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      11-07-2019, 09:47 AM   #1
mctga
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F87 N55 Coolant Change

Have any OG M2 owners done a coolant change yet? Early cars will be 3 and a half years old now so getting towards the age where a coolant change would be considered, assuming you donít buy in to BMWís lifetime coolant idea. Mine is a Sep 16 build and is a keeper so Iím about to do a coolant change myself.

Glysantin make the coolant and they state 3-4 years being the lifetime so not consistent with BMWís advice.

I did a coolant change on my M135i and I expect the M2 to be similar but there are some key differences;

You need to remove the front axle stiffening plate to access the water pump so that the hose can be removed for the drain, and replace the tension bolts.

Coolant capacity is 10.5 ltr vs 6.7 on standard N55.

I donít have access to an air compressor so intend to just use the inbuilt bleed function to bleed trapped air. This worked fine on my M135i.

Has anyone else done this maintenance to their M2 yet?
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      11-14-2019, 04:50 PM   #2
Wattens
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Yeah, I had mine done when I had a Turbosmart Electronic Diverter Valve installed a few months ago as it is near impossible to do without moving the coolant pipes out of the way.
The place I used just used the BMW Coolant (which is the exact same product as Gysantin G48 silicated hybrid).

From what I remember seeing, they removed the bottom bash plate and dropped what looked like a front sway bar and they could access the water pump/coolant pipe from there.
It wasn't a hard job but seemed easy because it was on a lift.

Mine is an April 16 build. There were no signs of corrosion. I personally wouldn't have changed it until after 5 years, but as it had to get drained to reach the diverter valve, what's the harm in replacing it?
Do remember that a "factory fill for life" for most OEM's is around 7-10 years. It doesn't actually mean "filled for the whole life of the vehicle' which is quite misleading and confusing.
I'm not sure how much coolant they used.

Full disclosure I do this for a living, meaning I'm a product manager for Oil and Chemicals companies, so I have a better idea than most forum users and I've managed BASF/Gysantin, Halterman Carless etc... in the UK, Europe, and Australia.

Also, I highly recommend upgrading the diverter valve with the Turbosmart Kompact EM product, the stock plastic diverter valve leaks boost. Don't waste your time with the GFB DV+, I tried that first because it was cheaper and it destroyed my OEM diverter valve, the Turbosmart one replaces the OEM diverter valve so when it comes time to sell, put the OEM one back on and use the Turbosmart one for the next car.

Hope this helps
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      11-15-2019, 03:48 PM   #3
mctga
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wattens View Post
Yeah, I had mine done when I had a Turbosmart Electronic Diverter Valve installed a few months ago as it is near impossible to do without moving the coolant pipes out of the way.
The place I used just used the BMW Coolant (which is the exact same product as Gysantin G48 silicated hybrid).

From what I remember seeing, they removed the bottom bash plate and dropped what looked like a front sway bar and they could access the water pump/coolant pipe from there.
It wasn't a hard job but seemed easy because it was on a lift.

Mine is an April 16 build. There were no signs of corrosion. I personally wouldn't have changed it until after 5 years, but as it had to get drained to reach the diverter valve, what's the harm in replacing it?
Do remember that a "factory fill for life" for most OEM's is around 7-10 years. It doesn't actually mean "filled for the whole life of the vehicle' which is quite misleading and confusing.
I'm not sure how much coolant they used.

Full disclosure I do this for a living, meaning I'm a product manager for Oil and Chemicals companies, so I have a better idea than most forum users and I've managed BASF/Gysantin, Halterman Carless etc... in the UK, Europe, and Australia.

Also, I highly recommend upgrading the diverter valve with the Turbosmart Kompact EM product, the stock plastic diverter valve leaks boost. Don't waste your time with the GFB DV+, I tried that first because it was cheaper and it destroyed my OEM diverter valve, the Turbosmart one replaces the OEM diverter valve so when it comes time to sell, put the OEM one back on and use the Turbosmart one for the next car.

Hope this helps
Thanks for sharing that. My understanding of the process was pretty much as youíve described. Having access to a lift would make it much easier. When I did the coolant change on my last N55 it was on low profile ramps in my garage and access was tight but just doable. The M2 is lower and access for removing the belly plate is really tight so I think I need some new ramps.

Other than that though it should be pretty straight forward.

As you say, changing coolant at 3 years is on the early side so Iím in no rush but will definitely get it done in the next twelve months. I enjoy wrenching on my cars and Iíve found BMWís easy to maintain for the home diyíer.

On Glysantinís website they state 3-4 years life, so less than 7-10 although it will probably be safe a little longer than their recommendation before it becomes too acidic.

Thanks for the heads up on the diverted valve too, sounds worth looking in to!
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      11-15-2019, 04:30 PM   #4
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Well, in the same way that BMW claim the coolant is a 'lifetime' fill, so the manufacturer of said coolant will claim it needs changing every time you drive the car.

