[KevinM]

Honestly, I'd keep the E46 M3. Sure, buy something else to add, but throw some moth balls in the E46 and put in on a battery tender. I think you'll regret it if you don't. The early-mid 2000 M cars are being thought of as the last "pure" M cars - NA engine, manual, no iDrive, etc. Appreciation (which is already occurring) aside, you can't get this experience in a modern M car (which of course have their own charms).

If you have to get rid of it, trading the E46 for the M2C really doesn't make sense to me. The M2C is going to be a great car (I'm planning on trading my M3 for one in about a year), but I don't think it is special enough to lose the E46 for. Now, I'd feel better about trading the E46 M3 for a GT3.

[boostspoon]

Going from an E46 to a GT3 is a world of a gap in many ways. If you’re willing to fork out money for a GT3 and still are sentimental about an E46, the decision to keep the E46 is just garage space.

The E46 isn’t worth much because they’ve aged — unless yours is unmolested.

The M2C or alternative is a ‘decent’ in-between if you convince yourself the commitment of a GT3 is too great.

With such a difference in price, I don’t know how this thread has gone on 3 pages.

[devo]

Originally Posted by Smindustries

Wait for the GT3. The rub is that if you want a new GT3, you’ll most likely have to first buy another Porsche from a dealer to get in queue for a GT3. The way it works at most dealers is that there are three lists. The first list is customers who have spent over $1MM. The second is customers who have spent less than $1MM. The third is people who haven’t bought anything and ask to be put on a list. When the quarterly allocations come out, the dealer calls people on the first list and ask if they want a car. If there are allocations left, the second list gets called. The third list never gets called.

If you get a GT3 and want to remain on the list, it’s in your best interest to sell the car back to the dealer from which you bought it. They’ll sell it for over sticker and split the proceeds. That’s why you see cars with a few hundred miles for $30k-$40k over sticker.

My spouse is okay with swapping cars, so I bought a 997.2 Turbo S in November. Sold it back to the dealer in April, bought an M2, and ordered a Competition, all with the knowledge that I should have a GT3 allocation in the spring of 2019. If you want a GT3, you have to plan well in advance.

Pretty sure all 991.2 GT3s will be completed as MY2018 and cease production Dec. 2018.

[devo]

Originally Posted by iczer34

Go drive a 991.1/.2 GT3.

The thoughts of an M2C will quickly evaporate.

How about you buy my GT4 so I can jump into a GT3.

once you drive the .2 you'll quickly forget about the .1

[devo]

Originally Posted by CosmosMpower

If you don’t track id skip the Gt3 it’s not a great street car. I’ve driven my 997 Gt3 800 miles on the street in 2 years if that tells you anything. 991 is a bit softer but still m2c would be a better street car you can use every day.

Purely subjective. I could dd my current gt3, my previous .1 or .2 997.

[devo]

Originally Posted by H82BL8

Speaking from first hand experience.
I have previously owned 991.1 gt3
I currently own 991.2 gt3 manual.

The GT3 is an outstanding car in both versions.
The m2 comp is impossible to be compared to experience of a gt3.
The m2 comp will be a fantastic car, no doubt, but it is no GT3.

Go test drive one. You will see that there is value in the GT3 to what you pay for.

Worth every penny.

+1

[norMcal]

Originally Posted by boostspoon

Going from an E46 to a GT3 is a world of a gap in many ways. If you're willing to fork out money for a GT3 and still are sentimental about an E46, the decision to keep the E46 is just garage space.

The E46 isn't worth much because they've aged — unless yours is unmolested.

The M2C or alternative is a 'decent' in-between if you convince yourself the commitment of a GT3 is too great.

With such a difference in price, I don't know how this thread has gone on 3 pages.

Yes, going from e46 M3 to GT3 is a fairly big jump, both in price and performance. However, I don't feel there is much else in between, outside of a GT4, but IMO they are overpriced, as the used GT4's still go for close to MSRP, while used 991.1 GT3's have depreciated at least a little bit.

As far as performance goes, I am within a few seconds lap time wise and am confident that I can handle it. From what I can tell, most of the gain is on acceleration and braking. I have followed several GT3's in capable hands and I don't loose much time through the twisty sections.

