[HawaiiG80Green]

Don't care too much about extra weight. Look how beautiful

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by Twt

Remember...brakes don't stop the car....but tires do. If you work from the tire backwards you can spec the "best" brakes. The current M2 brakes with track pads can engage ABS even with Rcomps or slicks, therefore any bigger brake is just added weight. One can argue cooling and thermal efficiency but on virtually every street tire these new bigger brakes are for show only....with unnecessary added cost and weight. They do look pretty!

Agreed that, compared to the already strong stock M2 brakes, improved cooling and thermal efficiency of 2NH or MPP Brakes is overkill for daily driving. As commented before, the stock M2 brakes are fit for purpose. And as regards tires: I'm pleased with the Michelin Pilot Sport 4S on my car.

The improved brakes (silver 2NH / red MPP) can be recommended if the car is regularly taken to the race track, mountains and/or the Autobahn. And if you regularly take it to the race track, also fit dedicated (squeaking) brake pads, such as for example the M Performance Sport Brake Pads (F87 M2 / F80 M3 / F82 M4 = BMW part # 34112284765 [front set] + 34212284766 [rear set]).



FYI, something about 'warped rotors':

Rotors Don't Warp
(source: here)
Brake rotors do not warp from heat, even when driven by the most aggressive traffic officer. Instead, they wear unevenly. This uneven wear is caused by the brake pads themselves as they intermittently touch an out-of-true rotor. The root cause of the uneven wear is one of two things: either the rotor was installed out-of-true with the hub, or the tire was improperly torqued to the hub during the last tire change.
All of this is important for fleet managers because their vehicles have the tires removed frequently and the pads and rotors replaced frequently. You won’t solve a problem caused by wear if you treat it as a problem caused by heat. Instead, fix the rotor installation or wheel lug nut torquing.
The problem of pedal vibration, incorrectly called rotor warp, occurs 3,000 to 5,000 miles after the brake or tire change. Because it is caused by uneven rotor wear, not the rotor warping like a potato chip from heat, you can’t solve this wear problem by better control of the heat, i.e., by the use of specially processed rotors or drilled and slotted rotors. Instead, you solve the wear problem by fixing the shortcuts in rotor installation or the improper lug nut tightening.
By taking a few steps, the fleet manager can easily, quickly and permanently fix the pedal pulsation problem. First, for each rotor change, verify the runout of the rotor, and then do one or two quick things to have it less than 0.002 inch, which is the OE spec for most vehicles. Two, for each tire and wheel change or rotation, torque the lugs in a star pattern using either a torque wrench or torque stick. Those two steps will virtually eliminate premature rotor wear, period.
Think about it this way: What are your conservative officers doing to their cars to “warp” the brake rotors in less than 5,000 miles? They don’t get the brakes warm (350°F), let alone patrol-hot (600°F), and never pursuit-hot (850°F). Yet their rotors are warping? No. They are not warping. They are unevenly wearing during the times of zero brake pedal pressure, and your officers are not doing anything to either prevent it or cause it.

Why Do Brake Rotors Warp?
(source: here)
Brake rotors are the large metal discs visible behind the wheels of a car. These spin along with the wheels so that when the brake pads clamp down on them, they stop the car. Brake discs have to withstand a tremendous amount of heat. Not only that, they have to dissipate that heat into the air as quickly as possible because the brakes will probably be pressed down again in a short amount time. If the surface of the disc becomes uneven over time, braking will become jittery and less effective. This is usually referred to as warping.

How brake rotors warp
A common misconception when rotors are referred to as “warped” is that they are no longer straight when rotating (similar to how a bicycle wheel gets warped). For cars, in order for that to be the case, the rotors themselves would have to be defective as the temperature required to make metal that resilient soft enough to simply bend would be tremendous.
Instead, the warping really refers to the flat surface of the rotor becoming uneven. Heat is the number one cause of this, and can cause warping in more than one way:

• Glazing the brake rotor with material from the brake pad. This happens because brake pads, like tires, are made with different amounts of hardness and stickiness depending on the intended purpose. When brake pads made for normal road use get very hot from high-speed driving and braking, or from riding on the brakes for a prolonged period of time, the grippy material can get too soft and basically "paint" the brake rotors. This means that the brake pads won't grip onto metal when the brakes are applied once again, causing decreased brake performance that is less smooth than before.
• Wearing down the surface of the rotor and making harder spots in the metal stay slightly raised off the surface. The reason that brakes don't normally wear down very much revolves around a fairly straightforward concept. Since the metal of the rotor is harder than the brake pad applying friction to it, the pad wears down while the rotor remains largely unaffected. With excessive heat, the metal becomes soft enough for the pad to wear down the rotor surface. This means that slightly less dense spots in the metal wear down faster and make the harder spots stick out, causing warping.

