[BEM-S4]

Originally Posted by ScarecrowBoat

Why don't you just say the truth that is, "I'm an old fart and I don't like change."

A 2 series shouldn't be anywhere near 40k? Anywhere near...so like what 35k? A Camry is going to be that much!

Times are changing, things are more expensive. Next you're going to be talking about how you used to be able to go down to the store and get a hot dog for a quarter...

Actually think it's a bit more refined than the 3 with all the hood bulges and whatnot.

[Iron Man]

Originally Posted by PrematureApex

Well we aren't asking you.

I mean, the 1M was more of a parts bin car. This car at least gets a pretty much new motor (new block, crank, pistons, etc.).

What did you want BMW to do? Redesign a steering rack, a rear diff, and a trans when the M3/4 gear is perfectly suited for the application?

Just for the hell of it? Just to avoid you calling it a "parts bin car"?

Stop throwing out buzz words like "parts bin car" and explain what you would have wanted them to do. Wanted a lighter car with an N/A 6 or turbo 4. OK, I agree. But they didn't do that with the M3/4 either.

The engine isn't parts bin. So you're talking about what exactly?

If the M2 released first, and they released the M3/4 with the M2 trans/diff/steering/suspension...would you call the M3/4 a "parts bin car"?

Most everyone considers the M3/M4 to be special above and beyond a regular 3-series, so shouldn't the M2 be considered special as well if it is made with the same parts?

Actually, people have been on here bitching and moaning for weeks on end that the M2 was NOT being made with enough M3/M4 parts (the engine, roof, mirrors, etc.).

I guess people just have to bitch about something...

[PrematureApex]

Originally Posted by Iron Man

Actually, people have been on here bitching and moaning for weeks on end that the M2 was NOT being made with enough M3/M4 parts (the engine, roof, mirrors, etc.).

The people saying that aren't using their heads before they post.

They would essentially be reproducing the M4 at 15/16th size.

You can't cut $10-15k off the price of a car by removing 4 inches of trunk space.

No one would buy an M4, if the M2 was identically spec'd.

Seriously, for what one would assume is a bunch of intelligent, well-to-do people, they sure say a lot of things that make no sense in reality.

[Gibson6594]

Originally Posted by PrematureApex

Seriously, for what one would assume is a bunch of intelligent, well-to-do people, they sure say a lot of things that make no sense in reality.

Many are intelligent and well-to-do. Many others are just spoiled brats.

[PrematureApex]

Originally Posted by classyfast

NA 6 would have been ideal, good call.

As usual, there is no talking sense to anybody on this forum.....later

So you're not going to answer any of the very simple questions posed to you?

They weren't illogical and were very straight forward. They'd go a long way to understanding what your opinion actually is.

Blurting out "it's a parts bin car", and refusing to follow up with a reasonable discussion on what you mean by that/wanted to see, is not you "talking sense", or even attempting to. Quite the opposite actually.


And don't get me wrong, I'm pretty sure we have similar views on the car.

[Artemis]

This forum sometimes, since a couple of days:

Cat #1: "What's your problem, dude ?"
Cat #2: "I am a real cat. You're just something ...'pussy'-ish."
Cat #1: "Still not over it that I'm here to stay, don't cha ?"
Cat #2: "Hell no, I'm faster than you anyways in alleys."
Cat #1: "Imposter ! I'll outrun you around the trees in the park."
Cat #2: "Hah, you can't even get a full-blown scratch post at Purr World. Pa-the-tic."
Cat #1: "Imposter ! You still meow like a kitten."
Cat #2: "Get outta my face, loser. You're disturbing my view."
Cat #1: "I won't budge. You're a public embarrassment !"
[SCRATCH] - [KICK] - [SCRATCH] - [ROLL] - [KICK]

[ScarecrowBoat]

Originally Posted by PrematureApex

So you're not going to answer any of the very simple questions posed to you?

They weren't illogical and were very straight forward. They'd go a long way to understanding what your opinion actually is.

Blurting out "it's a parts bin car", and refusing to follow up with a reasonable discussion on what you mean by that/wanted to see, is not you "talking sense", or even attempting to. Quite the opposite actually.


And don't get me wrong, I'm pretty sure we have similar views on the car.

Right? Every goddamn time an M car comes out there is a fight that it's not a "true" M or it doesn't conform to the standards of the M cars. They attack the concept, call the engineers lazy or accuse them of cutting corners.

[SW19]

Originally Posted by ScarecrowBoat

Don't agree that it's a parts bin car, but take your point that it is - who cares? You think it's too expensive yet you expect them to make it more custom?



