01-15-2020, 10:41 AM | #23 |
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I don't think they misspoke. Looks as if the HPFP line to rail is flex with a right angle SS line (both ends). Should/may look stock 'ish once the engine cover is removed.
Any thoughts on when/IF the LPFP should be replaced ? |
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01-15-2020, 11:03 AM | #24 | |
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01-15-2020, 12:02 PM | #25 | |
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That's being said if you are able to diy I'd skip the B58C and go for the B58D hpfp. I wouldn't recommend buying used since hpfps are known to fail with age and you never know what you might get. Remember it's not a clean cut job.
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01-15-2020, 12:10 PM | #26 | |
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Generally speaking direct injection requires less pressure from the lpfp than port injection since the hpfp will pressurize the fuel to what is required for the direct injectors. That's why we see car with just an hpfp upgrade being able to hit huge horse power numbers with the stock lpfp. That being said I would personally upgrade the lpfp if you're running PI as well, or running over E35 since ethanol is corrosive and lacks lubrication vs pump gas so you'd want an ethanol compatible pump. It's hard to give a solid number since we don't have an lpfp sensor, but since e35 should be able to Max out a PS2 and get 550whp I'd say if you had a stage 1 pump and were unable to Max out ps2 before your hpfp rail pressure drops you'd need an lpfp. So essentially if you're unable to achieve the power your hpfp is suppose to be able to support you'd need an lpfp. You should probably upgrade the lpfp when running ful
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01-15-2020, 12:28 PM | #27 |
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Tuning related question, but since it’s linked to necessary HPFP fuel flow I’ll ask it here:
Is there a certain E mix where there are little to no gains on our platform vs full E85? Or is it completely turbo & tune dependent? For instance, if I upgrade the HPFP, can I get more power out of my Dinan turbo with higher than E30? If so, any idea the right E mix and how much more HP before we’re boosting out of its efficiency range and creating unwanted high IATs? And, what are the answers to these questions if I switch to a PS2? Thanks! |
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01-15-2020, 12:47 PM | #28 | ||
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You'll probably be able to hit 500 whp on E35, and depending on your intercooler you may need a bit more in the summer when iat's spike.
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01-15-2020, 01:01 PM | #29 | |
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01-15-2020, 01:02 PM | #30 | |
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Hearing all this, I’ll probably just run E47-48 (half E10, half E85) so I don’t have to constantly calc Emix amounts when filling up, or take extra lubrication precautions if using full E85. I know ethanol concentration varies in E85, so some safety would be baked into any custom tunes I do. For now I’ll upgrade the HPFP and continue to run the BM3 Stg 2 E30 map with my Dinan turbo so I can run E47-48 year round. Maybe later this year I’ll upgrade the turbo and then do a couple custom tunes: one for the street with max power and good for a few pulls, and one for the track that’s dialed back to help keep IATs in check. It sounds like Dorch or Spool Stage 1 HPFP’s will be good enough for this plan, but if Stage 2 is only a couple hundred bucks more I’ll jump on one of those. |
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01-15-2020, 02:27 PM | #31 | |
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01-15-2020, 03:45 PM | #32 |
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In many cases, bad fuel quality is the reason for stuttering or spitting engines with a dme tune.
I don't think, your hpfp is the faulty part in your setup, but the tune itself is. Bet, you have to check the fuel-flow map in your file. Seems like it asks for to much fuel in the mid-range. A less aggressive tune with a more linear increase of boost pressure to higher rpm's could already solve your problem. |
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01-15-2020, 03:53 PM | #33 | |
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Like for me in Canada petro Canada imo has a really shitty winter gas imo which drops octane. Husky has really consistent gas all year round.
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01-15-2020, 03:58 PM | #34 | |
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01-15-2020, 03:59 PM | #35 | |
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Just remember anytime you're running ethanol you're susceptible to ethanol related wear and tear from a lack of lubrication, regardless of concentration. You also have to remember to run fuel stabilizer. You can also get an Ethanol sensor to ensure you get the correct ethanol mix (well close to since it's actually a hydroscopic sensor) In regards to the dinan turbo you probably won't see too much gain from E35-E50 just better in cylinder combustion temps.
