[SEAT TIME RULES]

Gang,

Need your Opinions and dyno #'s with mods such as what I'm planning....

I've spent weeks on the boards going over builds on both the N55 & S55 motor.

I'm looking to build a M2 for street & HPDE duty. I don't want to take the car up to the edge of reliability, heat soak at HPDE's etc.

Do I go out and buy the current M2 at $54K (or a low mileage used one) and mod the N55 motor?

Or do I wait till this summer to place an order on the new S55 M2 and mod it? The 2019 looks like its going to be $60+K.

Both motors look like they are fuel delivery limited and I don't necessarily want to do the PI or Meth route to add power.

I'll be happy running Pump 93 (live in New England) with the ability to run E85 or any blend for HPDE track days.

On the N55 It looks like with the Pure Turbo I'll hit around 500WHP before running out of fuel.

On the S55 the headroom is much higher...like 625-650 WHP with the Pure Turbo's.

Bolt ons:
Drop in filter(s), or intake
HFC 200cel DP
Proper tuning setup
FMIC
Catback System
Charge Pipes

I plan on running a D/A C/O setup with plates and a 2nd set of 275 or 285 track tires on 10" rims 4 corners.

I'm leaning towards the S55 because I can get 500WHP from just a tune and bolt ons...then go nuts with the Pure Turbo setup when I get near the end of the factory warranty.

So what are your thoughts on this? Why one over the other?

THX
HAZMAT

[emdeuce]

Fuel pump in the N55 tends to be the limitation to 400+ power.

[Bt12]

Q for you... for HDPE do you really need 600hp on a 3k lb car? It’s not a straight course right? If you can get the n55 bear 500ish feels like it would suffice? Plus you could lightEn up the car a smidge.

Granted you need to solve the fueling issue and possibly upgrade to a bigger turbo for reliability to get to the 500 range.

[DETRoadster]

Originally Posted by Bt12

Q for you... for HDPE do you really need 600hp on a 3k lb car?

My thoughts exactly. More is not always better unless you are just looking for bragging rights. Just my opinion, you'll be slower with 600 Hp that you will be with 500 Hp. Above the mid 400s and traction becomes a real problem with this chassis.

Unless you are a rockstar driver who is highly skilled at driving a traction limited, 600 Hp, RWD car, I think it'll be a waste of money and potentially dangerous. I don't know your background or your abilities, but if you are anything like me or the 90% of the people on this forum, 600 Hp is just overkill.

[DOMs335D]

Has it actually been confirmed that the 2019 M2 has the S55? I thought so there was only talk of CS/GT4/CSL variant receiving the S55. I can't imagine the normal M2 would as well as it would be too close to the normal M4.

[skiparock]

If supply was tough for the m2 now and they eol it this summer for a 10k more m2 comp, do all of these people on the forum think they can just walk in and get an allocation this easily?

[AlexCirci]

2019 base M2 won't have the S55. Only CS and you won't get one unless you are already on a list. Also as previously stated why do you need 500+ for HPDE car... if you want a pure driving experience get an M2, mod appropriately (brakes, fueling, cooling, tune) and enjoy.

Cheers

[RedCarrot]

Originally Posted by DETRoadster

My thoughts exactly. More is not always better unless you are just looking for bragging rights. Just my opinion, you'll be slower with 600 Hp that you will be with 500 Hp. Above the mid 400s and traction becomes a real problem with this chassis.

Unless you are a rockstar driver who is highly skilled at driving a traction limited, 600 Hp, RWD car, I think it'll be a waste of money and potentially dangerous. I don't know your background or your abilities, but if you are anything like me or the 90% of the people on this forum, 600 Hp is just overkill.

I agree with you 100%. I learned that from experience myself. I added a centrifugal SC to my ‘14 Stingray to push power to 600 whp and 580 wtq because... well, it seems like half the forum members were doing it lol. I could only feather the throttle at lower speed to keep the rear from going sideway so the extra power is not useful there. The power could only be fully used at higher speed, say, from going 60 mph to triple digit plus - and I got there in an instant. Sure, it was fun but I didn’t enjoy being an asshat. And I knew it would be a matter of time before I get nailed if I repeated this often.

I eventually removed the SC after a year. The difference/improvement in handling from the nearly 100 lbs removed from the front of the car, was remarkable. IMO, 400whp is just about the traction limit for the FR platform. Yes, you can change to steamrollers in the rear to handle the power but that takes away the intended handling character of the car. Running track tires for normal driving is not an appealing option to me either.

So I think S55 makes sense for those that want that near 400whp and don’t want to mess with the ECU. My preference is to go with the N55 for better sound and quicker boost, then make up that gap to 400whp with DP and tune.

[SEAT TIME RULES]

Originally Posted by DETRoadster

My thoughts exactly. More is not always better unless you are just looking for bragging rights. Just my opinion, you'll be slower with 600 Hp that you will be with 500 Hp. Above the mid 400s and traction becomes a real problem with this chassis.