My e46 M3 is worth at least $35k, between the base car and the parts I can sell off. It may not be a lot to some, but it is a nice chunk of change towards another car. It's not unmolested, but can be put back to 100% stock and sits at 45k miles. An absolute identical (stock) car just sold on BaT 2 days ago for $28.3k and I have lot more $$ to gain from BBK, Recaoro seats, CSL parts etc.

Judge for yourself:
https://drive.google.com/drive/folde...t5dWh05MLb5U62

So at first glance it seems like a huge difference in price, but if I have $70k in funds for an M2C, am I really that far off acquiring a GT3 in a year or two, if I can save at a pretty rapid rate?

[Isty]

Originally Posted by norMcal

Yes, going from e46 M3 to GT3 is a fairly big jump, both in price and performance. However, I don't feel there is much else in between, outside of a GT4, but IMO they are overpriced, as the used GT4's still go for close to MSRP, while used 991.1 GT3's have depreciated at least a little bit.

As far as performance goes, I am within a few seconds lap time wise and am confident that I can handle it. From what I can tell, most of the gain is on acceleration and braking. I have followed several GT3's in capable hands and I don't loose much time through the twisty sections.

My e46 M3 is worth at least $35k, between the base car and the parts I can sell off. It may not be a lot to some, but it is a nice chunk of change towards another car. It's not unmolested, but can be put back to 100% stock and sits at 45k miles. An absolute identical (stock) car just sold on BaT 2 days ago for $28.3k and I have lot more $$ to gain from BBK, Recaoro seats, CSL parts etc.

Judge for yourself:
https://drive.google.com/drive/folde...t5dWh05MLb5U62

So at first glance it seems like a huge difference in price, but if I have $70k in funds for an M2C, am I really that far off acquiring a GT3 in a year or two, if I can save at a pretty rapid rate?

Gorgeous M3 man! Keep it.

My thoughts were the same: theres not much that can replace M3 e46, but a GT porsche can.
I tried with the M2 and it didn't really succeeded.

[akkando]

Originally Posted by norMcal

Yes, going from e46 M3 to GT3 is a fairly big jump, both in price and performance. However, I don't feel there is much else in between, outside of a GT4, but IMO they are overpriced, as the used GT4's still go for close to MSRP, while used 991.1 GT3's have depreciated at least a little bit.

As far as performance goes, I am within a few seconds lap time wise and am confident that I can handle it. From what I can tell, most of the gain is on acceleration and braking. I have followed several GT3's in capable hands and I don't loose much time through the twisty sections.

My e46 M3 is worth at least $35k, between the base car and the parts I can sell off. It may not be a lot to some, but it is a nice chunk of change towards another car. It's not unmolested, but can be put back to 100% stock and sits at 45k miles. An absolute identical (stock) car just sold on BaT 2 days ago for $28.3k and I have lot more $$ to gain from BBK, Recaoro seats, CSL parts etc.

Judge for yourself:
https://drive.google.com/drive/folde...t5dWh05MLb5U62

So at first glance it seems like a huge difference in price, but if I have $70k in funds for an M2C, am I really that far off acquiring a GT3 in a year or two, if I can save at a pretty rapid rate?

That's still my favorite looking car ever.

[norMcal]

Originally Posted by Isty

Gorgeous M3 man! Keep it.

My thoughts were the same: theres not much that can replace M3 e46, but a GT porsche can.
I tried with the M2 and it didn't really succeeded.

Exactly my feelings. A GT Porsche can!

Originally Posted by akkando

That's still my favorite looking car ever.

Agreed. Which is probably my biggest hang up going for an M2. Great car I'm sure, but looks wise no where near.

[Sumotang]

Given the fact that in Australia the M2C is probably going to be around the $120K mark and the Porsche GT3 starts at $350K plus the endless options list there is no comparison down in this part of the world when you are looking at cost. The car is 3 times as expensive. I have owned some older P cars before and they are amazing. I think they are the ultimate driving car. But when I test drove the current M2, I got a similar feeling to driving my older P cars. The M2 is a fantastic machine that you just love driving and you can use it as a DD. I cant wait for my M2C!

A nice used E46 here is just under $30K.

If i could afford the GT3 then I would get that and have the M2C as the daily driver.

