[marcva]

The 3 series used to live on this list. Times have changed.

[chris719]

Originally Posted by marcva

The 3 series used to live on this list. Times have changed.

Indeed. The competition has raised their game and BMW has only softened their cars in their empty quest to win the sales volume crown.

I'm not sure I fault them. What the average person wants and what enthusiasts want are not the same thing. They are a business and so they are chasing the money.

They need to be careful though. They are a strong brand because of their reputation. They need to be providing something the bigger manufacturers do not. If they keep watering the cars down, what is the point of a BMW?

[Poochie]

Originally Posted by chris719

Indeed. The competition has raised their game and BMW has only softened their cars in their empty quest to win the sales volume crown.

I'm not sure I fault them. What the average person wants and what enthusiasts want are not the same thing. They are a business and so they are chasing the money.

Word..

There used to be a time, not to long ago when all BMWs models (Except the 7 series) came standard with a manual transmission; automatic was an added cost option.. Now, in this day and age, it's in reverse..

A lot of direction where BMW is headed is to cater towards current demand, which means softening around the edges..

BMW is going Level 5, self-driving electric cars by 2030, so enjoy the 'ride' while you still can..

https://www.motortrend.com/news/bmw-...iving-machine/

[carve29]

[QUOTE=Poochie;24090574]Word..

A lot of direction where BMW is headed is to cater towards current demand, which means softening around the edges..

BMW is going Level 5, self-driving electric cars by 2030, so enjoy the 'ride' while you still can..

...Totally agree. The people on this forum are a very small minority...and I'm one of them. The vast majority of "drivers" don't really even want to drive. In less than 10 years, Uber/Lyft subscriptions, self-driving cars, auto sharing, etc. will be the dominant forms of transportation. The insurance savings and overall cost/hassle to drive will win out and I understand. I live in Atlanta and it's a nightmare dealing with distracted drivers, traffic, parking, terrible road conditions (potholes everywhere). The menu of cars in the future will be sterile/generic and the designs will be focused on efficiency and cabin comfort/tech.

[HPIA4v2]

[QUOTE=carve29;24091561]

Originally Posted by Poochie

Word..

A lot of direction where BMW is headed is to cater towards current demand, which means softening around the edges..

BMW is going Level 5, self-driving electric cars by 2030, so enjoy the 'ride' while you still can..

...Totally agree. The people on this forum are a very small minority...and I'm one of them. The vast majority of "drivers" don't really even want to drive. In less than 10 years, Uber/Lyft subscriptions, self-driving cars, auto sharing, etc. will be the dominant forms of transportation. The insurance savings and overall cost/hassle to drive will win out and I understand. I live in Atlanta and it's a nightmare dealing with distracted drivers, traffic, parking, terrible road conditions (potholes everywhere). The menu of cars in the future will be sterile/generic and the designs will be focused on efficiency and cabin comfort/tech.

And no more tracks, just go to arcade, hop onto driving simulator for a couple of hours. Then on your way home in one of those people transporters.
Geeee life would be boring in 20 years from now; virtual driving, virtual vacation even virtual sex. Well, I guess Anthropologists are wrong, diseases would not end humanity but machines/computers will.

[Poochie]

[QUOTE=HPIA4v2;24091611]

Originally Posted by carve29

And no more tracks, just go to arcade, hop onto driving simulator for a couple of hours. Then on your way home in one of those people transporters.
Geeee life would be boring in 20 years from now; virtual driving, virtual vacation even virtual sex. Well, I guess Anthropologists are wrong, diseases would not end humanity but machines/computers will.

It's moving at a slow pace due to economic factors but that's where we're eventually headed..

I'm sure the folks in 70s couldn't imagine a day where you could have porn on a mobile phone.. #Progress

Check out this predictive video from 1974:

[marcva]

[QUOTE=HPIA4v2;24091611]

Originally Posted by carve29

And no more tracks, just go to arcade, hop onto driving simulator for a couple of hours. Then on your way home in one of those people transporters.
Geeee life would be boring in 20 years from now; virtual driving, virtual vacation even virtual sex. Well, I guess Anthropologists are wrong, diseases would not end humanity but machines/computers will.

