[drp087]

So with the Daily M2C, I am taking it out on weekends every 2-3 months or so to the canyons, but I don't want to be pushing it on public roads- really want to try taking it to the track.

Now, I don't have any track experience, but just some basic advice shows to get better brake fluid and brake pads for starters. However, after some more research, I'm not so sure if I want to be taking this car to track, since it is my daily, and I baby this car far too much.

I'm guessing probably 2-3 track days a year or so, and I do want a car to be a better driver in, so maybe a second lower powered car will be a better option? Also looking for a relatively affordable option for maintenance, repair, parts. Not a mechanically inclined so will not be doing major repairs or maintenance myself.

1. Go with the M2C, save the cash, and just be careful

2. Get a 350z for $10-15K (100K miles), dedicated track car

2. Get the new GR86 (If I can get one for MSRP), mainly track car, but much better reliability/warranty

Any advice?

Also, are there any recommended training programs for beginners in California?

[MooMooM2]

The best track car is the one you have.

You have not yet done any track days so buying a dedicated track car is a bit much.

I have now 5 track days under my belt so a noob and was just where you were at the earlier this year. The m2c is at home at the track, you basically have to do nothing to it and can take it to the track (specially as a new comer) but just do brake fluid and that is really all you need if you want to do 2-3 track days a year. The car is going to be fine, you will not be breaking it, not even close, it can take the abuses (again specially since it will be your first time, you think you are going to be fast and kill the brake pads and the tires but you won't.

You have a car that is a hoot at the track so why buy another car that won't be as good or as fun at the track? Take what you got. Get the insurance when you go so if something happens you will be covered. Yes shit happens but you will be surprised at how safe HPDEs are. Also they are a blast, best days I have had this year, can't wait until next season.

[flybigjet]

Fair warning-- you're about to go down a (increasingly expensive) rabbit hole!

I had the same thought you had. Just take the car to the track occasionally, have some fun, keep the costs down.

The problem is twofold. a) you start to have fun exploring the limits of the car, which leads to b) you start to get better-- going faster, turning in tighter, going deeper into the braking zone, etc. and c) you start getting "go fast" parts to make the car handle better on the track.

Which uses up consumables (they're called that for a reason) at an increasingly alarming rate.

You figure out that your tires are a limiting factor (Yes, Pilot Sports, I'm talking to YOU). Which means dedicated track wheels and tires.

Which means spending a bit of time taking wheels/tires on/off.

They last six HPDE's.

SIX.

If you're lucky.

Then, you figure out that you need to upgrade your brake pads, as that's the next logical step. So you get some very spendy high-performance hybrid pads that'll work on the street as well as "light" track duty, because you just want to swap wheels and go and don't want to bother with dedicated track pads.

Those? Last four HPDE's.

FOUR.

The wife is somewhat..... displeased. Especially since the pads cost damn near $1000 and you told her these would last for "a couple of years".

So now, your dipping your toe into the world of track days and HPDE's results in you spending a day BEFORE the HPDE changing wheels, tires, brakes and fluid and the day AFTER the HPDE doing the same. And the new track-friendly brakes? Sound like you've just dropped a sack full of hammers down the stairs every time you come to a stop on the road on your way to the track.

The end result? You're poor. You await track days like a kid waiting for Christmas. You start seeing late-apex lines on your daily drive to work. You start to seriously consider surgery to remove the permanent grin on your face every time you hit a turn "just right" at the track.

Hence, the rabbit hole.

I'm not saying it's a bad idea. I'm just warning you of what you're getting yourself into.

R.

[3LiterBeater]

It's all a compromise really. I average about 15 events per year and also daily my M2 in all four seasons. At a beginner level, I'd say take the car out (pads and fluid are a great choice) and learn the basics. Eventually you'll get to a point where you'll want to heavily modify the car to use for track time (make it worse on the street) or you'll want a true "cheap" track car.

There's no right answer as everyone is different but, getting out there first is a really important step. Take the M2 and have a great time.

[RugbyBro]

Go completely stock, just make sure you have fresh fluid and a decent amount of pad left. You won’t be fast enough to warrant any modifications or otherwise. You’ll know if you like it after your first few days. After that, then you should look at pads/fluid, tires, & camber plates + alignment… and that’s it, just get more seat time after that and fine tune the car as your abilities improve.

I’d say you’ll need at least a season with the M2 before you’ll know whether you want a separate dedicated track car or not.

For your first track day, I would highly recommend Hooked On Driving - they run a very tight and well put together program that is tailor made for beginners.

