M2C - Share your Journey

richard in NC · 09-23-2020, 08:25 AM

Looks great AVM. I might have to spend some money. Do the coil-overs come with camber plates? I track my car and would want that for more camber on track days.

Also, how much drop was that? Looks great but I'd likely not go for quite as much.

///AVM · 09-23-2020, 08:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AUSf22

Wow looking good AVM!

How much did that set you back over in the states?

I'll take your MPE if you ever decide to part ways with it

Aus

Thank you.

Just north of $11K final invoice.

///AVM

///AVM · 09-23-2020, 08:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by richard in NC

Looks great AVM. I might have to spend some money. Do the coil-overs come with camber plates? I track my car and would want that for more camber on track days.

Also, how much drop was that? Looks great but I'd likely not go for quite as much.

Thank you Rich

Regarding camber settings, the technician who worked on my car was top-notch and a tracker himself. He 'educated' me on the camber settings and, at the end of the day, convinced me that - unless I were tracking the vehicle - he would set camber to stock neutrality with coilover drop factored into the settings.

Without my routine tracking, track-oriented camber settings would produce awkward road handling and uneven tire wear. This is a long way of stating that whatever came with the coilover package allowed the technician to dial-in the camber settings. I could ask, but do not know what the camber settings are number-wise.

The process of dialing-in the height was very labor-intensive, requiring my presence and multiple drops of the rig for assessment, then reloading and removal of wheels to adjust settings. It took about 2 hours of tweaking to get height 'perfect.'

Of note, as the technician also informed me, there is a reason the front gap is so much larger than the rear gap from factory, and it was ill-advised to try and 'level' the front and rear out perfectly. So, grossly, the front and rear gaps on my beast look pretty level, but we did retain some of the factory offset as to not disrupt the driving dynamics.

I do not know what the drop 'settings' are at each wheel? The adjustments are 'twists' of the threads and we were gauging height, not twists - keeping in mind the front-to-rear offset from factory that needed to be largely respected and maintained.

Finally, one of the hardest things to do is capture the M2C in photos that reflect its appearance in person. The fender-to-wheel gap is probably tops on the list. What I can tell is that I do not like anything remotely close to 'slammed.' If you saw my beast in person you would quickly appreciate the drop is not even close to slammed. Very conservative, but aesthetically effective drop.

///AVM

richard in NC · 09-23-2020, 10:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ///AVM

Aus

Thank you.

Just north of $11K final invoice.

///AVM

It looks like the MPE is a pricey portion of that. I wonder who it's sourced from. The Dinan exhaust is about half the price.

But I need to understand doing the mods to a leased car.

BigKutta · 09-23-2020, 10:07 AM

Congrats AVM!! Looks amazing and sure tempts many of us to go drop some coin! Also seems like you had a really good tech, which made for an even better outcome and experience. Enjoy!

///AVM · 09-23-2020, 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by richard in NC

It looks like the MPE is a pricey portion of that. I wonder who it's sourced from. The Dinan exhaust is about half the price.

But I need to understand doing the mods to a leased car.

Rich

Personally, I do not lease my cars and would never invest in mods if I did . . . that being said, I do not typically keep my cars very long, so I know I took a hit with the mods.

Ok, for real this time, I am done with the mods. The beast is tweaked perfectly to MY liking . . . famous last words.

///AVM

///AVM · 09-23-2020, 10:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigKutta

Congrats AVM!! Looks amazing and sure tempts many of us to go drop some coin! Also seems like you had a really good tech, which made for an even better outcome and experience. Enjoy!

Thank you brother Kutta

The tech was fantastic. Knowledgeable and a perfectionist. He spent an hour getting the left front drop to perfectly match the right front drop . . . which was only off by 5mm after 3-4 adjustments. He would not accept the 5mm imperfection.

Regarding the 'coin,' yes, we pay to play the car enthusiast game. Then, to make things worse, we gather on forums and entice one another further. I think I will actually get to claim JCZ5 as a dependent on my tax return this year.

///AVM

JCZ5 · 09-23-2020, 10:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ///AVM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigKutta

Congrats AVM!! Looks amazing and sure tempts many of us to go drop some coin! Also seems like you had a really good tech, which made for an even better outcome and experience. Enjoy!

Thank you brother Kutta

The tech was fantastic. Knowledgeable and a perfectionist. He spent an hour getting the left front drop to perfectly match the right front drop . . . which was only off by 5mm after 3-4 adjustments. He would not accept the 5mm imperfection.

