BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read
M2 Technical Topics > S55 Engine / Drivetrain / Exhaust / Bolt-ons / Tuning > M2C missing part of intake piping.

Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      07-12-2019, 11:10 PM   #1
SEAT TIME RULES
HAZMAT
SEAT TIME RULES's Avatar
294
Rep
462
Posts

Drives: 20 BMW M2C 17 Mazda MX-5 RF
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: "Get Busy Living, or Get busy Dying"

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2020 BMW M2C  [0.00]
M2C missing part of intake piping.

I added some RPI Air Scoops thinking they would attach where the holes are next to the radiator. Guess what? No holes! On my car the extension piece is attached coming out of the airbox but not the elbow to connect them to the front open grill area.

So each side of the intakes have part #11 attached to the filter housing.

Parts 13 and 14 are not on the car. Where the grill (P14) attaches there are no holes.

It looks like BMW ditched these because the Light assemblies impede on the elbow some.

I cut away where the holes should be after looking a nearby M3. Then made my own elbows out of old plastic containers. I finished it all off with Blk duct tape to create a closed intake.

There are also holes on the outboard side of each Part 11. I was able to close those up thus getting cold air from the front grill only.

With my AK Motion reading IAT's I went from 20-25 degrees over outside air temp to 10-15 over at any decent speeds. Even less at 75+ MPH

If all the M2C's are the same then your sucking in hot air from the engine compartment.

Best,..
HAZMAT
Attached Images
 
__________________
2005-2006 BMWCCA Boston Chapter president
2004 Mazda Rev It Up Finalist
2002-Present HPDE Instructor
Appreciate 3
      07-13-2019, 10:21 PM   #2
SEAT TIME RULES
HAZMAT
SEAT TIME RULES's Avatar
294
Rep
462
Posts

Drives: 20 BMW M2C 17 Mazda MX-5 RF
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: "Get Busy Living, or Get busy Dying"

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2020 BMW M2C  [0.00]
Yup! I grabbed the wrong blowup.

For what I'm explaining the 90 bend and the neck it attaches to are not on my 2020.
__________________
2005-2006 BMWCCA Boston Chapter president
2004 Mazda Rev It Up Finalist
2002-Present HPDE Instructor
Appreciate 0
      07-15-2019, 03:02 AM   #3
Bee Pee
Brigadier General
United Kingdom
1236
Rep
3,952
Posts

Drives: AW M2 DCT
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: SW London

iTrader: (3)

Quote:
Originally Posted by SEAT TIME RULES View Post
I added some RPI Air Scoops thinking they would attach where the holes are next to the radiator. Guess what? No holes! On my car the extension piece is attached coming out of the airbox but not the elbow to connect them to the front open grill area.

So each side of the intakes have part #11 attached to the filter housing.

Parts 13 and 14 are not on the car. Where the grill (P14) attaches there are no holes.

It looks like BMW ditched these because the Light assemblies impede on the elbow some.

I cut away where the holes should be after looking a nearby M3. Then made my own elbows out of old plastic containers. I finished it all off with Blk duct tape to create a closed intake.

There are also holes on the outboard side of each Part 11. I was able to close those up thus getting cold air from the front grill only.

With my AK Motion reading IAT's I went from 20-25 degrees over outside air temp to 10-15 over at any decent speeds. Even less at 75+ MPH

If all the M2C's are the same then your sucking in hot air from the engine compartment.

Best,..
HAZMAT
Good work Hazmat - UK B58 mx40i owners found similar issue - work around was to retrofit B58 "hot climate" spec elbow and grill parts...

https://www.babybmw.net/forum/viewto...t=intake+grill
__________________
Fettled M135i EB AT - gone but not forgotten:
AW M2 DCT
Appreciate 0
      10-24-2019, 12:03 AM   #4
Alfy
Enlisted Member
Alfy's Avatar
Lebanon
59
Rep
48
Posts

Drives: M2 Competition
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Lebanon

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by SEAT TIME RULES View Post
I added some RPI Air Scoops thinking they would attach where the holes are next to the radiator. Guess what? No holes! On my car the extension piece is attached coming out of the airbox but not the elbow to connect them to the front open grill area.

