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      02-23-2019, 03:31 PM   #199
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Just go the Wagner Evo II Comp. Future proof for your stage 2 tune and relatively light weight. Runs great on my car with stock turbo and no noticeable lag.

Wouldn't bother with VRSF or CSF purely based on their empty claims.
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      02-23-2019, 03:48 PM   #200
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dabozo View Post
Just finished going through all 10 pages here and am still bewildered as to what is best solution based on my setup/future mods. Seems recommendations are all over the place and sometimes contradictory.

Currently have stock turbo, stock exhaust, fabspeed cat. Don't track but would some day like to...and if I did, it would be very rare.
Live in southern Ontario where summers are hot and humid. Don't drive the car in winter.

So the purpose for me is basically some spirited street driving when the opportunity presents itself.

-Future plans are at minimum bm3 stg 1.
-Chance I go stg 2 but would unlikely include a new turbo.
-I have easy access to 93+ octane fuel.

Mike at xph recommended a 5" AA or vrsf.

However I've also seen him recommended larger 6" IC's to others with similar setups and aspirations.

Of course, balance is everything and I definitely don't want to introduce too much lag. This would likely mean a 5" or something lower density. But would like to attempt to future proof myself.

VRSF mentioned a middle of the road option was in development back in December. Tiago, if you are reading this, how is that project coming along?

For you guys out there who have been around the block when it comes to tuning/performance mods, recommend I consider for my IC?
Stage 1 , go with 5" including Wagner EVO I, Active Autowerke or VRSF 5" HD

Stage 2 and/or upgraded turbo , go with 6" including Wagner EVO II, VRSF 6" Race CSF or Evolution Racewerks.
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      02-27-2019, 11:27 AM   #201
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Quote:
Originally Posted by heimbo View Post
Mike - Does the CSF require front bumper removal like the front page pic? Thank you
No, not according to Evolve YT clip below..



Quote:
Originally Posted by atlas View Post
Just go the Wagner Evo II Comp. Future proof for your stage 2 tune and relatively light weight. Runs great on my car with stock turbo and no noticeable lag.

Wouldn't bother with VRSF or CSF purely based on their empty claims.
Agree Wagner Comp Evo 2 is a good upgrade for stock or tuned - I had one on stage 2 JB4'd M135i - all good. CSF seems to work well - compared to stock on STARLA, Evolve's stg 2 remapped M2.

I've asked Evolve, given how narrow the CS FMIC [when compared to wider stock FMIC] is, could this allow room to run 2.5"/3" ducting from lower grill area to both front brakes ?
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Last edited by Bee Pee; 02-27-2019 at 11:39 AM..
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      02-27-2019, 11:31 AM   #202
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Fit them all the time without removing the front bumper as per that video above.
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      02-27-2019, 11:56 AM   #203
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Imran@Evolve View Post
Fit them all the time without removing the front bumper as per that video above.
cool Video
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      02-27-2019, 03:30 PM   #204
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Here is the chart from the video that Evolve Automotive put together.
https://flic.kr/p/SPybxf



Summary
- Little to no pressure drop compared to OEM
- 21℃ drop in Intake air temp = ~70℉ drop in IAT's compared to the OEM
- Mid range power gain ~20whp / 20 tq
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      02-27-2019, 03:40 PM   #205
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CSF Cooling View Post
Here is the chart from the video that Evolve Automotive put together.
https://flic.kr/p/SPybxf


Summary
- Little to no pressure drop compared to OEM
- 21℃ drop in Intake air temp = ~70℉ drop in IAT's compared to the OEM
- Mid range power gain ~20whp / 20 tq
Nice!!
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      02-27-2019, 06:07 PM   #206
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CSF Cooling View Post
Here is the chart from the video that Evolve Automotive put together.
https://flic.kr/p/SPybxf



Summary
- Little to no pressure drop compared to OEM
- 21℃ drop in Intake air temp = ~70℉ drop in IAT's compared to the OEM
- Mid range power gain ~20whp / 20 tq
Pretty good! What's the ambient temperature to ensure this data can be compared with other intercoolers?

Otherwise that's some great numbers! Wouldn't call it power gain though, more accurate to say no power lost due to ignition being pulled as a result of high iats.

But otherwise great results you've convinced me and I'll probably get a CSF IC in the future.
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      02-28-2019, 01:18 AM   #207
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Quote:
Originally Posted by atlas View Post
Just go the Wagner Evo II Comp. Future proof for your stage 2 tune and relatively light weight. Runs great on my car with stock turbo and no noticeable lag.

