[Moflow]

Originally Posted by flybigjet

I do see the potential for the Executive Package to be offered as a standard feature on the 2021-- it would simplify the parts chain and eliminate some complexity in the build process. They could bump the price up a small bit and probably break even overall.

Just a thought.

R.

Yeah it seems like the vast majority of people order it with the executive package anyway (which makes sense, it's a pretty small percentage of vehicle cost.)

[Poochie]

Originally Posted by Moflow

Yeah it seems like the vast majority of people order it with the executive package anyway (which makes sense, it's a pretty small percentage of vehicle cost.)

Its separated in order to keep the MSRP a hair under $59,999.99, which sounds way better in some people's mind, than a whopping 60k sticker price..

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.liv...99-cents-.html


Reminds me of the "11" Spinal Tap video:

[Poochie]

I take back everything I predicted earlier about BMW making major inclusions, such as Adaptive Suspension, for the M2C final model year, since I just learned that will be for 2021.

BMW is not going offer any such unique features, if it's going to run parallel to a competing vehicle, such as the M2 CS, which already has such options.

So don't expect any major changes for 2021 M2C MY


https://www.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...php?p=25745303

[///AVM]

Originally Posted by Poochie

I take back everything I predicted earlier about BMW making major inclusions, such as Adaptive Suspension, for the M2C final model year, since I just learned that will be for 2021.

BMW is not going offer any such unique features, if it's going to run parallel to a competing vehicle, such as the M2 CS, which already has such options.

So don't expect any major changes for 2021 M2C MY


https://www.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...php?p=25745303

Poochie, I will ask again, do you think packaging some desirable options from the parts bins equates to making 'major changes?'

I think it is pretty clear, and never anticipated BMW to make anything remotely close to major change to the 21' M2C. I did consider BMW making more options available from the parts bins, however, cptobvious gave compelling explanation as to why 'ringing the cash register' has not been an option in the 19' and 20' M2C models . . . and will remain the case for the 21' release.

What does seem reasonable is offerings from the parts bins as standard in the 21' M2C. I gave one example of what I thought to represent reasonable bundling, to include Executive Package, M performance steering and M Performance Exhaust as standard features for a modest new model price increase.

///AVM

[Poochie]

Originally Posted by ///AVM

Poochie, I will ask again, do you think packaging some desirable options from the parts bins equates to making 'major changes?'

I think it is pretty clear, and never anticipated BMW to make anything remotely close to major change to the 21' M2C. I did consider BMW making more options available from the parts bins, however, cptobvious gave compelling explanation as to why 'ringing the cash register' has not been an option in the 19' and 20' M2C models . . . and will remain the case for the 21' release.

What does seem reasonable is offerings from the parts bins as standard in the 21' M2C. I gave one example of what I thought to represent reasonable bundling, to include Executive Package, M performance steering and M Performance Exhaust as standard features for a modest new model price increase.

///AVM

With the new information I'm now privy to, I honestly don't believe there will be any major changes for the 2021 MY.

Maybe a special edition, here and there or some inclusive cosmetic add-on but nothing worthwhile that would make you ultimately regret opting for an earlier model year.

I was working with the assumption that there would be a 2022 M2C model, right after the CS had run it's course, then BMW would of thrown one last hurrah for the generation's sunset.

However, since I've now learn that they're running co-currently, BMW will not have a similar model vie with each other, in terms of features. This is pretty much the end of the road for the F-series M2, as far as evolution goes.

They'll try to keep some sort of hierarchy between models, in terms of features or else what's the point of offering both simultaneously.

Sorry I got your hopes up about anything major coming down the pipeline but if you're seeking more, you're going to have to hold out for the G87 M2 in 2023 or maybe grab an M4.

I'm in the same boat as you, I'm 100% contented with my vehicle but being on this forum and seeing everyone with their new toy, makes me green with envy, which, everyday, almost pushes me to make an irrational financial decision but now I'm going to hold strong for the new G87.