Stuck in the past. Turbo is what engines are going to be, not just going forward but now. Better power, lighter, and uses less fuel. But sure, BMW should scrap all of the last 10 years of engine R&D for fear that the old [fashioned] buyers won't like change. Are you disappointed that you can't play your old cassettes in the M2?

The only reason that all of the car makers are now using turbo engines is because they reduce the amount of emissions that the car produces.They are being forced to do this by the new government mandates on car emissions. I don't have a problem with it but that is the reason they are doing it.

[Transfer]

I like cars.
I like BMWs.
I like the M2.

I bet it's going to be a really fun car to drive.

[Legal Bill]

I spoke with my dealer today. He has an allotment of 1, orders for 4, and predicts that any car I ordered would not be here until the fall at best and most likely next year. He also said they reserve the right to charge "market price" in case they are selling at a premium. So I'm sticking with the M235i.

[gthal]

Originally Posted by classyfast

NA 6 would have been ideal, good call.

As usual, there is no talking sense to anybody on this forum.....later

Pot, meet kettle. I have a mirror in the hallway you should check out...

Originally Posted by PrematureApex

So you're not going to answer any of the very simple questions posed to you?

They weren't illogical and were very straight forward. They'd go a long way to understanding what your opinion actually is.

Blurting out "it's a parts bin car", and refusing to follow up with a reasonable discussion on what you mean by that/wanted to see, is not you "talking sense", or even attempting to. Quite the opposite actually.


And don't get me wrong, I'm pretty sure we have similar views on the car.

It drives me nuts when people like to argue without actually ever responding to questions asked

P.S. Every M car is, to some extent, a parts bin car... none are completely bespoke. Not sure why some people get worked up about this.

[PrematureApex]

Originally Posted by gthal

Pot, meet kettle. I have a mirror in the hallway you should check out...



It drives me nuts when people like to argue without actually ever responding to questions asked

P.S. Every M car is, to some extent, a parts bin car... none are completely bespoke. Not sure why some people get worked up about this.

Breath of fresh air...finally...

[cjosulli]

Performance per dollar along with features and build quality, this car is going to be hard to match. No s coded motor, mirrors, cfrp roof, ect, so long as they pass the savings on I don't see why anyone would complain. As others have said it's an m car regardless of your opinion, and more "special" than an m235i. People tend to be critical when insecure, but a lot of these posts have good points. Maybe they'll make a csl for 70 grand.
Cheers!

[chris719]

They're all engineered to a price point and that always involves compromises. All M cars are already compromises because they have to share a chassis and a lot of parts with series cars.

[chambolle]

Originally Posted by classyfast

Congrats on that asshole comment, there's a difference between a fan boy and fan of the brand. You clearly must be the former.

I'm not an old fart I'm 36 and exactly the market BMW targets these cars to. Younger, expendable income type of folks. Just to make it clear I've owned every iteration of m3 except e30 and f80 (still have my e46M) so I'm not just tossing references out there with no basis. So I'll stand by my opinions here without hesitation: the m2 is a parts bin M car as was the 1M. Cool cars but pets bin cars and nothing really special if you ask me.

Well, I will readily admit I AM an old fart, and I just don't get this 'parts bin car' nonsense. The E30 M3 was a parts bin car, then, as was the E36 M3 - both grabbed bits from here and there to jazz up what was a fairly mundane 3 series coupe. The E30 was a freaking box with flared fenders and a boy racer wing tacked on; the E36 was not even that, basically the stock coupe with an aero kit. In the U.S., the E36 M3 engine was a shadow of its Euro self. But they were both rather fine cars, were they not? Neither was a ground up design.

As for the M2, the price is competitive with some pretty mundane stuff. Go look for a Volvo sedan and put some options on it and tell me what the sticker says. Point me in the direction of a $50k car that competes with the M2, and please, don't try to sell me on some rice rocket or souped up Ford, both of which will be in junkyards ten years from now.

What's 'really special' in your view? And which M cars have been 'parts bin cars' and which have not. I'm not seeing a bright line between what you would condemn as "parts bin' and what you would consider sufficiently "special.' I would grant you the 1M was something close to 'parts bin'... Seemingly an afterthought. I admittedly have not owned one, but it strikes me it's 'specialness' lies mostly in the low production numbers, not the engineering and design. Hopefully none will take offense at my saying that, but I anticipate some flames from 1M owners will come my direction nevertheless.

[BiscottiGelato]

Originally Posted by chambolle

Well, I will readily admit I AM an old fart, and I just don't get this 'parts bin car' nonsense. The E30 M3 was a parts bin car, then, as was the E36 M3 - both grabbed bits from here and there to jazz up what was a fairly mundane 3 series coupe. The E30 was a freaking box with flared fenders and a boy racer wing tacked on; the E36 was not even that, basically the stock coupe with an aero kit. In the U.S., the E36 M3 engine was a shadow of its Euro self. But they were both rather fine cars, were they not? Neither was a ground up design.

