06-17-2020, 09:56 PM | #45 | |
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Out of the box it is clear the GT4 it is a far superior car but I do not think you can compare them really... there is a 30-35% price different at least, one is a 2 seat mid engine with barely any trunk space and the other is a 4 passenger coupe. Now resale value is a complete different story and the GT4 will win that all day. |
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06-17-2020, 11:55 PM | #46 | |
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06-18-2020, 12:19 AM | #47 |
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The article talked about how well the CS took the corners and how it could brake later but attributed the improvement in performance to the cups and not the CCB.
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06-18-2020, 03:30 AM | #48 |
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You know, if you want a Cayman you can buy one. I think some people are in the wrong forum? This thread was about two BMWs on a track. It has nothing whatsoever to do with a small 2 seater from another manufacturer. I really do not get this weird obsession. It's getting really boring.
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06-18-2020, 05:46 AM | #49 |
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That’s because they know what they are talking about. The advantage does come from the tires and not the brakes. This has been debated ad nauseam, the CCB do not offer any meaningful advantage in braking performance.
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06-18-2020, 05:58 AM | #50 | |
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Oh no, what a tragedy! |
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06-18-2020, 05:59 AM | #51 |
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I don’t believe the Cayman has advantage in that regard. The S55 heat management is quite impressive, I’ve never had heat issues even in back-to-back sessions running on hot days.
As a tidbit, I have fun asking folks to put their hand on my intercooler right after a track session. It’s funny to see them look in awe as the intercooler is cool to the touch within the scorching hot engine compartment. It’s quite impressive.
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06-18-2020, 07:10 AM | #52 |
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Anyone having experience turning 718/911 would know saying M is faster around track is a joke.
Center gravity and thus the speed difference carried into corner is massive. The Ms feel like normal street cars with more power, stiffer and more balanced chassis, and more grip. While 718/911 is the glued-to-ground sports car that's engineered from a whole different base. BTW, Christian Gebhardt seems to be constantly 0.6~0.7s faster than Uwe Sener at Hockenheim GP...
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06-18-2020, 08:15 AM | #53 | |
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06-18-2020, 08:47 AM | #54 | |
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M2 CS is 20k less than the GT4, but faster. But it doesn't matter, nothing is enough to sway the M haters The M2 CS could weigh 1000lb, have 600hp, cost 30k and still, the world would be full of morons saying it's inferior to the porsche. You must understand that Porsche fanboyism is like a religion.
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06-18-2020, 08:49 AM | #55 | |
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The joke is on feeble minded people who think Porsche builds magical cars that cannot be beat. It is evident these feeble minded people spend precious little time on the track which explains their absolute cluelessness |
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06-18-2020, 08:55 AM | #56 | |
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If I were in Rennlist, spending my time laughing at how my street driven E90 M3 and F80 CS crush the tender little manginas of all the 991 GT3s at PCA's fastest run group, well, I'd expect to be banned. That wouldn't change that it's the truth. It's always the same story. BMW cannot win. Whatever they do will be criticized by people who should put their money where their loud mouths are and buy their POS Porsches. First BMW makes a special edition M2 and everyones hates on it before the price is even announced, saying it's going to be too expensive and that 'for that price' they would buy a Porsche. Second, BMW announced the price, 20k less than the GT4. It doesn't matter, people continue to hate on it because even though 83k is cheaper than most Cayman S configurations, it's still 'too expensive' and 'not fast enough' Third, a 3rd party organization tests the CS and it's faster than the GT4. Still doesn't matter, more hate Don't worry too much though, eventually some of these Porsche lovers save up their banana peels by eating ramen noodles and finally afford a used GT3 and think it's God's gift to mankind. And I crush them at Watkins Glen. For reference, this is the red (fastest) run group at PCA in a club which is so snobby that if you try to attend their track day with a BMW they tell you 'we are sorry but due to the high driving level of XXX club we are concerned you cannot keep up'. The only meaningful reason for the video posting is it's the fastest 991 GT3 we've run into. The rest get blown away like flies hitting a windshield.
