[243Racing]

Dyno shows +10 whp and +33 wtq on the 93 map. For anyone interested.

The numbers fell off a cliff on the 3rd pull, even after letting it cool down.

[Dasnub]

Originally Posted by BeastieBombRacing

Dyno shows +10 whp and +33 wtq on the 93 map. For anyone interested.

The numbers fell off a cliff on the 3rd pull, even after letting it cool down.

Thanks for the update. This seemed a little too good to be true given what other tuners have squeaked out of a stage 1 flash.

[Dinan_Engineering]

Originally Posted by BeastieBombRacing

Dyno shows +10 whp and +33 wtq on the 93 map. For anyone interested.

The numbers fell off a cliff on the 3rd pull, even after letting it cool down.

Please post the dyno if you get a chance. Would love to see it so it can be analyzed with more depth.

I assume the numbers you posted are the peak gains. We advertise/show +16whp/+50wtq for those specific data points. Other factors could be at play -- ambient temp, type of dyno, were the before/after run the same day/same dyno, adequate cooling used, etc.

[243Racing]

Originally Posted by Dinan_Engineering

Please post the dyno if you get a chance. Would love to see it so it can be analyzed with more depth.

I assume the numbers you posted are the peak gains. We advertise/show +16whp/+50wtq for those specific data points. Other factors could be at play -- ambient temp, type of dyno, were the before/after run the same day/same dyno, adequate cooling used, etc.

All great and valid questions. Both runs were on dyno Jets (albeit different ones) about 75* ambient (I got lucky today, it was cooler than it was supposed to be). Should be same smoothing and correction. I will post both dynos when I get home.

[243Racing]

Originally Posted by Dinan_Engineering

Please post the dyno if you get a chance. Would love to see it so it can be analyzed with more depth.

Quick additional info. Baseline dyno was on 93 octane with BMC filter, no other mods. Tuned dyno was on 93 octane with aFE pro dry filter and ER Charge pipes - no other mods.

Baseline:




Tuned:

[MDrivenPwr]

I will be swapping my Dinantronics elite stage 1 for the Stage 1 flash tomorrow. Hope it's the right decision. Will keep you posted.

[Dinan_Engineering]

Originally Posted by BeastieBombRacing

Quick additional info. Baseline dyno was on 93 octane with BMC filter, no other mods. Tuned dyno was on 93 octane with aFE pro dry filter and ER Charge pipes - no other mods.

Thanks for posting.

Having 2 different dynos on 2 different days its hard to make a real accurate assessment of a before and after. For any real accuracy in a delta, same day/same dyno is the only way to go.

One other note is that the pulls were run quite differently (starting at 2k versus 2.7k) which shifts peak RPM. May just be a difference in how each operator does pulls but it also may be indicative of running the car in different gears between stock and tuned as well. Regardless it makes a direct overlay really difficult.

Still, if you just take the data on face value ignoring all the other stuff mentioned and just take the median pull for both (Stock=Green, Tuned=Red) you still get some respectable deltas even when you ignore the shift.

Also, on the tuned run by itself it measures a max power of 361 WHP / 416 WTQ. We advertise 358 WHP / 416 WTQ.

What did the butt dyno tell you in your limited ownership out of curiosity?

[243Racing]

Originally Posted by Dinan_Engineering

Thanks for posting.

Having 2 different dynos on 2 different days its hard to make a real accurate assessment of a before and after. For any real accuracy in a delta, same day/same dyno is the only way to go.

To be fair, none of the Dinan dealers in my area have a dyno. So with your requirement that a dealer do the install, such a back to back comparison is all but impossible

Originally Posted by Dinan_Engineering

One other note is that the pulls were run quite differently (starting at 2k versus 2.7k) which shifts peak RPM. May just be a difference in how each operator does pulls but it also may be indicative of running the car in different gears between stock and tuned as well. Regardless it makes a direct overlay really difficult.

I thought this was weird too, but didn't notice until I left.

Originally Posted by Dinan_Engineering

Still, if you just take the data on face value ignoring all the other stuff mentioned and just take the median pull for both (Stock=Green, Tuned=Red) you still get some respectable deltas even when you ignore the shift.

Also, on the tuned run by itself it measures a max power of 361 WHP / 416 WTQ. We advertise 358 WHP / 416 WTQ.