Wouldn't bother with VRSF or CSF purely based on their empty claims.
Empty claims? Are you trying to troll? i have a CSF cooler it cools like a beast with oem fitment and zero lag. Both companies have substantial testing available if you attempt to look you will find it . Peter from pure turbos eu had a great review on the CSF cooler vs the wagner
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      02-28-2019, 02:18 AM   #208
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Quote:
Originally Posted by atlas View Post
Just go the Wagner Evo II Comp. Future proof for your stage 2 tune and relatively light weight. Runs great on my car with stock turbo and no noticeable lag.

Wouldn't bother with VRSF or CSF purely based on their empty claims.
Wagner and CSF make a quality intercooler but since you're spreading mis-information we're obligated to respond. We have multiple customers out there who have posted data on our Race intercooler including the independent customer testing below which includes a before/after dyno:

VRSF Race Intercooler – N55 F30 335i
75° Ambient | 2-4 Gear Pull | Start 89° – End 86°



21hp & 33tq peak gains with over 50hp/tq gained in the mid range.

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      02-28-2019, 02:59 AM   #209
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CSF Cooling View Post
Mid range power gain ~20whp / 20 tq
Imran@Evolve Hi Imram - the quote above implies you were showing wHP on your dyno in the YT clip I posted above in this thread. Were both 403 std FMIC v 413 CSF FMIC stats at the wheels or at the crank figures ? Thanks, BP.
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      02-28-2019, 05:28 AM   #210
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bee Pee View Post
Imran@Evolve Hi Imram - the quote above implies you were showing wHP on your dyno in the YT clip I posted above in this thread. Were both 403 std FMIC v 413 CSF FMIC stats at the wheels or at the crank figures ? Thanks, BP.
Crank figures in the video.

Just a simple typo from CSF as they are used to WHP I guess.
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      02-28-2019, 11:52 PM   #211
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiago@VRSF View Post
Wagner and CSF make a quality intercooler but since you're spreading mis-information we're obligated to respond.
I'm glad you felt the need to respond. I should have been more clear - when I said empty claims I was referring to the 'wager' that VRSF and CSF both signed up to many months ago, and to date, there has been nothing but 'empty' posturing.
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      03-01-2019, 01:36 PM   #212
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Quote:
Originally Posted by switlikbob View Post
I agree, and I went ahead and bought one of the ATM units. So, if anyone here is running something like the VF-stage 2 tune or similar, and wants to buy my Active Autowerke intercooler with less than 5k miles on it, for cheap, please PM me.

I will be running a pure stage 2 turbo with inlet pipe, precision raceworks ignition kit, DV+ and 1st gen ///M Perforance Exhaust with Bluetooth controller and TTFS/XDI HPFP (fueling). These are all new additions and / or replacements for my current FBO setup with VF stage 2.

Anyway, check out this bad boy!
Turns out I can't use this intercooler because it won't work with my Evolution Racewerks Charge & TIC pipes. So I just bought the ER intercooler that's good for 650hp.

Anyone want to buy this beautiful ATM unit? PM ME, you'll get a great deal.
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      03-01-2019, 08:09 PM   #213
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Quote:
Originally Posted by switlikbob View Post
Turns out I can't use this intercooler because it won't work with my Evolution Racewerks Charge & TIC pipes. So I just bought the ER intercooler that's good for 650hp.

Anyone want to buy this beautiful ATM unit? PM ME, you'll get a great deal.
Why won't it work? Due to the different inlet/outlet locations from stock?
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      03-01-2019, 09:01 PM   #214
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FaRKle! View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by switlikbob View Post
Turns out I can't use this intercooler because it won't work with my Evolution Racewerks Charge & TIC pipes. So I just bought the ER intercooler that's good for 650hp.

Anyone want to buy this beautiful ATM unit? PM ME, you'll get a great deal.
Why won't it work? Due to the different inlet/outlet locations from stock?
Exactly, and the rigidity of the ER pipes.
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      03-02-2019, 01:06 PM   #215
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Originally Posted by switlikbob View Post
Exactly, and the rigidity of the ER pipes.
Are you trying to fit the pipes with the IC fully bolted into place, or have you also tried only screwing in the bolts that hold the IC up part way so you have some play to wiggle the IC around as you fit the pipes?
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      03-02-2019, 01:09 PM   #216
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FaRKle! View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by switlikbob View Post
Exactly, and the rigidity of the ER pipes.
Are you trying to fit the pipes with the IC fully bolted into place, or have you also tried only screwing in the bolts that hold the IC up part way so you have some play to wiggle the IC around as you fit the pipes?
Tried everything. I spoke with the owner of ATM, he said it's a known issue with the ER pipes.
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      03-03-2019, 03:39 AM   #217
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Read the whole thread now, very interesting.
Many years ago I bought a 7 inch IC from one of the companies participating in this thread. I did not know as much then as I do now and thought that bigger is generally better. I have no doubts that the IC did perform well but since I was not heavily modded (intake, charge pipe, 7" IC and custom tune, appr. 380-390bhp) the IC introduced noticable lag, a good second from foot down to turbos kicking in.

