[Mr Pete]

I think the CS is a fantastic car, better than my M2C. My opinion, I still think it's a tuned up version of the M2C, but from the factory with a warranty. Not hating on it, as I considered getting one, but moreso for the 'exclusivity' due to the limited numbers.

The extra $25k+ I would spend towards the CS, I decided I'll just use that towards the purchase of my dream car, 992 GT3 Touring. My wife thinks I'm an idiot, but that's 98% of the time anyways.

[sdhotwn]

Originally Posted by S65V8

Some fair points, but you ask Why more power? because $85k in my book deserves more power and a car that is actually lighter weight bc of CF bits added onto it.

Agree the 'new for new' is a different comparo and to reference my reply above, $85k used GT4 vs a $85k M2CS for pure driving pleasure and track performance which both are built for, I personally would have to pick a GT4.

Ultimately, both are wonderful cars, and I am sure the CS will be worth a lot in the years to come, but putting that aside - what is objectively a better track day car with the most driving feel and tactile precision - GT4 will edge out the CS a bit is all Im saying…

M2C on the other hand is handily cheaper for almost the same amount of fun…and if you add $20k in mods - thats a lot of BMW fun…

Lastly, GTS 4.0 becomes interesting even at a base level which is about the same price as a M2CS at $85k. Since both would be bare bones given what a CS is supposed to be.

I am 100% sure no one with a CS is going to say they bought the wrong car for $85k and not that they should, everyone buys cars for a specific reason and if a CS is your bag of fun -

I'm a track guy, and I specifically bought the CS after driving the 981 GT4 and not coming away in love despite obsessing over it for nearly five years. I've had enough track and other fun car and driving experiences to realize the GT4 wasn't going to give me what I wanted on all the days off the track, or enough bump on the track over other options. Absolutely zero doubt the CS was the right purchase every time I drive it and with a track day under the belt and a few more coming up in a couple weeks.

[S65V8]

Originally Posted by sdhotwn

I'm a track guy, and I specifically bought the CS after driving the 981 GT4 and not coming away in love despite obsessing over it for nearly five years. I've had enough track and other fun car and driving experiences to realize the GT4 wasn't going to give me what I wanted on all the days off the track, or enough bump on the track over other options. Absolutely zero doubt the CS was the right purchase every time I drive it and with a track day under the belt and a few more coming up in a couple weeks.

yup, it is such a subjective thing, each car has its own purpose for the owner- congrats on that CS.

[Sublime00]

Someone do a covid adjusted price on these cars…makes most of them stupid to buy.

I recently drove a 911 carrera S with 1k miles on odo, asking $170k. Lol. So dumb.

[frostyrides]

Really don't understand why everyone obsesses over the price of the CS. The car is completely sold out so obviously it was priced correctly. (They weren't offering M3cs/M4cs discount on these cars that's for sure) If you remove price from the equation, would you get a CS over the competition? I bet 100% of people would reply yes. It's better in every way.

[sdhotwn]

Originally Posted by S65V8

yup, it is such a subjective thing, each car has its own purpose for the owner- congrats on that CS.

Thanks! And I plan on doing a track build gutted 2014 Cayman S in the next year or so. Then add a 718 GT4 and a 997.2 GT3 in the coming years... so I have issues (Note, I said nothing about selling anything. LOL)

[S65V8]

Originally Posted by Sublime00

Someone do a covid adjusted price on these cars…makes most of them stupid to buy.

I recently drove a 911 carrera S with 1k miles on odo, asking $170k. Lol. So dumb.

understatement of 2021! prices are crazy right now 🤯

[S65V8]

Originally Posted by frostytacos

Really don't understand why everyone obsesses over the price of the CS. The car is completely sold out so obviously it was priced correctly. (They weren't offering M3cs/M4cs discount on these cars that's for sure) If you remove price from the equation, would you get a CS over the competition? I bet 100% of people would reply yes. It's better in every way.

…of course you would but a $25k difference is a reality for most people. no one disputes a comp is less of a car than a cs, just most dont agree the upcharge is worth it.

[Gdiddy23]

I'd buy the M2cs in a heart beat if I could swing it. These cars are likely never going to go down in value come the full EV era in the next couple of years

[mchart]

Originally Posted by S65V8

…of course you would but a $25k difference is a reality for most people. no one disputes a comp is less of a car than a cs, just most dont agree the upcharge is worth it.

Well what car was there in between the M2C/GT350/ZL1 $60-something range, and a GT4 $100k (at best)? If you can't afford it you can't afford it, but the reality is that at MSRP the M2CS was basically on it's own in the price range when looking at capable driver-focused two-doors. I suppose you have the GTS, but I think that offers way less value for the money at that $80k range compared to the CS. Really, a more apt comparison is GTS or CS if you look at just the price point.

[Tornado1M]

Originally Posted by mchart

Well what car was there in between the M2C/GT350/ZL1 $60-something range, and a GT4 $100k (at best)? If you can't afford it you can't afford it, but the reality is that at MSRP the M2CS was basically on it's own in the price range when looking at capable driver-focused two-doors. I suppose you have the GTS, but I think that offers way less value for the money at that $80k range compared to the CS. Really, a more apt comparison is GTS or CS if you look at just the price point.

