[F87source]

Originally Posted by rtl32

I was fairly certain they were cooking because the heat wash was up 4-5 threads from the tip area and the electrode area was looking pretty white. Now the border has receded back.

Since the last time I did plugs (10k ago) I have replaced my delphi coils and injectors (5-6k ago) and I actually have a new set of plugs sitting in my trunk that I was going to do today. Tomorrow I'll post up a picture of the old ones that have been in for 10k and used almost exclusively with E30-E45 on stage 2+ since the summer. Let me know what you think.

Great case of dunning kruger here, I thought I already knew what was up, I did not, thank you for all the info!! So overall, keep gaps as large as possible (for max spark area = better combustion), and gap down till there are no misfires up top (it's not getting blown out), because smaller gaps need more current and that overall seems like it should be avoided from an ignition perspective.

If the tips are getting really white it could very well be running too hot, what kind of afrs are you seeing? Your cylinder temps could also be really hot. This is especially strange because generally on ethanol combustion chamber temps drop due to the evaporative cooling effect of ethanol.


Yes as large a gap as possible to promote complete combustion.

[rtl32]

Originally Posted by F87source

If the tips are getting really white it could very well be running too hot, what kind of afrs are you seeing? Your cylinder temps could also be really hot. This is especially strange because generally on ethanol combustion chamber temps drop due to the evaporative cooling effect of ethanol.


Yes as large a gap as possible to promote complete combustion.

Right!! I guess I'm a black sheep.

PTF just cleared out my account and reset my VIN because they had to fix some DME update related lockout that was stopping me from flashing for a while, so I lost the entire history of logs that I had..

However if I remember correctly very low 13's on E mix with STFT on WOT pinned low because of either a small boost leak or Dinan intake. So if anything it's pulling because it thinks it's too rich.

I throw a lean code during idle but have no problem holding 19-20 psi all day long. So it's either really small or just a vacuum leak. Hence why I haven't tried to find it (been a rough semester)

Plug pics tomorrow

[F87source]

Originally Posted by rtl32

Right!! I guess I'm a black sheep.

PTF just cleared out my account and reset my VIN because they had to fix some DME update related lockout that was stopping me from flashing for a while, so I lost the entire history of logs that I had..

However if I remember correctly very low 13's on E mix with STFT on WOT pinned low because of either a small boost leak or Dinan intake. So if anything it's pulling because it thinks it's too rich.

I throw a lean code during idle but have no problem holding 19-20 psi all day long. So it's either really small or just a vacuum leak. Hence why I haven't tried to find it (been a rough semester)

Plug pics tomorrow

13 imo is a little bit too lean. You should be low 12's (12.0-12.2 range) at WOT and full load, that's what the stock car targets too. I think they leaned it out to prevent the HPFP from crashing.

[Wolfman’s Brother]

I’m moving back to stock plugs soon. Went NGK gapped to .023 out the gate for BM3 Stage 2, but will be reverting back.

Not having any issues, but hope to smooth out cold start a bit.

Thanks for all the intel.

[F87source]

Originally Posted by Wolfman’s Brother

I’m moving back to stock plugs soon. Went NGK gapped to .023 out the gate for BM3 Stage 2, but will be reverting back.

Not having any issues, but hope to smooth out cold start a bit.

Thanks for all the intel.

No problem. Imo ngks are quite expensive at $20/plug vs. $5/plug for the Bosch, so why spend more if it's not needed or beneficial. If you do need it then you need it and spend the extra money, otherwise it's just like wasting money on botique oils.

[M2RAW]

Originally Posted by F87source

No problem. Imo ngks are quite expensive at $20/plug vs. $5/plug for the Bosch, so why spend more if it's not needed or beneficial. If you do need it then you need it and spend the extra money, otherwise it's just like wasting money on botique oils.

Going to let my mechanic install oem stock plugs.. what's really the stock gap? The pre gap size 0.31" or do I need to tell my mechanic adjust it to 0.028".

TIA

[///393]

.28 is what I understand

[pal]

This is what my (2018 M2) stock plugs looked like after 26 track days, 20K miles on the odometer and 4 years of service life. I just replaced them with new OE plugs that I got off Amazon (BMW P# 12-12-0-039-634) and new Delphi coils. The latter was simply preventative and while I was in there.

[IMG]https://media.fotki.com/2v2aFz9k8xu6LVA.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]https://media.fotki.com/2v2aFz9T3xu6LVA.jpg[/IMG]

[IMG]https://media.fotki.com/2v2aFz9d9xu6LVA.jpg[/IMG]

[PackPride85]

Originally Posted by F87source

Ok lets clear up some spark plug information, I have not really been clear enough on this in the past and have also made some small slip ups so I want to also clarify it here:

1) If you are buying the bosch plugs you should avoid ZR5TPP339 this is the one that have cracked insulator issues.

OEM part numbers for the faulty plug is: 12120038832, 12120038894. So ensure these part numbers are not present in the spark plugs part numbers and you are fine.

Here is the bmw TSB
https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/20...48022-9999.pdf


This spark plug should be discontinued so the chance of accidentally buying this defective plug should be low to impossible now, unless you get some really really really old stock - so just check the part numbers on the box when you get it.

2) You should be purchasing the ZR5TPP330A version which is the updated one found on the S55 and m2 n55.

The OEM part number for this plug is: 12120039634


Note these plugs can also be called "RB ZMR5TPP330" without the A at the end, so to ensure you got the correct plug see if the plug has these MFG numbers which are correct:

ZR5TPP330A
ZR5TPP330
0242145541
ZMR5TPP330
0242145590
8179, 8165

After that make sure the compatible OEM part numbers has the one bmw provides as well, then you can be sure you got the correct plug. But the important part is it is the 330 version, not the 33 version, because the 330 version (1 step colder than stock n55) is for the S55 and n55 m2 while the 33 version is for the normal n55.


