09-23-2019, 12:33 PM | #243 | ||
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09-23-2019, 12:53 PM | #244 |
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Daaang....For as many times as P cars have been mentioned in this 12 page thread I thought I might be on a Porsche forum . They are great cars no doubt, but you're either a Porsche sports car kind of guy or you're not. I'm not. I am a BMW guy so I'm on a BMW forum. I'm not going to go over and look at a Porsche forum, but I have to wonder if the guys over there are raving about how great BMW's are and what a crappy value their special edition P cars are. Probably not.....
P.S. my friend who is a Porsche guy said this is how you price a Porsche. You find the bottom line base price of the model you want then spec the car out properly and figure about double. |
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09-23-2019, 01:46 PM | #246 | |
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09-23-2019, 01:57 PM | #247 | |
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09-23-2019, 02:01 PM | #248 |
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Hi guys,
For me the situation is a bit different and I would not mind getting your advice. I currently daily a basic Civic and on the weekend I drive a 981 GT4. I was thinking about trading both those cars in to get a BMW M2 CS with manual transmission. Does it make sense? I would not mind seeing what you guys think. Thanks!
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09-23-2019, 02:06 PM | #249 |
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09-23-2019, 02:19 PM | #250 |
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Two different cars. One is limited edition vs a car that will be on lots everywhere. One is a compact coupe vs large sedan. DCT vs regular ZF8 automatic transmission. RWD vs AWD. Plus M3 has that grille.
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09-23-2019, 02:28 PM | #251 | |
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09-23-2019, 02:32 PM | #252 |
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Can we talk production numbers for the M2cs?
We know worldwide it will be about 2200... So, what does that translate for the USA market? I was thinking 450-500??? Thoughts 🤔 |
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09-23-2019, 02:32 PM | #253 | |
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First I hope that BMW NA learned some things about their M customers with the F80CS variants. For the price of the vehicle the actual added value perceived by customers was too low. What started out as "wait-list' vehicles (albeit probably not to the degree that M2CS lists sound to be going) are now still sitting on lots and can't be sold. While most agree it's the best iteration of the F80, they just don't agree with it's price point in the market relative to it's competition. Originally with worse lease residuals that the Base/Comp F80's and the very high MSRP's I think they were leasing in the $1400-1500's and higher maybe? In the end BMWNA gave $6,000 or $7,000 "trunk money" on unsold CS's to dealers along with lease residuals to match the base M3. Some dealers went even further and gave the Added Value away to customers as well getting leases in the $800's. The F80 Base to CS was a 50% increase in price. If BMWNA does that to the M2CS it will be $90k starting. Then apply any dealer "market adjustment" to that! Add some CCB's and all the options and you've got a 110k - 120k F87 M2. That's absurd. Second, August 2019 YTD financials show that 2.1% of total sales were 2 series. Not sure how much of that is M2, but even if it's a half of that it's only 2,446 units. For the M2CS, we know 2,200 units are going to be made worldwide. How many of those are going to come to the US? The US got about 300/700 M4 GTS. My point is, this is a drop in the bucket for BMW. What reason do they have to make it a 90k car? Is it even in the realm of what you can get elsewhere for $90k? What can $90k get you in the C8 platform? They aren't going to make any money off of doing that so the only real reason for that would be to get that perception of exclusivity like I believe they tried for with the F80CS which we know (and they now know) didn't work. Having M3/M4CS's still sitting on dealer lots unsold is not a good thing. The 2 series and the M2 are supposed to be BMW's entry models. They should be intended to grab younger buyers that turn into BMW lifelong customers, not gouge the market because of limited production. ...I'm still hoping for mid 70's USD MSRP...(fingers crossed).
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09-23-2019, 03:31 PM | #254 |
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Guys, I have digged out some new info on the M2 CS after discussing the car with a bunch of my contacts over the past few days. The carbon roof, carbon bonnet and front lip seem to be different from the M Performance product range available for the M2 and M2C. They all look different. The rear spoiler won't be a M Performance part. It is only M2 CS, but you can get it via your dealer's parts department.
BMW M has not gone through the carbon parts bin at M Performance, but decided to develop their own parts. Of course, the mirror caps seem to be the same as before. The diffuser might be slightly different as well. I was still stunned when I heard it. I thought those guys at BMW had to cut cost???? Why re-invent "the wheel"? Also the M performance exhaust won't be on the car in Europe due to emission regulations. I hear stories it will have the standard exhaust with different carbon end pipes, but I have not been able to confirm that. MR Last edited by MR.; 09-23-2019 at 03:38 PM.. |
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09-23-2019, 03:48 PM | #255 | |
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09-23-2019, 04:15 PM | #256 |
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I still think this will stay under 80k here in the US. 77k for 6MT with no options.
Maybe 82ish with DCT and something comparable to exec pack. Not including tax |
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09-23-2019, 04:45 PM | #257 | |
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On the other hand the rear diffuser of the car in Brussels was an M Performance part. I looked below the diffuser to check the exhaust and saw a M performance marking in the middle part of the diffuser close to the inwards edge |
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09-23-2019, 04:52 PM | #258 |
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I guess I am the minority. I kind of hope BMW will price the M2 CS high like the M3 CS and M4 GTS. Why? Because people will drop off dealers wait-lists like flies and price will eventually go down. M3/M4 CS could be had $20k off of MSRP.
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09-23-2019, 05:26 PM | #259 | |
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09-23-2019, 05:28 PM | #260 |
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$80 - $85K base is my guess. Hoping the base stays below $90k. Can't wait until price is announced so we can end the speculation.
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09-23-2019, 05:34 PM | #261 | |
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09-23-2019, 05:37 PM | #262 |
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Yep! I should have gone to Brussels to see it and then I could have confirmed more after seeing it with my own eyes.
I also heard people say that it is pretty damn capable on track. More than the Sport Auto numbers might suggest. Time will tell what that means, but it good to hear they have made something more special for collectors to park in their collections. MR |
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09-23-2019, 05:44 PM | #263 | |||||
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09-23-2019, 05:49 PM | #264 |
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