[PackPride85]

At minimum I would do track brake fluid and a hybrid pad like a ds2500 for your first few. Preference would be swap to full track pad but downside is cost and if you only track once they are worthless since you can't street them. Many people will say you'll be fine on stock pads but that comes down to the track and how comfortable you get. I've seen quite a few people have bad enough fade to go off the track on stock pads.

[flybigjet]

Originally Posted by PackPride85

At minimum I would do track brake fluid and a hybrid pad like a ds2500 for your first few. Preference would be swap to full track pad but downside is cost and if you only track once they are worthless since you can't street them. Many people will say you'll be fine on stock pads but that comes down to the track and how comfortable you get. I've seen quite a few people have bad enough fade to go off the track on stock pads.

The DS2500 is a fantastic "daily" pad, and would be great for a novice/first track day or two.

But, once you start running advanced classes? You'll vaporize them in four days. Oops.

3600 lbs. is a lot of metal to be repeatedly dragging down from speed on the track.

R.

[drp087]

lol Thanks for the very entertaining yet practical warning.

Looks like I gotta just take the M2 out and see for myself. What are some recommended track programs/instructions for beginners in Socal?

The Hooked on Driving program looks good with a private instructor for a reasonable price, but date availability is not great. Any others recommended?

Originally Posted by flybigjet

Fair warning-- you're about to go down a (increasingly expensive) rabbit hole!

I had the same thought you had. Just take the car to the track occasionally, have some fun, keep the costs down.

The problem is twofold. a) you start to have fun exploring the limits of the car, which leads to b) you start to get better-- going faster, turning in tighter, going deeper into the braking zone, etc. and c) you start getting "go fast" parts to make the car handle better on the track.

Which uses up consumables (they're called that for a reason) at an increasingly alarming rate.

You figure out that your tires are a limiting factor (Yes, Pilot Sports, I'm talking to YOU). Which means dedicated track wheels and tires.

Which means spending a bit of time taking wheels/tires on/off.

They last six HPDE's.

SIX.

If you're lucky.

Then, you figure out that you need to upgrade your brake pads, as that's the next logical step. So you get some very spendy high-performance hybrid pads that'll work on the street as well as "light" track duty, because you just want to swap wheels and go and don't want to bother with dedicated track pads.

Those? Last four HPDE's.

FOUR.

The wife is somewhat..... displeased. Especially since the pads cost damn near $1000 and you told her these would last for "a couple of years".

So now, your dipping your toe into the world of track days and HPDE's results in you spending a day BEFORE the HPDE changing wheels, tires, brakes and fluid and the day AFTER the HPDE doing the same. And the new track-friendly brakes? Sound like you've just dropped a sack full of hammers down the stairs every time you come to a stop on the road on your way to the track.

The end result? You're poor. You await track days like a kid waiting for Christmas. You start seeing late-apex lines on your daily drive to work. You start to seriously consider surgery to remove the permanent grin on your face every time you hit a turn "just right" at the track.

Hence, the rabbit hole.

I'm not saying it's a bad idea. I'm just warning you of what you're getting yourself into.

R.

[swampfox94]

Check out the bmw cca for socal area. The one in DC usually runs 3 track weekends per year and are super beginner friendly

[okla_m2c]

+1 to BMW CCA. Sign up for a membership if you don't have one already, it's ~$60/year. You can select your chapter for what geographically makes sense.

Look up events on their website and/or on motorsportreg (https://www.motorsportreg.com/).

Personally, I would choose a BMW CCA HPDE event if it's your first time. They focus on safety while giving you the foundational skills needed for on-track driving. It's a heck of a lot of fun, and all of their events are well-organized and well-executed. Plus, you get to meet a lot of other BMW enthusiasts, and it's just a great crowd overall - very inviting and lots of fun.

[OG Shark]

It is all about comfort zone & what you want out of your track time. The M2C is an excellent dual use platform (one of the best available today). It is very reliable & durable and the out of the box performance is excellent. The rear is a bit twitchy compared to the F80/2 but is still very manageable. With right foot control it is also a good learning tool. It is heavy though and with pace it can be a bit hard on consumables. Bit of a trade off for the fun factor the M2C has.

Money factor - with the amount of usage you are expecting it would likely take you years to break even with the 2nd car. I would also prefer the reliability of a current M2C over most cars in that price range and with 100k on them. To me would anticipate a 2nd car costing more unless you use it enough for the consumables to balance out the price of entry.

Fun factor - personal here but I would much rather drive the M2 on the track even while learning. The power isn't unmanageable - and that is also part of the learning process. And as you progress you are not capped with an inferior performing car. If you think the M2 is fun on the street - it out does that exponentially on the track.

