04-27-2020, 11:36 AM | #1 |
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Carbahn vs. Dinan flash tunes? Pros/cons from one to the other?
Guys--
Juuuust starting to research warrantied tunes for my M2C. Not looking to go crazy, just to bump up to M2 CS/M4 territory (i.e. a bit more "oomph", but nothing that will stress the motor unduly). I'm planning on putting in a CSF heat exchanger and M4 air intake guides since I'm pulling the bumper to replace w/ a euro one anyway, and VTT crank bolt capture kit-- that's as far as I'm interested in going with engine mods. The car will be 95% street, with the very occasional SCCA driver's school once in a while (if they ever get rescheduled). NO track days, etc. I'm looking for a "load and forget" flash tune w/ warranty. I'm not interested in getting into the guts of tuning myself, endless tweaking, etc. So, for those in the know-- how would you compare the tunes? They seem to be well-designed and the data seem to be fairly similar. But, there don't seem to be a great number of reviews either way. So, any information? TIA. R. |
04-27-2020, 04:15 PM | #3 |
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im installing noelle tune thursday and u get most power and warranty ....People hate on it on this site but from what i hear its the real deal 520 to wheels
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04-27-2020, 04:42 PM | #4 | |
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I won't get into all of the reasons (if you've followed them, you know most of them), but let's just leave it there. Pretty much interested in either Dinan or Carbahn-- although I'm leaning towards Carbahn if I can find an installer within reasonable distance of me. R. |
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04-27-2020, 05:54 PM | #5 |
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Go with Carbahn.
Here is why: 1. Go listen to the Steve Dinan episode in the podcast on The Smoking Tire. 2. Go listen to the one on the Do It for a Living podcast. 3. Go watch the Drive interview on YouTube with Steve while he was still at Dinan. 4. Call Chris at Carbahn and ask him all of your questions. Especially the warranty questions. If those 4 things alone don't convince you to go with Carbahn over Dinan, then I would be surprised. Not to knock on Dinan the company, as I'm sure they are great, but I rather put my money with the guy who was indisputably integral to its success and his new company (not to mention his deep personal relationships with BMW), than the new PE owners. That's just my opinion. Also, after having driven an M2C 6MT for an extensive period of time with Carbahn's stage 1, all I have to say is holy hell thats worth every penny. I only drove a Dinan one for a little bit of time, and while definitely an improvement, didn't really feel like the Carbahn one (though to be fair didn't have equal seat time). All in all, both will show just how undertired the M2C is from the factory. By the way, the Carbahn tune on manual made driving efficient mode much easier than it used to be on a 6MT, and sport mode is a whole different animal. One thing I will say though, is that Dinan will void your warranty if you mix it with unapproved engine mods. Carbahn will too, unless you disclose it at the time you flash the tune and put it on your warranty paperwork - just talk to Chris at Carbahn about it. Lastly, not affiliated with any company, just did a ton of research.
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Wife's Car: 2020 X4M Competition, Alpine White on Black Alcantara and Biege
Current Car: 2018 F80 M3CS, SMB, DCT, ZEC, MPE Recently Departed: 2020 F87 M2C, LBB, ZEC, 6MT (Euro Delivery Aug. 29, 2019, totaled by an idiot in a Camry who then ran from the scene) Wife's Prior Car: 2018 F80 M3, Yas Marina Blue, DCT, Black 19s, Carbon Structure Anthracite Cloth/Leather Combination, Driving Assistance Package (Euro Delivery Oct. 9, 2017) |
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04-27-2020, 05:58 PM | #6 | |
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Obviously this is your choice and wish you the best no matter what, but just please make sure you've explored them thoroughly. I'd hate to see anyone get screwed on this. https://www.noelleperformance.com/wp...tatement-2.pdf |
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04-27-2020, 06:10 PM | #7 | |
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That's *exactly* the type of analysis I was looking for. My only engine mods will be the CSF heat exchanger (which Carbahn sells and recommends, so I see no issue there) and the VTT crank bolt capture kit (which is purely preventative). I'll reach out to Chris, but I can't imagine that either of these would void their warranty as long as they were installed by a shop familiar with BMW-- to my knowledge, Carbahn does *not* require the heat exchanger and/or CBC kit to be installed by them. I'll also have to see if they have an associated dealer near Colorado-- not exactly interested in driving from Denver to San Jose just for a flash. R. |
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04-27-2020, 06:30 PM | #8 | |
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04-27-2020, 07:31 PM | #9 | ||
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At the end of the day though, I'm just a forum member, so definitely reach out to Chris. His info is at bottom of Carbahn page when you go to the high performance BMW page.