[Lucky1]

I see it every now and again on forums...regret from people who had special cars like the E46 M3 or Z4 M Coupe or an S2k or P car etc etc who regret their decision to sell. If you can swing it maybe do what some others suggest and wait til you can afford the GT3 without selling the M3. After driving the new car for a while if you never feel the need to drive the E46 that often you can always make the decision to sell then.

Sell to get the GT3 and you won't know how you'll feel til its too late.

Having said that as much as the M3 sounds like an awesome car can't imagine wanting to take it out that much with the GT3 around unless you need the rear seats.

[Rupes]

Is it possible to replace the wife and buy cars as you see fit?

Just kidding (mostly). But seriously, you should of be able to buy what you want as long as it isn't financially irresponsible. Meh, I'm already paid pontificating and providing no value to this post, so I'll see my way out.

[Karmic Man]

At the end of the day I don't see why you would go for the M2C if you can afford to buy and run the GT3.

Can you mod the M2C to be as fast as the GT3? Possibly but it is obvious that you have subconsciously set your mind on the GT3 before you started the thread but may be you didn't realised it.

One thing that the M2C has on the GT3 would be practicality and running cost and if they are trivial matters, nor is the depreciation or the purchasing cost then why are you still hesitating? May be go and test drive the M2C when it becomes available to see if this will hit the last nail in the coffin for wanting the M2C.

[KevinM]

Originally Posted by norMcal

Judge for yourself:
https://drive.google.com/drive/folde...t5dWh05MLb5U62

Keep that car. Thank me in 10 years.

[dmboone25]

If you can get the GT3, that’s “another level” car - hard to pass that up.

But in re: to the E46 M3, there’s no doubt about it’s respective greatness...and all of the collective accolades it has gotten. But it’s also a 10+ year old car at this point. And will be significantly slower than a M2C, much less an OG M2.

No doubt it’s a great car...for it’s time. That’s not today. Just sayin.

[dmboone25]

Originally Posted by KevinM

Keep that car. Thank me in 10 years.

I respectfully disagree.

I think we tend to romanticize these things a bit...and it’s easy to bemoan the loss of hydraulic steering or NA engines....but the M2C (just like the OG M2) is going to be much faster than an E46 M3, so.....

[chris719]

Originally Posted by norMcal

Exactly my feelings. A GT Porsche can!




Agreed. Which is probably my biggest hang up going for an M2. Great car I'm sure, but looks wise no where near.

If you can afford a GT3 then just get a GT3 and no need to sell the M3. The M2 is going to be a more versatile car but it will pale in comparison to a GT3 in feel and fun. As it should for the price difference .

You must be a seriously good driver to keep near even a 996 GT3 though. A 991 GT3 basically laps the ring one full minute faster than an E46 M3.

Honestly, you will probably be thrilled with either car. You'll give up of that gritty feeling with the M2 but it is so much better in most other ways.

[KevinM]

Originally Posted by dmboone25

I respectfully disagree.

I think we tend to romanticize these things a bit...and it’s easy to bemoan the loss of hydraulic steering or NA engines....but the M2C (just like the OG M2) is going to be much faster than an E46 M3, so.....

Agree to respectfully disagree. My E39 M5 and Z4M coupe keep me honest about the driving experience. Of course, I agree new cars are faster (not just BMWs). I think it's about when you got into enthusiast driving. Those initial cars (for me the E39) will often be your benchmark, despite 0-60 times. I will tell you that the steering in my first 2 E39s (1999 528 and 2003 530 5-speeds) and the Z4M coupe surpass any other BMW I have driven.

[Racer X]

Imo a e46 M3 is going to go up in value pretty substantially in the next 5 years... it is looked at as the high water mark for the M cars pure driving experience. I am in fact keeping my eye out for a nice example to add to my stable.

The M2C is going to be as good as it gets in modern M cars. But it’s going to be a 60-70k car US$... look at 2 year old M2s now... most are in the high 40s. Imo you expect the same % of depreciation in the M2C.

[norMcal]

Originally Posted by dmboone25

I respectfully disagree.
....but the M2C (just like the OG M2) is going to be much faster than an E46 M3, so.....