[Hegge]

Originally Posted by Poochie

With the new information I'm now privy to, I honestly don't believe there will be any major changes for the 2021 MY.

Maybe a special edition, here and there or some inclusive cosmetic add-on but nothing worthwhile that would make you ultimately regret opting for an earlier model year.

I was working with the assumption that there would be a 2022 M2C model, right after the CS had run it's course, then BMW would of thrown one last hurrah for the generation's sunset.

However, since I now learn that they're running co-currently, BMW will not have a similar model step on each other's toes, in terms of features. This is pretty much the end of the road for the F-series M2, as far as evolution goes.

They'll try to keep some sort of hierarchy between options and features or else what's the point of offering both simultaneously.

Sorry I got your hopes up about anything major coming down the pipeline but if you're seeking something more, you're going to have to hold out for the G87 M2 in 2023 or maybe grab an M4.

I'm in the same boat as you, I'm 100% contented with my vehicle but being on the forum and seeing everyone with their new toy, makes me green with envy, which, everyday, almost pushes me to me a irrational financial decision but now I'm going to hold strong for the new G87.

Poochie is right. Any updated F87 M2 is the M2 CS. No big changes to M2 Competition. All new G87 M2 is not until 2023.

[mikeyymonster]

Originally Posted by Poochie

With the new information I'm now privy to, I honestly don't believe there will be any major changes for the 2021 MY.

Maybe a special edition, here and there or some inclusive cosmetic add-on but nothing worthwhile that would make you ultimately regret opting for an earlier model year.

I was working with the assumption that there would be a 2022 M2C model, right after the CS had run it's course, then BMW would of thrown one last hurrah for the generation's sunset.

However, since I've now learn that they're running co-currently, BMW will not have a similar model vie with each other, in terms of features. This is pretty much the end of the road for the F-series M2, as far as evolution goes.

They'll try to keep some sort of hierarchy between models, in terms of features or else what's the point of offering both simultaneously.

Sorry I got your hopes up about anything major coming down the pipeline but if you're seeking more, you're going to have to hold out for the G87 M2 in 2023 or maybe grab an M4.

I'm in the same boat as you, I'm 100% contented with my vehicle but being on this forum and seeing everyone with their new toy, makes me green with envy, which, everyday, almost pushes me to make an irrational financial decision but now I'm going to hold strong for the new G87.

Me too, except now we have to deal with the whole mark up BS again like when the f87 first came out.

[Poochie]

Originally Posted by mikeyymonster

Me too, except now we have to deal with the whole mark up BS again like when the f87 first came out.

God, don't remind me..

I remember when the M2 now came out, it was hell to get one, let alone one at MSRP.

In July 2016, I found one at a dealer in NJ with a original sticker of $53,000 but marked up to $65,000, with just a few cosmetic add-ons and they wasn't budging on the price.

It was annoying AF and the messed up thing is it was sold within 3 days.

That's why when folks here make a 60+ page thread bitching about how the M2 CS is too expensive and it won't sell, I just chuckle at how ignorant they are towards the market.

There are more than enough trust-fund babies and mid-life crisis men out there to scoop up every single unit, at above sticker, without hesitation.

US, here on this forum, represent a small microcosm, in comparison to rest of the consumers out there, with money to burn. And I'm not exactly sure why but the M2 has a very loyal following, more so than any other modern BMW.

Just sit back and watch every vehicle sell, like penny lemonade on a hot day.

[xxyion]

I was just told by a dealership that there will not be a 2021 M2 Competition. Only a 2021 M2 CS.

[///AVM]

Originally Posted by xxyion

I was just told by a dealership that there will not be a 2021 M2 Competition. Only a 2021 M2 CS.

Xylon

I am quite surprised to hear that information, as it seems to go against all that has been previously reported and anticipated.

My apologies for casting any doubt upon feedback you received from your SA, but I believe further confirmation is in order.

///AVM

[Poochie]

Originally Posted by xxyion

I was just told by a dealership that there will not be a 2021 M2 Competition. Only a 2021 M2 CS.

