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      12-16-2019, 12:57 PM   #749
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Originally Posted by bjcarls View Post
I hope its a fantastic drive, it needs to be. Whooaaa

I think I'd go this route, GTS, but that's just me.

https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-...Type=spotlight

https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-...ckType=listing
Or this....

https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-...Type=spotlight
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      12-16-2019, 12:58 PM   #750
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People who say "...for Porsche money" need to fully understand what goes into that statement.

Sure it is Porsche money for the "base" Porsche cost. And as we all know, nobody really specs out a Porsche as "base". There are so many nickel and dime options that are typically standard in other models. All said and done, there is still quite a bit of delta between the BMW and Porsche equivalent.

Therefore, in terms of pricing strategy, BMW has determined that $83.6K is possibly a stretch, but still attainable, while the Porsche, you will be seriously going to another price bracket all together.

Where I see competition on this price is with other entirely different models. For example, me personally I would consider the Mercedes GLE 450 or BMW 8 series grand coupe 840i. Sure, it's not a direct performance competitor, but it's fighting towards these more luxurious products. I know I'm not alone cross shopping these disproportionate options.
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      12-16-2019, 12:58 PM   #751
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Poochie View Post
Or the M2C will get Adaptive Suspension in the final MY and topple both of them in value.
Of course I could be wrong, but I highly doubt they would do that and take away one of the only meat and potato advantages of the CS over the C.
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      12-16-2019, 01:02 PM   #752
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JCZ5 View Post
People who say "...for Porsche money" need to fully understand what goes into that statement.

Sure it is Porsche money for the "base" Porsche cost. And as we all know, nobody really specs out a Porsche as "base". There are so many nickel and dime options that are typically standard in other models. All said and done, there is still quite a bit of delta between the BMW and Porsche equivalent.

Therefore, in terms of pricing strategy, BMW has determined that $83.6K is possibly a stretch, but still attainable, while the Porsche, you will be seriously going to another price bracket all together.

Where I see competition on this price is with other entirely different models. For example, me personally I would consider the Mercedes GLE 450 or BMW 8 series grand coupe 840i. Sure, it's not a direct performance competitor, but it's fighting towards these more luxurious products. I know I'm not alone cross shopping these disproportionate options.
Thank you, you conveyed it better that I ever could..

A Porsche cost real money, a BMW you can stretch your budget and maybe sleep in your car for a couple of months but it's still attainable, for a fully spec model.

Not taking anything from either vehicle but there is levels to this ish..
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      12-16-2019, 01:06 PM   #753
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlpsRider View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Poochie View Post
Or the M2C will get Adaptive Suspension in the final MY and topple both of them in value.
Of course I could be wrong, but I highly doubt they would do that and take away one of the only meat and potato advantages of the CS over the C.
We'll just have to wait and see.. But once the CS is officially discontinued, all bets are off..
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      12-16-2019, 01:15 PM   #754
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JCZ5 View Post
People who say "...for Porsche money" need to fully understand what goes into that statement.

Sure it is Porsche money for the "base" Porsche cost. And as we all know, nobody really specs out a Porsche as "base". There are so many nickel and dime options that are typically standard in other models. All said and done, there is still quite a bit of delta between the BMW and Porsche equivalent.

Therefore, in terms of pricing strategy, BMW has determined that $83.6K is possibly a stretch, but still attainable, while the Porsche, you will be seriously going to another price bracket all together.

Where I see competition on this price is with other entirely different models. For example, me personally I would consider the Mercedes GLE 450 or BMW 8 series grand coupe 840i. Sure, it's not a direct performance competitor, but it's fighting towards these more luxurious products. I know I'm not alone cross shopping these disproportionate options.
I'd argue that a Cayman 718 S would outperform this M2 CS. Especially if you optioned out the 718 S to $83K.

Also, you lost me when you said you'd cross shop a M2 CS with a GLE450. You're in a population of 1 there...lol.