In the meantime: Has it changed colour? Does it still feel oily?

I also run a 2002 E46 330ci. According to the paperwork the coolant had never been changed when I bought it at 150k/11 years. The radiator was junk and there were some signs of electrolytic corrosion.

Early is better, but not necessary. Late is always bad. May I suggest that there is a frequency distribution that BMW uses for its warrantee claims, and that under whatever is a standard length of financial deal where you are, the 'lifetime' fill doesn't result in them losing money.

So. Check it regularly, and change it if it shows signs of breaking down. in the meantime, noting that its cheap to do, try not to worry.
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      11-16-2019, 05:36 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M Fifty View Post
Well, in the same way that BMW claim the coolant is a 'lifetime' fill, so the manufacturer of said coolant will claim it needs changing every time you drive the car.

In the meantime: Has it changed colour? Does it still feel oily?

I also run a 2002 E46 330ci. According to the paperwork the coolant had never been changed when I bought it at 150k/11 years. The radiator was junk and there were some signs of electrolytic corrosion.

Early is better, but not necessary. Late is always bad. May I suggest that there is a frequency distribution that BMW uses for its warrantee claims, and that under whatever is a standard length of financial deal where you are, the 'lifetime' fill doesn't result in them losing money.

So. Check it regularly, and change it if it shows signs of breaking down. in the meantime, noting that its cheap to do, try not to worry.
Iím in the UK and warranty is 3 years for us. Iím not trying to start a debate on when the right time to change is and Iím certainly not worried about it! Just seeing if any other keen DIYers have completed the change yet and can share some advice. Likewise when I get round to it Iíll share my experience for the benefit of others.
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      11-16-2019, 11:47 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wattens View Post
Yeah, I had mine done when I had a Turbosmart Electronic Diverter Valve installed.
Hijacking the thread a bit but I'm really interested in your DV+ experience. Besides the failure has the DV+ performed as well as the Turbosmart?
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      11-16-2019, 10:04 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mctga View Post
Iím in the UK and warranty is 3 years for us. Iím not trying to start a debate on when the right time to change is and Iím certainly not worried about it! Just seeing if any other keen DIYers have completed the change yet and can share some advice. Likewise when I get round to it Iíll share my experience for the benefit of others.
In Canada that warranty is 4 years, and BMW offer an extended warranty of an additional 4 years. You'd sort of expect that BMW would have a service schedule for stuff that they wouldn't expect to last 8 years.
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      11-18-2019, 12:54 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mr_lab_rat View Post
Hijacking the thread a bit but I'm really interested in your DV+ experience. Besides the failure has the DV+ performed as well as the Turbosmart?
Don't do what I did and get the DV+ because it was cheaper. It's just a headache and a shitty product.
I mean the Turbosmart and the GFB items operated the same (while the GFB DV+ was working) as there's not much to it, they are both operated by the car ECU and both make a better seal than the OEM.

As the diverter valve requires quite a lot of removing the bash plate cover, a front sway bar and removing a coolant pipe from the water pump resulting in a full coolant flush, ideally a car lift, you'd want the better lasting product in it the first time so you aren't throwing money down the drain trying to access the diverter valve to repair/replace it.

Once you have access to the diverter valve, the major difference is the Turbosmart product used 3 bolts that fit into the turbo perfectly, and it came with the right plug that connects to the BMW wiring.
The DV+ is a similar procedure, except you then pull apart the plastic OEM diverter valve, modify it, then put it back on to the turbo.
Even if the DV+ part doesn't fail, the plastic OEM diverter valve is still just that, plastic and WILL eventually fail again.

My advice is just to get the Turbosmart product installed from the beginning and have the OEM diverter valve sitting in the garage as a spare until it's time to put the car back to stock to sell the car. And then sell the Turbosmart product or take it with you on to your next car.

The Turbosmart product is made of billet aluminum. It even just feels like a well-enginered part.
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      11-18-2019, 03:01 PM   #9
M Fifty
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Hopefully everyone removing the chassis reinforcement (it really, really isn't a 'bash plate'...) thought to renew the strechbolts that hold it in place, and didn't do anything that would apply torsion to the front end while it was off...
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      11-18-2019, 04:19 PM   #10
mctga
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M Fifty View Post
Hopefully everyone removing the chassis reinforcement (it really, really isn't a 'bash plate'...) thought to renew the strechbolts that hold it in place, and didn't do anything that would apply torsion to the front end while it was off...
Correct, itís a stiffening plate and the car needs to be raised evenly on both sides when removing so as not to upset geometry. Iíve got new bolts ready to install. I plan to drive the car into ramps to gain access.
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      11-19-2019, 03:40 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wattens View Post
Don't do what I did and get the DV+ because it was cheaper. It's just a headache and a shitty product.
I mean the Turbosmart and the GFB items operated the same (while the GFB DV+ was working) as there's not much to it, they are both operated by the car ECU and both make a better seal than the OEM.

