[SafariEdition]

I love my 2017 M2, I truly do. Its been the best car I've owned...aside from one...very glaring issue. It will occasionally grind/lockout on the 1-2 shift. This typically happens at higher RPM's (above 6k) and can happen in a straight line OR in a turn. Has anyone found a solution to this yet? Typically I do the easy answer....shift at a lower RPM, and thats fine...however I also autocross my car, and during prosolo events your reaction time and 60 foot actually matter...so shifting earlier isnt the better way.

A friend of mine who used to own an M2 (and is a national champion) had the trans replaced, motor/trans mounts replaced and fluid changed...with no change in the behavior. It would still do it occasionally, so I dont think its a synchro issue (I know thats going to be the first suggestion, but a new factory trans should eliminate that).

Since we both ran/run in street class...stiffer engine mounts werent explored, so I'm curious if anyone had tried that and seen if the stiffer mounts fix it or not. I'm thinking about either moving into a different class where I can do these kinds of things, or trading the car for something else...which I'd hate to do. I love the car, but throwing away runs at national events because of this gear issue is...frustrating to say the least.

[PackPride85]

Originally Posted by SafariEdition

I love my 2017 M2, I truly do. Its been the best car I've owned...aside from one...very glaring issue. It will occasionally grind/lockout on the 1-2 shift. This typically happens at higher RPM's (above 6k) and can happen in a straight line OR in a turn. Has anyone found a solution to this yet? Typically I do the easy answer....shift at a lower RPM, and thats fine...however I also autocross my car, and during prosolo events your reaction time and 60 foot actually matter...so shifting earlier isnt the better way.

A friend of mine who used to own an M2 (and is a national champion) had the trans replaced, motor/trans mounts replaced and fluid changed...with no change in the behavior. It would still do it occasionally, so I dont think its a synchro issue (I know thats going to be the first suggestion, but a new factory trans should eliminate that).

Since we both ran/run in street class...stiffer engine mounts werent explored, so I'm curious if anyone had tried that and seen if the stiffer mounts fix it or not. I'm thinking about either moving into a different class where I can do these kinds of things, or trading the car for something else...which I'd hate to do. I love the car, but throwing away runs at national events because of this gear issue is...frustrating to say the least.

Get a new transmission with different gear ratios. Seriously, there really is no fix for the massive rpm difference you'll see when shifting due to the existing different in 1-2 ratios. You might see the engine drop rpms faster with a lightweight flywheel which would help but not sure.

[SafariEdition]

Originally Posted by PackPride85

Get a new transmission with different gear ratios. Seriously, there really is no fix for the massive rpm difference you'll see when shifting due to the existing different in 1-2 ratios. You might see the engine drop rpms faster with a lightweight flywheel which would help but not sure.

So you're thinking the RPM difference is what causes the 1st to 2nd lock out?

[DanG]

Simple solution, get a DCT.

[SafariEdition]

Originally Posted by DanG

Simple solution, get a DCT.

That'd just make a bad problem worse, since the DCT can't launch reliably to cut a perfect reaction time to save its life

[3LiterBeater]

Also following.

I have considered a heavier or different fluid but it sounds like that won't get the job done either.

Group buy on custom gear ratios anyone?

[2020M2Competition]

Originally Posted by SafariEdition

I love my 2017 M2, I truly do. Its been the best car I've owned...aside from one...very glaring issue. It will occasionally grind/lockout on the 1-2 shift. This typically happens at higher RPM's (above 6k) and can happen in a straight line OR in a turn. Has anyone found a solution to this yet? Typically I do the easy answer....shift at a lower RPM, and thats fine...however I also autocross my car, and during prosolo events your reaction time and 60 foot actually matter...so shifting earlier isnt the better way.

A friend of mine who used to own an M2 (and is a national champion) had the trans replaced, motor/trans mounts replaced and fluid changed...with no change in the behavior. It would still do it occasionally, so I dont think its a synchro issue (I know thats going to be the first suggestion, but a new factory trans should eliminate that).

Since we both ran/run in street class...stiffer engine mounts werent explored, so I'm curious if anyone had tried that and seen if the stiffer mounts fix it or not. I'm thinking about either moving into a different class where I can do these kinds of things, or trading the car for something else...which I'd hate to do. I love the car, but throwing away runs at national events because of this gear issue is...frustrating to say the least.