I'll refer you to your own words here.

Originally Posted by Dinan_Engineering

<snip> . You can expect the same delta as what is shown in the 93 chart above. Don't concern yourself with the absolute numbers but rather the delta as that is ultimately what you are purchasing.

There are some good gains especially around 4k, but overall the deltas are less across the board than advertised. Perhaps my baseline being higher means there was less room to "grow", I don't know.

Originally Posted by Dinan_Engineering

What did the butt dyno tell you in your limited ownership out of curiosity?

I felt the torque increase.

For me, since I'm trying to build a car to the limits of the series I'm running in, the horsepower just isn't enough. Even running full slicks, with my comp weight set impossibly low, I'd still need to be close to 380 to the wheels. The massive dropoff in the 2nd and 3rd runs scares me, too. On my baseline, with near identical ambient temps, that didn't happen.

Further edit...sorry. I didn't post in this thread to complain - only to share information!

[Dinan_Engineering]

Originally Posted by BeastieBombRacing

To be fair, none of the Dinan dealers in my area have a dyno. So with your requirement that a dealer do the install, such a back to back comparison is all but impossible.

I felt the torque increase.

For me, since I'm trying to build a car to the limits of the series I'm running in, the horsepower just isn't enough. Even running full slicks, with my comp weight set impossibly low, I'd still need to be close to 380 to the wheels. The massive dropoff in the 2nd and 3rd runs scares me, too. On my baseline, with near identical ambient temps, that didn't happen.

Further edit...sorry. I didn't post in this thread to complain - only to share information!

Fair enough. Point is a year between pulls on different dynos with different procedures is not an ideal way get accurate before and after data.

The comparison to tuned peaks (yours versus advertised) taken on its own without any other data I find interesting is all in that it is damn near identical to reported. My statement about the deltas being consistent is true given good data. The delta in this case is immaterial as the data is flawed. I stand by the statement that if this was run on the same dyno, similar days , same gear / pull procedure you would see delta's much closer/same as advertised. This isn't to slam the information supplied just to point out that it is skewed is all and needs to be taken with a grain of salt.

In terms of your series requirements -- If you want 380 to the wheels you need a quality intercooler at absolute minimum to shift the efficiency in your favor at the top end (and also assist in staving off heat soak), especially if you are only running 93. In our testing these are typically good for around 8-10whp on the platform. As a comparison, the stage 2 flash in development (Non-M2 N55) on 93 with the big turbo (stage 1) and intercooler is around 385whp at the peak but with a torque jump up to 445wtq. The M2 version may get slighly more than the non-M2 N55 but not by much. That’s all to say the peak numbers are really limited by fueling.

[Poochie]

Originally Posted by BeastieBombRacing

Dyno shows +10 whp and +33 wtq on the 93 map. For anyone interested.

The numbers fell off a cliff on the 3rd pull, even after letting it cool down.

Putting the numbers aside for a moment, do you feel or notice a discernible difference increased power?

What does you butt dyno have to say?

[akkando]

Originally Posted by Dasnub

The lag issue is definitely a thing on the 6MTs. Very frustrating- there are some recent long threads on it. Any tuner that solved this would get my business even without a power bump.

Do you feel like the stage 1 tune is going to have a significant impact on longevity/reliability over stock without changing the IC and turbo as well? The tune really puts me where I’d like to be in terms of power but don’t want to do it at the expense of those things, as this is a 25k/yr daily driver.

Put another way- is this stage 1 tune or full stage 4 a more reliable option?

get an intercooler unless you just want to do one pull.

[243Racing]

Originally Posted by Poochie

Putting the numbers aside for a moment, do you feel or notice a discernible difference increased power?

What does you butt dyno have to say?

I felt the increased torque, for sure.

For a 'safe' street tune, I would recommend this - like I said my only concern was the rapid degradation on the successive runs. Cooling mods may help - but this tune is advertised for otherwise stock vehicles.

[akkando]

Originally Posted by Dinan_Engineering

Thanks for posting.

Having 2 different dynos on 2 different days its hard to make a real accurate assessment of a before and after. For any real accuracy in a delta, same day/same dyno is the only way to go.

One other note is that the pulls were run quite differently (starting at 2k versus 2.7k) which shifts peak RPM. May just be a difference in how each operator does pulls but it also may be indicative of running the car in different gears between stock and tuned as well. Regardless it makes a direct overlay really difficult.