As for the M2, the price is competitive with some pretty mundane stuff. Go look for a Volvo sedan and put some options on it and tell me what the sticker says. Point me in the direction of a $50k car that competes with the M2, and please, don't try to sell me on some rice rocket or souped up Ford, both of which will be in junkyards ten years from now.

What's 'really special' in your view? And which M cars have been 'parts bin cars' and which have not. I'm not seeing a bright line between what you would condemn as "parts bin' and what you would consider sufficiently "special.' I would grant you the 1M was something close to 'parts bin'... Seemingly an afterthought. I admittedly have not owned one, but it strikes me it's 'specialness' lies mostly in the low production numbers, not the engineering and design. Hopefully none will take offense at my saying that, but I anticipate some flames from 1M owners will come my direction nevertheless.

Agreed.

Would love more differentiation between M2 and 235. Of course custom parts specific to the M2 for better weight reduction wouldn't hurt. But for this asking price, I think it's a good proposition.

A car is good for the price or not. All car are parts bin car short of 1 off stuff like Veyron or Koenseggs or something.

[Black Gold]

Originally Posted by chambolle

Well, I will readily admit I AM an old fart, and I just don't get this 'parts bin car' nonsense. The E30 M3 was a parts bin car, then, as was the E36 M3 - both grabbed bits from here and there to jazz up what was a fairly mundane 3 series coupe. The E30 was a freaking box with flared fenders and a boy racer wing tacked on; the E36 was not even that, basically the stock coupe with an aero kit. In the U.S., the E36 M3 engine was a shadow of its Euro self. But they were both rather fine cars, were they not? Neither was a ground up design.

As for the M2, the price is competitive with some pretty mundane stuff. Go look for a Volvo sedan and put some options on it and tell me what the sticker says. Point me in the direction of a $50k car that competes with the M2, and please, don't try to sell me on some rice rocket or souped up Ford, both of which will be in junkyards ten years from now.

What's 'really special' in your view? And which M cars have been 'parts bin cars' and which have not. I'm not seeing a bright line between what you would condemn as "parts bin' and what you would consider sufficiently "special.' I would grant you the 1M was something close to 'parts bin'... Seemingly an afterthought. I admittedly have not owned one, but it strikes me it's 'specialness' lies mostly in the low production numbers, not the engineering and design. Hopefully none will take offense at my saying that, but I anticipate some flames from 1M owners will come my direction nevertheless.

That's pretty weak on the comment on the ford. Just because you don't like ford for whatever reason, doesn't mean it's not an excellent car. It has a lot to offer vs an m2 and will crush it in performance all while having a much more unique and special engine. A lightly used Cayman s and the gt350 are excellent competition for the m2, and in many areas are superior.

I also would consider a 2011-2013 e92 over an m2. A vette isn't far off either.

There is plenty of competition for the m2 imo.

[BiscottiGelato]

I guess some ppl collect cars like they do watches. Ought to be 'special'. I just look at value for money. Everyone defines value a lil differently of coz.

[Iron Man]

Originally Posted by Nantucket

The only reason that all of the car makers are now using turbo engines is because they are better at fooling the government tests to think they reduce the amount of emissions that the car produces.They are being forced to do this by the new government mandates on car emissions. I don't have a problem with it but that is the reason they are doing it.

I fixed it for you.

[dmk08]

Originally Posted by WWM3

Why the change? Payment?

No locked down change as of now. I purchased a 4runner a couple months ago and now having a 4 door M3 just seems silly. Kinda wanna get into a 2 door car. Unfortunately I'm too tall to drive the likes of a 911, Z06, or whatever so I'm stuck to 'sports coupes'.

I also know I can get an allocation/good deal on one of these right off the bat. It would be a nice payment change vs the M3 for a second car lol.

[W///]

Ahh, great to see people still rushing to judgement whether this is a "true" M car without having seen one journalist drive one, yet alone themselves. Some things truly never change.

Bravo.

[WWM3]

Originally Posted by dmk08

No locked down change as of now. I purchased a 4runner a couple months ago and now having a 4 door M3 just seems silly. Kinda wanna get into a 2 door car. Unfortunately I'm too tall to drive the likes of a 911, Z06, or whatever so I'm stuck to 'sports coupes'.

I also know I can get an allocation/good deal on one of these right off the bat. It would be a nice payment change vs the M3 for a second car lol.

That's awesome. I was in the same boat. I had an E90 M3, but after I bought a CRV the four doors seemed redundant. I'm in a 435 now, but I'll be picking up one of these in early 2018.