I've never experienced any grind or lockout, but stiffer transmission mounts made a noticeable difference in shifting for me

The stock trans mounts are ridiculously soft

I went with the Rogue Engineering transmission mounts

https://www.rogueengineering.com/Rog...nts_p_137.html

I did experience a very slight increase in NVH, but well worth it

ECS also offers some stiffer poly mounts, but people have reported more NVH with those

https://www.ecstuning.com/b-ecs-part...02705ecs02a~a/

https://www.ecstuning.com/b-ecs-part...002705ecs01~a/

You could also look into BMW Motorsport motor mount inserts (#3 in the link below)

https://www.realoem.com/bmw/enUS/sho...diagId=22_0218

And VTT also offers motor mount inserts, as well

https://vargasturbo.com/product/vtt-...mount-inserts/

[2020M2Competition]

Also forgot to mention the usual upgrades

Clutch delay valve removal and/or E90 Clutch Slave

https://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1625114

https://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1682441

https://f30.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1666477

Autosolutions Short Shift Kit and Urethane Bronze Bushings

http://autosolutions.info

http://autosolutions.info/urethane-bronze-bushing/

Rogue Engineering Short Shift Kit

https://www.rogueengineering.com/Rog...Kit_p_115.html

Ultimate Clutch Pedal

http://www.ultimateclutchpedal.com

Some people have also claimed to have smoother shifting with different fluids such as

https://www.redlineoil.com/dctf-dual...smission-fluid

https://www.motul.com/us/en-US/products/multi-dctf

Even though they are DCT fluids, both manufacturers claim that they are suitable replacements for the BMW MTF-LT5 fluid

[F87source]

Originally Posted by 2020M2Competition

Also forgot to mention the usual upgrades

Clutch delay valve removal and/or E90 Clutch Slave

https://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1625114

https://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1682441

https://f30.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1666477

Autosolutions Short Shift Kit and Urethane Bronze Bushings

http://autosolutions.info

http://autosolutions.info/urethane-bronze-bushing/

Rogue Engineering Short Shift Kit

https://www.rogueengineering.com/Rog...Kit_p_115.html

Ultimate Clutch Pedal

http://www.ultimateclutchpedal.com

Some people have also claimed to have smoother shifting with different fluids such as

https://www.redlineoil.com/dctf-dual...smission-fluid

https://www.motul.com/us/en-US/products/multi-dctf

Even though they are DCT fluids, both manufacturers claim that they are suitable replacements for the BMW MTF-LT5 fluid

Yeah redline dctf is the fluid you would go to replaced MTF LT-5 because MTF is a low viscosity fluid just like DCT fluid is.


Anyways what I noticed was my 1-2 shifts were so much smoother to the point of completely eliminating the knotchiness I felt early in my car's life after I changed out the transmission oil. I suspect that there was alot of particulate matter released during break in and so that is why the transmission fluid flush made such a huge impact.

Also I wanted to go with redline dctf but it was out of stock locally and so I just bought some MTF-LT5 (which is actually the German made stuff directly from BMW AG in Germany if you are in Canada) and it is a night and day difference. Literally every shift is buttery smooth now.

[chris719]

Originally Posted by SafariEdition

So you're thinking the RPM difference is what causes the 1st to 2nd lock out?

I don't know, but every M car with 6MT has this issue to varying degrees going back to the S52 engine cars or even earlier. This is despite multiple vendors for the transmission (ZF 6MT on the Z4M one of the worst for this).

I am going to chalk it up to the ratios as mentioned, soft BMW transmission and motor mounts, and possibly something to do with how BMW specifies the transmission requirements (cost cutting on synchros?).

I did CDV, fluid, shift knob, etc. on my Z4M and none of it fixed the 2nd gear feeling of lockout on fast shifts. The mounts may help, but I don't think it's ever going to shift like a 911.

[F87source]

Originally Posted by chris719

I don't know, but every M car with 6MT has this issue to varying degrees going back to the S52 engine cars or even earlier. This is despite multiple vendors for the transmission (ZF 6MT on the Z4M one of the worst for this).

I am going to chalk it up to the ratios as mentioned, soft BMW transmission and motor mounts, and possibly something to do with how BMW specifies the transmission requirements (cost cutting on synchros?).

I did CDV, fluid, shift knob, etc. on my Z4M and none of it fixed the 2nd gear feeling of lockout on fast shifts. The mounts may help, but I don't think it's ever going to shift like a 911.