Hmm.. That doesn't sound right, someone else needs to verify that claim..

[Thescout13]

Originally Posted by xxyion

I was just told by a dealership that there will not be a 2021 M2 Competition. Only a 2021 M2 CS.

They are wrong. Kills me how much salespeople at dealers don't know shit. They are trying to rush you into a car now instead of having you wait.

[newcar55]

For what it's worth, the CA I was talking to said that there aren't any changes for 2021. However take it with a grain of salt because he might just be trying to speed up the sale.

[TheRealOrosie]

Originally Posted by Poochie

Its separated in order to keep the MSRP a hair under $59,999.99, which sounds way better in some people's mind, than a whopping 60k sticker price..

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.liv...99-cents-.html


Reminds me of the "11" Spinal Tap video:

In keeping with the "This is Spinal Tap" theme....there is about as much chance at more options for '21 as there is successfully "dusting for vomit".

[AlpsRider]

Originally Posted by newcar55

For what it's worth, the CA I was talking to said that there aren't any changes for 2021. However take it with a grain of salt because he might just be trying to speed up the sale.

I think it is safe to say the salespeople have even less information than what you can find on this forum.

[xxyion]

Originally Posted by Thescout13

They are wrong. Kills me how much salespeople at dealers don't know shit. They are trying to rush you into a car now instead of having you wait.

Yeah thats why i wanted to confirm, since i trust these forums more than the salespeople. Its even possible they wont knonw officially because BMW doesnt want their dealerships telling people just to wait.

[giamo64]

Dealers claim to know in advance but they actually don't. My decades of experience tell me so.

[richard in NC]

Originally Posted by cptobvious

TLDR: BMW would if they could, but they can't so they don't.

Apologies in advance for the novel length post, but it sounds like you're asking a genuine question, so am trying to provide a genuine answer. If you're really seriously asking why Porsche do it but BMW does not, I have a real answer based on having done quite a bit of work in assembly plants and manufacturers.

I do quite a bit helping Fortune 500 companies set up operations, including assembly plants for auto manufacturers. On this forum, I'm a clown. But in my real life job, I spend a lot of time advising senior execs at big companies.

Porsche can offer 8,000 options because they use a technique called "Lean." Lean manufacturing enables Porsche to flexibly design their assembly plants so that they can easily accommodate "customized" builds. For example, last year, Porsche pointed out that at most they'd only built 2 identical 911's worldwide. What that means is that due to their lean manufacturing prowess, they were able to build ~10k custom cars.

No other auto manufacturer has this capability. As a result, Porsche have the highest margins of any auto manufacturer. Letting people custom design their cars allows Porsche to perfectly "price discriminate" and charge consumers at precisely their maximum willingness to pay.

Again, NO OTHER AUTO MANUFACTURER has this capability. Toyota are arguably even better at lean than Porsche (the technique originated with Toyota) but they have focused their lean capabilities 100% on reliability and quality, as opposed to customization and price discrimination, as Porsche have.

The reason BMW does not give us 8,000 options to customize our cars is not that they don't want to, or that they don't recognize the value in doing so, or that they don't know that we'd be willing to pay out the nose for the privilege... it's that BMW and all the other manufacturers not called Toyota and Porsche still use a version of mass manufacturing. Because BMW has not mastered lean techniques, their plants, their people, their processes are not set up to allow any REAL customization.

There was a huge long thread many moons ago decrying the fact that if you wanted an individual color on the M2C, it would cost you $24k. The reason it costs so much is not that BMW was gouging you for the privilege. It was that the Leipzig plant is not set up to do customization, and it probably costs BMW greatly in excess of $24k to provide individual paint - I think they only did it for Mr. Fux and maybe one or two other VIPs worldwide.

So, with all that said, the Leipzig plant is set up in a very inflexible way, the workers are trained and incentivized with a mass manufacturing culture and mindset, and the processes are turgid. As a result, the 2021 model year will most likely end up with EXACTLY the same features as the 2020 model...

