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      05-26-2020, 09:28 PM   #1
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Considering an M2C... have a few questions

Hi everyone,

I'm strongly considering a 2020 M2C. Local dealer has the exact specs I want and is willing to deal.

However, I'm a bit stumped at the value proposition and need some guidance (or rather, a push from you all) to get the BMW.

Along with the BMW, I'm also considering a Bullitt. Bullitt has more power, sounds better, has a better stereo, is roomier, but: it doesn't have the tech/features that BMW has, it doesn't drive as tight, and the quality is questionable.

M2C's seats are also amazing with seemingly infinite ways to adjust them.

Here is my issue: BMW will end up costing me ~$24K more over 5 years (also note that Bullitt can be had for 0% over 5 years whereas M2C's interest rates are 2.99%). I'm in a financial position to not worry about it but $24K is a lot of money that could be used for many other things.

So here is my question: what made you decide on your M2C? What else were you considering? Do you have any regrets?
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      05-26-2020, 09:37 PM   #2
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Honestly, a bullit and an M2C are vastly different cars and shouldn't even be in the same conversation/topic (my own personal opinion). Coming from someone who had a Camaro SS (6th gen) there is a reason I got rid of it and jumped back to BMW. If there was any American car that I would consider MAYBE owning it would be a GT350, and even then they have terrible reliability issues (know 2 people personally who have been through multiple engines).

If you are a sound guy, get the mustang. If you are a handling and overall package guy, get the BMW.

Go test drive both, and if after you don't get the M2C, you were always a mustang guy who was dipping his toes in a BMW.

Also, last I read on the BMW website, it's not 2.99% it's 0.9%. But that could just be my region.

Have never met another M2C owner (except for maybe 1-3 guys on this board who went to a lotus), that has regretted getting an M2C or wish they would have gotten an American muscle type car. Now there is one guy on here, 5.0 monster or some shit, who is an OG M2 owner and will be around shortly to tell you how we are all wrong and American cars are the best because American sound bald eagles Disney world hell yeah.
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      05-26-2020, 09:40 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Emm2Cee View Post
Hi everyone,

I'm strongly considering a 2020 M2C. Local dealer has the exact specs I want and is willing to deal.

However, I'm a bit stumped at the value proposition and need some guidance (or rather, a push from you all) to get the BMW.

Along with the BMW, I'm also considering a Bullitt. Bullitt has more power, sounds better, has a better stereo, is roomier, but: it doesn't have the tech/features that BMW has, it doesn't drive as tight, and the quality is questionable.

M2C's seats are also amazing with seemingly infinite ways to adjust them.

Here is my issue: BMW will end up costing me ~$24K more over 5 years (also note that Bullitt can be had for 0% over 5 years whereas M2C's interest rates are 2.99%). I'm in a financial position to not worry about it but $24K is a lot of money that could be used for many other things.

So here is my question: what made you decide on your M2C? What else were you considering? Do you have any regrets?
Bullitt is a Mustang right?

Buddy of mine had an OG M2. Crashed it, he hydroplaned during some pretty inclimate weather. He replaced it with a Mustang. He lasted 6 months in the Mustang before selling it and putting a deposit down for a M2C.

Ultimately you get what you pay for. Of course asking on a BMW forum people will say get the BMW. If you go over to Mustang-clubwhatever.com they'll tell you to get the Mustang - it all depends on what you want.

Mustang sounds better - but the M2 is a better all around car. It's the last of the "good BMW's" in that it hearkens back to the e46 M3. It's still analog enough in a digital world to be able to focus on the driving experience.

I don't know if/when BMW will release another well priced fun car, if ever. G series m3 will be expensive, who knows what the G series M2 will look like.
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      05-26-2020, 09:49 PM   #4
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I really like the Bullit.

However, at least in Australia the Mustangs always seem to develop a problem in road tests. Even the NSW police tested it and rejected it as it would always overheat in their track testing.

Maybe if you are in a cold climate it could be an option?

I'd go the M2 though. It's a nicer size, nicer interior, more classy and you sort of wear it when you drive it whereas you feel more like you are negotiating the Mustang down the road still in a good way but not the same feeling.
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      05-26-2020, 09:54 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Emm2Cee View Post
Hi everyone,

I'm strongly considering a 2020 M2C. Local dealer has the exact specs I want and is willing to deal.