Here is the FCP euro link for the correct 330A/330 spark plug that you should be buying.
https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/bmw...sch-0242145541



Here is the FCP euro link for the incorrect 33 version of the 33 bosch spark plug: https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/bmw...037580#fitment



3) Gap: this one has been hard to find but when I get a chance I will look at ISTA again. But the stock gap for the s55 and n55 should be 0.028", while the stock gap for the n55 is 0.032". The bosch plugs IIRC come gapped from 0.032-0.035 so you proabably have to gap down to 0.028".

Is the only difference between the 330 and 330A that the 330 is the BMW branded one and 330A is not? The A is $20 cheaper per plug.

[PackPride85]

Originally Posted by PackPride85

Is the only difference between the 330 and 330A that the 330 is the BMW branded one and 330A is not? The A is $20 cheaper per plug.

I answered my own question. They are different plug materials/designs. This is from Bosch support.

[PackPride85]

The only Bosch part number that is officially "recommended" for BMW #12120039634 is the 330. The 330A is not recommended by Bosch for that BMW number.

I'm not sure why BMW specs the platinum one when the copper core/iridium tip is better (ngk plug is also copper/iridium).

You can get the 330 Bosch plugs for $8 a plug from the Bosch website vs $25 everywhere else.

[F87source]

Originally Posted by PackPride85

I answered my own question. They are different plug materials/designs. This is from Bosch support.

Yeah I was not 100% sure, I just saw them as equivalent part numbers so I thought they were interchangeable. But it turns out there are differences.

[PackPride85]

Originally Posted by F87source

Yeah I was not 100% sure, I just saw them as equivalent part numbers so I thought they were interchangeable. But it turns out there are differences.

My guess is the plug selection goes all the way back to 2014 with the intro of the s55 m3/m4. With s55 testing going back further platinum was probably the preferred/top end plug type at the time and they've never bothered to upgrade the OE part as long as they can still get the same spec.

As long as the heat range is the same the 330a Bosch or comparable ngk plug should be fine. Iridium should have better performance and higher durability than platinum.

[PackPride85]

Originally Posted by F87source

Yeah I was not 100% sure, I just saw them as equivalent part numbers so I thought they were interchangeable. But it turns out there are differences.

You might still be right. When people are ordering the 330A model from fcp euro the plug says "double platinum" on it. The Bosch doc they sent me says they should be iridium.

It looks like sometime after 2019 bmw switched to ngk iridiums as OE for existing engines. Either plug type should work for pre 2019 as long as heat range is correct.

[chris719]

Originally Posted by PackPride85

You might still be right. When people are ordering the 330A model from fcp euro the plug says "double platinum" on it. The Bosch doc they sent me says they should be iridium.

It looks like sometime after 2019 bmw switched to ngk iridiums as OE for existing engines. Either plug type should work for pre 2019 as long as heat range is correct.

Is this change for N55 only, or S55 also? Is there a new PN for the NGKs?

[F87source]

Originally Posted by chris719

Is this change for N55 only, or S55 also? Is there a new PN for the NGKs?

You probably will need to call the dealer to find that out, real oem stopped getting updated after 2019.

[PackPride85]

Originally Posted by chris719

Is this change for N55 only, or S55 also? Is there a new PN for the NGKs?

I'm not 100% sure I just see Bosch stops displaying the known part in their application guide after 2019 for all BMWs. BMW parts sites would likely still stock the Bosch part since the bmw part # didn't change.

[F87source]

Originally Posted by PackPride85

I'm not 100% sure I just see Bosch stops displaying the known part in their application guide after 2019 for all BMWs. BMW parts sites would likely still stock the Bosch part since the bmw part # didn't change.

That lines up with when real oem stopped getting updated too. I wonder what is happening, and I also wonder if bmw would consider shutting down their etk, because enthusiasts use it to buy parts which directly benefits bmw. There literally is no con to it imo, it's not like a shop manual where newtis caused people to not have to rent it from bmw and thus cause a profit loss, this is literally a self serve option whereas the alternative would be harassing a dealership - either way there is no additional profit to be had when getting p/n's online vs a dealer.

[AmuroRay]

I'm replacing plugs again because the NGK 97506 are garbage - what is the consensus on the 330s? Are the "a" interchangeable and worth it?

[F87source]

Originally Posted by AmuroRay

I'm replacing plugs again because the NGK 97506 are garbage - what is the consensus on the 330s? Are the "a" interchangeable and worth it?

What happened with your ngk's?

The Bosch plugs are pretty good - well if you don't get a bad batch.

The 330a should be interchangeable with the 330 because the heat ranges are the same as judged by the Bosch part number, the only difference is material construction and the a version with the irridum copper design should be better.

[F87source]

Originally Posted by PackPride85

I answered my own question. They are different plug materials/designs. This is from Bosch support.

Just bringing this back up, but for bosch plugs the 3rd digit is the heat range. Since they are both 5 they are the same heat range, only construction varies so they should be cross compatible without issue.

[AmuroRay]

Originally Posted by F87source

What happened with your ngk's?

The Bosch plugs are pretty good - well if you don't get a bad batch.

The 330a should be interchangeable with the 330 because the heat ranges are the same as judged by the Bosch part number, the only difference is material construction and the a version with the irridum copper design should be better.

I’ve seen a few comments where they are defective out of the box. Simply put, they are not the right plug for the car and cause more problems. Just stick with OEM - the NGK plugs and small gap are garbage for this platform.

https://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...2#post28965442