[M2Nebula]

Originally Posted by Corinne

Have I missed something here ? How do I turn off this damned auto rev match which is really spoiling my MT experience ? I've even noticed it auto rev matches in Sport+ which I always understood wasn't the case. I'm getting a god-awful transmission clunk when letting the clutch out in second gear when slowing down at roundabouts. To be more precise, I change down to third which is fine, change down to second and push in the clutch as I wait for it to be clear then let the clutch out and accelerate. Since the rev match occurs when I push the clutch in, the engine returns to idle for the two seconds it takes to accelerate away. In a normal (older) car the revs would decline more slowly and there would be no clunk but on the M2 there is.

Just remember no nannies with DSC off so make sure you have your shit together when pushing the envelope.

On the clunk, 3rd to 2nd is where this can happen most frequently. Most here, myself included, have found that the quicker you commit to the shift and let the clutch out the better. Don't dilly dally around and let it out slow or you will get the clunk. Be fast and deliberate. Please try this and see if that helps.

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by Corinne

Have I missed something here ? How do I turn off this damned auto rev match which is really spoiling my MT experience ? I've even noticed it auto rev matches in Sport+ which I always understood wasn't the case.

Originally Posted by termigni

you have to turn everything off in Sport+ mode. Hold down that button for a while.

Originally Posted by D CHOI

You mean hold down the DSC OFF button.

To de-activate rev-match: keep pushing the DSC button to activate DSC OFF mode.

Beware: in DSC OFF mode you got no safety net anymore - you're left to your own devices ! Don't do it if you feel uncomfortable about the risks (especially oversteer).

[V.Smurf]

Hi stefan,

Originally Posted by stefan

Three scenarios to lead to a transmission choice seem like this:

1. you can't drive manual (ok to admit this btw)
2. you refuse to buy a second car and must subject your M2 to standstill traffic on a commute
3. you genuinely like an automatic gearbox from a tech perspective.

I bought the DCT, and while I've yet to get my car (its about to disembark its "cruise" to my home town of Melbourne) I have driven the DCT and thoroughly enjoyed it. I appreciate that you've at least had a good think about the reasons why someone would choose the DCT

On your above list, #3 is the only one that I can relate to, however there are a whole raft of reasons that made it the obvious choice for me ... and I offer them here as I think others who have chosen the manual may not be appreciate:

1. So that my partner, who can't drive a manual can enjoy it too (see my comments below to 3rdPedalAddict)
2. Super smooth gear changes
3. Great technology, very cleverly implemented
4. Auto-blip on downshift (I see this as a positive)
5. Loads of fun to drive (I don't equate changing gears = fun)
6. The option to use the paddle shifts (manual) when I want to enjoy "changing the gears" myself
7. Standard/No Cost (in AU the regular car has the DCT: you can delete it and specify a manual ... or order the stripper "Pure" version that is manual only)
8. Better launch ability (great for the Red-Light-500)
9. Better resale (in AU)
10. Superior fuel economy
11. Easier to use

Originally Posted by stefan

The first few times you floor it while DCT rips upshifts is fun, but that wears off, doesn't it?

Thing is, that fun is always there - just like changing gears on a manual I believe I could validly ask why doesn't the "fun" of changing manual gears won't wear off, but "fun" of the ripping DCT gear changes will? Its just perspective - I don't for a moment believe you won't get fun from changing gears - I enjoy it when I drive a manual, but I don't know if that's my thing to do day-in, day-out.

Hi 3rdPedalAddict,

Originally Posted by 3rdPedalAddict

I think one of the more common reasons people choose dct over manual is because their wife also needs to drive the car from time to time.

^This is me, and proudly so And its been a huge bonus ... here's a few reasons why:

1. I got no pushback when I wanted to select the M2 over the M240i (it was roughly a $35k purchase price differential in AU)
2. I've had zero comments on the stack of accessories I've already advance-purchased for the car (rear diffuser, lots of IND goodies, customised number plate etc)
3. I'm going to get lots of pleasure from watching my partner enjoy the car too - as a 50% owner of it, why shouldn't my partner be able to enjoy driving the car? Its a wonderful drive.

Cheers!

[Artemis]

Originally Posted by 3rdPedalAddict

I think one of the more common reasons people choose dct over manual is because their wife also needs to drive the car from time to time.

My wife dislikes automatic gearboxes. Back in the 90s she drove an automatic during her studies in the US and was happy to drive a manual again once she got back to Europe. Still to date for her: three pedals and a stick or bust.