Agreed!

So many reviews pitting the CS vs the GT4……realistically speaking, there is at least a $25-30K difference. So, a comparison to the GTS from a price perspective makes more sense in my opinion.

[S65V8]

Originally Posted by mchart

Well what car was there in between the M2C/GT350/ZL1 $60-something range, and a GT4 $100k (at best)? If you can't afford it you can't afford it, but the reality is that at MSRP the M2CS was basically on it's own in the price range when looking at capable driver-focused two-doors. I suppose you have the GTS, but I think that offers way less value for the money at that $80k range compared to the CS. Really, a more apt comparison is GTS or CS if you look at just the price point.

…used 981 GT4 if you read the replies above, and yes a 718 GTS 4.0, definitely. Ultimately very subjective, but the main point is most buyers can get very close to the enjoyment of a CS for $25k less with a M2C. The $25k gap is not worth it to most, and it seems the premium paid is going mostly to the exclusivity factor (which is great if that's your thing). There just isn't a ton of parts in the M2CS you couldn't replicate or improve quite easily in the aftermarket…dare I say for less than $25k? maybe 🤔

[SexyRoger]

I have been driving a manual a3 for last few days as courtesy car.

I cannot think enough how it reminds me of the m2.

The gearbox sucks it's like a slush puppy, gutless etc and driving position is better in a Mercedes van. Lol

Now my m2 had dct and ohlins. And you wonder what is similar between the two cars

UNDERSTEER. Mind you this one understeers at lower speeds and I cannot go down a chicane as quickly as the m2 .

Interior is nicer to the eye but far from user friendly.

Winner m2.

[TheStanman]

The amount of recency bias in this list is ridiculous. They should have made a more intentional effort to be objective and thorough.

This is a list of their favorite cars over the past 2 years, and then they spent an afternoon thinking of some great older ones.

[Jimjamz]

BMW bet they could remove most marketing limitations on the M2C and go for broke on the M2CS (engine, parts, power). They only needed to sell 2200 which they seemed to have done and have won a lot of kudos for doing so. Doesn't sound like a dumb overpriced move to me?

These cars aren't being compared to stock Porsches - it's the GTs that they are up against. Not a conversation BMW was even in before these cars came out.

[TheStanman]

Also, CS cars are clearly far more than the sum of their parts.

Anyone else feel like that's what M used to offer? It sucks that they've reserved that for more expensive, limited productions models.

[NISFAN]

Originally Posted by TheStanman

The amount of recency bias in this list is ridiculous. They should have made a more intentional effort to be objective and thorough.

This is a list of their favorite cars over the past 2 years, and then they spent an afternoon thinking of some great older ones.

Erm, yes. The older cars wouldn't cut it today, so you would only consider those older cars that really broke the mould in their day.

For example BMW e92 M3 GTS. Awesome in its day, but we know it would really struggle to stay with an M2CS on track. That confirms an M2CS win against these two giants at least.

If it was all down to 'recency bias' the G80/82 would be top of the list. It didn't even feature.

[Davil]

Originally Posted by S65V8

1) …used 981 GT4 if you read the replies above, and yes a 718 GTS 4.0, definitely. Ultimately very subjective,

2) but the main point is most buyers can get very close to the enjoyment of a CS for $25k less with a M2C.

3) There just isn't a ton of parts in the M2CS you couldn't replicate or improve quite easily in the aftermarket…dare I say for less than $25k? maybe 🤔

1). Ugly little car that is boring on the road. Fine if you live on a circuit. Otherwise, boring.

2). No, not really. I've owned both. I loved the M2C but honestly, there's no comparison. For me anyway.

3). This has been dissected every which way over the last (maybe) 2 years. Long story short. You are wrong here too.

[Davil]

Originally Posted by TheStanman

Also, CS cars are clearly far more than the sum of their parts.

Anyone else feel like that's what M used to offer? It sucks that they've reserved that for more expensive, limited productions models.

Yes, in the case of the last two iterations (2&5), CS stands for Connoisseur Spec.

Something a bit special that only a minority will fully appreciate. Lost on many. Appreciated by few. It's a wonderful initiative from BMW.

[mfarrzhp]

Originally Posted by S65V8

…used 981 GT4 if you read the replies above, and yes a 718 GTS 4.0, definitely. Ultimately very subjective, but the main point is most buyers can get very close to the enjoyment of a CS for $25k less with a M2C. The $25k gap is not worth it to most, and it seems the premium paid is going mostly to the exclusivity factor (which is great if that's your thing). There just isn't a ton of parts in the M2CS you couldn't replicate or improve quite easily in the aftermarket…dare I say for less than $25k? maybe 🤔

I think this is a common theme for people that have not driven both cars. It's a lot more than carbon bits that separate the M2C and the CS. It all comes together for a much different driving experience than the M2C; the youtube reviewers aren't making it up.

