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      03-07-2015, 07:55 AM   #111
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Car dealerships are broken, the entire system. These are all bs/fluff numbers that BMW takes and rewards dealers based on how well that dealer manipulates the figures. It really sucks. Their are no real satisfaction numbers. Every thing is exaggerated both good and bad.
The surveys you take only screw the dealer employee. (the little guy)


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      03-07-2015, 08:00 AM   #112
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LI M6 View Post
You may be right but from the average consumer's perspective, the only thing we judge a dealership on is the sales and service experiences....occasionally parts as well.
Understand no one like to spend money. Service is a luck of the draw, some cars have an unbalanced amount of issues and some cars don't. There are bad apples out there but most employees just want to make a living and go home.


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      03-07-2015, 09:58 AM   #113
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I don't doubt this a bit as we have 'some' dealers in the Chicago area that will try and do the same, maybe not as much, but the only thing that will change that is people not paying a $60K markup on a car.

As for the Chicago area dealerships, MotorWerks in Barrington was always pretty good (sales and service).

The other dealers in this area are just horrible and lie about everything, I guarantee you that certain ones who I'll leave nameless here, will have big banners up in the front windows "Voted Top BMW Dealer Again".

The best was just a few months ago when I got a call from a certain dealer:

Dealer: Hey xxxx, just wanted to let you know that we are getting our i8 in and we'll ONLY be marking it up $80K!
Me: Um, yeah, remember that conversation about me not being a real MSRP kind of guy?
Dealer: Yes...?
Me: Well what makes you think that I'd be interested in paying you $80K OVER MSRP for an i8?
Dealer: Well, each dealer is only going to get one this year so they'll be in pretty high demand.
Me: Good luck with that, have a nice day....

I'm glad to see that BMW 'changed' the criteria for the top awards. The customer should be #1, before, during AND after the sale.

All these dealers that 'received the award xx years in a row' means what? Just like the little league teams that each player gets a trophy just for participating, regardless of overall performance?

I get it that it's a business and it's all about making money, otherwise they wouldn't be in business, but can't honest business be done without trying to screw the customer?

I can also almost guarantee that every dealer is going to have one 'bad' deal that didn't go the way that someone wanted it to, it comes down to the whole 'you can't please everyone, all the time' statement.

But some of these dealers it seems like are going out of their way to try and screw the customer. I also feel bad for some of the SA's that are really good people, but management won't let them make a deal because it doesn't meet their dealerships guidelines.

Chicago area dealers.... Anyone listening or looking at the stats........?


Quote:
Originally Posted by index1489 View Post
Irvine BMW makes the list because they sell cars with 60k markups and parts at 900 percent over MSRP.

Even when the same car is for sale at a LA area dealer for MSRP or under.
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      03-07-2015, 10:50 AM   #114
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I can say that BMW of Riverside has really turned things around. Hopefully I can swing a good deal with them BC I'd rather not deal with the OC snobbish dealers.
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      03-07-2015, 11:04 AM   #115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by index1489 View Post
Irvine BMW makes the list because they sell cars with 60k markups and parts at 900 percent over MSRP.

Even when the same car is for sale at a LA area dealer for MSRP or under.
I have never bought a car from Irvine BMW so can not comment to that point.

However, I have taken both of my BMW's for maintenance there and they have beaten Crevier and Sterling on prices both times when I had to compare. No dealership is perfect though as I have had a couple of issues at Irvine. I had two SA's quote very different pricing a week apart for the same service. They have misplaced my key twice when I went to pick my car up after it being serviced and I will no longer have them work on my car after a holiday.

After all of my visits over the past 5 years I now have a specific SA I work with that is pretty great and we can skip past most of the normal dealership BS.
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      03-07-2015, 11:08 AM   #116
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wow theirs not even 1 in Massachusetts
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      03-07-2015, 05:28 PM   #117
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigDog
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vector Pilot View Post
Doesn't bode well for Chicago area dealers.
no such thing as a good chicago area dealer
in chicago, Elmhurst bmw is smaller but very easy to work with. patrick bmw has an awesome service dept, their service manager has gone to bat for me a few times.
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      03-07-2015, 08:15 PM   #118
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it's hilarious some of the insults people are throwing in here. So many BMW owners do not know the basic difference between there/their or your/you're and yet are amazingly condescending towards the dealerships with suspect knowledge of how a business works. Learn grammar, logic, and basic decorum while you're at it.

Classy insults supplemented by not so great intellect.
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      03-07-2015, 10:17 PM   #119
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havent had a good customer service at keeler yet they made this list. But Rallye BMW in NY was great so far.
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      03-08-2015, 12:47 AM   #120
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Quote:
Originally Posted by index1489 View Post
Irvine BMW makes the list because they sell cars with 60k markups and parts at 900 percent over MSRP.
Damn, I guess I failed to recognize the good deal they were offering when they only wanted $20k over MSRP for that B6 we saw there last year.

Seriously, though, even if a "brand" has a bad rep, every company is made up of individuals. Sometimes the difference between a good vs. bad sales experience is just trying to find those who give a @#$% and avoiding the sociopaths who find it great fun making a game out of ripping you off.

I've worked with some real knuckleheads back in the day (I'm sure we all have), and I'm grateful that my clients didn't hold that against me.