Long term - not something you would really be concerned about right now - but long term the ceiling of the M2 is much higher. A lot of room to grow with the car and then when the car starts holding you back there are a lot of good upgrade options available. Also any money you do put into the M2 is something that can be enjoyed on the street too. With 99% of your driving being on the street I like the idea of being able to enjoy any money spent on your track car being able to be enjoyed all the time.


If you do end up tracking the M2 - you are on point with the basic track prep. Brakes are the key focus - definitely a good fluid (I really like Castrol SRF and yes it is worth the small extra cost). Pads I still recommend a dedicated track pad and swapping back & forth for track days. I do not think the time saved for only 2 to 3 days a year is worth running a hybrid pad that will create a ton of dust on the street and also does not have the level of fade resistance as a decent track pad. The 2500s are a good pad (we run & sell quite a few) but they do generate a ton of dust. I personally would not want to run them all year just to save a bit of time not swapping out for 2 or 3 days of track time. Fade resistance - a pad like the 2500 can handle some light track use but not what a track pad is capable of doing. We do not know your driving style nor the tracks you are planning on running (just as important). You do not have to be a pro and threshold braking all over the track to outrun the performance of a hybrid pad. A beginner can do it just the same - especially in modern cars. Dragging out the brakes is a pretty common thing beginners do and this can be worse than threshold braking. Also DSC uses the brakes (all four corners) quite a bit to make the corrections - and if you are constantly banging on that limit you can very easily generate more heat in this heavy car than what a hybrid can handle. And what tracks you run plays a very big factor as well - some are easy on brakes and some absolutely punish them. A pad like the 2500 might be sufficient but I think a having a set each of street and track pads is the way to go for your usage.

[to_riffic]

If it's your first time out, at least brake fluid swap. I full send my CS and have no qualms about it. If it's your first time, you'll be a lot slower and I wouldn't expect you to be drifting through corners or going max out in your M. So yes, the tires will be a limiting factor, but you, yourself will already be the limiting factor so I'd say take it out, and stretch 'er legs.

[RugbyBro]

A couple unorthodox but helpful tips for your first day (and tracking in general) regarding S55:

1. Do not use S3 if you have the DCT, use either S2 or even S1.
2. Use either efficient or sport throttle settings. Don’t knock efficient until you try it on track, it really helps to manage S55 torque. S55 is an engine that you manage with your right foot and sport plus has an extremely small margin for error.

I personally use S2 in the dry and S1 in the wet with either efficient or sport throttle depending on the response I want on the day.

[SCMTX]

Originally Posted by flybigjet

Fair warning-- you're about to go down a (increasingly expensive) rabbit hole!

I had the same thought you had. Just take the car to the track occasionally, have some fun, keep the costs down.

The problem is twofold. a) you start to have fun exploring the limits of the car, which leads to b) you start to get better-- going faster, turning in tighter, going deeper into the braking zone, etc. and c) you start getting "go fast" parts to make the car handle better on the track.

Which uses up consumables (they're called that for a reason) at an increasingly alarming rate.

You figure out that your tires are a limiting factor (Yes, Pilot Sports, I'm talking to YOU). Which means dedicated track wheels and tires.

Which means spending a bit of time taking wheels/tires on/off.

They last six HPDE's.

SIX.

If you're lucky.

Then, you figure out that you need to upgrade your brake pads, as that's the next logical step. So you get some very spendy high-performance hybrid pads that'll work on the street as well as "light" track duty, because you just want to swap wheels and go and don't want to bother with dedicated track pads.

Those? Last four HPDE's.

FOUR.

The wife is somewhat..... displeased. Especially since the pads cost damn near $1000 and you told her these would last for "a couple of years".

So now, your dipping your toe into the world of track days and HPDE's results in you spending a day BEFORE the HPDE changing wheels, tires, brakes and fluid and the day AFTER the HPDE doing the same. And the new track-friendly brakes? Sound like you've just dropped a sack full of hammers down the stairs every time you come to a stop on the road on your way to the track.

The end result? You're poor. You await track days like a kid waiting for Christmas. You start seeing late-apex lines on your daily drive to work. You start to seriously consider surgery to remove the permanent grin on your face every time you hit a turn "just right" at the track.

Hence, the rabbit hole.

I'm not saying it's a bad idea. I'm just warning you of what you're getting yourself into.

R.

Well said!

[DrChase]

Originally Posted by drp087

So with the Daily M2C, I am taking it out on weekends every 2-3 months or so to the canyons, but I don't want to be pushing it on public roads- really want to try taking it to the track.

