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M2 Technical Topics > Suspension | Brakes | Chassis > 2NH M Sport Brakes & M Performance Parts Brakes: bigger and ± 16 kg / 35 lbs extra

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      05-22-2018, 02:28 AM   #89
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So, 68 kg more for the M2C vs. M2 LCI. Add the performance break and the M2C is still more heavier: 68+15 = 83 kg !!!
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      05-22-2018, 03:11 AM   #90
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Originally Posted by Motorsport_M View Post
So, 68 kg more for the M2C vs. M2 LCI. Add the performance break and the M2C is still more heavier: 68+15 = 83 kg !!!
Yes but the goal is dismount the whole car and retrofit all the carbon parts for just 15000 usd +\- basically heavier than m3 m4
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      05-22-2018, 10:16 AM   #91
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Originally Posted by Motorsport_M View Post
So, 68 kg more for the M2C vs. M2 LCI. Add the performance break and the M2C is still more heavier: 68+15 = 83 kg !!!
Where you live, Europe and in UK the M2C is 55kg more than M2LCI and 10kg less than M4.

If you don’t want the weight then don’t add the option. It is a novel concept isn’t it, who would think larger calipers and rotors weigh more on every single car you add them too. If you would rather have less braking performance and less weight...don’t add them. You want the increased braking performance and don’t mind the weight...then add them. If you want larger brakes and less weight, source oem M4 CCB rotors for the upgraded 2NH calipers. Every option is available for people in Europe since the brakes aren’t standard.

Last edited by hellrotm; 05-22-2018 at 10:52 AM..
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      05-22-2018, 10:26 AM   #92
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackJetE90 View Post
If you don’t want the weight then don’t add the option. It is a novel concept isn’t it, who would think larger calipers and rotors weigh more on ever single car you add them too. If you would rather have less braking performance and less weight...don’t add them. You want the increased braking performance and don’t mind the weight...then add them. If you want larger brakes and less weight, source oem M4 CCB rotors for the upgraded 2NH calipers. Every option is available for people in Europe since the brakes aren’t standard.
It is currently up in the air as to whether we will have the option not to take them in the US. It looks like they may come standard, which is at the heart of the debate.
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      05-22-2018, 10:35 AM   #93
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Originally Posted by Cavpilot2k View Post
It is currently up in the air as to whether we will have the option not to take them in the US. It looks like they may come standard, which is at the heart of the debate.
Correct US specs are not known. But the two individuals above are from overseas and have the choice, if the weight from larger brakes bothers them so much. So honestly they shouldn’t be b*tching. It still boggles my mind that it’s news to anyone larger calipers and rotors add weight.

They should come standard by the way. That would be amazing.

Last edited by hellrotm; 05-22-2018 at 10:53 AM..
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      05-22-2018, 10:39 AM   #94
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Quote:
Originally Posted by infinitekidM2 View Post
You'll need the big brake kit to help stop the car with the extra weight of those big brakes...oh wait!
1+

#irony
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      05-22-2018, 10:51 AM   #95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chris719 View Post
They are the same brakes but there are far fewer complaints about the blue brakes on the M3/M4. I think there is better airflow to cool them on the M3/M4.
M3/M4 calipers turn green just like M2.
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      05-22-2018, 11:09 AM   #96
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Quote:
Originally Posted by infinitekidM2 View Post
You'll need the big brake kit to help stop the car with the extra weight of those big brakes...oh wait!
Well apparently, the majority of Europeans get to spec the car they want it. That's actually quite nice.

Personally, BlackJetE90 if you want to hear the least kvetching , then you should root for the 2nh brakes to be a no cost added option ( just like the moonroof option vs carbon fiber roof on M3/M4) so that buyers can decide what setup they want and you won't have to tell people not to complain... they can have

19s for life with the big silvers vs stock brakes which have the flexibility of using 18s for track tires or winter tires.

The entirety of the united states sees enough variation in climate that this really is the most logical choice. Are 19" snow tires readily available?