However, I'm a bit stumped at the value proposition and need some guidance (or rather, a push from you all) to get the BMW.

Along with the BMW, I'm also considering a Bullitt. Bullitt has more power, sounds better, has a better stereo, is roomier, but: it doesn't have the tech/features that BMW has, it doesn't drive as tight, and the quality is questionable.

M2C's seats are also amazing with seemingly infinite ways to adjust them.

Here is my issue: BMW will end up costing me ~$24K more over 5 years (also note that Bullitt can be had for 0% over 5 years whereas M2C's interest rates are 2.99%). I'm in a financial position to not worry about it but $24K is a lot of money that could be used for many other things.

So here is my question: what made you decide on your M2C? What else were you considering? Do you have any regrets?
What's a Bullitt?
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      05-26-2020, 10:01 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Thescout13 View Post
Honestly, a bullit and an M2C are vastly different cars and shouldn't even be in the same conversation/topic (my own personal opinion). Coming from someone who had a Camaro SS (6th gen) there is a reason I got rid of it and jumped back to BMW. If there was any American car that I would consider MAYBE owning it would be a GT350, and even then they have terrible reliability issues (know 2 people personally who have been through multiple engines).

If you are a sound guy, get the mustang. If you are a handling and overall package guy, get the BMW.

Go test drive both, and if after you don't get the M2C, you were always a mustang guy who was dipping his toes in a BMW.

Also, last I read on the BMW website, it's not 2.99% it's 0.9%. But that could just be my region.

Have never met another M2C owner (except for maybe 1-3 guys on this board who went to a lotus), that has regretted getting an M2C or wish they would have gotten an American muscle type car. Now there is one guy on here, 5.0 monster or some shit, who is an OG M2 owner and will be around shortly to tell you how we are all wrong and American cars are the best because American sound bald eagles Disney world hell yeah.
I like what you said. I guess I need to find out if I'm a Mustang guy dipping my toes in a BMW or I'm a BMW guy.

2.99% are the rates here in Alberta, Canada.

Bullitt = Ford Mustang special edition with a tuned engine that sounds facken amazing.

Bullitt and M2C are actually much closer than they appear. They have similar performance but they go about it differently.
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      05-26-2020, 10:12 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Emm2Cee View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thescout13 View Post
Honestly, a bullit and an M2C are vastly different cars and shouldn't even be in the same conversation/topic (my own personal opinion). Coming from someone who had a Camaro SS (6th gen) there is a reason I got rid of it and jumped back to BMW. If there was any American car that I would consider MAYBE owning it would be a GT350, and even then they have terrible reliability issues (know 2 people personally who have been through multiple engines).

If you are a sound guy, get the mustang. If you are a handling and overall package guy, get the BMW.

Go test drive both, and if after you don't get the M2C, you were always a mustang guy who was dipping his toes in a BMW.

Also, last I read on the BMW website, it's not 2.99% it's 0.9%. But that could just be my region.

Have never met another M2C owner (except for maybe 1-3 guys on this board who went to a lotus), that has regretted getting an M2C or wish they would have gotten an American muscle type car. Now there is one guy on here, 5.0 monster or some shit, who is an OG M2 owner and will be around shortly to tell you how we are all wrong and American cars are the best because American sound bald eagles Disney world hell yeah.
I like what you said. I guess I need to find out if I'm a Mustang guy dipping my toes in a BMW or I'm a BMW guy.

2.99% are the rates here in Alberta, Canada.

Bullitt = Ford Mustang special edition with a tuned engine that sounds facken amazing.

Bullitt and M2C are actually much closer than they appear. They have similar performance but they go about it differently.
Good call on the rate in Canada, didn't realize you were in Canada and as a typical American assumed your were here lol.

I think a good test drive will really help you figure it out. There really is no wrong answer, just what you feel fits you better.
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      05-26-2020, 10:19 PM   #8
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Bullitt Mustang is just a GT with some trim, wouldn't consider it at all.