Last edited by JimM6GC; 03-08-2015 at 12:52 AM..
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      03-08-2015, 03:48 AM   #121
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimM6GC View Post
My wife and I have been to most of the dealers in the greater L.A. area, even though we live in Northern California. I have to agree that the NorCal dealers leave much to be desired, but Steve Thomas in the Camarillo area was the only dealer who flat out ignored us when we stopped in one evening. The sales people were chatting among themselves while we were looking at M6's, and there were no other customers in the showroom. So we simply walked out and bought our M6GC elsewhere. No surprise they did not make the list. Eff 'em. Their loss.

As for BMW Irvine, +1 to what others have said.
The people running Steve Thomas are crooks. Speaking from experience. Side note, congrats on the M6GC, my favorite car in the BMW lineup right now.
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      03-08-2015, 01:07 PM   #122
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hiimatif View Post
Side note, congrats on the M6GC, my favorite car in the BMW lineup right now.
Thanks! I fell in love with the GC ever since I first saw it in the car mags a few years ago. My wife and I bought many cars over the years, and this is our first BMW. We're total converts now (we also have a B6 on order). I opted for the M6 because I could order one with a manual transmission.
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      03-08-2015, 02:17 PM   #123
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Golden Arrow View Post
I think these awards are given based on sales numbers, not customer service.
Agreed. #2 sells lots of cars, and USED to have a great service department - most of which has since moved to a suburban dealership. They managed to forget they had my car for several weeks a couple years ago (my last visit); the SA had moved on but they were still sending calls to his non-monitored voice mail. It took a letter to the GM to get a response.
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      03-11-2015, 11:37 AM   #124
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sdshah View Post
Then get better insurance. I am 27 and own my own IT company. But I was under 24 when I lived in the area. However, they should market to me because I am not rare in that area. Stevens creek claims to be the best dealership in the affluent South Bay where you have young and successful people.

Also, why don't they check the stats for how accident prone drivers under 24 who drive BMW's. I'm sure it's not that different than a 44 year old.
I can guarantee the number of accidents, particularly those with very high repair costs or as a result of speeding/distracted driving/breaking the law/etc are significantly higher in the under 24 age group than 44 year olds. You're 27 and apparently very successful financially, act like it. You are the exception and should be smart enough to recognize that.
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      03-11-2015, 11:44 AM   #125
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I love the comment, "they just wouldn't work with me". Oh so your demands and/or what was probably an unreasonable offer or asking for a discount makes them bad at their jobs. How about just paying what it costs like every other thing you purchase in life. Who decided everything related to the cost of owning a car should be negotiable, that's absurd. Things cost what they cost, we should all have to pay the same amount. It's only fair that everyone should pay the same price for everything. Allowing some to negotiate better deals than other is an epic fail and it's killing the automotive industry. There are salesman busting their ass selling 20-30 cars a month who can barely put food on the table all because you had to squeeze all the fat out of the deal. You're buying a $120,000 BMW and they are driving a 1999 civic to work. Give me a break.
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      03-11-2015, 11:49 AM   #126
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I think including sales figures scews the results, for owners purposes. I would be less cynical of these winners if sales figures were not included in the analysis.
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      05-23-2015, 01:37 PM   #127
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mtbnole View Post
Yeah, I was thinking the same thing, neither Braman nor Vista in south Florida. Braman might have a chance, but still have a ways to go.
Vista? You mean the same Vista that sells their parts at up to twice MSRP and when asked about it say "We use a different price matrix"?

The same Vista that sells CPO cars that have glaring omissions in their CPO process despite claiming to have checked them?

The same Vista that is so bad that BMW USA complained to me that they had "reached out" to them but were having a hard time getting any answers?

Yeah, why were they excluded?
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      05-23-2015, 01:40 PM   #128
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Technic View Post
No South Florida -and not one Florida as a state- dealer listed.

Ummm... I have 11 Key Performance Indicators of why is that: Customer Last, No Aftersales and Sales data. They do move cars though, but like cattle. And it does feel like cattle.
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      05-29-2015, 10:19 AM   #129
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Originally Posted by hyperboost View Post
no dealership from mass... what a shame
Yup.
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      05-29-2015, 10:21 AM   #130
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Originally Posted by Christopher06 View Post
wow theirs not even 1 in Massachusetts
Nope...
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      05-29-2015, 10:37 AM   #131
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ti317 View Post
Vista? You mean the same Vista that sells their parts at up to twice MSRP and when asked about it say "We use a different price matrix"?

The same Vista that sells CPO cars that have glaring omissions in their CPO process despite claiming to have checked them?

The same Vista that is so bad that BMW USA complained to me that they had "reached out" to them but were having a hard time getting any answers?

Yeah, why were they excluded?
Had a terrible sales experience with South. Got my car with Vista, but only after going straight to the sales manager. The sales people didn't want to talk $ unless I drove all the way to Pompano. Just going with ED from now on.

Also had a completely unsatisfactory first service with Braman. They lost my keys and scratched up one of my side mirror covers. Amongst a bunch of other BS.

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      05-29-2015, 01:47 PM   #132
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roastbeef View Post
Not sure how Irvine made the list...
Agreed.. they tried to rip us off in the dumbest way possible. I still chuckle every now and then thinking about it.
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