Last edited by M3 Adjuster; 05-22-2018 at 01:10 PM..
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      05-22-2018, 11:24 AM   #97
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M3 Adjuster View Post
Well apparently, the majority of Europeans get to spec the car they want it. That's actually quite nice.

Personally, BlackJetE90 if you want to hear the least kvetching , then you should root for the 2nh brakes to be a no cost added option ( just like the moonroof option vs carbon fiber roof on M3/M4) so that buyers can decide what setup they want and you won't have to tell people not to complain... they can have

19s for life with the big silvers vs stock brakes which have the flexibility of using 18s for track tires or winter tires.
this but we will see soon enough what "options" we have.
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      05-25-2018, 12:42 AM   #98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Franzino View Post
2NH are not standard...they are an option
confirmed standard for us market
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      05-26-2018, 08:18 AM   #99
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Originally Posted by Artemis View Post
The majority of my 35K kms so far with my M2: German Autobahn and mountains.

On long Authobahn drives (many consecutive hours of driving) I experience some mild brake vibration and mild fading after some time, as a result from repeated braking at very high speed....
Very helpful description. Thanks!

For my intended use mostly on Norwegian roads, I believe the stock brakes would be more than sufficient. I don’t expect any 'voooaaam' noise in our speed limits… For track use, I may have to change to track pads anyways. The stock brakes also enables me to use 18” wheels for the winter.
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      05-26-2018, 09:19 AM   #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dermator View Post
Very helpful description. Thanks!

For my intended use mostly on Norwegian roads, I believe the stock brakes would be more than sufficient. I don’t expect any 'voooaaam' noise in our speed limits… For track use, I may have to change to track pads anyways. The stock brakes also enables me to use 18” wheels for the winter.
Braking on the Autobahn from 270 km/h 150 km/h is evidently more straining for the brakes than braking from 170 km/h to 50 km/h. A matter of physics: energy. On the Autobahn you don't run out of tarmac for repeatedly hitting V-max limits.

A race track, on the other hand, is bloody straining for the brakes because you brake much more frequently and more intense in a short period of time. No time to cool down. Hence, the importance of cool down laps.

Mountains got their unique feature when compared to the Autobahn and race tracks: lower speed (2nd/3rd gear dancing) but high gradient levels (and different pressure levels for tires because of height changes) + (possible) oncoming traffic + road surfaces of all sorts (good to bad) + temperature & humidity variation: the brakes are strained when giving it the spurs up/down a mountain from hairpin to hairpin. Especially during 'spirited' downhill stints, for obvious reasons: required brake power to reduce the Newtons deployed to properly negotiate the hairpin. Especially in the mountains - apart from the highest level of self-restraint - high quality brakes & tires are of prime importance for your safety and other's safety. Way up there, you definitely don't want to run out of talent & tarmac (totaling the car and yourself) or run into another road user.
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      05-26-2018, 01:10 PM   #101
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Artemis View Post
Braking on the Autobahn from 270 km/h 150 km/h is evidently more straining for the brakes than braking from 170 km/h to 50 km/h. A matter of physics: energy....
Yes, in that scenario almost 2 times as much kinetic energy have to be converted to heat

I agree. Safety first. For me it is not about breaking records. You are making me think twice about my decision. It sounds like you are actually missing some stopping power. I thought the standard brakes would be safe and sufficient, even for spirited driving in the mountains (using common sense on public roads).
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      05-26-2018, 01:24 PM   #102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dermator View Post
Yes, in that scenario almost 2 times as much kinetic energy have to be converted to heat

I agree. Safety first. For me it is not about breaking records. You are making me think twice about my decision. It sounds like you are actually missing some stopping power. I thought the standard brakes would be safe and sufficient, even for spirited driving in the mountains (using common sense on public roads).
The standard brakes are sufficient, definitely. They are already big.