[BruceM]

Originally Posted by Artemis

My wife dislikes automatic gearboxes. Back in the 90s she drove an automatic during her studies in the US and was happy to drive a manual again once she got back to Europe. Still to date for her: three pedals and a stick or bust.

I recommend that you keep her and count your blessings...which I am sure you already do

[Nezil]

Originally Posted by Artemis

My wife dislikes automatic gearboxes. Back in the 90s she drove an automatic during her studies in the US and was happy to drive a manual again once she got back to Europe. Still to date for her: three pedals and a stick or bust.

My wife learnt to drive in a manual, but has only really driven automatics since passing her test many years ago.

I'm getting a 6MT and will teach her again to drive manual, and she will love it.

[Aloha Joe]

Originally Posted by V.Smurf

Hi stefan,

Thing is, that fun is always there - just like changing gears on a manual I believe I could validly ask why doesn't the "fun" of changing manual gears won't wear off, but "fun" of the ripping DCT gear changes will? Its just perspective - I don't for a moment believe you won't get fun from changing gears - I enjoy it when I drive a manual, but I don't know if that's my thing to do day-in, day-out.
Cheers!

I'm with Stefan on this one. Had paddles in my G35 and initially it was fun changing the gears perfectly with it, but that eventually wore off.

I guess it's like golfing. If I started to sink every single putt I faced without fail, why putt? Sure it would be fun initially but after awhile, once I'm on the green, I might as well pick up my ball.

So I guess for me, the fun doesn't lie in perfection, but in my attempts to achieve it.

[M2Nebula]

Originally Posted by Aloha Joe

I'm with Stefan on this one. Had paddles in my G35 and initially it was fun changing the gears perfectly with it, but that eventually wore off.

I guess it's like golfing. If I started to sink every single putt I faced without fail, why putt? Sure it would be fun initially but after awhile, once I'm on the green, I might as well pick up my ball.

So I guess the for me, the fun doesn't lie in perfection, but in my attempts to achieve it.

Love the anology. Every shift is a gimme....probably sandbagging on their handicap as well....

[clemsonkev]

[DoggieHowser]

I blame myself.

When we first got married, she was driving manual only. But we had just moved to a new city and learning the roads without a GPS and I convinced her to get an auto.

Now I can't wean her off auto. Every new car for her is like pulling teeth.. she wants everything the same so I had to keep that old Golf for 6 years. I even swayed her from the A250 AMG to the 125i M Sport just cos the auto shifter is in the same place and not on the steering column (shivers).

That said, I was still damn proud of her when she drove my old Evo 8MR 6MT with a twin plate Exedy clutch that was a bugger to drive - back when I used to drive to Sepang F1 track for track days and was too tired on the drive home.

These days I keep the M2 6MT for myself and she gets the 125i M Sport - which I had to drive while waiting for the M2.

One of these days I am going to try to transplant bits of my M2 to that 125.

[Paddy]

Manual M driver for long time. Went DCT on my M2, (picking her up Sunday). I do a lot of track days, will report back in 3 months.

[ORIGIN M.]

Originally Posted by D CHOI

You mean hold down the DSC OFF button.

That is where you are on your own.

[ORIGIN M.]

Originally Posted by clemsonkev

[PICTURE]

A real woman embraces her mans choices.

The rest are a dime a dozen.

[Nezil]

So I'm moving from an automatic (ZF 6-Speed) in a Jaguar XF to a 6MT M2.

One of the things that I find frustrating in automatics, and I'm not sure if the DCT behaves this way, is the behaviour of the throttle. In preparation for my M2 arriving, I ordered a VGate iCar II OBD Dongle and downloaded the Torque app to my phone, and found something REALLY interesting about the throttle behaviour in my XF.

Keep in mind that everything I'm saying here is first hand information for a Jaguar XF throttle response, not a DCT M2, but it does explain a lot of the things that I find frustrating about autos in general, including many DCT autos that I've driven in the past like those from VAG.

In summary, the throttle on an automatic is more like a control for acceleration, rather than a throttle for the engine. I'll try to explain this a little better:

In order to control acceleration, you have two things you can do:

• Selection of Gear
• Throttle position of the engine

In many auto cars, these two things are combined, and going to manual mode doesn't exactly disconnect them.

My car has two driving modes, and these affect throttle response, gearbox behaviour, and traction control. This is pretty easy to feel, but exactly what's happening to the throttle is much more interesting.