Unless you are a rockstar driver who is highly skilled at driving a traction limited, 600 Hp, RWD car, I think it'll be a waste of money and potentially dangerous. I don't know your background or your abilities, but if you are anything like me or the 90% of the people on this forum, 600 Hp is just overkill.

Your post is spot on....But I have plenty of experience both as a driver, and instructor in both seats to handle this platform with 600WHP.

I'll run 305's on the rear on the street and a square setup at the track.

I'll set the suspension up using my Solo DL and a pyrometer.

The tune will be setup for a consistent, progressive, manageble boost curve.

And most importantly the throttle settings will be setup to handle modulation at apex to track out..

Thx for the feedback so far....

HAZMAT

[SEAT TIME RULES]

Originally Posted by AlexCirci

2019 base M2 won't have the S55. Only CS and you won't get one unless you are already on a list. Also as previously stated why do you need 500+ for HPDE car... if you want a pure driving experience get an M2, mod appropriately (brakes, fueling, cooling, tune) and enjoy.

Cheers

Quote from the BMW Blog:

"While the M2 Competition won’t be artificially limited, the number of units produced will be based on the production capacity and demand. First units will arrive to customers in late summer"

[ashburyn54]

Originally Posted by SEAT TIME RULES

Gang,

Need your Opinions and dyno #'s with mods such as what I'm planning....

I've spent weeks on the boards going over builds on both the N55 & S55 motor.

I'm looking to build a M2 for street & HPDE duty. I don't want to take the car up to the edge of reliability, heat soak at HPDE's etc.

Do I go out and buy the current M2 at $54K (or a low mileage used one) and mod the N55 motor?

Or do I wait till this summer to place an order on the new S55 M2 and mod it? The 2019 looks like its going to be $60+K.

Both motors look like they are fuel delivery limited and I don't necessarily want to do the PI or Meth route to add power.

I'll be happy running Pump 93 (live in New England) with the ability to run E85 or any blend for HPDE track days.

On the N55 It looks like with the Pure Turbo I'll hit around 500WHP before running out of fuel.

On the S55 the headroom is much higher...like 625-650 WHP with the Pure Turbo's.

Bolt ons:
Drop in filter(s), or intake
HFC 200cel DP
Proper tuning setup
FMIC
Catback System
Charge Pipes

I plan on running a D/A C/O setup with plates and a 2nd set of 275 or 285 track tires on 10" rims 4 corners.

I'm leaning towards the S55 because I can get 500WHP from just a tune and bolt ons...then go nuts with the Pure Turbo setup when I get near the end of the factory warranty.

So what are your thoughts on this? Why one over the other?

THX
HAZMAT

When I'm on track I'm not thinking about how I wish I had 600whp but I get it!

If it helps the n55 fuel limitations are about to be a thing of the past. A few people are working on packaging and selling the dual s55 HPFP's on the M2 n55. Meaning Pure stage 2 can find its limits without meth or PI. I'm thinking that's around the 550whp-600whp range.

A few upsides to the M2 and it's powertrain for me are 1: simplicity of the single setup. 2: cheaper parts 3: better sound. 4. I'm thinking the ps2 power delivery on the n55 M2 will probably be more linear and enjoyable vs the s55 but that's just me!

[DETRoadster]

Originally Posted by SEAT TIME RULES

Your post is spot on....But I have plenty of experience both as a driver, and instructor in both seats to handle this platform with 600WHP.

I'll run 305's on the rear on the street and a square setup at the track.

I'll set the suspension up using my Solo DL and a pyrometer.

The tune will be setup for a consistent, progressive, manageble boost curve.

And most importantly the throttle settings will be setup to handle modulation at apex to track out..

Thx for the feedback so far....

HAZMAT

If you have the chops to handle it (and it sounds like you do), then I say go for it!

[DETRoadster]

Originally Posted by RedCarrot

I agree with you 100%. I learned that from experience myself. I added a centrifugal SC to my ‘14 Stingray to push power to 600 whp and 580 wtq because... well, it seems like half the forum members were doing it lol. I could only feather the throttle at lower speed to keep the rear from going sideway so the extra power is not useful there. The power could only be fully used at higher speed, say, from going 60 mph to triple digit plus - and I got there in an instant. Sure, it was fun but I didn’t enjoy being an asshat. And I knew it would be a matter of time before I get nailed if I repeated this often.

I eventually removed the SC after a year. The difference/improvement in handling from the nearly 100 lbs removed from the front of the car, was remarkable. IMO, 400whp is just about the traction limit for the FR platform. Yes, you can change to steamrollers in the rear to handle the power but that takes away the intended handling character of the car. Running track tires for normal driving is not an appealing option to me either.

