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      07-23-2020, 01:47 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leftkeylife View Post
If you look at both times that were ran by Christian Gebhardt, they are as follows.

718 GT4 1:53.9 (this is also referenced in the m2CS vs CS racing link)
M2 CS 1:54.8 (M2 CS also ran a 1:55.8 in a previous Hock GP run with SportAuto)

Funny how they seemed to cherry pick the time done by a different driver (Uwe S) vs the time Christian ran for both. One could easily call the M2 CS time a 1:55.8 by that same methodology.

So realistically the GT4 is still a good bit faster as a 1 second delta is pretty big here.

To add, the GT4 was a manual and the M2 CS a DCT so I think once the GT4 gets PDK it is probably 2+ seconds faster here. Really not that close overall.
PDK available for 2021 GT4.
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      07-24-2020, 12:34 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by hellrotm View Post
PDK available for 2021 GT4.
Very true. I am not sure it needs PDK, but I am sure it will be fantastic. It's PDK, there is no better automated manual out there. I do think the 6MT in the GT4 is also quite possibly the best manual put in a car though too (any manual in the GT2/3 and S2000 are also right there) so either way you're set! It's nice to even be able to spec manual, let alone a great one.

Last edited by Leftkeylife; 07-24-2020 at 12:44 PM..
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      07-25-2020, 08:02 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by c1pher View Post
As much as I love my 718, I think Porsche screwed up by succumbing to the media and offering a flat 6 that doesn't really perform better than the previous turbo flat four. i believe the 718 GTS did 1:56 at Hockenheim with 50 less HP. If the GT4 had been the more punchy flat 4, there would be a much better result. JMO, the new flat six doesn't sound all that hot either.
Iíve been a bit confused by the sound too - I have a 981 BGTS with the 3.4L flat six, and it sounds crazy good. So do the ďotherĒ 3.8 and 4L engines...Iím hoping itís just the EU particulate filters and that the US car will sound a lot better, but Iíve been underwhelmed by all the videos Iíve seen.

Need to see one in person to hear the real deal. The 718 Spyder is hopefully my next ride, someday.
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      07-26-2020, 12:27 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by M-Pilot View Post
I think it sounds pretty good even in stock form (especially the US version). However, an aftermarket system completely transforms it. This sound is a good enough reason for me to pick one:


Ok, that sounds amazing.
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      07-26-2020, 05:11 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by dmboone25 View Post
Ok, that sounds amazing.
Sounds so much like a GT3. Very Le Mans racer. Also excited to see how much power this 4.0 liter will make. Can it achieve 475-500 hp with full bolt on suite? I am inclined to think so since the GT3 and GT3RS are able to put up substantial gains on a much platform that is way more tuned from the factory.

Last edited by Leftkeylife; 07-26-2020 at 05:18 PM..
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      07-27-2020, 09:53 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by babaikram View Post
Please read the blow from Pistonhead


https://www.pistonheads.com/news/gen...20Smart%20List
Awesome thanks for sharing!
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      08-12-2020, 10:37 AM   #29
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Looks like Sport Auto just ran the M2CS at the Ring and it did 7:43. It's well off the pace of a 6MT 718 GT4; about 11 seconds since Sport Auto did 7:32 recently. I would guess the PDK version will be 4-6 seconds fast than the 6MT.
Interesting that the M2CS is also slower than the 2016 981 GT4 which with Sport Auto ran 7:42 (only manual was available).
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      08-12-2020, 11:19 AM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leftkeylife View Post
Looks like Sport Auto just ran the M2CS at the Ring and it did 7:43. It's well off the pace of a 6MT 718 GT4; about 11 seconds since Sport Auto did 7:32 recently. I would guess the PDK version will be 4-6 seconds fast than the 6MT.
Interesting that the M2CS is also slower than the 2016 981 GT4 which with Sport Auto ran 7:42 (only manual was available).
I think the impressiveness of the CS happens when your significant other calls you mid lap to request a stop at Costco on the way home to pick up a months worth of groceries. The ability to perform that task is going to leave some time on the table against a GT4.
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      08-13-2020, 08:38 AM   #31
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Originally Posted by medphysdave View Post
I think the impressiveness of the CS happens when your significant other calls you mid lap to request a stop at Costco on the way home to pick up a months worth of groceries. The ability to perform that task is going to leave some time on the table against a GT4.
Well, you can fit plenty in the GT4 too as it does have 14.9 cubic ft of space between the two trunks. The M2 CS only has 13.8 cubic ft in its trunk by comparison. The GT4 is practical enough to get plenty of groceries if you so wish.