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Wife's Car: 2020 X4M Competition, Alpine White on Black Alcantara and Biege
Current Car: 2018 F80 M3CS, SMB, DCT, ZEC, MPE Recently Departed: 2020 F87 M2C, LBB, ZEC, 6MT (Euro Delivery Aug. 29, 2019, totaled by an idiot in a Camry who then ran from the scene) Wife's Prior Car: 2018 F80 M3, Yas Marina Blue, DCT, Black 19s, Carbon Structure Anthracite Cloth/Leather Combination, Driving Assistance Package (Euro Delivery Oct. 9, 2017) |
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04-27-2020, 08:37 PM | #10 | ||
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04-28-2020, 08:09 PM | #11 |
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I just cancelled my Dinan flash appointment and ordered Carbahn today. Will report back next week on what I think. Spoke with Chris and the power and warranty seems solid. With how they are tuning they don't worry about a crank hub until over 600 wtq.
Advertised 549/564 at the crank. With my AA midpipe should easily make over 500 whp. I'll hit the dyno in a few weeks.
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04-28-2020, 10:29 PM | #12 |
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I wrote Chris an email last night, and he was quite prompt in getting back to me.
Here's his response-- it may help others make the decision. Personally? I'm sold. I have a few hoops to jump through (and the 1200 mile break-in is tough when you're on lockdown and the State has a "no driving more than 10 miles from your home" order, but I'll get there....) Here's his email. my questions are in italics: Thank you for the very in depth email Rod, it helps me do what I cant to meet your "go fast" expectations. Our software may not claim the most power or have the loudest exhaust crackle or maximize E85....However if you are looking for a great power increase and not worry about any check engine lights, maintain ALL of your factory diagnostic safety codes and not lose any warranty coverage then our software is what you have been searching for!! 1. Would any of the three minor modifications listed above [CSF heat exchanger, M3/M4 intake ducts & VTT crank bolt capture kit] your warranty? A. No They will not 2. If the three minor modifications listed above are installed at a local (and very reputable) independent BMW shop here in the Denver area, will that void your warranty? A. No they will not 3. How do I get the flash done in the Denver area? I’ve looked on your website and No Joy for authorized dealers in Colorado, Arizona, New Mexico, Nebraska, Wyoming or Utah. That obviously makes things difficult— I’m not really interested in driving 16 hours to San Jose and 16 hours back and I really don’t want to pull the DME and send it out and back, and I don’t know any tuners here that would do that anyway. I’m much more interested in a “Here— tune this and give it back to me” way of doing things— I’m not quite brave enough to pull the DME, trust FedEx, reinstall, and refresh on my own. Bad Things happen when I get creative with electronics. A. Unfortunately right now there is no "drive in flash / drive out" option for the 2020 M2 Comp.... BMW put fun blockers in the software. So the DME will have to be sent in for bench loading. We would be happy to work with any BMW dealer or European performance shop that you trust with you car in Colorado. We have this process down, DME overnighted today would be back in your car buy Thursday afternoon. We always make sure that the DME is insured and sending overnight limits the ability for the logistics companies to lose it. 4. What is “Exhaust overrun and start-up roar” that you have listed under the Stage 1 Software tab? A. It open the valve during start up "barks to life" also we can add volume or length to the pops in the M1 M2 modes if you would like. 5. Will the software perform safely with 91 octane? That’s pretty much all we can get in Colorado (fun fact— Regular in CO is 85, Midgrade is 87 and Premium is 91. I don’t know why, but that’s how they do it here). A. Yes absolutely or premium here in the bay area is 91 also Let me know how I did on my test and if you have any other questions feel free to ask! Best regards, Chris |
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04-29-2020, 12:37 AM | #13 | |
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Wife's Car: 2020 X4M Competition, Alpine White on Black Alcantara and Biege
Current Car: 2018 F80 M3CS, SMB, DCT, ZEC, MPE Recently Departed: 2020 F87 M2C, LBB, ZEC, 6MT (Euro Delivery Aug. 29, 2019, totaled by an idiot in a Camry who then ran from the scene) Wife's Prior Car: 2018 F80 M3, Yas Marina Blue, DCT, Black 19s, Carbon Structure Anthracite Cloth/Leather Combination, Driving Assistance Package (Euro Delivery Oct. 9, 2017) |
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05-01-2020, 05:49 AM | #14 |
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I apologize in advance if this has been answered elsewhere, but I can't seem to find an answer (I emailed Chris and haven't received a response yet). I've also spoken to a local tuning shop and they told me no.