The synchros are stronger and upgraded on the m2/m3/m4 6mt, they also added carbon to make the shifts feel better irrc, but how and to what capacity idk.


But I really think swapping fluid is the first step.

[SafariEdition]

Yeah I plan on swapping fluid...I had thought about removing the CDV, but read that it didnt fix the 1-2 lockout issue since it only slows down the clutch engagement, but not its release. I'm not particularly worried about NVH....the car will be my daily driver, but its more important function is to be competitive...so I'll take some discomfort for that haha.

[DarthFader]

All my MT woes were solved with the Auto Solutions Shift Kit.

I hated the stock set up and was thinking of selling the car due to occasional lock out and just the rubbery vagueness of it. Took a stab at the shift kit and all is well. I guess I'd start there or maybe the transmission mounts or both.

[3LiterBeater]

Originally Posted by DarthFader

All my MT woes were solved with the Auto Solutions Shift Kit.

I hated the stock set up and was thinking of selling the car due to occasional lock out and just the rubbery vagueness of it. Took a stab at the shift kit and all is well. I guess I'd start there or maybe the transmission mounts or both.

Have any pictures of the shift kit? Their site doesn't show a whole lot, sadly

[chris719]

Originally Posted by SafariEdition

Yeah I plan on swapping fluid...I had thought about removing the CDV, but read that it didnt fix the 1-2 lockout issue since it only slows down the clutch engagement, but not its release. I'm not particularly worried about NVH....the car will be my daily driver, but its more important function is to be competitive...so I'll take some discomfort for that haha.

Yes, anyone that tells you the CDV does something for the resistance entering 2nd is fooling themselves. Even if the valve delayed disengagement, it's a short delay and there is no way by the time you are trying to enter 2nd that it isn't fully disengaged.

[DarthFader]

Originally Posted by 3LiterBeater

Have any pictures of the shift kit? Their site doesn't show a whole lot, sadly

This thread shows it.

https://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1613458

[hson10]

I mainly track my OG M2 (2017), so I don't really ever shift fast from 1-2. This past weekend, I did a very soft roll-on launch from 1st gear, and shifted into 2nd at around redline and it just completely locked me out of gear/made an awful noise. This is the first time this has happened / honestly the first time I've ever shifted fast from 1-2. I have the Rogue Engineering trans mourns as well as the Turner poly rear shifter bushings, and while shift feel is improved, clearly not a remedy for this problem. I changed my trans fluid to BMW OEM about 3,000 mi ago, but thinking I might give the fluid a try. Not sure if the short shifter is worth the hassle of putting in..

[F87source]

Originally Posted by hson10

I mainly track my OG M2 (2017), so I don't really ever shift fast from 1-2. This past weekend, I did a very soft roll-on launch from 1st gear, and shifted into 2nd at around redline and it just completely locked me out of gear/made an awful noise. This is the first time this has happened / honestly the first time I've ever shifted fast from 1-2. I have the Rogue Engineering trans mourns as well as the Turner poly rear shifter bushings, and while shift feel is improved, clearly not a remedy for this problem. I changed my trans fluid to BMW OEM about 3,000 mi ago, but thinking I might give the fluid a try. Not sure if the short shifter is worth the hassle of putting in..

Did you look into doing a cdv delete?

[hson10]

Originally Posted by F87source

Did you look into doing a cdv delete?

Originally Posted by F87source

Did you look into doing a cdv delete?

I've read posts on doing a CDV delete on the F87, but I need to find a shop to do it - not really something I would attempt on jack stands by myself. I'm thinking if it's gonna take the labor to do the CDV delete, might as well do the short shifter at the same time..? But not sure if both of these are worth the money!

That's why I'm interested in the change in fluid, maybe that'll stop the issue.

[M Fifty]

OP, is your clutch releasing fully? If it isn't, 1-2 upshifts is where you would notice it most.

[windnsea00]

Most M cars I've owned just don't like a super-fast 1-2 shift so I try to avoid it. CDV delete is a nice touch but doesn't really help with the 1-2 shift if you are really moving it quickly.

[vrooooom]

Originally Posted by F87source

Anyways what I noticed was my 1-2 shifts were so much smoother to the point of completely eliminating the notchiness I felt early in my car's life after I changed out the transmission oil. I suspect that there was alot of particulate matter released during break in and so that is why the transmission fluid flush made such a huge impact.

ok i think u just twisted my arm in going under the car again this weekend. I already have the RL fluid anyways.