yep, I try to run DSC off once I've learned the track a bit more so that shouldn't be a problem for much longer! Quote:
Quote:
__________________
Cary Jordan 91 Oct Tune~ CSF FMIC, DCT Cooler~ VRSF Chargepipe~ MST Turbo Inlet Pipe~ Fabspeed Sportcat Downpipe~ Turbosmart BV~ Ohlins R&T~ do88 Oil Cooler, Radiator, Remote Radiator~ Girodisc Rotors
|
|||
Appreciate
1
pal433.00 |
06-09-2022, 08:31 AM | #15 | |
Captain
433
Rep 753
Posts |
Quote:
Lastly, I think it may be worth testing a track day with some octane booster and see if it helps. Even a 91 tune at 5000ft is probably pushing against knock parameters under sustained load. Just a thought before you do all the cooling mods. |
|
Appreciate
0
|
06-09-2022, 09:41 AM | #16 |
Second Lieutenant
130
Rep 221
Posts |
I did speak with AA regarding tunes and safety on track (after hearing of two cars with cracked pistons due to ignored limp modes/ "aggressive" tunes)
Using the M235iR as a reference point as it has the same engine, he found that any N55 car will start to lose power even at stock power levels. I don't doubt that much of this has to do with the factory intercooler being a tad small. As mentioned though, I do feel my car pull power a few laps into a session. I recall him mentioning that some do their pro teams use "less aggressive" tunes to help mitigate power loss as the car heats up (if I recall correctly, I'll reach back out to him to verify) All in, I could not find a strong enough argument to convince myself that any tune was needed on this engine. I swapped out for a catless downpipe (and run with a CEL), have yet to experience any limp modes. My feelings are that the tune only offers higher power until things get hot, and then settles to what factory software will offer. I don't have solid data to confirm this, however. I'd love to see if someone had that. |
Appreciate
0
|
06-09-2022, 09:59 AM | #17 |
Brigadier General
2811
Rep 3,696
Posts |
100 octane or E85 always helps on air-to-air intercooled cars on hot track days, even if you're not tuned for it.
The most power I've been able to run stable on 100F+ track days is Stg 2 E30 (~415whp). However, I'm now running an E50 tune (480whp/535wftlbs), have the Evo 3 IC and all the oil/water coolers, just added the M2 CS Racing BMW Motorsports DCT pan (had to replace my DCT filters & remove stock pan anyways) and switched back to the OE DCT cooler for more airflow across the radiator, am running 100% water & wetter, and added a GTS hood for more airflow thru the nose & engine bay. So, we'll see in a month or so how she holds up, and I'll update this thread then: https://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...hlight=extreme Bottom line, if you add power you'll need all the hardware cooling mods possible, and run a mix of race gas or ethanol if you don't want power pulled. Last edited by ZM2; 06-09-2022 at 10:45 AM.. |
Appreciate
0
|
06-09-2022, 12:34 PM | #18 | ||
Private
57
Rep 52
Posts |
Quote:
Quote:
__________________
Cary Jordan 91 Oct Tune~ CSF FMIC, DCT Cooler~ VRSF Chargepipe~ MST Turbo Inlet Pipe~ Fabspeed Sportcat Downpipe~ Turbosmart BV~ Ohlins R&T~ do88 Oil Cooler, Radiator, Remote Radiator~ Girodisc Rotors
|
||
Appreciate
1
pal433.00 |
06-09-2022, 02:18 PM | #19 | |
Brigadier General
2811
Rep 3,696
Posts |
Quote:
And, with that kind of power curve in your tune, I would be shifting at 6k to maximize power and to generate less upper RPM heat. Last edited by ZM2; 06-09-2022 at 03:09 PM.. |
|
06-09-2022, 06:25 PM | #20 | |
Captain
829
Rep 647
Posts |
Quote:
Are you running on track in traction mode? If so, why? |
|
Appreciate
0
|
06-09-2022, 06:38 PM | #21 | |
Brigadier General
2811
Rep 3,696
Posts |
Quote:
Also, Traction mode runs the Comfort like cooling profile, which is dumb on BMW’s part, so I only use it in the rain. DSC off for the dry. https://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1574055 |
|
06-10-2022, 10:40 AM | #22 |
Private
57
Rep 52
Posts |
Like ZM2 said above, I prefer the steering and throttle of Traction over the artificial steering weight and touchy throttle in Sport+. I do wish it didn't run the Comfort cooling setting though.
__________________
Cary Jordan 91 Oct Tune~ CSF FMIC, DCT Cooler~ VRSF Chargepipe~ MST Turbo Inlet Pipe~ Fabspeed Sportcat Downpipe~ Turbosmart BV~ Ohlins R&T~ do88 Oil Cooler, Radiator, Remote Radiator~ Girodisc Rotors
|
Appreciate
0
|
Post Reply |
Bookmarks |
|
|