Maybe in a straight line and top speed, but the added heft will give some back in turns and breaking. To clarify, I an not talking stock vs stock. I am comparing prepping both cars with adequate mods. See my comment below.

Originally Posted by chris719

You must be a seriously good driver to keep near even a 996 GT3 though. A 991 GT3 basically laps the ring one full minute faster than an E46 M3.

Honestly, you will probably be thrilled with either car. You'll give up of that gritty feeling with the M2 but it is so much better in most other ways.

To clarify, when I compare these cars and lap times, I am comparing to a modified e46 M3. Granted that's not apples to apples, but the e46 M3 left a lot more room for improvement, as it was fairly soft in stock form. GT3 is track ready out of the gate and the M2C is about half way there.

Throw coil overs, camber plates, BBK and R-comps on any half way decent car, and your not that far off. With that said, I am ~5 seconds slower than a GT3 @ Thunderhill (3 mile track). The Nurburgring is over 5 times longer, which translates to 1/2 minute slower. So I don't think it is that I am seriously good driver, just that you were comparing a stock e46 M3, and I wasn't.

For that same reason, I don't feel an M2C will be a big step up. I am currently at ~370 hp and under 3200 lbs. M2C will be 405 hp at ~3600 lbs. On paper that is not looking much better if at all, which is why I have doubts it is worth it.

The biggest reason I was considering the M2C, is that it would take less to modify to make it as quick or quicker and thus making it more user friendly for more street driving. Not that I need that, as I have a DD, but it is nice to drive your fun car in between track days a bit more.

[norMcal]

Originally Posted by Lucky1

I see it every now and again on forums...regret from people who had special cars like the E46 M3 or Z4 M Coupe or an S2k or P car etc etc who regret their decision to sell. If you can swing it maybe do what some others suggest and wait til you can afford the GT3 without selling the M3. After driving the new car for a while if you never feel the need to drive the E46 that often you can always make the decision to sell then.

Sell to get the GT3 and you won't know how you'll feel til its too late.

Having said that as much as the M3 sounds like an awesome car can't imagine wanting to take it out that much with the GT3 around unless you need the rear seats.

Originally Posted by Rupes

Is it possible to replace the wife and buy cars as you see fit?

Just kidding (mostly). But seriously, you should of be able to buy what you want as long as it isn't financially irresponsible. Meh, I'm already paid pontificating and providing no value to this post, so I'll see my way out.

Originally Posted by dmboone25

I respectfully disagree.

I think we tend to romanticize these things a bit...and it’s easy to bemoan the loss of hydraulic steering or NA engines....but the M2C (just like the OG M2) is going to be much faster than an E46 M3, so.....

Originally Posted by Racer X

Imo a e46 M3 is going to go up in value pretty substantially in the next 5 years... it is looked at as the high water mark for the M cars pure driving experience. I am in fact keeping my eye out for a nice example to add to my stable.

The M2C is going to be as good as it gets in modern M cars. But it’s going to be a 60-70k car US$... look at 2 year old M2s now... most are in the high 40s. Imo you expect the same % of depreciation in the M2C.

Thanks for all the comments. I don't think I would regret selling the e46 m3 for a GT3, but probably would for a M2C, that much has become clear now!

The GT3 is not in the cards for me at this very moment, but chances are decent it could be in the near future. When and if I could afford one, or if the spouse should let me or not, is all very subjective. I do OK for myself supporting my family and an above average lifestyle, but I doubt I am anywhere near average income of a Porsche GT3 owner. That is a pretty tall order. My spouse has "allowed" me to buy new cars on a regular basis, but marriage is a compromise. I don't know too many spouses that would give a green light to a $130k track toy. Maybe if we still lived in the Bay Area, and I could just refi my home and pull 100 G's out it would be a different story. Not a big deal when your house just went up a 50% in a matter of a few years. But we chose to get out of the rate race and move to an area with a slower pace and having our own business. Best decision I ever made. The ironic thing is that I’ve doubled my income since, yet probably can afford less car now, because it is a lot harder to “earn” the money, then to pull it out of real estate. Well, maybe the bubble will burst again, and some will have to sell of their fancy toys for pennies on the dollars. I’ll be ready to step in ;-)


Appreciate all the input and the humor in some cases. I think the consensus is to stay put and see how things shake out.