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01-15-2020, 04:44 PM | #36 | |
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01-15-2020, 06:28 PM | #37 | |
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It is more likely to be because IAT's dropped in the winter vs. summer allowing you to run more timing and boost which the car doesn't see in the summer since IAT's are high the car pulls timing and boost. So the increased boost and timing on the winter will require more fuel causing your hpfp to crash. Bad fuel can also be a part of it since the additives also can make the car run a bit leaner requiring more fuel and thus putting more strain on the hpfp. My sti used to run alot leaner on winter gas blends vs. husky who sold consistent gas, and this was the result all year round.
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01-15-2020, 06:37 PM | #38 | |
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Also, I wouldn't automatically attribute it to "bad winter gas" as air density is quite different in the winter. Cooler air is more dense, and more dense air needs more fuel. Nor attribute it to the tune adding more boost and timing in winter (because the logs show the same boost and timing across seasons) |
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01-15-2020, 06:49 PM | #39 | |
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Take a look at your MAF data and see how much more air the MAF sees in the winter vs the summer. Also was your hpfp psi extremely close to it's targets during the summer? Because like you said increased air density during the winter could be enough to crash the hpfp if it was already struggling in the summer. Bad fuel has always caused my sti to run leaner than normal until it deviated so far I would get weird fuel dumps. I'm just pointing this out since it was always a route of my problems in my sti days, again I'm not a tuner so a real tuner would be able to provide the best advice I'm just here to chime in with what I know and I do make mistakes. I still would not say it's the tuners fault, the map ran fine in the summer and now conditions changed it is having issues. You can't really expect alot from an ots map made for a wide range of cars. That's generally why I stay far away from canned tunes, there's no such thing as one size fits all while trying to push the envelope. The only one sized fits all tune is the stock one since it factors in all the hardware for all conditions.
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01-16-2020, 11:37 AM | #40 | |
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For hot summer days at the track, where do you think the larger turbo, boost, Emix, and IAT balance is in terms of additional HP over my current setup (BM3 Stg 2 E30, Dinan turbo, Wagner Evo II Comp, HJS 300-cell DP)? Overall, can I really expect much of a consistent HP gain on track in the summer without additional IATs? Or, am I still stuck with doing Meth, custom oil cooler, larger FMIC, and/or custom liquid to air IC no matter what? It would be great to add “more efficient” power, but it seems wishful that higher HP won’t yield higher IATs. |
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01-16-2020, 03:35 PM | #41 | |
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First my question is: What's your power goals, and what are your cooling mods? Because the stock cooling system can barely keep a stock tuned car cool under track conditions. In regards to iats as you increase boost iat's will rise with it, in order to get a hp gain without too much additional iats get an upgraded turbo that can flow more air at a lower boost which can translate to more power without or even an iat drop. You'll likely need a larger oil cooler and radiator with a tuned setup for consistent performance in 30°C + weather during the summer, you likely won't need a custom setup untill you upgrade the turbo past stage 1 all though this can vary. You probably won't need an air to water intercooler setup, meth would be helpful but you likely won't need that either with ethanol, since higher octane fuels helps combat high iat's. Just check your logs and see if iat's cause timing to be pulled, it shouldn't happen when running E30, although your hpfp can crash on the track. It's possible if you get a really large turbo that runs lower boost, your iat's post intercooler will be lower than running a smaller turbo at high boost and out of it's efficiency range and the power will be the same in both cases. However more power means more heat and you'll run into cooling system issues.
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01-16-2020, 03:47 PM | #42 | |
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https://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...1568593&page=4 https://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...1525790&page=3 If I could get another 40-50whp reliably on track, I’d be pretty damn happy. Altho, I don’t have much appetite right now to go with custom cooling mods, so I’m still trying to determine the best path. I guess the only real path is to add the power and see what happens. Just feels like I’ll still be screwed when it comes to cooling. |
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01-16-2020, 07:16 PM | #43 | |
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The issue is with air to air intercooler cars BMW decided to save some space by chopping nearly 1/4 off of the radiator so the intercooler can slide in underneath. So the real issue is water temps, you can solve a large majority of that with an AC delete CSF radiator which is still PnP. That should (again hugely variable and difficult to predict) get you up to 420 whp on a hot summer day doing 30+ min sessions. That should be 50 whp more than dinan stage 2. Oil temps would then be the issue, but the CSF or ER kit should be able to do 400ish whp. That's probably still 30 whp over dinan. If you want more than that it's going to require custom cooling setups.
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01-17-2020, 01:10 AM | #44 | |
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Their website shows an F series chassis option for the fuel line and N55 engine, this is available for both their long line from HPFP to tank and short line which is from the HPFP to oem fuel line. So I guess I was correct.
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