I'll give you the 8 series gran coupe comp, but nobody (expect you) is cross shopping a M2 CS with a GLE450.
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      12-16-2019, 01:22 PM   #755
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JCZ5 View Post
People who say "...for Porsche money" need to fully understand what goes into that statement.

Sure it is Porsche money for the "base" Porsche cost. And as we all know, nobody really specs out a Porsche as "base". There are so many nickel and dime options that are typically standard in other models. All said and done, there is still quite a bit of delta between the BMW and Porsche equivalent.

Therefore, in terms of pricing strategy, BMW has determined that $83.6K is possibly a stretch, but still attainable, while the Porsche, you will be seriously going to another price bracket all together.

Where I see competition on this price is with other entirely different models. For example, me personally I would consider the Mercedes GLE 450 or BMW 8 series grand coupe 840i. Sure, it's not a direct performance competitor, but it's fighting towards these more luxurious products. I know I'm not alone cross shopping these disproportionate options.
Agreed. Theres no 911 under $100k that most M2 CS-level drivers would want to drive.

MAYBE one of the upper end 718 variants fits the bill but, once again we're back into the 100k range with the GT4 and other models.
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      12-16-2019, 01:31 PM   #756
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Relax, guys. We’ve all seen this story before with CS/GTS. BMW will get a few suckers at MSRP, and a couple of ultra-suckers in California and Florida for MSRP + ADM.

The rest of us will wait a few months until the standard 35% off for GTS and CS goes into effect if you think this car is only worth $55-60k, just wait for a bit until you can purchase it for exactly that price
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      12-16-2019, 01:34 PM   #757
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M2audioman View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by JCZ5 View Post
People who say "...for Porsche money" need to fully understand what goes into that statement.

Sure it is Porsche money for the "base" Porsche cost. And as we all know, nobody really specs out a Porsche as "base". There are so many nickel and dime options that are typically standard in other models. All said and done, there is still quite a bit of delta between the BMW and Porsche equivalent.

Therefore, in terms of pricing strategy, BMW has determined that $83.6K is possibly a stretch, but still attainable, while the Porsche, you will be seriously going to another price bracket all together.

Where I see competition on this price is with other entirely different models. For example, me personally I would consider the Mercedes GLE 450 or BMW 8 series grand coupe 840i. Sure, it's not a direct performance competitor, but it's fighting towards these more luxurious products. I know I'm not alone cross shopping these disproportionate options.
I'd argue that a Cayman 718 S would outperform this M2 CS. Especially if you optioned out the 718 S to $83K.

Also, you lost me when you said you'd cross shop a M2 CS with a GLE450. You're in a population of 1 there...lol.

I'll give you the 8 series gran coupe comp, but nobody (expect you) is cross shopping a M2 CS with a GLE450.
So two rebuttals here...

Sure you can spec out a Cayman S at $83K that can outperform a M2CS. But as we all know, it's not all about performance, it's the entire package, usability, warranty, after sales service, etc. if you're talking about performance, you can buy a mustang Shelby or C8 for much less that will outperform.

Second comment about cross-shopping SUVs. I know one other member who is cross shopping between a M2CS and the new defender...and the point of my argument was competing against an entirely different model. Not literally a GLE450 to a M2CS or bust.
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      12-16-2019, 01:35 PM   #758
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Looks like with the additional 4 options: DCT, CCB, Cup 2 tires, & Gold wheels, the price will be around $100K after TTL....YIKES!!

Thank God those 4 items are optional, if I was going to order one, I won't need those 4 fancy options!!
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      12-16-2019, 01:36 PM   #759
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth One View Post
Relax, guys. We've all seen this story before with CS/GTS. BMW will get a few suckers at MSRP, and a couple of ultra-suckers in California and Florida for MSRP + ADM.