So each side of the intakes have part #11 attached to the filter housing.

Parts 13 and 14 are not on the car. Where the grill (P14) attaches there are no holes.

It looks like BMW ditched these because the Light assemblies impede on the elbow some.

I cut away where the holes should be after looking a nearby M3. Then made my own elbows out of old plastic containers. I finished it all off with Blk duct tape to create a closed intake.

There are also holes on the outboard side of each Part 11. I was able to close those up thus getting cold air from the front grill only.

With my AK Motion reading IAT's I went from 20-25 degrees over outside air temp to 10-15 over at any decent speeds. Even less at 75+ MPH

If all the M2C's are the same then your sucking in hot air from the engine compartment.

Best,..
HAZMAT


Thanks for pointing this out, I just checked my car and I was also surprised to see that there are no air inlets behind the kidney grills as well!!

I analyzed the front bumper thoroughly and it seems the intake sucks air from narrow inlets perpendicular to the oil cooler.

Now I understand why you cut holes behind the kidney grills, I wonder why BMW ditched the inlet elbows on the M2c.

Did you try fitting the M4 elbows? Can you please share some pix of how you did this??

I took a pic inside my grill to make it clearer for everyone and check out the M4 intake elbows from realoem..

Cheers
Attached Images
  

Last edited by Alfy; 10-24-2019 at 04:42 AM..
Appreciate 1
Kankles674.50

      10-24-2019, 08:16 AM   #5
Megator
First Lieutenant
Megator's Avatar
122
Rep
309
Posts

Drives: M2 Competition
Join Date: Mar 2019
Location: NL

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfy View Post
Thanks for pointing this out, I just checked my car and I was also surprised to see that there are no air inlets behind the kidney grills as well!!

I analyzed the front bumper thoroughly and it seems the intake sucks air from narrow inlets perpendicular to the oil cooler if you look closely at the lower grill.

Now I understand why you cut holes behind the kidney grills, I cant believe BMW designed it this way after you confirmed that it is possible.

Did you try fitting the M4 elbows? Can you please share some pix of how you did this??

I took a pic inside my grill to make it clearer for everyone and check out the M4 intake elbows from realoem..

Cheers
BMW likely did this in order to increase the pressure of the air going through the rads in order to improve cooling efficiency. This is why most modern cars have ducted inlets to the rads.
Appreciate 0
      10-27-2019, 10:58 PM   #6
SEAT TIME RULES
HAZMAT
SEAT TIME RULES's Avatar
294
Rep
462
Posts

Drives: 20 BMW M2C 17 Mazda MX-5 RF
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: "Get Busy Living, or Get busy Dying"

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2020 BMW M2C  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Megator View Post
BMW likely did this in order to increase the pressure of the air going through the rads in order to improve cooling efficiency. This is why most modern cars have ducted inlets to the rads.
I don't believe so. I had a M4 right next to my car in the shop and the headlight assemblies are closer to the grill area on the M2c than the M4. I think they didn't want to spend a few bucks more fabricating a smaller set of elbows to fit in the smaller spaces.
__________________
2005-2006 BMWCCA Boston Chapter president
2004 Mazda Rev It Up Finalist
2002-Present HPDE Instructor
Appreciate 1
Poochie3940.50

      10-27-2019, 11:17 PM   #7
Simon P.
New Member
Canada
15
Rep
12
Posts

Drives: BMW M2C
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Montreal

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by SEAT TIME RULES View Post
I don't believe so. I had a M4 right next to my car in the shop and the headlight assemblies are closer to the grill area on the M2c than the M4. I think they didn't want to spend a few bucks more fabricating a smaller set of elbows to fit in the smaller spaces.
I can confirm this.
If you look at the available space between the airbox intake tube front end (right next to the headlight) and the radiator ducting, there isn't very much room to turn 90 degrees.
It looks like the short RH elbow from the M4 might work on the M2C, but certainly not the long M4 LH elbow.
You could possibly get creative and flip the M4 short RH elbow upside down and put it on the LH side of the M2C, thus using 2 M4 LH elbows but flipping one to make it face in the correct direction but that remains to be validated.
Appreciate 1
Alfy58.50