As the diverter valve requires quite a lot of removing the bash plate cover, a front sway bar and removing a coolant pipe from the water pump resulting in a full coolant flush, ideally a car lift, you'd want the better lasting product in it the first time so you aren't throwing money down the drain trying to access the diverter valve to repair/replace it.

Once you have access to the diverter valve, the major difference is the Turbosmart product used 3 bolts that fit into the turbo perfectly, and it came with the right plug that connects to the BMW wiring.
The DV+ is a similar procedure, except you then pull apart the plastic OEM diverter valve, modify it, then put it back on to the turbo.
Even if the DV+ part doesn't fail, the plastic OEM diverter valve is still just that, plastic and WILL eventually fail again.

My advice is just to get the Turbosmart product installed from the beginning and have the OEM diverter valve sitting in the garage as a spare until it's time to put the car back to stock to sell the car. And then sell the Turbosmart product or take it with you on to your next car.

The Turbosmart product is made of billet aluminum. It even just feels like a well-enginered part.
I don't want to start and argument, but I think what you're saying is a little unfair...

To start with, your complaint with the GFB DV+ is the first I've heard of, and similarly this is also the first time I've heard of the Turbosmart alternative.

You suggest that to replace the diverter valve requires "[removing the] front sway bar and removing a coolant pipe from the water pump resulting in a full coolant flush", but this is simply untrue. There are several videos and forum posts that show this is not necessary. It is necessary to remove the stiffening plate, and though not necessary, unbolting the water pump but not disconnecting any pipes helps with access.

The DV+ itself re-uses the solenoid portion of the factory diverter valve, which itself has no moving parts. Everything else, including all moving parts, are replaced with machined metal parts. Three replacement screws are supplied and they too fit into the turbo perfectly. It also has the same plug because the solenoid is factory... therefore it just plugs in.

I don't want to suggest that fitting the DV+ is easy; it's a royal pain, but that's not the fault of the product, and I wonder if your mechanic did something wrong when installing the DV+ which caused it to fail.

The Turbosmart option is probably great, and since I've not seen it or installed it myself I'm not qualified to comment, but I feel that you're unfairly bashing the DV+ product... no-one else seems to have had anything but praise for it... myself included.
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      11-19-2019, 10:59 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nezil View Post
I don't want to start and argument, but I think what you're saying is a little unfair...

To start with, your complaint with the GFB DV+ is the first I've heard of, and similarly this is also the first time I've heard of the Turbosmart alternative.

You suggest that to replace the diverter valve requires "[removing the] front sway bar and removing a coolant pipe from the water pump resulting in a full coolant flush", but this is simply untrue. There are several videos and forum posts that show this is not necessary. It is necessary to remove the stiffening plate, and though not necessary, unbolting the water pump but not disconnecting any pipes helps with access.

The DV+ itself re-uses the solenoid portion of the factory diverter valve, which itself has no moving parts. Everything else, including all moving parts, are replaced with machined metal parts. Three replacement screws are supplied and they too fit into the turbo perfectly. It also has the same plug because the solenoid is factory... therefore it just plugs in.

I don't want to suggest that fitting the DV+ is easy; it's a royal pain, but that's not the fault of the product, and I wonder if your mechanic did something wrong when installing the DV+ which caused it to fail.

The Turbosmart option is probably great, and since I've not seen it or installed it myself I'm not qualified to comment, but I feel that you're unfairly bashing the DV+ product... no-one else seems to have had anything but praise for it... myself included.
You're not looking for an argument? But your whole reply is just bashing my first-hand experience...

I couldn't care less if you had a good experience with DV+, I didn't and I only brought it up as someone wanted to know more about it. So I gave them my experience.

How long did it take you to change your DV?
Because my mechanic did it in 30 minutes from hoist up to hoist down, by dropping things to make it easier to access. The time he saved on labor went into new coolant. I'd rather pay for new coolant in my car than wasted labor costs...
Also in my first post, I believe I said: "it is near impossible to do without moving the coolant pipes out of the way." I'm well aware you don't have to remove the water pump and sway, but it makes it next level easier if you do.

This guy in the link below took 8 hours to get the OEM DV off on his 235i and still complained that he couldn't see a lot of what he was doing and was doing things by feel. If only he made his life easier by dropping the coolant...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R4NvxLuLILg

My car's still running the OEM plastic charge pipes, so by your logic the others out there that have failed did something wrong?

You don't even know how it failed and why it's made my OEM part useless, yet you're telling me the product is fine...

You're not a DV+ reseller by any chance?

Wow this is the last time I reply to someones innocent question about DV+
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      11-20-2019, 09:07 AM   #13
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I'm reading this as a DIY guy and I run into the drama every forum has. Disappointing.
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      11-20-2019, 05:35 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gabhart View Post
I'm reading this as a DIY guy and I run into the drama every forum has. Disappointing.
I've no idea why people feel the need to bash someone's first-hand experience just because it doesn't agree with their experience...

Childish really...
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