The rest of us will wait a few months until the standard 35% off for GTS and CS goes into effect if you think this car is only worth $55-60k, just wait for a bit until you can purchase it for exactly that price
This
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      12-16-2019, 01:37 PM   #760
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      12-16-2019, 01:49 PM   #761
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Poochie View Post
If they trying to entice a few holdouts of this M2 generation before the model end, Adaptive Suspension is a nice treat to offer.
Agreed

I'm not saying it's going to happen, but (as previously discussed) with the current M4 ending production around June 2020, the timing would be right

Other than potentially dissuading or upsetting a few M2 CS buyers, I think it would make sense
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      12-16-2019, 01:50 PM   #762
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That is used with 34k miles. 34k miles is a lot.
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      12-16-2019, 01:51 PM   #763
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Others I have pointed out a used M4GTS would be a better buy. i agree with them but I'm very happy with just my plain M2C.
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      12-16-2019, 01:52 PM   #764
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Agreed

I'm not saying it's going to happen, but (as previously discussed) with the current M4 ending production around June 2020, the timing would be right

Other than potentially dissuading or upsetting a few M2 CS buyers, I think it would make sense
What's the appeal of having adaptive suspension exactly? So there isn't a blank button on the center console? For the extra cost (and weight) why not run a set of proper coilovers, be able to adjust height, and subsequently tune the suspension to your liking. Won't a proper suspension setup provide better performance? Albiet, coilovers won't carry a factory warranty, I'm just curious.

You aren't going to see an appreciable increase in performance on backroads by setting the suspension to an overly stiff mode. If you're that serious about being able to adjust you suspension, then a proper setup makes more sense no?
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      12-16-2019, 02:11 PM   #765
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Conissah View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by VTBoss302 View Post
Agreed

I'm not saying it's going to happen, but (as previously discussed) with the current M4 ending production around June 2020, the timing would be right

Other than potentially dissuading or upsetting a few M2 CS buyers, I think it would make sense
What's the appeal of having adaptive suspension exactly? So there isn't a blank button on the center console? For the extra cost (and weight) why not run a set of proper coilovers, be able to adjust height, and subsequently tune the suspension to your liking. Won't a proper suspension setup provide better performance? Albiet, coilovers won't carry a factory warranty, I'm just curious.

You aren't going to see an appreciable increase in performance on backroads by setting the suspension to an overly stiff mode. If you're that serious about being able to adjust you suspension, then a proper setup makes more sense no?
For me personally, I want the ability to soften the suspension during daily driving duties and firm up on the weekends doing mountain passes.

I'm lazy and incompetent to install my own coil overs and adjust accordingly. Just wanted something simple from the factory that meets my needs. Therefore, this is why BMW made this car. For people who don't wish to get their hands dirty with various mods haha.

Now, I do admit I don't know how soft or firm the adjustable dampers get. But in my mind, there is quite the difference, this is why I want it! In addition to the soft merino leather seats for my butt.
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      12-16-2019, 02:14 PM   #766
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Conissah View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by VTBoss302 View Post
Agreed

I'm not saying it's going to happen, but (as previously discussed) with the current M4 ending production around June 2020, the timing would be right

Other than potentially dissuading or upsetting a few M2 CS buyers, I think it would make sense
What's the appeal of having adaptive suspension exactly?

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      12-16-2019, 02:20 PM   #767
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darth One View Post
Relax, guys. We've all seen this story before with CS/GTS. BMW will get a few suckers at MSRP, and a couple of ultra-suckers in California and Florida for MSRP + ADM.

The rest of us will wait a few months until the standard 35% off for GTS and CS goes into effect if you think this car is only worth $55-60k, just wait for a bit until you can purchase it for exactly that price
UK market

100% this M4CS
100% this M3CS
100% this M4GTS

You have to REALLY want one to pre order. Otherwise it's worth the risk of missing out to save £30k? Over here it seems yes.

I'm not saying it is it isn't worth it, just this is exactly how it plays out in the UK.
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      12-16-2019, 02:22 PM   #768
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JCZ5 View Post
People who say "...for Porsche money" need to fully understand what goes into that statement.

Sure it is Porsche money for the "base" Porsche cost. And as we all know, nobody really specs out a Porsche as "base". There are so many nickel and dime options that are typically standard in other models. All said and done, there is still quite a bit of delta between the BMW and Porsche equivalent.