      10-28-2019, 12:26 AM   #8
Alfy
Enlisted Member
Alfy's Avatar
Lebanon
59
Rep
48
Posts

Drives: M2 Competition
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Lebanon

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Simon P. View Post
I can confirm this.
If you look at the available space between the airbox intake tube front end (right next to the headlight) and the radiator ducting, there isn't very much room to turn 90 degrees.
It looks like the short RH elbow from the M4 might work on the M2C, but certainly not the long M4 LH elbow.
You could possibly get creative and flip the M4 short RH elbow upside down and put it on the LH side of the M2C, thus using 2 M4 LH elbows but flipping one to make it face in the correct direction but that remains to be validated.
I concur since the OG M2 has the same elbow part number as the M4.

So if the RH elbow fits the OG M2 then it should definitely fit the M2c!!

The discrepancy seems to be the LH elbow, it would be cool if a tuner can develop them.

Check out the diagram comparison from realoem
Attached Images
 

Last edited by Alfy; 10-28-2019 at 12:38 AM..
Appreciate 0
      10-28-2019, 03:45 AM   #9
Megator
First Lieutenant
Megator's Avatar
122
Rep
309
Posts

Drives: M2 Competition
Join Date: Mar 2019
Location: NL

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfy View Post
I concur since the OG M2 has the same elbow part number as the M4.

So if the RH elbow fits the OG M2 then it should definitely fit the M2c!!

The discrepancy seems to be the LH elbow, it would be cool if a tuner can develop them.

Check out the diagram comparison from realoem
It would be easy enough to 3D print... If the R side one fits on the left it would be easy to make an inverted rep.

To the person that carried out the mod A) how and B) engine temps?

The M2C was meant to have cooling "issues" over the M2/M4 that is why I mention it. M2C also has less frontal area than M4 and is missing the side gills for evacuating hot air.
Appreciate 0
      10-28-2019, 04:10 AM   #10
Alfy
Enlisted Member
Alfy's Avatar
Lebanon
59
Rep
48
Posts

Drives: M2 Competition
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Lebanon

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Megator View Post
It would be easy enough to 3D print... If the R side one fits on the left it would be easy to make an inverted rep.

To the person that carried out the mod A) how and B) engine temps?

The M2C was meant to have cooling "issues" over the M2/M4 that is why I mention it. M2C also has less frontal area than M4 and is missing the side gills for evacuating hot air.
This would be a great upgrade if we can implement these elbows but the problem is taking the measurements in such a tight space!

It would require a lot of trial and error with the bumper removed to make a perfect fit.

I miraculously managed to take a pic of the LH existing intake nozzle through a very tight opening from the engine bay and outlined in red.

Notice how the path underneath the intake nozzle is blocked with the chassis arms. God knows how the air is being channeled upwards to feed the intake...
Attached Images
 
Appreciate 1
Poochie3940.50

      10-28-2019, 08:22 AM   #11
Simon P.
New Member
Canada
15
Rep
12
Posts

Drives: BMW M2C
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Montreal

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfy View Post
This would be a great upgrade if we can implement these elbows but the problem is taking the measurements in such a tight space!

It would require a lot of trial and error with the bumper removed to make a perfect fit.

I miraculously managed to take a pic of the LH existing intake nozzle through a very tight opening from the engine bay and outlined in red.

