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      12-06-2018, 03:39 PM   #1
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2017 OG M2 vs 2018 Honda Type R

Yes I know it's FWD, 4 doors and looks are polarizing, so please let's not go there. I'm comparing it from a spirited driving, street only, daily driver perspective, exactly what my M2 does.

First of all, finding a Type R at MSRP was much harder than getting my M2 at MSRP when it was launched back in 2016. I was able to secure a M2 and do ED in May of 2017, exactly when I wanted and got 5% off of MSRP.

My son is a 26 year old engineer who works in a secure facility and can't use his computer or phones for personal use, so he asked me to assist in finding one for him. The Hawaii Honda sharks are all asking $10k over MSRP. So after 4 months of calls, email & messages, I finally secure one for MSRP $35,595 + doc fee of $195 from a dealer in KC, Missouri. They included a 30 day trip permit and pick up from the KC airport. My son can now register and pay HI sales tax in HI. So we made this father son road trip using motorcycleroads.com as one of our guides. 950 miles of road driven fun from KC to Dallas, ending it with the Titans vs Cowboys MNF game.

Believe the hype on the Type R, it's very good! First of all the seats are nice, they're supportive, comfortable and well bolstered. It holds you in very well if you are of average build, but not sure you'd be comfortable if you are on the wider side. Overall the interior can't match the M2, but hey it's $23k less. I'm also not a techy person but the center screen display seemed okay, comes standard with GPS, Apple Car Play and satellite radio for 90 days.

The M2 beats the Type R on straight line accleration but the power delivery of the 4 cylinder turbo is very good and linear like our M2, with very little turbo lag on hard acceleration pulls. We didn't go past 5k for the 1st 600 miles per Honda break in recommendation but did go to redline after. It's very impressive as I felt it kept pulling on strong to the redline of 7k. Also impressive was the absence of torque steer on hard acceleration. I only felt it once during our trip. It happened about 3.5k as the front wheel hit an uneven bump, a split second after I started gassing it out of a turn.

The Type R steering feels very accurate and nicely weighted, maybe just a smidge heavier than our M2. And on straight line highway driving, it wanders less than my M2. Still can't beat hydraulic though, as some of the feedback wasn't there. One area where I miss my 370Z.

Staying on the topic of feel, you can definitely tell the Type R is 300 lbs less than our M2. On quick hard turns, body roll feels close to the M2 but the Type R feels more nimble. Probably why it can run the Nurburgring in a very fast time.

Ride is an interesting one. The Type R is firm but never harsh and could easily be used as a daily driver plus mountain carver. The M2 is smoother on better roads but can be a little more harsh vs the Type R on rougher roads.

Clutch is a little heavier on the Type R, but it's travel is shorter than my M2, and I have BMS stop with 3 washers! It's pick up is just a little higher than my M2 with 3 washers, so pretty darn good for stock. Clutch pick up is easy and smooth like the M2, much better than the abrupt nature of my 370Z. Type R would be my favorite clutch with the M2 & BMS stop an extremely close 2nd.

Shifter on the Type R is very good. It's shorter vertically and horizontally vs my M2. I had to recalibrate my brain when driving the Type R as I went from 2nd the 5th a few times before getting the hang of it. The shifter is also not rubbery like the M2, but the gates aren't as well defined as the 370Z. However if I had to pick one out of the 3, it would be the type R.

Brakes felt good and strong but not overly sensitive. However I don't feel the type of driving which I did, would make me the best judge of this.

Sound, my M2 has the Fabspeed sport cat and ASD coded off. No contest here at all, M2 by a knock out! Even stock, M2 all the way.

Overall I was very impressed and enjoyed driving the Type R. If I was 26 years old, I would absolutely love it. Maybe if it wasn't for the looks, I could forgive the exhast note, save $23K and be driving a Type R now. Nah, I'm older and enjoy my M2 too much.

Other notes from this KC delivery program Yes, I treated my son for the trip and shipping of his car back to HI, but it was more than worth it. I don't know how to measure the cost for the time and experience with him, but it's an extremely better deal than having him pay $10k extra to the Honda sharks here in HI. Also the Type R gets tons of attention. I was really surprised to see the amount of thumbs up on the road, as well as all the positive comments, cell phone pics by males & females of all ages at the gas stations and restaurants we stopped at.
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      12-06-2018, 04:17 PM   #2
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Terrific post. Sounds like a great trip!

It's quite something how values of Type Rs have held up. Looks kill it for me, but white works well.
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      12-07-2018, 05:23 AM   #3
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We should really talk about the GTI here . . .

I kid, I kid.
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      12-07-2018, 05:34 AM   #4
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I can’t get past the looks and all the fake parts, but as I always say, to each their own. I’d rather have a Focus RS, Golf R/S3.
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      12-07-2018, 12:55 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GeilesAuto View Post
Terrific post. Sounds like a great trip!

It's quite something how values of Type Rs have held up. Looks kill it for me, but white works well.
Thanks Geiles, and agree on the color white, that was my son's #1 color as well as mine.
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      12-07-2018, 12:56 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by switzerr View Post
We should really talk about the GTI here . . .