Regarding the 'coin,' yes, we pay to play the car enthusiast game. Then, to make things worse, we gather on forums and entice one another further. I think I will actually get to claim JCZ5 as a dependent on my tax return this year.

///AVM

If that means you get to pass me down a Porsche, yes please 😂

///AVM · 09-23-2020, 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JCZ5

If that means you get to pass me down a Porsche, yes please 😂

JC

Porsches are way underrated . . . just enjoy the bang for the buck you have with your M2C.

///AVM

tjsabec · 09-23-2020, 10:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LakiTopalovich

What's the price difference between MPE and Akrapovic? Looking at these photos MPE looks like children had a welding hour in kindergarten.

I thought the same thing when I saw mine

///AVM · 09-23-2020, 10:59 AM

So, just took the beast out for some backroad enthusiasm. Got in 20-25 miles.

Yes, I realize $11K is not insignificant, but it was worth every penny.

Acoustics fantastic. . . stock acoustics were already great, but MPE just makes it better. I was a huge pundit of aftermarket exhausts going in, so I'm going take my medicine and say I was wrong about MPE. Cannot speak for other aftermarket systems.

I had no idea what the MP coilovers were going to do when it came to ride and handling. Anyone on fence needs to get off. The beast rides softer, feels lighter and handling is much tighter.

Is it a 718 CGTS? Fuck no. However, it feels like it shed about 200-300lbs. I cannot imagine anyone would not consider the coilovers a worthwhile investment. . . and this does not even take into account the aesthetic improvement, which is now spot-on according to my taste.

///AVM

j23 · 09-23-2020, 12:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ///AVM

Thank you Rich

Regarding camber settings, the technician who worked on my car was top-notch and a tracker himself. He 'educated' me on the camber settings and, at the end of the day, convinced me that - unless I were tracking the vehicle - he would set camber to stock neutrality with coilover drop factored into the settings.

Without my routine tracking, track-oriented camber settings would produce awkward road handling and uneven tire wear. This is a long way of stating that whatever came with the coilover package allowed the technician to dial-in the camber settings. I could ask, but do not know what the camber settings are number-wise.

The process of dialing-in the height was very labor-intensive, requiring my presence and multiple drops of the rig for assessment, then reloading and removal of wheels to adjust settings. It took about 2 hours of tweaking to get height 'perfect.'

Of note, as the technician also informed me, there is a reason the front gap is so much larger than the rear gap from factory, and it was ill-advised to try and 'level' the front and rear out perfectly. So, grossly, the front and rear gaps on my beast look pretty level, but we did retain some of the factory offset as to not disrupt the driving dynamics.

I do not know what the drop 'settings' are at each wheel? The adjustments are 'twists' of the threads and we were gauging height, not twists - keeping in mind the front-to-rear offset from factory that needed to be largely respected and maintained.

Finally, one of the hardest things to do is capture the M2C in photos that reflect its appearance in person. The fender-to-wheel gap is probably tops on the list. What I can tell is that I do not like anything remotely close to 'slammed.' If you saw my beast in person you would quickly appreciate the drop is not even close to slammed. Very conservative, but aesthetically effective drop.

///AVM

This post deserves more credit.

My thoughts exactly. I've been saying there's always a compromise when dialing in a performance-oriented suspension like coilovers. If aesthetics are prioritized when reducing the front gap and increasing negative camber, your car won't be as street-friendly as stock. It's as simple as that.

Frankly, I can't for the love of me figure out why anyone would want aggressive negative camber on a street car. It won't help anyone corner faster, I can promise you that. If somebody does it for the "cool" factor and is ok with the trade-offs, then more power to them. I laugh whenever I see a street car with caved-in wheels from too much negative camber. It looks terrible IMO, but to each his own.

I will go as far and say that the drop on these cars is not suppose to be "even" gap-wise. This held true back in the e36/e46 M3 era, as well. The only reason why the gap appears more pronounced when lowered is because it's easier to tell where the fender meets the tire.

BMW recommended settings are probably the safest bet and that's what I plan on sticking with when I install my MPC.

///AVM · 09-23-2020, 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by j23

Quote:

Originally Posted by ///AVM

Thank you Rich

Regarding camber settings, the technician who worked on my car was top-notch and a tracker himself. He 'educated' me on the camber settings and, at the end of the day, convinced me that - unless I were tracking the vehicle - he would set camber to stock neutrality with coilover drop factored into the settings.