But if BMW would have offered 2NH (M Sport Brakes) back in 2016, I would have ordered them. That's why I consider getting the M Performance brakes for my car (available at the end of this year). I prefer the improved braking over the extra weight of those.
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      05-26-2018, 01:31 PM   #103
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackJetE90 View Post
the F10 M5 400x36mm front rotor, as I believe the front is the same exact setup(caliper/rotor).
Negative ghostrider.

They both are 400x36 2p Floating Front, but they are not the exact same disc assembly due to the difference in rotor offset. The calipers are also slightly different. Using the F10M Blue Brembo MN6 Radial Mount as the baseline, these are the differences for the other similar variations:

F10M MCCB Gold MN6 - Titanium Pistons, additional 5mm Caliper Mounting Surface Length.

F8X MCCB Gold MN6- Same as above with Axial Mount Caliper Adapter Bracket

F87 M2C Grey/Red MN6 -Same Caliper Housing and bracket as F8x MCCB, but with Stainless Pistons.
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      05-26-2018, 01:43 PM   #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lemetier View Post
The M2C rear discs are F8x MCCB hats with new iron friction rings.
The rear 2NH rotor hat looks nothing like the CCB rotor hat.
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      05-26-2018, 02:04 PM   #105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackJetE90 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by lemetier View Post
The M2C rear discs are F8x MCCB hats with new iron friction rings.
The rear 2NH rotor hat looks nothing like the CCB rotor hat.
Good catch. Was looking at prototype assembly instead of production spec. Now removed.
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      05-26-2018, 02:25 PM   #106
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Artemis View Post
The standard brakes are sufficient, definitely. They are already big.

But if BMW would have offered 2NH (M Sport Brakes) back in 2016, I would have ordered them. That's why I consider getting the M Performance brakes for my car (available at the end of this year). I prefer the improved braking over the extra weight of those.
Remember...brakes don't stop the car....but tires do. If you work from the tire backwards you can spec the "best" brakes. The current M2 brakes with track pads can engage ABS even with Rcomps or slicks, therefore any bigger brake is just added weight. One can argue cooling and thermal efficiency but on virtually every street tire these new bigger brakes are for show only....with unnecessary added cost and weight. They do look pretty!
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      05-26-2018, 03:16 PM   #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlackJetE90 View Post
The rear 2NH rotor hat looks nothing like the CCB rotor hat.
They look like F10 M5 parts from pics.
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      05-26-2018, 04:44 PM   #108
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I don't care about the track, that twin turbo motor with its GT-R-like power potential; those BBK brakes are welcomed on the public streets... #ICantDrive55
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      05-26-2018, 04:58 PM   #109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Twt View Post
Remember...brakes don't stop the car....but tires do. If you work from the tire backwards you can spec the "best" brakes. The current M2 brakes with track pads can engage ABS even with Rcomps or slicks, therefore any bigger brake is just added weight. One can argue cooling and thermal efficiency but on virtually every street tire these new bigger brakes are for show only....with unnecessary added cost and weight. They do look pretty!
Yeah you're right. The size is generally about thermals for repeat braking. I find it implausible that someone has caused their blue brakes to fade on the street and still has a driver's license. Maybe on the autobahn. They aren't single piston floating caliper Civic brakes.

I have noticed differences in pedal feel, initial bite, and other modulation related characteristics between stock and upgraded brakes, but I doubt it affects braking distance of the first couple emergency stops.
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      05-26-2018, 05:33 PM   #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chris719 View Post
Yeah you're right. The size is generally about thermals for repeat braking. I find it implausible that someone has caused their blue brakes to fade on the street and still has a driver's license. Maybe on the autobahn. They aren't single piston floating caliper Civic brakes.

I have noticed differences in pedal feel, initial bite, and other modulation related characteristics between stock and upgraded brakes, but I doubt it affects braking distance of the first couple emergency stops.
You should see how some of the yahoo’s drive on SoCal cayon roads. Surprised they still have a license.
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