I kid, I kid.
Good one!
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      12-07-2018, 06:43 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by MGM135is View Post
I can’t get past the looks and all the fake parts, but as I always say, to each their own. I’d rather have a Focus RS, Golf R/S3.
MGM, I understand about the looks, polarizing for sure. Regarding the fake parts, below is a copy of a post I put on another thread.

I often hear on this forum that our M2 is a parts bin car and it's also true for the Type R. While looking for a good deal for my son, I read up a lot on it. Honda used the basic Civic body/chassis, and like the M2, upgraded a number of parts. They wanted to keep their price point at $35k.

Every funky looking piece on the Type R has a purpose, it wasn't just put on for the aftermarket, boy racer looks. Hood scoop is functional. The fender pieces were needed to accomodate wider tires, the front bumper sides with 4 holes each were added to reduce drag, as well as the opening after the front fenders, plus increase air flow to brakes. The little end lips on the front lower lip and side skirts just before the wheels, aid in downforce on the corners of the car. The huge rear spoiler is thin on top, to reduce drag and does increase downforce at speed. Those 4 little things at the very rear inner part of the roof and on the side rear, that runs down the back window. Designed to channel the wind to the thin top of the spoiler and away from the support pillars of the spoiler. Extensive testing was done by Honda in a wind tunnel for all of these parts.

Respect to Honda on all these little details, while these additions does give the car a polarizing look. They remained true to their vision of creating a very fast, great driving Civic for $35k.
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      12-07-2018, 07:20 PM   #8
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Nice post !

Was thinking of adding the typeR instead of putting the 30k extra dough on my incoming M2c ... But not sure if I can swing the typeR styling ... family's going to think I’m going through midlife crisis for sure
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      12-08-2018, 02:11 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by D22M2 View Post
Nice post !

Was thinking of adding the typeR instead of putting the 30k extra dough on my incoming M2c ... But not sure if I can swing the typeR styling ... family's going to think I’m going through midlife crisis for sure
D22 Mahalo,

If your family includes younger peeps, they might think you’re the coolest dad

Yes a big savings over the M2 if you can find one at MSRP. California has the largest amount of Type R’s in inventory by far, yet are still asking for some of the highest markups. If you can find one for a good price, I’d say, be that cool dad
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      12-08-2018, 09:58 PM   #10
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In California I would reckon that would often be a pull me over car as well. I saw that car at the LA Auto show and if you are over 40 years old your friends may think you are having a mid life financial crisis if you bought that car when they have always seen you driving BMW and Porsches.. When that car beats the M2 around the Nurburgring though you know that it is no joke, them Japanese know how to build good Hondas
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      12-09-2018, 02:18 PM   #11
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the civic that got the really good lap times on the ring, was a one off heavily modified version, not really indicative of what you would get if you bought one...
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      12-10-2018, 07:03 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by GoneIn4Secs View Post
the civic that got the really good lap times on the ring, was a one off heavily modified version, not really indicative of what you would get if you bought one...
I'm sure every single car manufacturer who releases times of their cars on the Ring, does multiple laps (some do it with multiple cars and drivers), with engine and suspension adjustments in between the laps.

How much is done? Not one of us will truly know. Thus all those lap times posted by manufacturers should be taken with a grain of salt and a cold glass of beer. Here's an article by C&D in regards to the 2017 Type R that ran the Ring.

https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a1...-record-video/
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      12-10-2018, 07:26 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aloha Joe View Post
I'm sure every single car manufacturer who releases times of their cars on the Ring, does multiple laps (some do it with multiple cars and drivers), with engine and suspension adjustments in between the laps.

How much is done? Not one of us will truly know. Thus all those lap times posted by manufacturers should be taken with a grain of salt and a cold glass of beer. Here's an article by C&D in regards to the 2017 Type R that ran the Ring.

https://www.caranddriver.com/news/a1...-record-video/
Modded or not still very impressive for a FWD vehicle - wow!
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      12-10-2018, 09:06 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GoneIn4Secs View Post
the civic that got the really good lap times on the ring, was a one off heavily modified version, not really indicative of what you would get if you bought one...
Possibly, but it did run an 8:05 for SportAuto I think. Which is still crazy for a car based on a FWD econobox.
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      12-11-2018, 01:11 AM   #15
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I happen to own both the '18 Civic Type R and '18 M2 LCI in manual at the moment, have had both cars for nearly a year now and have also taken it on track..

I'm surprised to say this myself, but the Type R has a more raw driving feel than the M2. The steering in the Type R is heavier and super precise feel, no dead centre and lets you know what the front tyres is doing both grip wise and road imperfections. The Type R also has a better driving position, where I can lower the seat to the lowest position and still can get comfortable with the steering wheels and gearshift position. Doing the same lowering the manual seats to the lowest point in my M2 I find my arm in a slight awkward position when changing gears.

