[mfarrzhp]

Originally Posted by robopp

Seriously, it's like if you don't think the M2CS is absolutely perfect then you're a troll according to a couple of forum members. The blinders are thick and wide.

I certainly appreciate the info, keep it coming!

Perfect? No, I could use comfort access. If the exhaust is a 6 volume, I could go to 7.5. It's sits a touch too high stock IMO. HK stereo is pretty good, but could be a little better. Other than that, it's really, really good.

I'd say top 5 M cars of all time, excluding super rare versions that didn't make it to the US. An X3M will beat it in the 1/4 mile. A modded M2C will beat it on the track. I don't care about either of those things. It does what I need, and that is it brings joy to driving. I took my son and his buddy to school today in the CS, 10 and 9 years old. They loved it.

If I had double the funds, I'd get a GT3 in addition to the CS.

This thread is really getting off topic, but it's enjoyable.

[m dizzle]

Originally Posted by sdhotwn

Great, so the 1/8" total toe in basically got you rear stability that you were happy with. I checked my alignment specs on two of my other cars I've tracked and was running that as well (.10° per side, so a hair less than your .14) for the rears (F30 and E36). So it'll be interesting to verify what the rear of my CS is at and adjust accordingly. I'll probably push the rear camber to the max possible stock (but not above about -2.1) Inner rear tire edge is doomed, but whatever.

I think he's actually running 2/8'' total toe in based on the sheet? Unless I'm calculating wrong. Running that much toe out in the rear will make most any rear stable.

Also, am I reading this wrong? it seems like he is running ALOT of toe out up front? 6 inches total toe out? Isn't that nuts? Don't have experience messing with the M2 CS on track but....on my current and past track cars if I run toe anywhere near that I would expect it to be tail happy.

Maybe I'm not reading/understanding this right.

[sdhotwn]

Originally Posted by m dizzle

I think he's actually running 2/8'' total toe in based on the sheet? Unless I'm calculating wrong. Running that much toe out in the rear will make most any rear stable.

Also, am I reading this wrong? it seems like he is running ALOT of toe out up front? 6 inches total toe out? Isn't that nuts? Don't have experience messing with the M2 CS on track but....on my current and past track cars if I run toe anywhere near that I would expect it to be tail happy.

Maybe I'm not reading/understanding this right.

I think for the front you are looking at the caster not the toe. His toe is zero up front.

His toe in the rear is toe in. And I rechecked it and it's 1/16 per side for 1/8 total.

[medphysdave]

Originally Posted by kart driver

M2C with camber plates with OEM suspension with an ABSOLUTELY new set of Michelin Cup 2 tires made a record laptime last summer: 1.23.94

Later in Autumn I added MP coilovers to the M2C and felt the car became significantly better in terms of its balance and thus I am sure it became faster. Although I had no chance to run new set of Michelin Cup2 tires at the same racetrack to check how much better than 1.23.94 it could do.

This Tuesday M2CS with camber plates with OEM suspension with an ABSOLUTELY new set of Michelin Cup 2 tires being for the first time at the racetrack did 1:25.76 which is more than 1.5 seconds slower than the best time of M2C
Today I tried M2CS again on a racetrack. Again around 1.5 seconds slower than the record time of M2C’s (1:23.94).

I didn’t like the balance of the M2CS being extremely tail happy both on Tuesday and today on a racetrack. So I went to check the camber and alignment. After I got recommendation to change the toe of the rear from neutral to 14 minutes each side I changed the settings as recommended and returned back to the racetrack to try it. The result was very good. The M2CS felt very balanced and I shaved 1.5 seconds off my previous laptime, showing the best time of 1.23.96 (with already worn Cup2 tires after two days at the racetrack). So this laptime of M2CS (with worn Cup2s) is identical to the best laptime of the M2C (with an absolutely NEW set of Cup2 tires).


