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      05-21-2020, 04:28 PM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mosely View Post
Just got my alignment done after adjusting ride height and adding spacers. They told me that they can't get any better on the rear toe without increasing camber? Seems like a lot of rear toe. I see gsrbri just above with same camber but much better toe. Shop being lazy or is what they're saying true? I'm running KW V3.

There are toe adjustment links at the rear - if you want close to neutral toe, it's adjustment. Shop should be able to get you where you need to be
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      05-21-2020, 05:46 PM   #46
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Had mine aligned yesterday after installing GC camber plates (stock suspension otherwise). Not sure what's up with the seemingly large diff in rear caster. May take it to another shop for a re-do.
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      05-21-2020, 09:48 PM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gsrbri View Post
There are toe adjustment links at the rear - if you want close to neutral toe, it's adjustment. Shop should be able to get you where you need to be
Isn't the rear toe an eccentric washer just like the camber but in a different axis?

https://www.newtis.info/tisv2/a/en/f...ent/1VnXnSoyiF

I thought you had to buy adjustable end links otherwise?
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      05-22-2020, 10:25 AM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mosely View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by gsrbri View Post
There are toe adjustment links at the rear - if you want close to neutral toe, it's adjustment. Shop should be able to get you where you need to be
Isn't the rear toe an eccentric washer just like the camber but in a different axis?

https://www.newtis.info/tisv2/a/en/f...ent/1VnXnSoyiF

I thought you had to buy adjustable end links otherwise?
I need to crawl under my car and look - these are all dynamic when you make other changes. In many cases, it's laziness by the alignment tech. Also, some machines are more accurate than others
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      05-22-2020, 11:12 AM   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gsrbri View Post
There are toe adjustment links at the rear - if you want close to neutral toe, it's adjustment. Shop should be able to get you where you need to be
There was another thread going into detail on the alignment and suspension dynamics of our cars that says the rear toe is increased by correcting the camber. So if you lower the car to a point where camber needs corrected then it apparently becomes difficult to bring the toe back in the rear.

In that post he was able to get the rear back to 0.26 (I'm at 0.36). It's possible I'm slightly lower than he is so I needed more camber correction to get back to -1.8 making the toe harder to reel in. I'll hit up another shop to see if it truly is at the limit of correction. Otherwise it appears adjustable rear endlinks are the only solution. Surprised this hasn't come up on here with how many people have coilovers.
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      05-22-2020, 09:09 PM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mosely View Post
There was another thread going into detail on the alignment and suspension dynamics of our cars that says the rear toe is increased by correcting the camber. So if you lower the car to a point where camber needs corrected then it apparently becomes difficult to bring the toe back in the rear.

In that post he was able to get the rear back to 0.26 (I'm at 0.36). It's possible I'm slightly lower than he is so I needed more camber correction to get back to -1.8 making the toe harder to reel in. I'll hit up another shop to see if it truly is at the limit of correction. Otherwise it appears adjustable rear endlinks are the only solution. Surprised this hasn't come up on here with how many people have coilovers.
How much lower are you in the rear? I was 30 mm lower than the stock at one point which was really noticeable, and more than I really wanted, and I still didn't have a problem getting the toe in to the median of the recommended range.
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      05-24-2020, 01:23 AM   #51
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The toe adjustment range is enough in the rear even when lowered. I would say it's just laziness.

I'm getting pretty good handling with these specs:

1.85 front camber (camber plates), toe 0.05 per side so 0.1 total (that's still within OEM specs, just on the minimum limit)

1.60 rear camber, toe 0.1 per side, 0.2 total (again, just on the OEM minimum)

I tried 0 toe in the front and didn't like it - too floaty on the highway.

This setup just about eliminated the mild understeer I was getting. The low camber in the back seems to help putting the power down.


Edit: Just came back from a track session where I bumped the front camber to 2.85 and I can report that it was perfect. Even tire temp and wear, excellent turn in, no understeer.

Last edited by mr_lab_rat; 05-25-2020 at 08:43 PM..
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      06-10-2020, 04:38 PM   #52
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      07-10-2020, 02:10 PM   #53
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Just got my street/track alignment with GC camber plates

F: 2.5 degrees of camber, toe of 0.00* (L) and 0.05* (R) for total toe-in of 0.05*, 7.3* of caster
R: 1.7 degrees of camber, toe-in of 0.14* per side for total toe-in of 0.28*
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      07-30-2020, 01:42 PM   #54
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@VisualEcho

I do t have the exact measurements. For how much they lowered the front and rear because we're waiting for it to settle.