Now, I don't have any track experience, but just some basic advice shows to get better brake fluid and brake pads for starters. However, after some more research, I'm not so sure if I want to be taking this car to track, since it is my daily, and I baby this car far too much.

I'm guessing probably 2-3 track days a year or so, and I do want a car to be a better driver in, so maybe a second lower powered car will be a better option? Also looking for a relatively affordable option for maintenance, repair, parts. Not a mechanically inclined so will not be doing major repairs or maintenance myself.

1. Go with the M2C, save the cash, and just be careful

2. Get a 350z for $10-15K (100K miles), dedicated track car

2. Get the new GR86 (If I can get one for MSRP), mainly track car, but much better reliability/warranty

Any advice?

Also, are there any recommended training programs for beginners in California?

If time is precious to you and you have a somewhat busy life, it might be worth it to simply track your worthy daily. I have a surgical weapon of an ND2 Miata (about $25K in track modifications ALL ordered/installed by myself), but it's a lot of extra work to maintain, prep, trailer or drive to/from, and requires extra space to use. I'm feeling burnt out on the "race car" and am going to be selling it. I realize now why old dudes drive a GT3 to their office or the country club, then drive to the track and beat on it, then drive home and at some point just take it to the dealer to have someone else work on the car. The M2C is highly capable and has high but approachable limits, and is currently serving me very well as my track car. My Miata hasn't left the garage in over six months. The M2C is comfortable, but still engaging on street and track. Also durable enough to do track work so long as you have some 200TW or solid street tires (e.g. PS4S), sufficient negative camber, DOT4 fluid, and decent pads (DS2500 or better). I'm set up with pads, SRF fluid, steel lines, Royal Purple Ice (coolant additive), and a set of square Apex wheels with Falken RT660s. Digging the setup and completely satisfied with it. Turns out I didn't need the dedicated racecar. To each his/her own, but this has been my experience as I get into my mid-30s.

[DrChase]

Originally Posted by drp087

So with the Daily M2C, I am taking it out on weekends every 2-3 months or so to the canyons, but I don't want to be pushing it on public roads- really want to try taking it to the track.

Now, I don't have any track experience, but just some basic advice shows to get better brake fluid and brake pads for starters. However, after some more research, I'm not so sure if I want to be taking this car to track, since it is my daily, and I baby this car far too much.

I'm guessing probably 2-3 track days a year or so, and I do want a car to be a better driver in, so maybe a second lower powered car will be a better option? Also looking for a relatively affordable option for maintenance, repair, parts. Not a mechanically inclined so will not be doing major repairs or maintenance myself.

1. Go with the M2C, save the cash, and just be careful

2. Get a 350z for $10-15K (100K miles), dedicated track car

2. Get the new GR86 (If I can get one for MSRP), mainly track car, but much better reliability/warranty

Any advice?

Also, are there any recommended training programs for beginners in California?

Oh, and I Turo-rented the GR86. Loved it to pieces, but I'm in an old man phase of life where I've spoiled myself with cars that are both capable of performance AND feel substantive and reasonably comfortable inside the cabin. I'm a sucker for lightweight and handling dynamics, which the 86 platform offers up in spades (with a pretty good powertrain now too). However, I already have the M2C and it's like a heavier but also faster, more versatile, and more comfortable derivation of the same theme. The new 86 felt like a cheaper version of the M2C (with WAY cheaper consumables) that I wish had been made when I was in my 20s. HUGE praise for the 86, but too similar to the M2C for me to pick one up.

[drp087]

Originally Posted by DrChase

If time is precious to you and you have a somewhat busy life, it might be worth it to simply track your worthy daily. I have a surgical weapon of an ND2 Miata (about $25K in track modifications ALL ordered/installed by myself), but it's a lot of extra work to maintain, prep, trailer or drive to/from, and requires extra space to use. I'm feeling burnt out on the "race car" and am going to be selling it. I realize now why old dudes drive a GT3 to their office or the country club, then drive to the track and beat on it, then drive home and at some point just take it to the dealer to have someone else work on the car. The M2C is highly capable and has high but approachable limits, and is currently serving me very well as my track car. My Miata hasn't left the garage in over six months. The M2C is comfortable, but still engaging on street and track. Also durable enough to do track work so long as you have some 200TW or solid street tires (e.g. PS4S), sufficient negative camber, DOT4 fluid, and decent pads (DS2500 or better). I'm set up with pads, SRF fluid, steel lines, Royal Purple Ice (coolant additive), and a set of square Apex wheels with Falken RT660s. Digging the setup and completely satisfied with it. Turns out I didn't need the dedicated racecar. To each his/her own, but this has been my experience as I get into my mid-30s.