Normally the laptime difference for me between an absolutely new set of Michelin Cup2s and worn out Cup2s is at least 1.5 seconds. So I make an assumption that once M2CS has new set of Cup2 tires (hopefully this Sunday), I would be able to show 1.5 seconds better laptime with M2CS bringing its best time to 1:22.5.


So as a result the conclusion is very likely to be that M2CS with OEM suspension is 1.5 seconds faster than M2C with OEM suspension on a 80+ seconds circuit.

Same tw cup2 or 180 vs 240? Not trying to not pick, just curious. If you've run both, do you notice a difference?

[m dizzle]

Originally Posted by sdhotwn

I think for the front you are looking at the caster not the toe. His toe is zero up front.

His toe in the rear is toe in. And I rechecked it and it's 1/16 per side for 1/8 total.

Oh wow. I read that completely wrong.

[kart driver]

Originally Posted by medphysdave

Same tw cup2 or 180 vs 240? Not trying to not pick, just curious. If you've run both, do you notice a difference?

Never paid attention to it.
I think the difference in laptime will be veeeery small if any.

[kart driver]

Here is the record laptime of M2C with a NEW set of cup2 tires





Here is the best time of M2CS I did yesterday with OLD cup2 tires once proper alignment was made:




These are the tires I drove yesterday with M2CS. Those are pretty worn out already as it is visible from the picture

[Davil]

Originally Posted by medphysdave

Same tw cup2 or 180 vs 240? Not trying to not pick, just curious. If you've run both, do you notice a difference?

I would imagine the 180 being a more focussed track tyre would be faster than the 240 which is more of a UHP road tyre. Terrible branding from Michelin!

[kart driver]

Originally Posted by medphysdave

Same tw cup2 or 180 vs 240? Not trying to not pick, just curious. If you've run both, do you notice a difference?

Checked it. It is 180.
Spoke to tire shop asking to supply only 180 in the future and they said in Europe it is 180 only.

[Davil]

Originally Posted by kart driver

Checked it. It is 180.
Spoke to tire shop asking to supply only 180 in the future and they said in Europe it is 180 only.

Can't see the photo, but are you saying that they don't equip M2CS with Cup2C in Eastern Europe? That's odd!

[kart driver]

Originally Posted by Davil

Can't see the photo, but are you saying that they don't equip M2CS with Cup2C in Eastern Europe? That's odd!

I think you are the only one not seeing my photos.


Cup2 in Europe has 180 treadwear rating only. There is NO 240 with Cup2s

[medphysdave]

Originally Posted by kart driver

I think you are the only one not seeing my photos.


Cup2 in Europe has 180 treadwear rating only. There is NO 240 with Cup2s

Cup2 vs cup2 connect?

[Davil]

Originally Posted by kart driver

Cup2 in Europe has 180 treadwear rating only. There is NO 240 with Cup2s

Did you get the car delivered with Cup 2C? If so they should be star spec and 240 TW. This was the development tyre and is a no cost option.

[kart driver]

Mine came with Super Sports. Bought the Cup2s (not connect) separately.

[Jimjamz]

Originally Posted by ptgltw

I can assure you I actually like this thread. It's very revealing. Please continue

Please recap as your points have changed. Actually I would hope you would start a dedicated thread that's easier to follow but so far:

M2C set a record time a while back when it was stock

M2 CS hasn't been able to match that
Time yet? I'm I summarizing correctly?

The m2 CS is more different than the M2C as the M2C is the the OG m2

All three different cars that look similar but are totally different.

We need to have a m2CS vs M2C vs ogm2 test.

Track, street etc. that would be a highly watched video

I might rent out VIR for that one and get a professional driver to drive all 3. That would be a killer day.

And oh let's throw in the m2 CSR for shits and giggles for the track
Comparison portion.

This would be an epic comparison video for the ages.

CSR vs CS v C v OG
x Track vs Road (excluding the CSR)

[Davil]

Originally Posted by kart driver

Mine came with Super Sports. Bought the Cup2s (not connect) separately.

That's a shame. The cup 2c star spec was the development tyre. It's really good.