Without my routine tracking, track-oriented camber settings would produce awkward road handling and uneven tire wear. This is a long way of stating that whatever came with the coilover package allowed the technician to dial-in the camber settings. I could ask, but do not know what the camber settings are number-wise.

The process of dialing-in the height was very labor-intensive, requiring my presence and multiple drops of the rig for assessment, then reloading and removal of wheels to adjust settings. It took about 2 hours of tweaking to get height 'perfect.'

Of note, as the technician also informed me, there is a reason the front gap is so much larger than the rear gap from factory, and it was ill-advised to try and 'level' the front and rear out perfectly. So, grossly, the front and rear gaps on my beast look pretty level, but we did retain some of the factory offset as to not disrupt the driving dynamics.

I do not know what the drop 'settings' are at each wheel? The adjustments are 'twists' of the threads and we were gauging height, not twists - keeping in mind the front-to-rear offset from factory that needed to be largely respected and maintained.

Finally, one of the hardest things to do is capture the M2C in photos that reflect its appearance in person. The fender-to-wheel gap is probably tops on the list. What I can tell is that I do not like anything remotely close to 'slammed.' If you saw my beast in person you would quickly appreciate the drop is not even close to slammed. Very conservative, but aesthetically effective drop.

///AVM

This post deserves more credit.

My thoughts exactly. I've been saying there's always a compromise when dialing in a performance-oriented suspension like coilovers. If aesthetics are prioritized when reducing the front gap and increasing negative camber, your car won't be as street-friendly as stock. It's as simple as that.

Frankly, I can't for the love of me figure out why anyone would want aggressive negative camber on a street car. It won't help anyone corner faster, I can promise you that. If somebody does it for the "cool" factor and is ok with the trade-offs, then more power to them. I laugh whenever I see a street car with caved-in wheels from too much negative camber. It looks terrible IMO, but to each his own.

I will go as far and say that the drop on these cars is not suppose to be "even" gap-wise. This held true back in the e36/e46 M3 era, as well. The only reason why the gap appears more pronounced when lowered is because it's easier to tell where the fender meets the tire.

BMW recommended settings are probably the safest bet and that's what I plan on sticking with when I install my MPC.

Thank you J

I do not know all of the ins-and-outs, but I have received good guidance.

///AVM

JCZ5 · 09-23-2020, 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by j23

Quote:

Originally Posted by ///AVM

Thank you Rich

Regarding camber settings, the technician who worked on my car was top-notch and a tracker himself. He 'educated' me on the camber settings and, at the end of the day, convinced me that - unless I were tracking the vehicle - he would set camber to stock neutrality with coilover drop factored into the settings.

Without my routine tracking, track-oriented camber settings would produce awkward road handling and uneven tire wear. This is a long way of stating that whatever came with the coilover package allowed the technician to dial-in the camber settings. I could ask, but do not know what the camber settings are number-wise.

The process of dialing-in the height was very labor-intensive, requiring my presence and multiple drops of the rig for assessment, then reloading and removal of wheels to adjust settings. It took about 2 hours of tweaking to get height 'perfect.'

Of note, as the technician also informed me, there is a reason the front gap is so much larger than the rear gap from factory, and it was ill-advised to try and 'level' the front and rear out perfectly. So, grossly, the front and rear gaps on my beast look pretty level, but we did retain some of the factory offset as to not disrupt the driving dynamics.

I do not know what the drop 'settings' are at each wheel? The adjustments are 'twists' of the threads and we were gauging height, not twists - keeping in mind the front-to-rear offset from factory that needed to be largely respected and maintained.

Finally, one of the hardest things to do is capture the M2C in photos that reflect its appearance in person. The fender-to-wheel gap is probably tops on the list. What I can tell is that I do not like anything remotely close to 'slammed.' If you saw my beast in person you would quickly appreciate the drop is not even close to slammed. Very conservative, but aesthetically effective drop.

///AVM

This post deserves more credit.

My thoughts exactly. I've been saying there's always a compromise when dialing in a performance-oriented suspension like coilovers. If aesthetics are prioritized when reducing the front gap and increasing negative camber, your car won't be as street-friendly as stock. It's as simple as that.