Notice how the path underneath the intake nozzle is blocked with the chassis arms. God knows how the air is being channeled upwards to feed the intake...
It's actually not that hard to get some measurements, you just need to remove the radiator upper support. I've attached some pictures from when I removed it for the RW Carbon front scoops I installed.
Once you've removed the radiator upper support, you remove the airbox assembly and you can wiggle the intake snorkel out and measure or test everything you want.
Attached Images
   
Appreciate 3
Alfy58.50
Poochie3940.50

      10-28-2019, 08:36 AM   #12
Simon P.
New Member
Canada
15
Rep
12
Posts

Drives: BMW M2C
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Montreal

iTrader: (0)

Here's the finished process for anyone interrested.
The good: the RW Carbon scoops (made for the M3/M4) fit with only minor adjusments to the M2C and I now have fresh air fed directly into the area where the airbox snorkels live.
The bad: On the M3/M4 platform the scoops feed directly into the elbows, but that can't happen on the M2C without "special" elbows because the scoops end up being higher than the snorkel by about 2 inches. The scoops certainly function when the car is moving forward, but not so much when the car is stationary.
Attached Images
    
Appreciate 3
Alfy58.50
Poochie3940.50

      10-28-2019, 09:18 AM   #13
Alfy
Enlisted Member
Alfy's Avatar
Lebanon
59
Rep
48
Posts

Drives: M2 Competition
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Lebanon

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Simon P. View Post
Here's the finished process for anyone interrested.
The good: the RW Carbon scoops (made for the M3/M4) fit with only minor adjusments to the M2C and I now have fresh air fed directly into the area where the airbox snorkels live.
The bad: On the M3/M4 platform the scoops feed directly into the elbows, but that can't happen on the M2C without "special" elbows because the scoops end up being higher than the snorkel by about 2 inches. The scoops certainly function when the car is moving forward, but not so much when the car is stationary.
Thank you so much for shedding some light and especially for posting the installation pix, you made this a lot easier for us now since I am planning on doing the same setup as yours.

Why did you remove the intake snorkel when installing the scoops though, I'm assuming that you also installed an aftermarket intake at the same time of the RW scoops installation?
Appreciate 0
      10-28-2019, 09:39 AM   #14
Simon P.
New Member
Canada
15
Rep
12
Posts

Drives: BMW M2C
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Montreal

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfy View Post
Thank you so much for shedding some light and especially for posting the installation pix, you made this a lot easier for us now since I am planning on doing the same setup as yours.

Why did you remove the intake snorkel when installing the scoops though, I'm assuming that you also installed an aftermarket intake at the same time of the RW scoops installation?
No problem, glad to help.
I removed the snorkels because there's an opening in them that lets hot engine bay air into the intakes and I wanted to block this off. Call me anal but I really can't understand why BMW did it this way.
I just cut a piece of plastic and used double sided tape to hold it in place. See attached. I also attached a picture showing where the scoops exit relative to where the snorkels live.
WRT to intake, yes, I'm using an Eventuri intake on my M2C. It retains the snorkels and attaches to them.
Attached Images
   
Appreciate 3
Alfy58.50
Malakas135.00
Poochie3940.50

      10-29-2019, 10:39 AM   #15
Alfy
Enlisted Member
Alfy's Avatar
Lebanon
59
Rep
48
Posts

Drives: M2 Competition
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Lebanon

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Simon P. View Post
No problem, glad to help.
I removed the snorkels because there's an opening in them that lets hot engine bay air into the intakes and I wanted to block this off. Call me anal but I really can't understand why BMW did it this way.
I just cut a piece of plastic and used double sided tape to hold it in place. See attached. I also attached a picture showing where the scoops exit relative to where the snorkels live.
WRT to intake, yes, I'm using an Eventuri intake on my M2C. It retains the snorkels and attaches to them.
Thanks once again for sharing this with us

Did you notice lower IAT's after this upgrade?
Appreciate 0
      10-29-2019, 01:22 PM   #16
Simon P.
New Member
Canada
15
Rep
12
Posts

Drives: BMW M2C
Join Date: Feb 2019
Location: Montreal

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alfy View Post
Thanks once again for sharing this with us

Did you notice lower IAT's after this upgrade?
Pretty much the same as the OP, about 30deg.
Let me know if you decide to go with RW Carbon scoops (same as me), there's a small modification you need to do to the mounting brackets. I'll post a picture if needed.
Appreciate 0
      10-29-2019, 01:33 PM   #17
Alfy
Enlisted Member
Alfy's Avatar
Lebanon
59
Rep
48
Posts

Drives: M2 Competition
Join Date: May 2018
Location: Lebanon

iTrader: (0)

I'm gonna go with your exact setup, what did you do to the bracket to make it work??