Either way, the performance delta (718 GT4 is faster than the 500 hp M4 GTS too by a good amount) here is pretty massive and only larger once the GT4 gets PDK. I would like to see an M2C with Cup2s and see how close it is to the CS (maybe within 2-3 seconds?) since I think most of the delta there is down to tires. I'm just not sure the CS moniker proves to be worth the massive premium over the Competition. It looks good, but the performance is not a huge step up beyond stickier tires.
People claimed the 718 GT4 wasn't going to be a huge step over the 981 GT4, but it has proven to be a different league of performance.

One could also argue that a Panamera turbo (not turbo S) on summer tires which ran 7:38 in 2017 and the M5C which did a couple seconds faster recently, are equally impressive in that they are 4500 lb cars. And just today, 2020 Panamera did 7:29. Wow.

Last edited by Leftkeylife; 08-13-2020 at 11:57 AM..
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      08-13-2020, 05:28 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leftkeylife View Post
Well, you can fit plenty in the GT4 too as it does have 14.9 cubic ft of space between the two trunks. The M2 CS only has 13.8 cubic ft in its trunk by comparison. The GT4 is practical enough to get plenty of groceries if you so wish.

Either way, the performance delta (718 GT4 is faster than the 500 hp M4 GTS too by a good amount) here is pretty massive and only larger once the GT4 gets PDK. I would like to see an M2C with Cup2s and see how close it is to the CS (maybe within 2-3 seconds?) since I think most of the delta there is down to tires. I'm just not sure the CS moniker proves to be worth the massive premium over the Competition. It looks good, but the performance is not a huge step up beyond stickier tires.
People claimed the 718 GT4 wasn't going to be a huge step over the 981 GT4, but it has proven to be a different league of performance.

One could also argue that a Panamera turbo (not turbo S) on summer tires which ran 7:38 in 2017 and the M5C which did a couple seconds faster recently, are equally impressive in that they are 4500 lb cars. And just today, 2020 Panamera did 7:29. Wow.
I think if you only need two seats it's tough to argue. Id probably go with the spyder.
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      08-13-2020, 05:56 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by medphysdave View Post
I think if you only need two seats it's tough to argue. Id probably go with the spyder.
I've always preferred hard roofs, but I do think the Spyder may be the prettiest top down car out there along with the Speedster except that the Spyder is 1/3 the price and not too far off in performance.
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      08-13-2020, 07:18 PM   #34
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If one doesn’t need rear seats, it is not even a question which one to choose.

GT4 or a Spyder is hands down a better car.
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      08-13-2020, 08:01 PM   #35
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Once the GT4 has pdk. What will be the main draw to the GT3?
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      08-13-2020, 11:12 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by medphysdave View Post
Once the GT4 has pdk. What will be the main draw to the GT3?
Higher performance, better engine, just more of everything.
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      08-14-2020, 09:11 AM   #37
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Quote:
Originally Posted by medphysdave View Post
Once the GT4 has pdk. What will be the main draw to the GT3?
Different driving dynamics. While Porsche keeps pushing the engine in the 911s further up in the chassis, they still do drive differently and have unique experiences. I love the balance and feel of a 911. They make most anything else feel imprecise by comparison. The Cayman chassis is just a super hero - really one of the best mid-engined cars around bar none.

The other thing is, and it's a bit crazy, but they hold back development of the GT4 so, so, so much. They don't go and pull all the stops like they do the 2RS/3/3RS and yet look how good the GT4 is. They can't without seriously invading the 911 hierarchy.
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      08-15-2020, 04:36 AM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hellrotm View Post
PDK available for 2021 GT4.
There is also GT4 RS coming with PDK only, allegedly 450 HP.
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      08-15-2020, 08:02 PM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by medphysdave View Post
Once the GT4 has pdk. What will be the main draw to the GT3?
GT4RS with PDK will be stupendous on track. One area where a GT3 will always shine, though, is threshold braking. The rear engine makes that platform so stable under heavy braking on track.
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      08-16-2020, 03:18 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leftkeylife View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by medphysdave View Post
I think the impressiveness of the CS happens when your significant other calls you mid lap to request a stop at Costco on the way home to pick up a months worth of groceries. The ability to perform that task is going to leave some time on the table against a GT4.
Well, you can fit plenty in the GT4 too as it does have 14.9 cubic ft of space between the two trunks. The M2 CS only has 13.8 cubic ft in its trunk by comparison. The GT4 is practical enough to get plenty of groceries if you so wish.