How to prevent warped brake rotors
To prevent the brake rotors from becoming glazed over with brake pad material, be mindful of how much braking the vehicle is doing compared to what is done during normal operation. When going downhill for prolonged amounts of time, try to control the speed of the vehicle by shifting the transmission into a lower gear. For automatics, the only option is usually to shift into "3," while vehicles with a manual or other shiftable transmission can decide on the best gear to use based on the engine's revs. When the brakes are hot, never sit with the brake pedal hard down on one spot.
Also, when the brake pads are first installed they should be properly broken in to ensure they don't leave too much material on the brake rotor. This usually involves getting the car up to road speed and then braking until it is traveling ten miles per hour slower. After this is done a few times, you can work your way up to braking to a complete stop. The first few full stops after that should be done with care. This allows the brake pad to perform better during hard braking further down the road.
The steps that can be taken to prevent excess wear on the surface of the brake rotor are similar to the steps for avoiding glazed rotors. Be sure to avoid hard braking when the brake rotors have gotten hot from prolonged use.

What do warped rotors feel like?
There are a few symptoms to look for when it comes to diagnosing warped rotors:

• If the brake rotors are glazed over, you may hear excessive squeaking when the brakes are applied or even smell burning rubber.
• If the braking suddenly becomes jittery and inconsistent, the brake rotors should be the first suspect.
• If the vehicle vibrates when coming to a stop, the brake rotor is likely warped.

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by hawaiiM2

Don't care too much about extra weight. Look how beautiful

And the MPP (identical as 2NH, except for the red caliper paint):

[HawaiiG80Green]

Originally Posted by Artemis

And the MPP (identical as 2NH, except for the red caliper paint):
[PICTURE]

Even better in red!

[lemetier]

Originally Posted by chris719

They look like F10 M5 parts from pics.

The rotors are definitely not straight from the F10M (wrong hat centerbore and rotor offset in front, no parking brake drum assembly and 396mm diameter in rear).

Here are the P/N's for the M2C 2NH Brakes:

Caliper Front:

Anthracite Left - 34 11 8 091 277
Anthracite Right - 34 11 8 091 278

Caliper Rear:

Anthracite Left - 34 21 8 091 282
Anthracite Right - 34 21 8 091 281

Brake Disc Front (400x36)

Left - 34 11 8 072 017
Right - 34 11 8 072 018

Brake Disc Rear (380x28)

Left - 34 11 8 072 019
Right - 34 11 8 072 020

Brake Servo: 34 33 7 850 999

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by lemetier

The rotors are definitely not straight from the F10M (wrong hat centerbore and rotor offset in front, no parking brake drum assembly and 396mm diameter in rear).

Here are the P/N's for the M2C 2NH Brakes

Are the part # of the "BMW M Compound Brake Discs of the BMW M Sports Brake System Red" (M2 M Performance Parts - red version of 2NH) already known ?

[lemetier]

Originally Posted by Artemis

Are the part # of the "BMW M Compound Brake Discs of the BMW M Sports Brake System Red" (M2 M Performance Parts - red version of 2NH) already known ?

The discs themselves, or the red calipers? The former will be the same as above, the latter should be 3rd to last digit as 4 but will provide once the database is fully populated (in process now).

There's obviously more P/N's associated with the entire brake system, but I'm using the new AOP system which doesn't allow copy/paste from my phone so it's a bit time consuming to type out each and every one.

[Blackfield]

Originally Posted by Artemis

And the MPP (identical as 2NH, except for the red caliper paint):

I don't seem to recall that we have the option to choose the red caliper color.
It seems silly if you order M2C and want the red caliper that you have to swap it with additional cost (buy it separately, sell the gray one yourself, etc).

[chris719]

Originally Posted by lemetier

The rotors are definitely not straight from the F10M (wrong hat centerbore and rotor offset in front, no parking brake drum assembly and 396mm diameter in rear).