My question is, after they pull and backdate the DME and bench load the tune, will I be able to OBD flash it back to stock myself? I was told Carbahn no longer does the tablet thing, so is it possible to run the software on a laptop? I don't like the idea of not being able to remove the tune and revert back to stock for servicing. Also, what is the labor like for pulling the DME? If this is the case, I may look into having my DME pulled and backdated, then going with bootmod3 so I can flash it myself. Thank you for any feedback! |
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05-01-2020, 10:01 AM | #15 | |
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Call Chris, more responsive to phone than email (he says he gets hundreds everyday). Labor depends on your shop but locally they will charge you like 2 hours - 1 to take out and 1 to put in.
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Wife's Car: 2020 X4M Competition, Alpine White on Black Alcantara and Biege
Current Car: 2018 F80 M3CS, SMB, DCT, ZEC, MPE Recently Departed: 2020 F87 M2C, LBB, ZEC, 6MT (Euro Delivery Aug. 29, 2019, totaled by an idiot in a Camry who then ran from the scene) Wife's Prior Car: 2018 F80 M3, Yas Marina Blue, DCT, Black 19s, Carbon Structure Anthracite Cloth/Leather Combination, Driving Assistance Package (Euro Delivery Oct. 9, 2017) |
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05-01-2020, 11:07 AM | #16 |
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Makes sense why I have not had an email back
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05-01-2020, 11:37 AM | #17 | |
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05-01-2020, 12:13 PM | #18 | ||
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Wife's Car: 2020 X4M Competition, Alpine White on Black Alcantara and Biege
Current Car: 2018 F80 M3CS, SMB, DCT, ZEC, MPE Recently Departed: 2020 F87 M2C, LBB, ZEC, 6MT (Euro Delivery Aug. 29, 2019, totaled by an idiot in a Camry who then ran from the scene) Wife's Prior Car: 2018 F80 M3, Yas Marina Blue, DCT, Black 19s, Carbon Structure Anthracite Cloth/Leather Combination, Driving Assistance Package (Euro Delivery Oct. 9, 2017) |
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05-01-2020, 08:57 PM | #19 |
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05-01-2020, 09:27 PM | #21 |
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No warranty, so not even a consideration for me. Or for OP either from the looks of it.
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Wife's Car: 2020 X4M Competition, Alpine White on Black Alcantara and Biege
Current Car: 2018 F80 M3CS, SMB, DCT, ZEC, MPE Recently Departed: 2020 F87 M2C, LBB, ZEC, 6MT (Euro Delivery Aug. 29, 2019, totaled by an idiot in a Camry who then ran from the scene) Wife's Prior Car: 2018 F80 M3, Yas Marina Blue, DCT, Black 19s, Carbon Structure Anthracite Cloth/Leather Combination, Driving Assistance Package (Euro Delivery Oct. 9, 2017) |
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05-01-2020, 09:28 PM | #22 |
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Product no, but the warranty transfers to new owner.
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Wife's Car: 2020 X4M Competition, Alpine White on Black Alcantara and Biege
Current Car: 2018 F80 M3CS, SMB, DCT, ZEC, MPE Recently Departed: 2020 F87 M2C, LBB, ZEC, 6MT (Euro Delivery Aug. 29, 2019, totaled by an idiot in a Camry who then ran from the scene) Wife's Prior Car: 2018 F80 M3, Yas Marina Blue, DCT, Black 19s, Carbon Structure Anthracite Cloth/Leather Combination, Driving Assistance Package (Euro Delivery Oct. 9, 2017) |
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