Either way, the performance delta (718 GT4 is faster than the 500 hp M4 GTS too by a good amount) here is pretty massive and only larger once the GT4 gets PDK. I would like to see an M2C with Cup2s and see how close it is to the CS (maybe within 2-3 seconds?) since I think most of the delta there is down to tires. I'm just not sure the CS moniker proves to be worth the massive premium over the Competition. It looks good, but the performance is not a huge step up beyond stickier tires.
People claimed the 718 GT4 wasn't going to be a huge step over the 981 GT4, but it has proven to be a different league of performance.

One could also argue that a Panamera turbo (not turbo S) on summer tires which ran 7:38 in 2017 and the M5C which did a couple seconds faster recently, are equally impressive in that they are 4500 lb cars. And just today, 2020 Panamera did 7:29. Wow.
You could put a ton of stuff in the back seats of the m2 and get really odd shaped stuff in by folding the rear seats down.

I'm sure the Cayman can fit more than people realize but you can get almost anything in an m2 besides a new television.
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      08-16-2020, 03:19 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by medphysdave View Post
Once the GT4 has pdk. What will be the main draw to the GT3?
gearing maybe?
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      09-07-2020, 12:53 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dmboone25 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by c1pher View Post
As much as I love my 718, I think Porsche screwed up by succumbing to the media and offering a flat 6 that doesn't really perform better than the previous turbo flat four. i believe the 718 GTS did 1:56 at Hockenheim with 50 less HP. If the GT4 had been the more punchy flat 4, there would be a much better result. JMO, the new flat six doesn't sound all that hot either.
I’ve been a bit confused by the sound too - I have a 981 BGTS with the 3.4L flat six, and it sounds crazy good. So do the “other” 3.8 and 4L engines...I’m hoping it’s just the EU particulate filters and that the US car will sound a lot better, but I’ve been underwhelmed by all the videos I’ve seen.

Need to see one in person to hear the real deal. The 718 Spyder is hopefully my next ride, someday.
AFAIK the US spec 718 has the same exhaust restriction as they didn't want to have different engine tunes for different exhaust back pressures. It basically has a some differences to the interior construction of the filter, but I havnt seen a definitive answer. The 718 exhaust valves also stay closed for noise regs in the lower rev range (until around 4k). The 718 still has a fantastic induction sound but a much quieter exhaust compared to the 981 (which is loud and absolutely glorious). Luckily the GPF style section on USDM cars is not emissions monitored so it can be removed. Soul, Fabspeed etc. all have versions of the over axel pipes which remove the restriction.
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      09-07-2020, 07:07 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leftkeylife View Post
I've always preferred hard roofs, but I do think the Spyder may be the prettiest top down car out there along with the Speedster except that the Spyder is 1/3 the price and not too far off in performance.
The Spyder is definitely the one to have in my opinion unless youíre a crazy serious track junkie. The previous Spyders didnít have all the same GT components, but the 718 is really a GT4 Spyder.

Iím saving all my nickels and dimes.
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      09-08-2020, 10:15 AM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Montaver View Post
AFAIK the US spec 718 has the same exhaust restriction as they didn't want to have different engine tunes for different exhaust back pressures. It basically has a some differences to the interior construction of the filter, but I havnt seen a definitive answer. The 718 exhaust valves also stay closed for noise regs in the lower rev range (until around 4k). The 718 still has a fantastic induction sound but a much quieter exhaust compared to the 981 (which is loud and absolutely glorious). Luckily the GPF style section on USDM cars is not emissions monitored so it can be removed. Soul, Fabspeed etc. all have versions of the over axel pipes which remove the restriction.
You are correct on the OPF/GPF, mostly the same but not monitored. I have Akrapovic over axel pipes on the way and they were cheaper than both SOUL and Fabspeedís stainless steel pipes. They open up a lot of sound. Otherwise, even stock the car sounds absolutely glorious - induction, engine, and exhaust sound through the range is nothing short of incredible, albeit a bit quiet.

Last edited by HeelToeShift; 09-08-2020 at 10:27 AM..
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