Here are the P/N's for the M2C 2NH Brakes:

Caliper Front:

Anthracite Left - 34 11 8 091 277
Anthracite Right - 34 11 8 091 278

Caliper Rear:

Anthracite Left - 34 21 8 091 282
Anthracite Right - 34 21 8 091 281

Brake Disc Front (400x36)

Left - 34 11 8 072 017
Right - 34 11 8 072 018

Brake Disc Rear (380x28)

Left - 34 11 8 072 019
Right - 34 11 8 072 020

Brake Servo: 34 33 7 850 999

I see. The calipers look practically identical, any idea if brake pad fitment is the same?

[lemetier]

Originally Posted by chris719

I see. The calipers look practically identical, any idea if brake pad fitment is the same?

Pads are the same as F10M in front:

34 11 2 294 869 - Standard Pad Set
34 11 2 284 465 - Sport Endurance Pad Set

Rear Pads: (sport pad set not yet listed)

34 21 8 091 600 - Standard Pad Set

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by Blackfield

I don't seem to recall that we have the option to choose the red caliper color.
It seems silly if you order M2C and want the red caliper that you have to swap it with additional cost (buy it separately, sell the gray one yourself, etc).

No choice. If you want the red calipers, you got to retrofit those.

[Franzino]

Originally Posted by Artemis

The majority of my 35K kms so far with my M2: German Autobahn and mountains.

On long Authobahn drives (many consecutive hours of driving) I experience some mild brake vibration and mild fading after some time, as a result from repeated braking at very high speed. Why 'repeated braking' and not simply releasing the throttle to slow down ? Well, I guess you know how the Autobahn works: once you get the famous "no speed limit" sign you can take your car all the way to the limit (± 270 km/h for a delimited M2), of course depending on road conditions and road traffic (safety first). But at some point a speed limit sign shows up out of the blue and you must decelerate quite quickly to abide to it (you certainly don't want German police to stop you for speeding). If you see it from faraway you can simply release the throttle and eventually mildly brake, but sometimes you got to slam the brakes. Or another road user forgot to use the mirrors and suddenly moves to the left lane upon your approach, requiring you to slam the brakes. For other's safety and your own safety, you got to anticipate all the time that those things can happen. Also lots of road works require you to slow down (mostly announced in advance). And subsequently there's the "no speed limit" sign again, or the slower car moved to the right again, and you can floor the throttle again. This acceleration/deceleration pattern goes on and on if you fancy a spirited Autobahn drive (but sometimes you prefer to cruise at high speed instead of very high speed). As you can imagine, those repeated hard decelerations strain the brake pads: energy - heat. And so after some time you hear this kind of 'voooaaam' noise when hitting the brakes, whilst experiencing a mild vibration under your right foot pushing the brake pedal (and sometimes some mild fading too if intense decelerations have been frequent).

Mountain drives: even during stints ranging from 8 up to 12 hours, my M2 brakes keep up quite well for me. Of course you got those variations: uphill driving, downhill driving (more demanding for brakes), cruising through valleys, chilly temps way up high, hot temps in the valleys. But IMHO it mostly depends on your braking behavior. Alike karting: don't overuse the brakes. When following a car in the mountains, you can fairly easily spot if the driver is used to mountain driving: those who don't brake often whilst keeping a steady pace through the turns. And if you notice a burning smell or even see smoke evaporating from the front wheels: no good (the driver in front of you is cooking his/her brakes).


I'm interested to get the new M Performance Brakes ("BMW M Compound Brake Discs of the BMW M Sports Brake System Red") for my M2 to optimize the brake capacity. Even with the extra 16 kg compared to my current standard brakes, my car will still be lighter when compared to a similarly equipped M2 Competition with standard brakes.

This was last Saturday (encountering rain and sun in the Dolomites the same day):
Attachment 1828545

Personally I think your driving style (or drive environment) would gain a lot from fitting different brake pads and change brake oil... No extreme squealing track brake pads, but something in between like a Endless MX72 / Frodo DS-2500 would work perfect for you.

I drive on the Nurburgring with the standard (blue) M2 Brembo brakes...I changed the brake oil (ATE Typ 200), fitted steel linings and uprated the pads. The brakes preform amazingly well, but for track I would still like to upgrade to a slightly bigger set with improved heat resistance and improved cooling.

[Franzino]

Originally Posted by Artemis

The standard brakes are sufficient, definitely. They are already big.