The Type R gear shift feels better, clicks into each gear precisely without any unnecessary play or movement. The M2 gearshift take a bit getting use to cos of the rubbery feel, but once you know that's how it is I find it very precise as well and goes into each gear very smoothly. The brake feel was a big difference in both cars I felt, the Type R has a stiffer more responsive brake pedal feel unlike the M2 which has a softer pedal feel and not as responsive, but this can be due to different brake pads or fluids used..

Suspension setup is what really amaze me with the Type R, having 3 modes Comfort/Sport/R+ means you can use comfort on the street, Sport on mountain drives and R+ on the track. Even in comfort mode the car still feel excellent to drive unlike other cars with adaptive suspension when in comfort mode the cars become too soft and unstable at above average speeds. The non adjustable suspension setup on the M2 is great on the perfect roads, but do get a bit crashy on broken street surfaces. Chassis wise I felt the Type R is stiffer than the M2 but very slightly, high speed cornering on both cars feels very different where the slightly wider bodied Type R feel a lot more planted than the M2 and I feel the aero bits on the exterior certainly helped in this occasion, but the M2 is a lot more playful if you decide to swing it around a bit. If you care about fast lap times the Type R is an easier car to achieve that for sure..

Practicality the Type R is simply a one car can do it all imo, whether you want to use it as a work car, family car, track car it can easily cover all that instead being just a pure sport coupe like the M2. The M2 interior design does feel its starting to get old but it still feels more upmarket in terms of material and feel when compared to the Type R, in Australia the M2 is about double the price of the Type R so I guess its irrelevant to compare this. Infotainment on the Type R is very average, where as the M2 iDrive 6 system is the best I've used out of all the cars I've owned before.

Lastly exterior, I certainly feel more blended in amongst other cars on the street with the M2 as the Type R's funky look does draw some WOW or NAH attentions. They are both excellent cars with its own characteristics, but if I was purely down to driving feel and rawness the Type R is the one to have. M2 being more of a luxury sport car is pretty much as raw as it gets without sacrificing the upmarket feel of a euro car and also the price its asking for..

I've always loved to try different cars makers to experience the driving feels, design and quality on them, my previous cars since 2005 till now has being WRX, Civic Type R EP3, Mini Cooper S, Evo X, Alfa Romeo Giulietta QV, Mercedes A250(nearly bought a A45), Audi RS3 8V, Renault Megane RS265 and they are all manual except the ones that don't come with it..

I may look into selling the M2 for a Porsche Cayman 718 GT4 next if funds allow, if not a Porsche Cayman of some sort. This is just my personal opinion, so hopefully I haven't started a war or anything
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      12-11-2018, 09:13 AM   #16
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I dont buy all that, just look at that hideous civic

M2 all the way baby, looks like a car in n4s
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      12-11-2018, 09:16 AM   #17
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If your saying the civic gets more oohs and aahs than the m2 in traffic, you must have the wrong color

I have black, and the glossy reflection really show off the contours of this slick car
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      12-11-2018, 10:02 AM   #18
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Like I said this is just my own opinion as I happen to own both cars, so you certainly don't have to agree with everything I said. Don't get me wrong I love both cars for what it is otherwise I wouldn't of bought them. I understand people get a bit defensive about their cars being discussed here hence I only read gather information I'm after and never post

My M2 LCI is in Alpine White, wasn't my personal preference to be honest but due to lack of colour choices Alpine White was my pick. I like the clean elegant look bright alpine white gives. My Type R is in Sonic Grey Pearl, which changes colour under different lightings and view angle. The colour is not available in some countries, but I read it will be added for 2019 models

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      12-11-2018, 06:25 PM   #19
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Owned both as well. ended up keeping the type R over the M2.



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      12-11-2018, 07:27 PM   #20
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I had deposits on both cars and by some stroke of luck they both were delivered a few days apart. Once I checked both out in person I asked for the deposit back on the Type R. The poor build quality was a deal beaker for me. The panel gaps and poor fitting body parts are worse than I have even seen from the domestics (WTH happened Honda?). I have seen cheap aftermarket side skirts that line up better than the ones on this car. I just knew if I bought it I would be looking to get out of it in a year or two because FWD still sucks at the end of the day and I would start lusting for something with RWD or AWD. Also these cars haven't been exactly reliable with transmission issues, engine oil leaks, transmission leaks, engine harness issues, body trim issues, etc.

Last edited by heavyD^2; 12-11-2018 at 07:33 PM..
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      12-14-2018, 06:21 PM   #21
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OP, sounds like an awesome experience for you and your son to share. I've tons of respect for the Civic type R. To me it seems that Honda did a fantastic job with the car. It also feels like a return to the Honda I used to love which warms my little fanboy heart.

I find that people underestimate the fun you can have in a properly set up front wheel drive car. There's a technique of tossing the car into corners and letting the front wheels pull you through which is an absolute riot to execute properly. Countering oversteer by mashing the throtle is also hilariously fun, though difficult to learn instinctively.

Don't get me wrong - I wouldn't trade my M2 for anything. If I was more budget minded though, the type R would be at or near the top of my list.
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      12-14-2018, 11:29 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kkakonn View Post
Owned both as well. ended up keeping the type R over the M2.



Financial decision or based on driving experience?
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