Frankly, I can't for the love of me figure out why anyone would want aggressive negative camber on a street car. It won't help anyone corner faster, I can promise you that. If somebody does it for the "cool" factor and is ok with the trade-offs, then more power to them. I laugh whenever I see a street car with caved-in wheels from too much negative camber. It looks terrible IMO, but to each his own.

I will go as far and say that the drop on these cars is not suppose to be "even" gap-wise. This held true back in the e36/e46 M3 era, as well. The only reason why the gap appears more pronounced when lowered is because it's easier to tell where the fender meets the tire.

BMW recommended settings are probably the safest bet and that's what I plan on sticking with when I install my MPC.

Do you plan to install spacers as well?

///AVM is slowly trying to convince me, but I just thinking doing the coilovers plus spacers is a lot of work. Especially when I swap tires for summer / winter. I know spacers are not a big issue. But I would prefer not to have them

///AVM · 09-23-2020, 02:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JCZ5

Do you plan to install spacers as well?

///AVM is slowly trying to convince me, but I just thinking doing the coilovers plus spacers is a lot of work. Especially when I swap tires for summer / winter. I know spacers are not a big issue. But I would prefer not to have them

JC

I do not know all of the ins-and-outs pertaining to the impact spacers place on performance?

In doing my forum 'homework' a couple things became apparent to me. (1) 10mm spacers are relatively small and impart no significant 'risk' toward form or function. (2) You want to get a quality product. As far as I could tell based on feedback available, Burger makes the best spacers on market . . . and you pay for them. I believe the four, 10mm spacers came out to about $210.

The above stated, my inclusion of the spacers were purely an aesthetic endeavor. I observed the drop with and without the spacers and, even though only 10mm, the overall aesthetic was visually significant and improved with the them vs without them. For ME, having the tread just inside the fender and sidewall bulge just outside the fender is ideal and what the spacers accomplished. I believe you can see that clearly in one of my pics from original post on the topic.

///AVM

j23 · 09-23-2020, 02:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JCZ5

Do you plan to install spacers as well?

///AVM is slowly trying to convince me, but I just thinking doing the coilovers plus spacers is a lot of work. Especially when I swap tires for summer / winter. I know spacers are not a big issue. But I would prefer not to have them

I'm in the same boat as you. I always prefer not to have spacers. I have run spacers in the past with stock wheels on prior BMW's and I didn't like it. The car just never felt "right".

Wheels with proper offsets are always the better option IMO. I say try it. Experiment. I may give a shot again, but knowing myself, I probably won't be able to live with it. Mechanically, I'm very anal and touchy about these things. Adding spacers does change the feel of how the car rides and handles. And no, widening the track with spacers does not always result in a better handling car. That's a myth.

Are spacers detrimental in any way? - Yes, technically they are. To what degree is debatable because driving habits play a role. More strain on the wheel bearings. Physics.

///AVM · 09-23-2020, 02:29 PM

I know a lot of you like to 'look under the hood,' so to speak.

One of the nice things about my local dealership is that the technician sends texts with photos as he moved through the job. Very nice touch, but I am more about the end-product than seeing the process.

At any rate, for those interested in seeing some of the coilover install process, I have attached a few pics provided to me. Please note I did not put the pics in any order corresponding to steps in the process.

Regarding the exhaust, I provide only one pic of the boxed MPE. One thing you realize quickly is that the MPE muffler is MUCH taller than the stock muffler, but not nearly as wide.

///AVM

BigKutta · 09-23-2020, 03:04 PM

What a wonderful tech you have. Most dont even see/know their customers. Where is the dealer? West Virginia some place?

///AVM · 09-23-2020, 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigKutta

What a wonderful tech you have. Most dont even see/know their customers. Where is the dealer? West Virginia some place?

Michigan . . . home of the Gretch. . . but not for long.

Yes, my local BMW dealership in Michigan is world-class.

///AVM

P.S. Brother Kutta, I will be living/working in Florida starting in couple weeks.

BigKutta · 09-23-2020, 03:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ///AVM

Michigan . . . home of the Gretch. . . but not for long.

Yes, my local BMW dealership in Michigan is world-class.

///AVM

P.S. Brother Kutta, I will be living/working in Florida starting in couple weeks.

Lucky guy! Sunshine all year long! No winter tires for you...

///AVM · 09-23-2020, 03:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigKutta

Quote:

Originally Posted by ///AVM

Michigan . . . home of the Gretch. . . but not for long.