The GT350 is properly special, incredible sound, riot to drive. It feels and drives like a big car. It will undoubtedly put a smile on your face though. I only have a few hours left seat time in one but I enjoyed every second.

The M2C is a much more 'all round' machine in terms of practicality and engineering, but not as visceral. In my experience BMW/Porsche attract the same subset of enthusiasts, Mustangs a different group really. You should just buy what makes you happy, GT350 and M2C both great cars.
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      05-26-2020, 10:52 PM   #9
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I very much agree with most everything above, and especially Montaver's last line. Even if one is more expensive than the other, neither is a bargain. For many of us, it was about the size of the car. The M2C isn't even that small. It's larger than every car I had from 1991 until 2013, but compared to the cars I had before 1991 and between 2013 and September of 18, it isn't TOO big. I've driven the current gen Mustang from the GT through the GT350. The PP2 GT and the GT350 were utterly brilliant, but felt big. Also, equal out the tires (add Sport Cup 2's to the M2C), and the GT350's minor performance gains drop off, to at least some extent. One note: When I drove the 350, it was clear when I started and drizzling when I finished with it. I would not have been OK driving the 350 on SC2's most of the year in Portland. They really are crap tires in the wet. Careful.

But none of that matters. If you drive the Mustang, are OK with the interior and the size, and walk away from the test drive thinking "that's my car", then that's your car.
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      05-27-2020, 12:13 AM   #10
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Had a 19' PP1 6MT, traded it on a M2C after 3 months. I usually keep my cars 7 plus years of that tells you anything.

Incredible sounding coyote Is really the only thing I miss. I wanted a m2 before I bought the stang, but figured I could get a fun car for a lot cheaper and be happy. Boy was I wrong, it was loaded had all the options digital dash every tech option they had out that year. It felt like a mustang is the best way I can describe it, every 17 year old in Houston had one, didn't feel "special". Felt heavy, cheap, and the on going list of ticking coyotes convinced me to get out of the car before I lost even more money. Luckily I bought it used with 3500 on it so I broke even.

I've had my m2c a year now and a couple track days later I still love it.
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      05-27-2020, 04:33 AM   #11
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I have owned a minimum of 6 Mustangs ranging from 1988 thru 2014 all in various stages of tune/mod. One was a 2003 SVT Cobra and for me personally the BMW M2 Competition is the Mustang I was always looking for. The M2C is everything I wanted the Mustang to be, but the Mustang failed at.
If you are looking for a car that sounds great and can do burnouts, then buy the Mustang. If you are looking for a solid, all around car that seems to speak to your soul every time you get behind the wheel...Then the BMW is for you.
In my eyes they are not even in the same league and I honestly could never even think of owning another Mustang after having owned the M2C.

Side notes:
- The Mustang and M2C are actually very close in interior size.
- The test drive is a lie, you cannot experience what the M2C is on a test drive.
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      05-27-2020, 06:21 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Emm2Cee View Post
Hi everyone,

I'm strongly considering a 2020 M2C. Local dealer has the exact specs I want and is willing to deal.

However, I'm a bit stumped at the value proposition and need some guidance (or rather, a push from you all) to get the BMW.

Along with the BMW, I'm also considering a Bullitt. Bullitt has more power, sounds better, has a better stereo, is roomier, but: it doesn't have the tech/features that BMW has, it doesn't drive as tight, and the quality is questionable.

M2C's seats are also amazing with seemingly infinite ways to adjust them.

Here is my issue: BMW will end up costing me ~$24K more over 5 years (also note that Bullitt can be had for 0% over 5 years whereas M2C's interest rates are 2.99%). I'm in a financial position to not worry about it but $24K is a lot of money that could be used for many other things.

So here is my question: what made you decide on your M2C? What else were you considering? Do you have any regrets?
I seriously considered the Bullitt before pulling the trigger on the M2C.
I love normal aspiration, low end torque and manual and I think the Bulliitt looks good (classy and mean).
So I went and test drove one (a pre-owned one at bmw dealer funny enough)
here's what I liked
the sound, the look
here's what I didn't like:
it actually doesn't feel that torquey at low rpms
the size
the shift action and quality
the level of refinement
the handling quality
it just overall felt sloppy

I just knew it wasn't for me, and funny enough I didn't get that feeling when several years ago I test drove a c7. I ended up buying a c7 and the sloppy feeling thing crept in after I had a few days and so I sold it and got another porsche cayman s.

domestics don't have the level of precision and refinement that german cars do. for me that matters.

the m2c is a very fun car (and I haven't even passed break in yet), about the only thing the bullitt would have over it would be sound.
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      05-27-2020, 09:06 AM   #13
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I didn't even know what a bullitt is....