Can you also post a pic of your front end slightly zoomed out, I would like to see how the scoops line up with the vertical elements of the kidney grill
Appreciate 0
      10-29-2019, 03:20 PM   #18
infinitekidM2C
Brigadier General
infinitekidM2C's Avatar
United_States
1644
Rep
4,986
Posts

Drives: 2019 M2 Competition
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Orange County, CA

iTrader: (4)

Garage List
Interesting thread...subbed!
Appreciate 1
Alfy58.50

      10-29-2019, 04:52 PM   #19
SEAT TIME RULES
HAZMAT
SEAT TIME RULES's Avatar
294
Rep
462
Posts

Drives: 20 BMW M2C 17 Mazda MX-5 RF
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: "Get Busy Living, or Get busy Dying"

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2020 BMW M2C  [0.00]
IAT's are hard to get an accurate measure on. At idle there is very little difference in IAT's. Heat Soak on the intake air and parts...

But as speed increases so does the drop in IAT's I monitored the IAT's over a several day period before doing the mod.

I looked at the delta between outside air temp and IAT's to determine this.

IMHO there's about a 8-15 degree improvement with the modification at any significant speed.

That's a conservative estimate.
__________________
2005-2006 BMWCCA Boston Chapter president
2004 Mazda Rev It Up Finalist
2002-Present HPDE Instructor
Appreciate 0
      10-29-2019, 05:06 PM   #20
Malakas
First Lieutenant
United_States
135
Rep
356
Posts

Drives: 2020 M2c
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Houston, TX

iTrader: (0)

Wow! Ive been trying to wrap my head around this, and you guys are absolutely right... I found the snorkels and they basically feed air from... nothing. So the secondary holes in the side of the snorkel must have been added because there are conditions where the snorkel itself had inadequate air flow.

Kudos to all of you for figuring this out and cutting those holes behind the grill. Would be interesting to play with a 3D printed "S" mold to channel air from the grill to the snorkel.

Lots of work... but Im going to patch those side holes and at least open a hole behind / next to the grill.
__________________
Ride: 2020 F87 M2C, 6MT Drive: Nine-Four Motorsports
Before:
2013 - 3.8L GTR, first DCT
2012 - 5.2L R8 v10, 6MT
2011 - 4.0L E92 M3, 6MT
Appreciate 2
      10-29-2019, 05:48 PM   #21
SEAT TIME RULES
HAZMAT
SEAT TIME RULES's Avatar
294
Rep
462
Posts

Drives: 20 BMW M2C 17 Mazda MX-5 RF
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: "Get Busy Living, or Get busy Dying"

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2020 BMW M2C  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Malakas View Post
Wow! Ive been trying to wrap my head around this, and you guys are absolutely right... I found the snorkels and they basically feed air from... nothing. So the secondary holes in the side of the snorkel must have been added because there are conditions where the snorkel itself had inadequate air flow.

Kudos to all of you for figuring this out and cutting those holes behind the grill. Would be interesting to play with a 3D printed "S" mold to channel air from the grill to the snorkel.

Lots of work... but Im going to patch those side holes and at least open a hole behind / next to the grill.
I took a pair of empty plastic oil containers and cut them up to fashion some elbows to connect the scoops to the snorkel openings. Finished it off with black duct tape. Can't see it unless your looking right at it. Works for me
__________________
2005-2006 BMWCCA Boston Chapter president
2004 Mazda Rev It Up Finalist
2002-Present HPDE Instructor
Appreciate 1
      10-29-2019, 06:18 PM   #22
infinitekidM2C
Brigadier General
infinitekidM2C's Avatar
United_States
1644
Rep
4,986
Posts

Drives: 2019 M2 Competition
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Orange County, CA

iTrader: (4)

Garage List
Besides colder IAT I reckon there's more air getting into the intake as well, more velocity. Anyone have a white paper on airflow?
Appreciate 0
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:20 PM.




m2
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST