[hellrotm]

Originally Posted by MR.

My OG M2 had an exhaust and sports down pipe among a bunch of smaller visual stuff, but in my profession I have driven numerous stock OG M2's and tuned ones.

My intention was to tune the M2 further but the M2C came, so I decided to move the tuning project to that car. If you take a look at post 1 of this topic you can see what I am planning to fit.

My main problem is that I have to do more and spend more to make it decent and proper. That is just crap.

MR

Well you bought the right car, the S55 by far is the more potent tuning platform. You’ll end up with a more capable car for sure. You could go to a exhaust shop tomorrow and have them remove the opf’s. Then have one of the tuners in US remote custom tune it with bm3. You’d have over 500whp and louder exhaust in less than 24hr. I bet removing the opf’s is only going to trigger a simple cel light, just like removing secondary cats. It’s not going to be as complicated as you think.

[MR.]

Originally Posted by Craig335d

I'm not sure why you even bought such a terrible car, you hated it after your initial drive but still went ahead. It's almost like you have an ulterior motive / agenda...

If it's actually as bad as you make out (and I don't believe it is, as there are tabloid amounts of massive over-exaggeration in the way you write), then surely no amount of modding will sort it.
You'll also have no real comparison to before and after, you've only carried out 700 miles, not revved above 5k, not had the run-in service and not turned the cabin noise off.
A better, more relevant, comparison for me would be on a car that has done these things, gathered a few thousand miles, settled down and then made some tweaks.

Personal opinion is that the noise from footage of EU cars from behind is just fine, I don't go in for the look at me, look at me shouty exhaust system any more and I personally wouldn't have a car like this in anything but manual so your main issues aren't issues I'll likely have.

However I will still be very interested to see how this plays out and if you are stunned at how crap your modifications or if it will then become the perfect car that BMW should have produced and you can come on here, promote the modifications and receive adulation.
I have a prediction about how this will end............

Decent statements under understandable if you just read what I as a professional editorial writer put on paper. it is always a bit more dramatic. I see your point, but as mentioned before. If I would have known it would be this crap, I would not have bought it and kept my OG M2 and tuned it further.

Unfortunately, I was already 10% down on the M2C and my M2 was sold four months ago. Add that to the fact that I work for a tuning company in the Netherlands, I honestly believe the package can be made decent and I think it is interesting choice to tune.

All my cars I have had in my life have been tuned and I would have tuned any car I would get, I am just annoyed it so crap out of the box and I need to throw more money and time at it. I will enjoy the tuning time no doubt and I hope to inform everyone here well in their choices.

MR

[hellrotm]

Originally Posted by MR.

...and I need to throw more many money and time at it.

Bright side, a fellow member is getting nearly 600whp from only downpipes and E85 tune. Basically $1500. The OG M2 would be loads more money to reach that power.

[MR.]

Originally Posted by hellrotm

Well you bought the right car, the S55 by far is the more potent tuning platform. You'll end up with a more capable car for sure. You could go to a exhaust shop tomorrow and have them remove the opf's. Then have one of the tuners in US remote custom tune it with bm3. You'd have over 500whp and louder exhaust in less than 24hr. I bet removing the opf's is only going to trigger a simple cel light, just like removing secondary cats. It's not going to be as complicated as you think.

All true, although the OPF removal might require a tune to get rid of the CEL, but you could fix that with fitting a Awron display which has acounteracting feature built it!

All in all, I am going a slightly different route hahah Akrapovic first with sport cats, and then a custom tune from my own tuner colleague in the Netherlands.

We are already testing options and I hope to have the first results before the end of the year when my M2 is back from Akrapovic.

Let's unleash the animal over time. It will be a fun and much longer process than initially anticipated, but it will create something that might well be the best BMW creation of the last ten years.

Who knows, but for now let's start the process and see where this ends. I am looking forward to it.

MR

[MR.]

Originally Posted by hellrotm

Bright side, a fellow member is getting nearly 600whp from only downpipes and E85 tune. Basically $1500. The OG M2 would be loads more money to reach that power.

Oh yeah 100%

But my aim is not power... I want engagement, experience and handling.

If I want power, I will drive one of Tim's cars (Shmee). I have that luck.

MR

[Craig335d]

Originally Posted by MR.

Decent statements under understandable if you just read what I as a professional editorial writer put on paper. it is always a bit more dramatic. I see your point, but as mentioned before. If I would have known it would be this crap, I would not have bought it and kept my OG M2 and tuned it further.

Unfortunately, I was already 10% down on the M2C and my M2 was sold four months ago. Add that to the fact that I work for a tuning company in the Netherlands, I honestly believe the package can be made decent and I think it is interesting choice to tune.

All my cars I have had in my life have been tuned and I would have tuned any car I would get, I am just annoyed it so crap out of the box and I need to throw more money and time at it. I will enjoy the tuning time no doubt and I hope to inform everyone here well in their choices.

MR

You work for a tuning company? That’s the context I didn’t have.
And have name dropped other tuners / manufacturers that I’m sure the tuning company you work for have agreements with?

Okay, here’s my predicted outcome, you’ll come back with the “perfect car”, how it should have been out of the box and those involved in making it so will get free advertising on here and likely additional sales.

Which explains the over-exaggerated writing style, the focus on any negative and pretty much makes your “independent opinion” worthless in my opinion.

[MR.]

Originally Posted by Craig335d

You work for a tuning company? That's the context I didn't have. And have name dropped other tuners / manufacturers that I'm sure the tuning company you work for have agreements with?

Okay, here's my predicted outcome, you'll come back with the "perfect car", how it should have been out of the box and those involved in making it so will get free advertising on here and likely additional sales.

Which explains the over-exaggerated writing style, the focus on any negative and pretty much makes your "independent opinion" worthless in my opinion.

Not really! My colleagues sell anything. The offering is extremely wide, and I am just external consultant on marketing and social media for this tuning business (which I believe I have never shared the name of here) as for many other companies across Europe, next to being Shmee150's business manager which is a full time job on its own...

As an ex-journalist with 15 years experience, I would not say I am biased. I have preferences based on experiences and I share that with anyone that asks me a question. We together can point 20 other people here with the same background.

I can tell what you should get and what not based on my experience or guide you to the right people across Europe on both MINI and BMW subjects that know a lot more than me... I would immediately push anyone to Ryan at IND, to Imran at Evolve in Lutton, Iain at Litchfield, Oliver at ACS or Christoph at Manhart Performance. None of these people I have any business incentive with... I am a customer and a content producing contact with Shmee150. Just ask me what you need and I can help you while respecting your preferences.

In the end, I am not making a cent on any of this. In return I always give people my commission as their discount, if they ask me for a contact to get a specific part. Anyone would do that in this community. And that is even if there is a some discount offered to me and the client. Doesn't happen often as far as I know.

Best example is that I spend 20K EUR to rebuild my MINI to a track specification over the last 1.5 years and a majority of the work was done by my colleagues in the workshop. There is no favorable treatment. Nor do I give them mine at my business side. Also my MINI is not the perfect car, lol does such a thing even exist.

I respect your opinion and I see your points, but I ensure you I can not run down your road. I would not feel good about it. This is also fun and a hobby.

Into the future I will be giving comments on the work done to my car. If I am not happy, I will share that. If I am happy, I will as well. I leave it up to you to enjoy this or that, if you can't then don't open this topic anymore...

MR

[MR.]

Next to this all, what else is there to mention...

- Reserving camera, damn that quality is much better than before

- Again those seats... much better than before

- New headlights, better visibility than on my OG M2

- PDI was not done properly by the dealer. I spotted more places yesterday where there is glue residu from the protection films and they had forgotten the two little films on the M2 logos on the seats.

- There is a little message when you switch on the car that says you have limited power and that full power will arrive soon. First time I have seen that. It wasn't there on the press car I believe. I remember the OG M2 being limited on revving for about 30 sec to a minute and then you could go full on. They should have made that something cooler, like... "Full M Power being loaded"

- The place to put my front plate is rather slim in all honesty. It fits and I could screw in a plate holder but I don't want to do it. For now it is double sided tape that does the job. Still I was amazed that the standard plate holder that came with the car doesn't really nicely fit well. There was a SO sister car that was handed over at my dealer and the sales guy who sold it said he did not know how to fit the plate. I showed him my solution, but he wanted to screw it on. Still the space is smaller than the OG M2.

Overall it runs beautifully. Not one hickup over the past days and within the first 1K km. Krizzie has it now and he will do the running in service while I am gone on a business trip. Gives him the option to do some comparison with his OG M2.

All in all, small things, but I have noticed them.

MR

[bri1042]

Originally Posted by MR.

- There is a little message when you switch on the car that says you have limited power and that full power will arrive soon. First time I have seen that. It wasn't there on the press car I believe. I remember the OG M2 being limited on revving for about 30 sec to a minute and then you could go full on. They should have made that something cooler, like... "Full M Power being loaded"

MR

Huh, I haven't seen this message in mine, even before I turned off all the legal disclaimers, and I think you've actually put more miles on yours so far than I have (get new car! Get a really, really bad cold for two weeks! wee?). Which display was it on?

[Alec02]

Originally Posted by bri1042

Huh, I haven't seen this message in mine, even before I turned off all the legal disclaimers, and I think you've actually put more miles on yours so far than I have (get new car! Get a really, really bad cold for two weeks! wee?). Which display was it on?

It is written under rev counter, I think it is the same for M3/M4 or S55 engine - it means, that your power is limited, until good temperature is achieved.

I confirm this statement on my car also (EU spec)

[MR.]

Originally Posted by Alec02

It is written under rev counter, I think it is the same for M3/M4 or S55 engine - it means, that your power is limited, until good temperature is achieved.

I confirm this statement on my car also (EU spec)

I never spotted this on a M3/M4 weirdly enough.

MR

[Balaazs]

Originally Posted by MR.

Yesterday I managed to hit 1000 km during my trip to Berlin while running in the car... You all might know what that means if you have stretches of unlimited Autobahn in front of you.

I decided to do a number of full throttle spurts from 70/80 kmh in 3rd and 4th to 170 kmh shifting at around 5000 rpm. I ran through the different modes and the outcome of my tests was .

I did the tests since my car is going to Akrapovic next week and this would have been the last time on summer tires in Germany before the end of the year and March next year when I swap back to summers on the new BBS wheels. I would therefore not drive this set up anymore on the highway any time soon.

The outcome is not positive. Even though that the ASD is not as loud as in the OG M2 (in all modes!), it is still there and masks any outside noise. I have not heard my exhaust in the cabin yet, not one time... No burbles or anything. Instead I hear the dump valve / wastegate release noise in front of me when I release the throttle at lower revs with the radio off. I kid you not... ASD masks it all! The sound of my EU spec M2C is horrible, what a disgrace.

Now lets move to the engine and gearbox combo. The set up is a fail in my opinion. Throttle response in efficient (Yes, efficient not comfort) and Sport is not good enough. In Sport plus it is decent in lower speeds and lower gears, but as soon as you are in a gear too high it is pretty crap. Overall, it has a lazy behavior all around. Same as I experienced on the press trip in the manual. Same shit, different toilet.

The gearbox has hardly any feedback on throttle loaded shifts. On full throttle and shifts at 5K rpm the shifts are so seamless I feel like I am driving a McLaren or a Nissan GT R. Epic if you have a Supercar with a decent speed potential, but this is pretty rubbish.

The problem is now that since there is no sound whatsoever on full throttle, no interesting gearbox feedback and no engagement you focus on how fast or shall I say how slow the M2C is. You are like it is fast, but mwah this is not really fast. Speed climbed nicely and the engine wants to rev but the experience is one of the most boring I have ever had in a M product.

If it is seamless than it needs to be lightning fast, if it is not lightning fast then it needs to be engaging. The M2C is neither of this and therefore it is in my opinion pretty damn boring in this spec. Yes, the handling is better and it steers better, but I am talking about the engine, gearbox and exhaust combo.

I am pretty much stunned how crap it is. Never thought it would be this bad in the DCT, but it is horrible. This car needs a massive tune, exhaust and maybe even downpipes to make it engaging to drive. Right now it feels immensely linear, seamless and all the engine/shifting fun we had in the OG M2 and the ferocious behavior from the M4 is completely gone.

Damn it

MR

That’s exactly how I feel and what I experience as well. Thanks for putting it in words. It sucks, I agree 100%. Even more reasons to look forward to developments at Akrapovic.

[Davil]

Originally Posted by Craig335d

However I will still be very interested to see how this plays out and if you are stunned at how crap your modifications or if it will then become the perfect car that BMW should have produced and you can come on here, promote the modifications and receive adulation.
I have a prediction about how this will end............

Amen.

[MR.]

Originally Posted by Balaazs

That’s exactly how I feel and what I experience as well. Thanks for putting it in words. It sucks, I agree 100%. Even more reasons to look forward to developments at Akrapovic.

Working on it... Next 6 months are gonna be important with all the brands releasing their upgrades for the car.

MR

[cptobvious]

Originally Posted by Craig335d

However I will still be very interested to see how this plays out and if you are stunned at how crap your modifications or if it will then become the perfect car that BMW should have produced and you can come on here, promote the modifications and receive adulation.
I have a prediction about how this will end............

Originally Posted by Davil

Amen.

Hey, come on, guys... MR has always been 100% upfront with all of us in terms of his industry ties. Moreover, although I haven't been on this forum for very long, I've seen a number of instances firsthand where he's gone out of his way to help other members with their needs. He's one of the only true enthusiast "journalists" around, and on top of that, he's actually KNOWLEDGEABLE, which we don't see with any of the other industry figures!!!

I LOVE the M2C, and disagree with MR's review. In fact, if he ever comes to San Diego, I'd settle our disagreement via trial by combat... and then we'd have some cognac together. But, nonetheless, I respect his opinion and his review and I don't question his integrity. He's coming at this from a different perspective from mine, is all. He had the OG M2, which he loved and modded heavily. Then, he sold that beautiful car eagerly anticipating the M2C. And then a) the EU stuck the OPF on there, and b) BMW remapped the throttle to have less torque lower down in the rev range. I can very well imagine that if I were in MR's shoes, I might have a review that perfectly mirrors MR's. (For the record, my "review" was the exact opposite! Ha!)

I mean, you have an awesome car, you're excited about the next improved generation, and then OPF and lower torque down low? Of course you're gonna be upset! And MR has said so all along - every thread he's been consistent about knowing that he's going to have do a ton of mods to get the car to where it needs to be. And MR's review is perfectly valid for all the members who are considering going from OG M2 to M2C. (Think about all the official Ascari reviews where NOBODY mentioned any of this, all they did was gush about the car because they were there on an all-expenses paid vacation. MR was the only one who was truthful about both the improvements and the handicaps.)

Anyway, I really appreciate the content, and am looking forward to hearing about the evolution of MR's car, as there will be lessons learned, and then I may end up modding my car along similar lines, depending upon outcomes!

* Disclaimer: I'm an employee of MR's. Just joking, guys...

[Robin_NL]

Originally Posted by Craig335d

I'm not sure why you even bought such a terrible car, you hated it after your initial drive but still went ahead. It's almost like you have an ulterior motive / agenda...