Now, when I have an M2 with, as far as I can tell, minimal lag I really don't want to introduce ANY lag but I'm really interested in getting the temps down.

To be honest, I will only drive on the street and rarely pushes the car to the max. If IŽd ever track I really don't care about more power because I don't have the skills to push the car I'd reckon.. Maayybe in the future I'd possibly to a stage 1 tune but that's it.

But if I where to upgrade the FMIC and want NO lag, could you guys with experience back up that there is no more lag with, for example, a VRSF/CSF/Wagner 5" than with the stock FMIC? I mean, I'd almost rather skip upgrading at all than risking the introduction of noticable lag. And with noticable I mean measurable in tenths of seconds on a 0-100 km/h time.
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      03-03-2019, 09:51 AM   #218
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fedorov View Post
Read the whole thread now, very interesting.
Many years ago I bought a 7 inch IC from one of the companies participating in this thread. I did not know as much then as I do now and thought that bigger is generally better. I have no doubts that the IC did perform well but since I was not heavily modded (intake, charge pipe, 7" IC and custom tune, appr. 380-390bhp) the IC introduced noticable lag, a good second from foot down to turbos kicking in.

Now, when I have an M2 with, as far as I can tell, minimal lag I really don't want to introduce ANY lag but I'm really interested in getting the temps down.

To be honest, I will only drive on the street and rarely pushes the car to the max. If IŽd ever track I really don't care about more power because I don't have the skills to push the car I'd reckon.. Maayybe in the future I'd possibly to a stage 1 tune but that's it.

But if I where to upgrade the FMIC and want NO lag, could you guys with experience back up that there is no more lag with, for example, a VRSF/CSF/Wagner 5" than with the stock FMIC? I mean, I'd almost rather skip upgrading at all than risking the introduction of noticable lag. And with noticable I mean measurable in tenths of seconds on a 0-100 km/h time.
You should not notice any lag with a quality 5" intercooler.

VRSF, Active Autowerke, Wagner EVO I

CSF is a 6" not the best option for a stock car
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      03-03-2019, 10:07 AM   #219
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mike@x-ph.com View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fedorov View Post
Read the whole thread now, very interesting.
Many years ago I bought a 7 inch IC from one of the companies participating in this thread. I did not know as much then as I do now and thought that bigger is generally better. I have no doubts that the IC did perform well but since I was not heavily modded (intake, charge pipe, 7" IC and custom tune, appr. 380-390bhp) the IC introduced noticable lag, a good second from foot down to turbos kicking in.

Now, when I have an M2 with, as far as I can tell, minimal lag I really don't want to introduce ANY lag but I'm really interested in getting the temps down.

To be honest, I will only drive on the street and rarely pushes the car to the max. If I´d ever track I really don't care about more power because I don't have the skills to push the car I'd reckon.. Maayybe in the future I'd possibly to a stage 1 tune but that's it.

But if I where to upgrade the FMIC and want NO lag, could you guys with experience back up that there is no more lag with, for example, a VRSF/CSF/Wagner 5" than with the stock FMIC? I mean, I'd almost rather skip upgrading at all than risking the introduction of noticable lag. And with noticable I mean measurable in tenths of seconds on a 0-100 km/h time.
You should not notice any lag with a quality 5" intercooler.

VRSF, Active Autowerke, Wagner EVO I

CSF is a 6" not the best option for a stock car
Much appreciated, thank you!
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      03-03-2019, 01:27 PM   #220
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fedorov View Post
Read the whole thread now, very interesting.
Many years ago I bought a 7 inch IC from one of the companies participating in this thread. I did not know as much then as I do now and thought that bigger is generally better. I have no doubts that the IC did perform well but since I was not heavily modded (intake, charge pipe, 7" IC and custom tune, appr. 380-390bhp) the IC introduced noticable lag, a good second from foot down to turbos kicking in.

Now, when I have an M2 with, as far as I can tell, minimal lag I really don't want to introduce ANY lag but I'm really interested in getting the temps down.

To be honest, I will only drive on the street and rarely pushes the car to the max. If IŽd ever track I really don't care about more power because I don't have the skills to push the car I'd reckon.. Maayybe in the future I'd possibly to a stage 1 tune but that's it.

But if I where to upgrade the FMIC and want NO lag, could you guys with experience back up that there is no more lag with, for example, a VRSF/CSF/Wagner 5" than with the stock FMIC? I mean, I'd almost rather skip upgrading at all than risking the introduction of noticable lag. And with noticable I mean measurable in tenths of seconds on a 0-100 km/h time.

https://youtu.be/YrM8X2F1RKU
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