But if BMW would have offered 2NH (M Sport Brakes) back in 2016, I would have ordered them. That's why I consider getting the M Performance brakes for my car (available at the end of this year). I prefer the improved braking over the extra weight of those.

If they would be available for my MY 2017 M2 I would have ordered the 2NH option also.... Are the red M performance brakes in essence the same as the 2NH M Sport brakes..? The red looks a bit to flashy for me and I prefer the silver one (based on looks of course).

[Franzino]

Originally Posted by Artemis

And the MPP (identical as 2NH, except for the red caliper paint):
[PICTURE]

Are they 100% identical? Is there not a difference in the bell (center of the brake disc)?

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by Franzino

Are they 100% identical? Is there not a difference in the bell (center of the brake disc)?

Forum fellow MR. passed on my brake question to BMW M and got confirmation that those brakes are the same, except for the caliper color:

Originally Posted by MR.

Q: Apart from the caliper color (silver vs red), is there a difference between optional M Sport brakes (option code 2NH) and the MPP "BMW M Compound Brake Discs of the BMW M Sports Brake System Red" ?
A: The M Sport brakes (option code 2NH) are exactly the same as the BMW M Sports Brake System Red. The only difference is the colour of the brake caliper. The reason we offer the kit is for customers with a M2 or future 2nd hand owners of a M2C who want to upgrade the brake kit. They can then order the red kit aftermarket at the dealer and install it at their dealer or specialist.

[Franzino]

Originally Posted by Artemis

Forum fellow MR. passed on my brake question to BMW M and got confirmation that those brakes are the same, except for the caliper color:

Thanks; so I can not order the silver 2NH in parts as an aftermarket fit then? I would rather have those silver 2NH calipers then flashy red items. Curieus about the price...

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by Franzino

Thanks; so I can not order the silver 2NH in parts as an aftermarket fit then? I would rather have those silver 2NH calipers then flashy red items. Curious about the price...

You could try to order all 2NH parts separately: see post #115 for the BMW part numbers.

[Advevo]

I pass for the bigger brakes

To much weight and no 18 inch wheels!

[Franzino]

Originally Posted by Artemis

You could try to order all 2NH parts separately: see post #115 for the BMW part numbers.

I will look into that when parts are available of the 2NH option...but price will of course also be a consideration. The price difference of the 2NH parts and the M perf brake option...but those red M calipers look so tuning and not exactly my style.

[Franzino]

Originally Posted by Artemis

You could try to order all 2NH parts separately: see post #115 for the BMW part numbers.

So brake servo needs to be replaced also...

[Arcanum-UK]

Originally Posted by Artemis

Agreed that, compared to the already strong stock M2 brakes, improved cooling and thermal efficiency of 2NH or MPP Brakes is overkill for daily driving. As commented before, the stock M2 brakes are fit for purpose. And as regards tires: I'm pleased with the Michelin Pilot Sport 4S on my car.

For you and the other poster they might be OK for daily driving. That's great for you. However, for others the brakes are far from OK.

I've had to park the car up on three occasions, on the road, to let the brakes cool for a while.

The first on an alpine pass heading in to Switzerland from Italy (Grimsel pass). I had the wife in the car with luggage and it was a hot day, but I wasn't driving hard at all (note, wife in the car! ). The brake peddle was right on the floor at the end and had to leave the brakes 30-minutes to cool down. Two other occasions came from hard driving, late at night on British B-Roads (lots of tight corners and short straights).

If you're not doing repeated hard stops or mountain passes on hot days, the brakes are fine. For me, the 2NH upgrade is a significant reason for getting an M2C. Even for road driving. (I know I could retrofit 2NH, but I'm hoping the rear damping has been sorted and I want the increase power of the M2C with my warranty intact).

BTW, totally agree on the PS4's. Great tyres and have lasted better than the PSS's with more grip. I hope the M2C comes with them as standard.

[lemetier]

Originally Posted by Franzino

I will look into that when parts are available of the 2NH option...but price will of course also be a consideration. The price difference of the 2NH parts and the M perf brake option...but those red M calipers look so tuning and not exactly my style.

The Retrofit Brake Kits are always significantly less than buying the components individually. Purchasing the kit and either swapping with someone who wants the red calipers or buying the Anthracite Calipers in addition to the full kit and selling the red ones on your own will be the logical choices.