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06-18-2020, 09:11 AM | #57 | |
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The 991 GT3 is pretty fast, an advantage it eeks out in the straights if you've ever tracked with one. Somewhere on this board there was a Ring video of a M2c with a few mods being faster than a GT3 RS. As usual on this forum, it was full on people saying the GT3 RS was actually much faster and blahblahblah. Well, if you read the comments on the Youtube video, the owner of the car had come FROM a 991 GT3 RS and was saying the M2c with a few mods was faster than his RS, and the GT3 RS driver from the video admitted his friend's M2c was faster. EDIT: here it is https://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...8&postcount=72 That's how you can tell who spends a lot of time at the track and is fast vs the ones who spend their time doing power to weight calculations in Excel and watching Youtube videos.
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06-18-2020, 10:35 AM | #58 |
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This forum is literally crawling with Porsche apologists. I'm waiting for the crew to show up bleating about how awesome $100k 4 cylinder Cayman's are, manuals are slower, an EPAS is somehow and upgrade not a downgrade compared to hydraulic steering.
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06-18-2020, 10:51 AM | #59 |
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Thank you SWT_Shadow for restoring sanity to this thread that would be more appropriately named "P car fan boy circle jerk"
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06-18-2020, 11:05 AM | #60 | |
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I don't understand why someone likes car X but spends time in the forum of car Y complaining about car Y. Rennlist is waiting for them with open arms! Get your 4 cylinder 100k crap and go to Rennlist! It seems so simple The best part is when you do actual racing at AER and every single one of the HPDE Porsche fanboys shows up in an M3... shouldn't they be driving a 986 Cayman or something? One of those magical dedicated sports cars? You certainly don't see me doing AER with a Mustang or something. After all the talk about 'Porsche would hold up better than M', then you go to a 8h endurance race and the Porsche guys are all running BMWs! How does that make sense exactly? The real world is so hilariously different than all these Porsche apologist comments. In the real world, a 997 911 is a Class 4 car at AER, the same class as 1997 E36 M3s US-spec which were neutered by BMW.
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06-18-2020, 11:43 AM | #61 | |
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06-18-2020, 01:04 PM | #62 | ||||
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06-18-2020, 01:54 PM | #63 | |
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If they were so secure in their superiority they wouldn't be here. If we were in the Miata forum and it was full of people with serious mental health problems talking about how wonderful M cars are, I would conclude that the cause of their mental health deterioration is that they've been to the track and a Miata has introduced its front bumper into the rear bumper of their M car without any lubricant at all, and it hurts them, so they spend the day talking to Miata people about how much better their M cars are Mental health is no joke, people suffering from it should seek professional help |
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06-18-2020, 02:00 PM | #64 | ||
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06-18-2020, 03:40 PM | #65 | |
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I love you guys, Turbomeister & SYT_Shadow!!! Yeah, it has always been truly baffling to me that on a BMW enthusiast forum there's so much hate for BMW. If I were to go by some of the posts, I would have thought that I'd accidentally landed on Ihatebimmerspost. So weird. What's truly bizarre is the whole, "Well, for that price, I could just get a GT4!" WTF??? 1. No, you couldn't. Last I checked, GT4's, spec'ed anywhere close to what you'd want, are something like $30k more than an M2CS here in the U.S. 2. If you want a GT4, go buy yourself a GT4! Why are you on this forum pissing and moaning about how you want a GT4? 3. Why are you constantly on this forum saying either "This is how the M2 should have come in the first place" and "For this money, I could get a tune and have higher performance"? Dude, if you want to mod your car, go mod your car! Why are you on this forum constantly pissing and moaning about how "I wouldn't spend that kind of money on X"? So weird! I mean, who wakes up in the morning and thinks to themselves, "You know what I gotta do today? I gotta get onto an Internet forum, and tell everyone what they should do with their money"??? Jeez Louise! You know what? Here's what I'm going to do as an homage to these weirdos. a) I'm going onto a Rolex forum and telling everyone: "I wouldn't pay $10k for a Submariner. For that kind of money, you could buy a Timex and have enough left over for 900 Costco lasagnas." b) I'm going onto a gardening forum and telling everyone: "I wouldn't pay $10 for a green bell pepper plant. For that kind of money, you could get a red bell pepper plant instead." c) I'm going onto a fish enthusiast forum and telling everyone: "The new koi varieties suck. For that kind of money, you could get a cat instead." Okay... rant over. |
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06-18-2020, 04:00 PM | #66 | ||
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Meanwhile, Car and Driver tests a sparsely optioned base 992 4(no S) that doesn't even have a LSD, price as tested, 129k. https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews...y-the-numbers/ A friend bought a 991.1 GTS, 147k without ceramics or anything cool. Welcome to the real world. |
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