So I think S55 makes sense for those that want that near 400whp and don’t want to mess with the ECU. My preference is to go with the N55 for better sound and quicker boost, then make up that gap to 400whp with DP and tune.

Agreed! I feel like 400 to 450 is the sweet spot for this chassis, and my skillset. Plenty of power to have all the fun I want without getting into the "I'm too scared to drive this" zone.

[SEAT TIME RULES]

Originally Posted by ashburyn54

When I'm on track I'm not thinking about how I wish I had 600whp but I get it!

If it helps the n55 fuel limitations are about to be a thing of the past. A few people are working on packaging and selling the dual s55 HPFP's on the M2 n55. Meaning Pure stage 2 can find its limits without meth or PI. I'm thinking that's around the 550whp-600whp range.

A few upsides to the M2 and it's powertrain for me are 1: simplicity of the single setup. 2: cheaper parts 3: better sound. 4. I'm thinking the ps2 power delivery on the n55 M2 will probably be more linear and enjoyable vs the s55 but that's just me!

THX..great post and gives me hope that a 500 WHP N55 M2 will be easy to put together by the time I put my order in, or buy a low mileage one.
I also agree that the N55 motor is more linear than the S55. Which is very important to me. I'd rather have a smooth spool up and then a flat TQ curve in the higher RPM's than what the S55 motors produce.

[ashburyn54]

Originally Posted by SEAT TIME RULES

THX..great post and gives me hope that a 500 WHP N55 M2 will be easy to put together by the time I put my order in, or buy a low mileage one.
I also agree that the N55 motor is more linear than the S55. Which is very important to me. I'd rather have a smooth spool up and then a flat TQ curve in the higher RPM's than what the S55 motors produce.

For sure! It's a matter of taste but I like smooth power delivery vs instant TQ. The S55 can be tuned to be more linear and both engines are inherently "Surgey" but a larger single should be a bit more linear fundamentally. For me it all comes down to feel but cost is a reality most can't ignore.

For comparison sake, PS2 on the N55 is cheaper. When combined with supporting mods it should be much cheaper. One vs two of everything for the hard parts. That could be offset depending on the cost of the S55 HPFP conversion, but I'm betting the value/savings will remain.

[akkando]

Originally Posted by AlexCirci

2019 base M2 won't have the S55. Only CS and you won't get one unless you are already on a list. Also as previously stated why do you need 500+ for HPDE car... if you want a pure driving experience get an M2, mod appropriately (brakes, fueling, cooling, tune) and enjoy.

Cheers

All 2019 model year M2s will have the detuned S55, the N55 won't be in any MY 2019 M2s.

[AlexCirci]

Originally Posted by akkando

All 2019 model year M2s will have the detuned S55, the N55 won't be in any MY 2019 M2s.

Source? No way BMW would put S55 in a "base" M2

[minimal_]

Originally Posted by AlexCirci

Source? No way BMW would put S55 in a "base" M2

I realize its all rumors right now, but what is it that makes it seem so unlikely to you?

[akkando]

Originally Posted by AlexCirci

Source? No way BMW would put S55 in a "base" M2

It's in the stickied "CS" threads on the front page. Basically the N55 base M2 is hitting end of production after MY18 and the only thing left at that time on the internal BMW schedule was the M2 Competition. No B58 version has been seen in testing so it seems almost impossible that would come out of nowhere.

[AlexCirci]

Originally Posted by minimal_

I realize its all rumors right now, but what is it that makes it seem so unlikely to you?

Yes rumors. I find it unlikely for a few reasons.

The M2 is BMW's "budget" entry level M car. With the S55 we would see a significant price increase.

I'd think it'd also effect M3/4 sales. It would also probably piss off a good number of N55 M2 owners.

[akkando]

Originally Posted by AlexCirci

Source? No way BMW would put S55 in a "base" M2

http://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho...&postcount=136

"Well well well...

To be honest, I never even bothered to check the EOP of the original M2. Just never thought I would discover anything newsworthy...

June 2018.

Let the outrage begin."


http://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho...85&postcount=1

'M2 COMPETITION' UPDATE #4 (DECEMBER 2017)
Autumn 2017: 'M2 Competition' PR campaign cars have been built (see here);
Winter 2017-2018: release and presentation of the M2 Competition (presentation location currently still unknown, but guessed to be the Geneva International Motor Show in March 2018 as likely venue - see here);
mid 2018: M2 Competition (3.0 S55 engine - 302kW) replaces the base M2 (3.0 N55 engine - 272 kW);

[M2PDX]

Originally Posted by AlexCirci

2019 base M2 won't have the S55. Only CS and you won't get one unless you are already on a list. Also as previously stated why do you need 500+ for HPDE car... if you want a pure driving experience get an M2, mod appropriately (brakes, fueling, cooling, tune) and enjoy.

Cheers

Actually, the S55 will be the only engine available starting late summer, according to all of the information on the forum.