I am in a very similar situation, in my mid 30's- I doubt I will have time for all the maintenance, prep, etc. I think I will try a similar setup- first track with just a brake fluid swap, then maybe start investing in a hybrid pads!

As for the GR86 I think I just need to scratch that itch by renting a turo and taking it to the canyons.

[infinitekidM2C]

Originally Posted by MooMooM2

The best track car is the one you have.

You have not yet done any track days so buying a dedicated track car is a bit much.

I have now 5 track days under my belt so a noob and was just where you were at the earlier this year. The m2c is at home at the track, you basically have to do nothing to it and can take it to the track (specially as a new comer) but just do brake fluid and that is really all you need if you want to do 2-3 track days a year. The car is going to be fine, you will not be breaking it, not even close, it can take the abuses (again specially since it will be your first time, you think you are going to be fast and kill the brake pads and the tires but you won't.

You have a car that is a hoot at the track so why buy another car that won't be as good or as fun at the track? Take what you got. Get the insurance when you go so if something happens you will be covered. Yes shit happens but you will be surprised at how safe HPDEs are. Also they are a blast, best days I have had this year, can't wait until next season.

I agree with this. Lots of good advice generally. I'm no track star but have tracked this car a decent amount of times, initially stock and then modded. To be honest as a newb, the car is fine as is to track, the pads and fluid hold up nicely. But yeah at some point those are good upgrades once they wear out.

Biggest suggestion i have is to pick the track carefully. I see you're in California, so i suggest Chuckwalla. I'd probably avoid the higher speed tracks until you get used to spinning it a couple times on a smaller track. So i'd probably avoid Auto Club Speedway and Big Willow. Work up to those. Pretty sure all track days have instructors available so you can look into that.

[drp087]

Originally Posted by infinitekidM2C

I agree with this. Lots of good advice generally. I'm no track star but have tracked this car a decent amount of times, initially stock and then modded. To be honest as a newb, the car is fine as is to track, the pads and fluid hold up nicely. But yeah at some point those are good upgrades once they wear out.

Biggest suggestion i have is to pick the track carefully. I see you're in California, so i suggest Chuckwalla. I'd probably avoid the higher speed tracks until you get used to spinning it a couple times on a smaller track. So i'd probably avoid Auto Club Speedway and Big Willow. Work up to those. Pretty sure all track days have instructors available so you can look into that.

Yea as I was looking, did notice some tracks looked high speed- definitely want to go safe, especially given mine's a manual and I see myself fumbling around alot more and more room for error.

How is Streets of Willow? Speed Ventures has an event Dec 10-11.

Also is Autocross a quicker, more accessible approach to test the waters?

[infinitekidM2C]

Originally Posted by drp087

Yea as I was looking, did notice some tracks looked high speed- definitely want to go safe, especially given mine's a manual and I see myself fumbling around alot more and more room for error.

How is Streets of Willow? Speed Ventures has an event Dec 10-11.

Also is Autocross a quicker, more accessible approach to test the waters?

Streets of willow is a good choice. Bit far for me but might work for you. I don't like autocross and don't think it looks nearly as fun, but it is probably a bit safer.

[Fabb]

With minimal mods, the M2c is pretty enjoyable at track. I know a guy only put Nankang CR1 tires on the M2c (stock wheel even) and ran buttonwillow 1:57. But if you start to put more mods, things get pretty expensive. If you suspect you might go down the rabbit hole of a dedicate track car, I would look gr86. Way lighter and easy to control at limit.

[FTS]

Originally Posted by drp087

I am in a very similar situation, in my mid 30's- I doubt I will have time for all the maintenance, prep, etc. I think I will try a similar setup- first track with just a brake fluid swap, then maybe start investing in a hybrid pads!

As for the GR86 I think I just need to scratch that itch by renting a turo and taking it to the canyons.

I have tracked for over 18 years, and have been an instructor for half of that time. There are lots of good advice in this thread, take them to heart.

One thing I would like to stress is that new drivers tend to overuse equipment, brakes, tires, and other consumables. As you gain experience and confidence things get better even when performance goes higher. This is particularly true with the brakes. Even though new drivers tend to drive slower, they stay on the brakes far too long for understandable reasons. So, brake pads and fluids, engine coolant and oil, etc. should be priorities.

Lastly, as suggested already, do invest in joining BMWCCA. Their track programs for new drivers particularly are excellent. Their instructor training is superb IMHO. A good instructor will make the whole difference on the track from safety and learning perspectives.

Have fun.