Yes, my local BMW dealership in Michigan is world-class.

///AVM

P.S. Brother Kutta, I will be living/working in Florida starting in couple weeks.

Lucky guy! Sunshine all year long! No winter tires for you...

. . . there are other advantages too, but I cannot state without moderators deleting my post . . . you know what I mean.

///AVM

j23 · 09-23-2020, 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ///AVM

. . . there are other advantages too, but I cannot state without moderators deleting my post . . . you know I mean.

///AVM

las mujeres?

09-23-2020, 08:25 AM	#1651
richard in NC Colonel 1229 Rep 2,602 Posts Drives: 2009 Z4 35i Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Charlotte, NC iTrader: (0)	Looks great AVM. I might have to spend some money. Do the coil-overs come with camber plates? I track my car and would want that for more camber on track days. Also, how much drop was that? Looks great but I'd likely not go for quite as much. __________________ 2020 X3M non-comp, Alpine White over black : Exec Pkg, ventilated M Sport seats, 20"s 2020 M2 Comp, Sunset Orange/Blk: Orange stitching, DCT, exec pkg, bicolor rims Gone '18 M550i, '16 X4 M40i, '15 M5, '13 X3 35i, '12 335is, '11 X5 50i, '09 Z4 35i, '08 550i, 06 X3, 06 650i, '02 M5, '99 540i
	Appreciate 1 ///AVM2529.50 Quote

09-23-2020, 10:07 AM	#1655
BigKutta Brigadier General 3904 Rep 4,048 Posts Drives: 2020 M2C, 2019 330xi, 2017 Q7 Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Washington DC Burbs iTrader: (1) Garage List 2019 330xi [0.00] 2017 Audi Q7 3.0 [0.00] 2020 M2C [0.00]	Congrats AVM!! Looks amazing and sure tempts many of us to go drop some coin! Also seems like you had a really good tech, which made for an even better outcome and experience. Enjoy!
	Appreciate 1 ///AVM2529.50 Quote

09-23-2020, 10:59 AM	#1661
///AVM Banned 2530 Rep 1,908 Posts Drives: G80 M3C Join Date: Aug 2019 Location: U.S.A. iTrader: (0)	So, just took the beast out for some backroad enthusiasm. Got in 20-25 miles. Yes, I realize $11K is not insignificant, but it was worth every penny. Acoustics fantastic. . . stock acoustics were already great, but MPE just makes it better. I was a huge pundit of aftermarket exhausts going in, so I'm going take my medicine and say I was wrong about MPE. Cannot speak for other aftermarket systems. I had no idea what the MP coilovers were going to do when it came to ride and handling. Anyone on fence needs to get off. The beast rides softer, feels lighter and handling is much tighter. Is it a 718 CGTS? Fuck no. However, it feels like it shed about 200-300lbs. I cannot imagine anyone would not consider the coilovers a worthwhile investment. . . and this does not even take into account the aesthetic improvement, which is now spot-on according to my taste. ///AVM
	Appreciate 0 Quote

09-23-2020, 02:29 PM	#1667
///AVM Banned 2530 Rep 1,908 Posts Drives: G80 M3C Join Date: Aug 2019 Location: U.S.A. iTrader: (0)	I know a lot of you like to 'look under the hood,' so to speak. One of the nice things about my local dealership is that the technician sends texts with photos as he moved through the job. Very nice touch, but I am more about the end-product than seeing the process. At any rate, for those interested in seeing some of the coilover install process, I have attached a few pics provided to me. Please note I did not put the pics in any order corresponding to steps in the process. Regarding the exhaust, I provide only one pic of the boxed MPE. One thing you realize quickly is that the MPE muffler is MUCH taller than the stock muffler, but not nearly as wide. ///AVM Attached Images
	Appreciate 0 Quote

09-23-2020, 03:04 PM	#1668
BigKutta Brigadier General 3904 Rep 4,048 Posts Drives: 2020 M2C, 2019 330xi, 2017 Q7 Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: Washington DC Burbs iTrader: (1) Garage List 2019 330xi [0.00] 2017 Audi Q7 3.0 [0.00] 2020 M2C [0.00]	What a wonderful tech you have. Most dont even see/know their customers. Where is the dealer? West Virginia some place?
	Appreciate 2 ///AVM2529.50 keylime503629.50 Quote