Therefore, in terms of pricing strategy, BMW has determined that $83.6K is possibly a stretch, but still attainable, while the Porsche, you will be seriously going to another price bracket all together.

Where I see competition on this price is with other entirely different models. For example, me personally I would consider the Mercedes GLE 450 or BMW 8 series grand coupe 840i. Sure, it's not a direct performance competitor, but it's fighting towards these more luxurious products. I know I'm not alone cross shopping these disproportionate options.
You might as well try to explain quantum physics to a pig.

Some people are not very intelligent. This is the same crowd that said that for 130k they've buy a GT3 instead of a M4 GTS... ignoring that over in the real world you need ~150 for a 911 GTS and more like 200k for a GT3.

A Cayman S with normal options is close to 100k... I don't know why anyone feels the M2 CS is overpriced.


There are some disgusting P car fanboys that for whatever reason want to stick around the M forums. God knows why. If I had a Camaro and there was some asshat in the Camaro forum going on and on and on about how wonderful M cars are... I'd seriously wonder about them.

Everyone just adores how Porsche will sell a 4 banger Cayman S to you for 100k and praise how wonderful it is... now don't complain when BMW takes a page out of their book and starts offering seven thousand versions of their M cars.

Last edited by SYT_Shadow; 12-16-2019 at 03:17 PM..
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      12-16-2019, 02:35 PM   #769
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SYT_Shadow View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by JCZ5 View Post
People who say "...for Porsche money" need to fully understand what goes into that statement.

Sure it is Porsche money for the "base" Porsche cost. And as we all know, nobody really specs out a Porsche as "base". There are so many nickel and dime options that are typically standard in other models. All said and done, there is still quite a bit of delta between the BMW and Porsche equivalent.

Therefore, in terms of pricing strategy, BMW has determined that $83.6K is possibly a stretch, but still attainable, while the Porsche, you will be seriously going to another price bracket all together.

Where I see competition on this price is with other entirely different models. For example, me personally I would consider the Mercedes GLE 450 or BMW 8 series grand coupe 840i. Sure, it's not a direct performance competitor, but it's fighting towards these more luxurious products. I know I'm not alone cross shopping these disproportionate options.
You might as well try to explain quantum physics to a pig.

Some people are not very intelligent. This is the same crowd that said that for 130k they've buy a GT3 instead of a M4 GTS... ignoring that over in the real world you need ~150 for a 911 GTS and more like 200k for a GT3.

A Cayman S with normal options is close to 100k... I don't know why anyone feels the M2 CS is overpriced.


There are some disgusting P car fanboys that for whatever reason what to stick around the M forums. God knows why. If I had a Camaro and there was some asshat in the Camaro forum going on and on and on about how wonderful M cars are... I'd seriously wonder about them.

Everyone just adores how Porsche will sell a 4 banger Cayman S to you for 100k and praise how wonderful it is... now don't complain when BMW takes a page out of their book and starts offering seven thousand versions of their M cars.
Damn! I don't think anybody can really refute anything you've said.
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      12-16-2019, 03:18 PM   #770
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Artemis View Post
My guesstimate was ± $85K as base price for the US (see here).

So it seems that I missed the mark by $1.4K.

And as omasou pointed out $995 destination & handling, actually $405 off mark.

US base price perspective (MSRP):
  • ± $53K (original M2 2016 US list price) + ± 57.74% = $83.6K (± $30.6K extra);
  • ± $59K (M2 Competition 2019 US list price) + ± 41.70% = $83.6K (± $24.6K extra);
  • ± $69K (M4 2019 US list price) + ± 21.16% = $83.6K (± $14.6K extra);
  • ± $74K (M4 Competition 2019 US list price) + ± 12.98% = $83.6K (± $9.6K extra).
You can also compare to m4cs and m3cs

On another note, lease deals on m3/4 cs have been steals lately so not sure if this car is even worth it.
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