I have the seat, PC and VR goggles plus fanatec wheel. I just need to grab the pedals and a motion base. It'll be great for teaching the kids.

[switzerr]

For the first time since I started reading"Car and Driver" (1980, maybe?), all of the cars I own are now on that list. Sort of. LCI M2, Mk 7.5 GTI, and my NA Miata (the ND is as close to an NA as we are likely to ever get again).

[bri1042]

Every car I've bought since 1995 has been on the list when it was introduced, if not when I actually bought one. The two cars I bought that were on the list when the model was introduced but not when I bought mine were my 2006 RSX-S and my 16 340iX. '95 Integra GS-R, 2002 RSX-S, 2010 and 2013 BMW 328i, and my M2C were all on the list for their model years.

Total coincidence since their list has nothing to do with my desire for a car.

[Project_F87]

Originally Posted by Poochie

Notice how he vaguely said "the tweaked suspension" I honestly believe he's referring to just the shiny new carbon fiber strut brace everyone is raving about and not the actual dampers or springs.. That's businessman i.e. bs talk..

I don't believe the M2C carbon brace is anything more than eye candy.. The M2 already had a massively amount of reinforcement, including a less attractive strut brace, so how much difference can a carbon piece possible make..

BTW a lot of the reinforcement in the M2 wasn't new; it was all borrowed from the standard convertible 2 series and the rest from the M4.. So they didn't exactly reinvent the wheel with M2 chassis.

I'm not criticizing the guy, just keeping it real.

Do me a favor and go drive one back to back from your M2 like I did and you'll notice the changes immediately. It's very impressive how much more responsive the car is.

[Poochie]

Originally Posted by alaing51

Do me a favor and go drive one back to back from your M2 like I did and you'll notice the changes immediately. It's very impressive how much more responsive the car is.

How? Magic?

It wouldn't be fair to doubt you because I didn't drive both vehicles to compare their subtle nuances like you did but logical would dictate that if they share the same exact parts how much different can they possibly feel..

I know factually the S55 is way more powerful motor and that's its crown jewel but suspension wise they're have the same hardware minus the strut brace and some software tuning.

[Project_F87]

Originally Posted by Poochie

How? Magic?

It wouldn't be fair to doubt you because I didn't drive both vehicles to compare their subtle nuances like you did but logical would dictate that if they share the same exact parts how much different can they possibly feel..

I know factually the S55 is way more powerful motor and that's its crown jewel but suspension wise they're have the same hardware minus the strut brace and some software tuning.

They've tuned the suspension components of the car from what I understand. I know the parts may be the same, but they could definitely have tuned them differently when putting the car together.

[Poochie]

Originally Posted by alaing51

They've tuned the suspension components of the car from what I understand. I know the parts may be the same, but they could definitely have tuned them differently when putting the car together.

How did they tune non-adaptive suspension?

It's the same car with a different motor, don't buy into the hype.

Not a negative thing, just stating facts.. Now if you can prove me wrong with any substantive facts beside a feeling; I'm always willing to learn and accept a new outlook.

[marcva]

[QUOTE=Poochie;24095988]How did they tune non-adaptive suspension?

It's the same car with a different motor, don't buy into the hype.

Not a negative thing, just stating facts.

Not sure about the details, but it would be possible to use slightly different spring weights and swaybar thicknesses to "tune" the static feel of a car. Swapping out the M3/4 suspension for the old M2 suspension changed the tune of the car. I don't know enough about the relative weights, but I could see the M3 suspension being a touch more compliant than the "driftmobile," as it served a broader audience and had a "competition pack" variant that allowed for a stiffer alternative.

I'm sure someone will quote the specs soon enough.

[G80indy]

Type R !!
Yeah baby, yeah !

[Robin_NL]

Everybody and I mean literally everybody who drove OG M2 and M2C back to back (including me, coming from OG M2) stated the ride felt different in M2C. Even the journos.

But we have to stick to the paper facts!
Mind you: This statement coming from someone who hasn't driven both of them.

I'll get some more coffee.

Cheers
Robin