I take that back: they did upgrade the rear lights between the 2019 and 2020 models. Check out the 15 threads on that REVOLUTIONARY change. Whoever can spot the difference between the rear lights on the 2019 versus 2020 models deserves a cookie! But, when you use mass manufacturing techniques like BMW does, that's about all you can profitably do between model years - in other words, next to nil.

Just now getting into this discussion but having seen the Spartanburg plant and knowing a bit of an insider view, I disagree with some of the above. BMW does use Lean manufacturing but maybe in a different way. They use an extremely efficient just-in-time manufacturing process and praised their lean initiatives regarding that in a meeting I attended. They are fully capable of and DO have each car down the line being a unique build (within a set of choices).

Regarding individual paints, I recall they run multiple lines and parallel batches. That way the paint, spray cartridges, etc don't have to be switched as often. A truly unique individual color requires extra time and effort to switch things out and production delays, hence the additional cost. Another factor is dealers being left with an un-sellable car if the buyer backs out or returns a leased car in 6 months. Who wants a purple car with green interior? Maybe only the one person in the world who ordered it. PS: I heard a talk from THE guy at BMW NA that DID make that happen for a select few individuals.

Other items such as interiors call on suppliers to deal with the challenges. To the plant's perspective, the supplier must deliver seats, etc in exact manufacturing order, given to the supplier each day. Throwing a unique order in, they'd still have to meet that. But it "should" be possible for example to order the X7 blue Nappa leather for an X3 since one supplier does both.

Regarding the M2 Competition, it was kept simple with few choices to reduce cost. Otherwise you'd end up with a $90k version just like you can with a Cayman.

I doubt they'd change much or add more options in the last year. Although I bet you will see one new final year color or addition.

[richard in NC]

Speaking of THE guy regarding Individual requests, watch this video. The whole 1 hour session is great if into classic BMWs but skip to 1:12:45 for a short story on individual requests. Also skip to 1:04:00 for another story re an 850 CSi.

https://youtu.be/Hh-s1KWZBA4

[AlpsRider]

I don't know the technical terms for the types of manufacturing techniques but I've been to the Leipzig plant tour. They have lots of different cars on the line. These cars come off the line in no particular order.

BMW 1 Series 5-door
BMW 2 Series Coupé
BMW 2 Series Cabrio
BMW M2 Competition
BMW 2 Series Active Tourer
BMW i3 and i3s
BMW i8 Coupé and i8 Roadster

I asked the tour leader why they didn't group them together and he said that it just doesn't matter.

[JCZ5]

@Poochie and ///AVM, I know both of you have been speculating on MY21 changes and I have actually be reading intently on your thoughts.

However, at this point I have decided to actively search for a MY20, and maybe get close to a 11% discount. New features would be great, but after some soul searching, the current M2C package is pretty great and I rather save a few grand than the potential of adaptive suspension. However, it would have been great if BMW just added blind spot monitoring. I have gotten way too use to this great feature.

[///AVM]

Originally Posted by JCZ5

@Poochie and ///AVM, I know both of you have been speculating on MY21 changes and I have actually be reading intently on your thoughts.

However, at this point I have decided to actively search for a MY20, and maybe get close to a 11% discount. New features would be great, but after some soul searching, the current M2C package is pretty great and I rather save a few grand than the potential of adaptive suspension. However, it would have been great if BMW just added blind spot monitoring. I have gotten way too use to this great feature.

JC

I am quite certain your decision to go with a 20' M2C will be very fulfilling regardless of the 21' release.

My impression from comments of others is that the 21' will be announced in March - a couple short weeks away - so it might be worthwhile to hold-out just a little while longer. Your anticipated discount would likely become a few percentage points even better.

I do not expect anything dramatic to change with 21' model release. I do think BMW is going to bundle a few desirable options AND I suspect BMW is going to offer 'something' many will find quite enticing.

You will enjoy whatever model year M2C you decide upon. That I am certain.

///AVM