In 'Normal' mode, the car has a somewhat linear throttle response up to about 30% throttle (pedal position and actual throttle are effectively linked), but beyond 30%, the throttle jumps immediately to 100% and stays there regardless of how much further you press down on the pedal. Now this is not to say that there is no difference between pressing the pedal down any more from 30%, because there is, but this is where the gearbox takes over. Up to about 40% pedal, the current gear is maintained (with 100% throttle as I said before), and then from 40% to about 60% pedal the gearbox drops one gear, and 60% to 80% drops another gear, and then above 80% maybe another gear or no difference at all.

In 'Dynamic' mode, the behaviour is effectively the same, but a bit less linear. You get to the 100% throttle by about 20% of pedal travel, drop the first gear by 30% etc.

Putting the gearbox in manual mode stops the car changing for you, but the throttle map stays the same. This effectively means that in 'Normal' manual mode, there is no difference between 30% pedal travel and 100% pedal travel; in 'Dynamic' manual mode, there is no difference between 20% and 100% pedal travel.

This lack of control over throttle is one of the things that disconnects a driver from the car in an automatic. I'm 99% certain that this behaviour is present in 99% of automatics.

When you think about it, this is all very logical actually. Using the throttle position to determine the gear to be in does make a lot of sense, but in my opinion, puts you that one additional layer away from direct control over the car.

I suspect this could be remedied by changing the throttle map when you switch to manual mode, but the perception as a driver would be that your car had suddenly got much slower, even if you do have more control.

Has anyone looked at the data from Torque about this? Does the DCT M2 behave in a similar way?

[ORIGIN M.]

Originally Posted by clemsonkev

[PICTURE]

Nope. It takes balls to make your own choices.

You are just feeding your insecurities.

[izzyM2]

Even so, my wife is still scared to drive the DCT due to its difference in application versus the typical auto tranny and the idea that she might easily engage it in manual mode. I'm exploiting this reasons at the moment.

[V.Smurf]

Originally Posted by Aloha Joe

I'm with Stefan on this one.

I do realise that trying to sell enthusiasts on the DCT is a bit like trying to sell ice to eskimo's, but I thought that I'd have a try

Originally Posted by Aloha Joe

I guess it's like golfing. If I started to sink every single putt I faced without fail, why putt? Sure it would be fun initially but after awhile, once I'm on the green, I might as well pick up my ball.

I've probably not made the point so well, but I actually wasn't suggesting that you can't get fun out of a manual, rather that fun comes in different ways for different folks ... and that not having a manual does not equal not having fun

Originally Posted by Aloha Joe

So I guess for me, the fun doesn't lie in perfection, but in my attempts to achieve it.

And that's true for a whole bunch of stuff in life ... my from the grind of laps in the swimming pool to try and improve my fitness to the other modifications I'll make to my just-about-to arrive M2.

More ice Mr. Eskimo...?

[DoggieHowser]

I?ve finally gotten the guts to turn off DSC and gotten to doing rev matching manually with heel toe.

It?s weird that the revs drop quickly - with DSC off. Even faster than on my Fiesta ST.

So much more fun.

And even in the wet it takes a lot to break traction.

[stefan]

Originally Posted by BMWMTWO

Your being presumptuous. This is a forum of enthusiasts. I'll bet almost everyone here has owned a manual or at least knows how to drive one. The reason manual transmissions are fading is they don't offer any of the performance advantages they once did, in fact it's at a disadvantage. If you like shifting for involvement good for you. But the DCT is technologically superior in every way and that is a big reason many choose it.

You're being presumptuous. This is a forum of enthusiasts. So people who can't acutely drive manual aren't likely to admit it. That's all I'm saying. The target customer for this car may well have been raised learning to drive auto and had NO access to manual cars given how rare they are now.

My argument is the manual driver doesn't care how technologically advanced DCT is. The M2 itself is praised for its simplicity over other M cars. If you are all about technology, you bought the wrong M car.

Again flat out acceleration is something you get used to no matter what you do. Tune it and it'll seem amazing until it becomes boring. All that ever remains is character. DCT doesn't have any. Those 50% of buyers didn't pick manual because it was superior in terms of performance, they bought it because it isn't.

Originally Posted by ORIGIN M.

Meanwhile I will decimate you in every category.

I cringed. Is this why people pick DCT?

[ORIGIN M.]

Originally Posted by clemsonkev

[PICTURE]

Only a sissy believes and posts that kind of bullshit.

[ORIGIN M.]

I guess you are as weak-suck as I thought.

Next /

Originally Posted by clemsonkev

[PICTURE]

[OGM2]

Originally Posted by clemsonkev

[PICTURE]

Stop it already, your making your "team" look bad.