Backdating DME bootloader at dealer?

CosmosMpower · 12-09-2019, 06:59 PM

Let's say you have a technician friend at a BMW dealer that has access to all the tools. Would they in theory be able to backdate your bootloader so you can then flash tune? Not sure if BMW systems even store the old versions.

Just curious...

Thescout13 · 12-09-2019, 08:07 PM

Technically they should be able to as that is what the current tuners do when you send it in for a "bench flash" IIRC. But not 100% certain on this answer.

shemeld_135 · 12-09-2019, 08:24 PM

Subscribed - interested to see where this goes.

MR RIZK · 12-10-2019, 02:04 AM

Generally the dealer will perform a full istep upgrade which touches all computers in the car not just the dme.

If your mate just does the dme there will be a mismatch according to the istep. Unlikely to be an issue. One way to find out is get your mate to do it and if doesn't work upgrade back to the correct rom.

filet.M2c · 12-10-2019, 08:43 AM

I had a similar idea and asked my indy shop if they could do it. They told me they don't keep backups of old istep updates, so it would not be possible for them to downgrade the car. A dealer may though... but I have not asked them yet.

cecaa850 · 12-10-2019, 10:49 AM

Not sure about BMW but most dealers can only update to newer software, not backdate. The reason I believe is that newer software has to pass emissions testing and the manufacturer won't let you go to a previous emission level.

TheHighRoad · 12-10-2019, 10:55 AM

I am a dealer tech. We cannot backdate the bootloader. Someone with access to the manufacturer software MIGHT be able to, but they won't.

CosmosMpower · 12-10-2019, 09:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheHighRoad

I am a dealer tech. We cannot backdate the bootloader. Someone with access to the manufacturer software MIGHT be able to, but they won't.

Any idea how the tuners who bench flash do it?

cookiesowns · 12-13-2019, 01:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CosmosMpower

Any idea how the tuners who bench flash do it?

Yes, they tap certain pins of the DME in order to bypass the BTLD. It requires special software and special harnesses.

With factory methods it's been completely patched in SW. The BTLD will prevent you from flashing an older version.

AK-Motion · 12-14-2019, 02:44 AM

There is one development tool in munich which can do the downgrade without touching anything, so just by OBD2.
But i think this tool will never be public / leave the dev-dept.
Only way is the bench flash and after the flash it will not fit to the database so warranty is gone anyway.

akkando · 12-15-2019, 11:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AK-Motion

There is one development tool in munich which can do the downgrade without touching anything, so just by OBD2.
But i think this tool will never be public / leave the dev-dept.
Only way is the bench flash and after the flash it will not fit to the database so warranty is gone anyway.

You mean it's a BMW dev software tool?

M2driverWV · 12-15-2019, 12:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by akkando

Quote:

Originally Posted by AK-Motion

There is one development tool in munich which can do the downgrade without touching anything, so just by OBD2.
But i think this tool will never be public / leave the dev-dept.
Only way is the bench flash and after the flash it will not fit to the database so warranty is gone anyway.

You mean it's a BMW dev software tool?

Sound like bmw did well on patching this jail break via obd. Safe to say the DME removal is necessary for all moving forward on the patched boot loader now. Just isn't enough resources on a niche item to figure out like what we see on iPhone jail break that normally also get figured out. Either love with what you have or pull the intake to get to the DME and ship it off.

AK-Motion · 12-17-2019, 01:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by akkando

You mean it's a BMW dev software tool?

Yes it is.
Strongly under control, so i guess it will be never public.

12-09-2019, 06:59 PM	#1
CosmosMpower Brigadier General 2051 Rep 3,714 Posts Drives: F87c, GT3, MK7 GTI Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Frisco, TX iTrader: (1)	Backdating DME bootloader at dealer? Let's say you have a technician friend at a BMW dealer that has access to all the tools. Would they in theory be able to backdate your bootloader so you can then flash tune? Not sure if BMW systems even store the old versions. Just curious...
	Appreciate 0 Tweet Quote

12-09-2019, 08:07 PM	#2
Thescout13 Brigadier General 4944 Rep 4,976 Posts Drives: '20 F80 M3CS, %E2%80%9818 GT3 Join Date: Nov 2013 Location: California iTrader: (0)	Technically they should be able to as that is what the current tuners do when you send it in for a "bench flash" IIRC. But not 100% certain on this answer. __________________ Wife's Car: 2020 X4M Competition, Alpine White on Black Alcantara and Biege Current Car: 2018 F80 M3CS, SMB, DCT, ZEC, MPE Recently Departed: 2020 F87 M2C, LBB, ZEC, 6MT (Euro Delivery Aug. 29, 2019, totaled by an idiot in a Camry who then ran from the scene) Wife's Prior Car: 2018 F80 M3, Yas Marina Blue, DCT, Black 19s, Carbon Structure Anthracite Cloth/Leather Combination, Driving Assistance Package (Euro Delivery Oct. 9, 2017)
	Appreciate 0 Quote

12-09-2019, 08:24 PM	#3
shemeld_135 Major 652 Rep 1,406 Posts Drives: 2020 SO - M2C Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: KOP, PA iTrader: (13) Garage List 2020 BMW M2C [0.00] 2016 BMW M2 [10.00]	Subscribed - interested to see where this goes.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

12-10-2019, 02:04 AM	#4
MR RIZK Major 758 Rep 1,336 Posts Drives: AW M2C Join Date: Mar 2013 Location: Australia iTrader: (0)	Generally the dealer will perform a full istep upgrade which touches all computers in the car not just the dme. If your mate just does the dme there will be a mismatch according to the istep. Unlikely to be an issue. One way to find out is get your mate to do it and if doesn't work upgrade back to the correct rom. __________________ Previous Rides: 13' 135i, 08' 130i, 03' HKS Turbo'd 350z, Modded GC8 WRX, NA MX5
	Appreciate 0 Quote

12-10-2019, 08:43 AM	#5
filet.M2c Captain 784 Rep 763 Posts Drives: M2c / mach e Join Date: Mar 2013 Location: Arizona iTrader: (1)	I had a similar idea and asked my indy shop if they could do it. They told me they don't keep backups of old istep updates, so it would not be possible for them to downgrade the car. A dealer may though... but I have not asked them yet.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

12-10-2019, 10:49 AM	#6
cecaa850 Captain 259 Rep 699 Posts Drives: 2018 M2 Join Date: May 2018 Location: South East TX. iTrader: (0)	Not sure about BMW but most dealers can only update to newer software, not backdate. The reason I believe is that newer software has to pass emissions testing and the manufacturer won't let you go to a previous emission level.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

12-10-2019, 10:55 AM	#7
TheHighRoad New Member 5 Rep 4 Posts Drives: 2002 M3, 2020 M2C Join Date: Jul 2019 Location: Alabama iTrader: (0) Garage List 2020 BMW M2 [0.00]	I am a dealer tech. We cannot backdate the bootloader. Someone with access to the manufacturer software MIGHT be able to, but they won't.
	Appreciate 1 CosmosMpower2050.50 Quote

12-14-2019, 02:44 AM	#10
AK-Motion New Member 10 Rep 8 Posts Drives: E46 M3, 335xi Join Date: Dec 2019 Location: Germany iTrader: (0)	There is one development tool in munich which can do the downgrade without touching anything, so just by OBD2. But i think this tool will never be public / leave the dev-dept. Only way is the bench flash and after the flash it will not fit to the database so warranty is gone anyway.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

Thread Tools	Search this Thread
Show Printable Version Email this Page	Search this Thread: Advanced Search