Below are the initial settings. MSS springs and Ground control camber plates.
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      07-30-2020, 04:53 PM   #55
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Finally get even tire wear when on-track. I do have MPS installed but not lowered.

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      07-30-2020, 10:51 PM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ae03440 View Post
@VisualEcho

I do t have the exact measurements. For how much they lowered the front and rear because we're waiting for it to settle.

Below are the initial settings. MSS springs and Ground control camber plates.
Why are you running that much toe in the back?
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      07-31-2020, 08:00 AM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dmf View Post
Finally get even tire wear when on-track. I do have MPS installed but not lowered.

What camber plates are you running?
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      07-31-2020, 08:16 AM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mr_lab_rat View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by ae03440 View Post
@VisualEcho

I do t have the exact measurements. For how much they lowered the front and rear because we're waiting for it to settle.

Below are the initial settings. MSS springs and Ground control camber plates.
Why are you running that much toe in the back?
Not sure tbh. The shop installed and aligned everything earlier this week. I told him I do about 2-3 track days a year and lots of daily driving. He set everything up for now until it settles and then he would dial it in after 1000 miles.

Think i should take some of that toe out in the rear?
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      07-31-2020, 08:58 AM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ae03440 View Post
Think i should take some of that toe out in the rear?
If you don't want to wear your tires extremely quickly, yes.
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      07-31-2020, 12:24 PM   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yadadameans View Post
What camber plates are you running?
Ground Control - from memory that was the first mod I had done to the car. They have been fine since install.
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      07-31-2020, 02:43 PM   #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dmf View Post
Ground Control - from memory that was the first mod I had done to the car. They have been fine since install.
Do you do any daily driving with your car?

I was running 3 degrees of camber with zero toe in the front and got excessive inner tire wear over the course of 7,500 miles.
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      07-31-2020, 03:13 PM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ggeezer View Post
Do you do any daily driving with your car?

I was running 3 degrees of camber with zero toe in the front and got excessive inner tire wear over the course of 7,500 miles.
Previously, yes I did but not with this camber. Now days I don't do nearly as much regular street driving. I suspect once I get back to driving to an office every day, I will notice it.

I only got a dedicated set of track wheels/tires very recently, so uneven tire wear was rarely a problem since my 1-2 track days/month tended to do wear them down far more significantly.
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      07-31-2020, 08:52 PM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ae03440 View Post
Not sure tbh. The shop installed and aligned everything earlier this week. I told him I do about 2-3 track days a year and lots of daily driving. He set everything up for now until it settles and then he would dial it in after 1000 miles.

Think i should take some of that toe out in the rear?
Yes. You are currently running nearly maximum OEM spec toe in. It can be good for high speed stability and putting power down on turn exit. But it wears tires and adds to understeer on turn entry and mid turn. With stock staggered tires I like to run on the low end of the OEM spec, something like 0.05 per side for 0.10 total.
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      07-31-2020, 09:24 PM   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mr_lab_rat View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by ae03440 View Post
Not sure tbh. The shop installed and aligned everything earlier this week. I told him I do about 2-3 track days a year and lots of daily driving. He set everything up for now until it settles and then he would dial it in after 1000 miles.

Think i should take some of that toe out in the rear?
Yes. You are currently running nearly maximum OEM spec toe in. It can be good for high speed stability and putting power down on turn exit. But it wears tires and adds to understeer on turn entry and mid turn. With stock staggered tires I like to run on the low end of the OEM spec, something like 0.05 per side for 0.10 total.
Thank you!
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      08-27-2020, 03:05 PM   #65
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Here's my specs. Stock suspension after installing Vorshlag camber plates.
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      08-27-2020, 03:28 PM   #66
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I’ve posted the below in other threads.

Alignment Specs (deg)-
Track: Front: -3.2, 0.04 total toe in, Rear: -2.1, 0.27 total toe in.
Street: Front: -2.1, 0.10 total toe in, Rear: -1.7, 0.28 total toe in.
OEM: Front: -1.5, 0.16 total toe in, Rear: -1.8, 0.27 total toe in.
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