Much better Wheels/Tires - $5-6K
Structural carbon roof and carbon hood
M4 seats - way nicer than the M2C
Alcantara and carbon tunnel - $$$ and makes the interior look much better
Remapped tune/power by BMW M division
Adaptive suspension
Yes, more CF with the front splitter and rear diffuser
Of course, exclusivity
M Drivers Pkg standard - Normally $2500

Could you make a CS clone out of an M2C for $25K? It would be a tight budget unless you perform your own labor. At the end of the day, you'd have a $60K CS wannabe with no warranty.

Yes, the CS is marketed as the halo BMW track car, but outside a couple dozen people on this forum, BMW knows most of our cars won't see 2 days on a racetrack.

Disclaimer: I'm not hating on the M2C, it's a lot of car for the money. My only issue is the constant comparison with the CS and people not realizing the extent of the driving and aesthetic difference inside and out. Looks like the M5 CS is getting killer reviews and you see the same argument against the M5C.

[ScullyD]

Originally Posted by mfarrzhp

I think this is a common theme for people that have not driven both cars. It's a lot more than carbon bits that separate the M2C and the CS. It all comes together for a much different driving experience than the M2C; the youtube reviewers aren't making it up.

Much better Wheels/Tires - $5-6K
Structural carbon roof and carbon hood
M4 seats - way nicer than the M2C
Alcantara and carbon tunnel - $$$ and makes the interior look much better
Remapped tune/power by BMW M division
Adaptive suspension
Yes, more CF with the front splitter and rear diffuser
Of course, exclusivity
M Drivers Pkg standard - Normally $2500

Could you make a CS clone out of an M2C for $25K? It would be a tight budget unless you perform your own labor. At the end of the day, you'd have a $60K CS wannabe with no warranty.

Yes, the CS is marketed as the halo BMW track car, but outside a couple dozen people on this forum, BMW knows most of our cars won't see 2 days on a racetrack.

Disclaimer: I'm not hating on the M2C, it's a lot of car for the money. My only issue is the constant comparison with the CS and people not realizing the extent of the driving and aesthetic difference inside and out. Looks like the M5 CS is getting killer reviews and you see the same argument against the M5C.

This point has been exhausted, but special edition BMWs always seem to suffer from perception that they aren't worth the cost. Maybe its cause the engines are the same and HP doesn't increase significantly and the cars don't visually look that much different than the base car. The M3 CSL was perceived to be too expensive and not much different, same with the 1M, same with the M2 CS, and now the M5 CS initially suffered from the same perception (now its impossible get a car without at least a 20k premium, and youtube videos show the car is vastly different from an M5C). I'm not even going farther back to things like the M3 Lightweight or M3 GT.

If you believe these cars aren't much different than original models, you are just wrong and history has proven you are wrong time and time again. Its not even a debate anymore.

Can't wait for the debate on how the new M4 CSL isn't much different than an M4 Comp. Meanwhile, based on BMWs track record, my deposit is already in.

[M3R1]

Personally I feel that many that think the price of the CS is too high have not driven one. I have had both the M2cs and M2c as well as an ESS VT625 E92 M3, and two E46 M3's. I have also driven an F80 M3, E60 M5 and a E39 M5.

The M2cs is without question the best of them all. I paid over MSRP to get in the club, however as most have commented the exclusivity and current market have driven the prices up on all cars. At MSRP the CS is objectively worth the premium. Some simply can't swing it, therefore it is easy to say the value is not there.

My SC'd M3 had about $25k in aftermarket parts and as a result the performance was at or very near the big dollar cars we are discussing here. Clearly the $100k total invested in that car was not retained. It was pretty awesome though...

You can build an M2c to be at the level of the M2cs, however the value of the heavily modded M2c will not reflect the money spent.

As for comparing it to a Porsche, the closest model in price is the GTS not GT4. I have not driven either so I will not comment on how the M2cs compares. I have however given my thought as to why I chose the cs over a GTS (or even a GT4). See my post below..

Originally Posted by M3R1

I spent GTS 4.0 money on my M2cs, yes I paid over MSRP. Although I appreciate the track prowess of the GT4, it was not even a consideration. I simply do not like driving a 2 seater.

I love Porsche as a company, they are in a league of their own in terms of engineering and build quality. Their commitment to producing a product that delivers in ways that other companies do not cannot be argued.

BMW makes great cars, but does appeal to a broader demographic. To me the ///M decision has produced cars that speak to me. I have owned many BMW (8 total), most notably 2 E46 M3's, a supercharged E92 M3, and M2c (breifly) and now the the M2cs. The M2cs is a pinnacle car for me and there is not a car made that I would like to replace it with. Perhaps a 992 911s with a SportDesign Aerokit package, however that is simply not a price that is feasible for a man like me.

This car is a weekend toy for me (Never will it see the track), mostly just to get out, clear my head and enjoy driving. The size, power, handling, ride, aesthetics, exclusivity, etc make this car what it is. At least for me.

https://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...3&postcount=44

At the end of the day we are comparing cars that most would be very happy to own. I know I am...