If it's actually as bad as you make out (and I don't believe it is, as there are tabloid amounts of massive over-exaggeration in the way you write), then surely no amount of modding will sort it.
You'll also have no real comparison to before and after, you've only carried out 700 miles, not revved above 5k, not had the run-in service and not turned the cabin noise off.
A better, more relevant, comparison for me would be on a car that has done these things, gathered a few thousand miles, settled down and then made some tweaks.

Personal opinion is that the noise from footage of EU cars from behind is just fine, I don't go in for the look at me, look at me shouty exhaust system any more and I personally wouldn't have a car like this in anything but manual so your main issues aren't issues I'll likely have.

However I will still be very interested to see how this plays out and if you are stunned at how crap your modifications or if it will then become the perfect car that BMW should have produced and you can come on here, promote the modifications and receive adulation.
I have a prediction about how this will end............

It's called marketing

Akrapovic will pay him well I gues


Cheers
Robin

[dmboone25]

Originally Posted by JustChris

Hold on kids, in pressing the RED MODE button.

You could just buy one red kit and one blue kit, right?

[COChris]

I don't have the restricted power announcement either on startup. Must be EU.

Really curious to see what improvements the OPF removal will make overall. I think this is one of the best cars BMW have made.

Currently own an S54 swapped wagon with X3 AWD and now the M2C as well.

Former cars:

E92 M3
E82 1M
E36 M3 (3 of them, one AA supercharged)
E36 318is
E34 M5
E28 535is

Also lots of seat time in an E46 M3. But I still think the M2C is a home run! Sorry to see that the EU cars are slacking off.

[dmboone25]

Originally Posted by MR.

The problem is now that since there is no sound whatsoever on full throttle, no interesting gearbox feedback and no engagement you focus on how fast or shall I say how slow the M2C is. You are like it is fast, but mwah this is not really fast. Speed climbed nicely and the engine wants to rev but the experience is one of the most boring I have ever had in a M product.

MR

This is difficult to believe...

Did you try rolling the windows down? I am not aware that the M2C had less sound dampening, so I wouldn't think that it's reasonable to expect more noise in the cabin with the windows up (and that aren't ASD enabled).

When I got my F80 18 months ago, I was shocked at how quiet it was - compared to the 981 I was coming from. However, this has been...part of the deal...for a while now. If I want to hear my F80 roar, I use those 4 buttons on the driver's side door.

I also don't buy it that the car effectively feels "slow" - detune or not, S55 + 405 BHP = fast vehicle. And yes, we realize you get to drive Shmeeeeeee's expensive shit, but that's on another performance and price planet. Not really relevant here.

You are definitely and obviously entitled to your opinion - especially on the engagement of the transmission, ASD levels, etc. But to suggest there's no exhaust note at all, and not roll the windows down...well that just doesn't make sense.

And the car isn't slow - it's objectively faster than the OG model. No debating that.

[///M Houbi]

I think it matters a lot from where or better what car you come. Well, as far it seems the M2C isn't the holy grail for OG or LCI M2 owners....

Wondering how my own experiencw will be, coming from a 2003 E46 330Ci.... we'll see.

[M-Pilot]

Originally Posted by krizze

In more positive news, Señor Marc has now handed the car over to me so I'm going to drive it to it's run in service on Thursday and then over the weekend I will do a a full B2B with my modded OG M2, be it modded I haven't touched the engine except for a sport cat from
akrapovic so the test should be relatively fair... I've driven it for 45 minutes this morning, and initial reaction is ..... it feels like it's lost it's DNA....

But I won't say anymore, I will write a full review with no bias on Sunday evening


Thanks

Kris.

Instead of just driving them back to back and relying solely on your butt dyno, would it be possible to also put these two cars on a real dyno back to back (same day, same dyno, same fuel etc., maybe after M2C's break-in service)?

[infinitekidM2C]

i feel like I'm reading the first part of an infomercial

my question will be if the new mods can make super crispy french fries