Still, if you just take the data on face value ignoring all the other stuff mentioned and just take the median pull for both (Stock=Green, Tuned=Red) you still get some respectable deltas even when you ignore the shift.

Also, on the tuned run by itself it measures a max power of 361 WHP / 416 WTQ. We advertise 358 WHP / 416 WTQ.

What did the butt dyno tell you in your limited ownership out of curiosity?

Also worth pointing out the power difference across the whole rev range, like what power is made at 4k rpm stock vs tuned, not just peak power.

[Dasnub]

Originally Posted by BeastieBombRacing

I felt the increased torque, for sure.

For a 'safe' street tune, I would recommend this - like I said my only concern was the rapid degradation on the successive runs. Cooling mods may help - but this tune is advertised for otherwise stock vehicles.

This is where I have a bit of an issue. If the car can only manage a single pull at these numbers, I’m not sure Dinan should be advertising their stage 1 as a flash tune only. An intercooler is clearly a necessary addition.

[AmuroRay]

The car is already near it’s maximum potential on the stock catalyst. Similar stage 1 tunes on the M2 lose power because they can’t overcome the heat and back pressure closer to redline.

Someone asked about TMS -
https://f30.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...ghlight=Turner

350- 360whp is about the limit for pump gas stage one, and that’s likely not even consistently without at least an intercooler. If you plan to go beyond that, Dinan’s tune isn’t for you.

[243Racing]

Originally Posted by AmuroRay

The car is already near it’s maximum potential on the stock catalyst. Similar stage 1 tunes on the M2 lose power because they can’t overcome the heat and back pressure closer to redline.

Someone asked about TMS -
https://f30.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...ghlight=Turner

350- 360whp is about the limit for pump gas stage one, and that’s likely not even consistently without at least an intercooler. If you plan to go beyond that, Dinan’s tune isn’t for you.

350-360 is what I make stock...

[AmuroRay]

Originally Posted by BeastieBombRacing

350-360 is what I make stock...

Most stage 1 tunes don’t make much, if any power past peak.

[Poochie]

Originally Posted by AmuroRay

The car is already near it's maximum potential on the stock catalyst. Similar stage 1 tunes on the M2 lose power because they can't overcome the heat and back pressure closer to redline.

Someone asked about TMS -
https://f30.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...ghlight=Turner

350- 360whp is about the limit for pump gas stage one, and that's likely not even consistently without at least an intercooler. If you plan to go beyond that, Dinan's tune isn't for you.

I hate to admit it but you're right; it sounds like the ECU is retarding the timing, in an attempt to reduce the power and by extension, heat, from the motor, so it's not necessarily a fault within the tune but the motor tapping out..

As they say, you can't get blood from a stone and at times of heavy, consistent loads, I feel my motor reaching its mechanical limits. So I know it's not bullcrap.

Sure, you can just get another aftermarket tune that juice the shit out of the boost pressure, without much regard for all the OEM safeties and limitations, to make up for the hardware shortcomings, as BMW tends to do with all their 4 cylinder turbos but you're just reducing the longevity of the motor and putting more strain on the powertrain. It's a vicious and asinine compromise, IMHO.

The Dinan S1 tune sounds like the software is maxing out as much as it can can safely squeeze out of the N55 motor.

I mean, it doesn't cost them anything to just turn up the boost over a more reasoned safe flash but if they're also saying, in literal terms, that the motor is already running at its capacity, then there is only so much more a flash can eek out of the N55.

So I guess this flash can be interpreted as peak but not consistent power.

[///M TOWN]

Originally Posted by VisualEcho

Dealer has to install?

No interest.

Agreed.

Can it be shipped to a dealer/reseller or do they need the car?

[VisualEcho]

Originally Posted by Poochie

I hate to admit it but you're right...

"It's the turbo Brian, it always has been the turbo.

The intercooler and catalyst are, they're just fumes."

[243Racing]

Originally Posted by ///M TOWN

Agreed.

Can it be shipped to a dealer/reseller or do they need the car?

You have to take your car to a Dinan dealer to have the flash done.

[BruceM]

I think it may be most accurate to say that it's the turbo and the HPFP. N55 engine internals can handle quite a bit more power.