Anyway, are they giving it away for free? But generally, the market sets the prices and the value you see. There must be a reason for the 24k delta, there always is.

I didnt compare my M2C to anything. That's all I wanted.
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      05-27-2020, 09:50 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Emm2Cee View Post
Along with the BMW, I'm also considering a Bullitt. Bullitt has more power, sounds better, has a better stereo, is roomier, but: it doesn't have the tech/features that BMW has, it doesn't drive as tight, and the quality is questionable.
Dude, I'm going to give you the only answer you need.

Drive both cars and pick the one you like best. Forget the money, if you're looking at cars in this price-point you have it to spare, don't act like you don't.

They are vastly different cars, and one of them will speak to you.
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      05-27-2020, 09:53 AM   #15
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I would expect the GT350 to be closer to the M2C not the Bullit. With that being said, there is a guy on the M3 forum that bought the GT350 to track and it was the most unreliable car he had ever car and the FORD experience ruined it for him... as far as the Bullit it's not apples to apples.
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      05-27-2020, 10:03 AM   #16
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Bullitt is just a GT with some paint, wheels, and trim. Nothing special. The GT350, on the other hand, is an entirely different animal. If you're getting one of those though, it NEEDS to be Gen 2 Voodoo, so 2019+. Also, the S550 are HUGE cars, sitting in the seat looking over that loooooong hood, it feels like you're literally driving a boat. The M2C on the other hand is very small, but still wide. They are completely different cars. Once again, everyone has their bias. Best bet is to drive both, you'll make your mind up real fast.

Some other things to think about: build quality, interior quality and layout, usability, tune-ability, unique-ness.
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      05-27-2020, 10:20 AM   #17
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I guess im the only one who feel the interior quality from both cars is the same...it is not ņike the m2c interior is the shit lol
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      05-27-2020, 10:29 AM   #18
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Quote:
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I guess im the only one who feel the interior quality from both cars is the same...it is not ñike the m2c interior is the shit lol
I guess you are. No one is saying that the M2 interior is "the shit", just that Ford styling hasn't left the early 2000s and the amount of cheap plastics and terrible quality is very apparent when compared to the M2, which, as it goes, is a couple steps above the mustang interior. But yes, it's no S class interior or Audi A8 interior.
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      05-27-2020, 10:34 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Emm2Cee View Post
I like what you said. I guess I need to find out if I'm a Mustang guy dipping my toes in a BMW or I'm a BMW guy.

2.99% are the rates here in Alberta, Canada.

Bullitt = Ford Mustang special edition with a tuned engine that sounds facken amazing.

Bullitt and M2C are actually much closer than they appear. They have similar performance but they go about it differently.
BMW Canada does have a 0.99% rate going as part of their loyalty incentive program. If you have a BMW (2012 or newer) in the same household (or maybe family member with same last name??) it applies. Or a $2500 cash discount.
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      05-27-2020, 10:59 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Emm2Cee View Post
Hi everyone,

I'm strongly considering a 2020 M2C. Local dealer has the exact specs I want and is willing to deal.

However, I'm a bit stumped at the value proposition and need some guidance (or rather, a push from you all) to get the BMW.

Along with the BMW, I'm also considering a Bullitt. Bullitt has more power, sounds better, has a better stereo, is roomier, but: it doesn't have the tech/features that BMW has, it doesn't drive as tight, and the quality is questionable.

M2C's seats are also amazing with seemingly infinite ways to adjust them.

Here is my issue: BMW will end up costing me ~$24K more over 5 years (also note that Bullitt can be had for 0% over 5 years whereas M2C's interest rates are 2.99%). I'm in a financial position to not worry about it but $24K is a lot of money that could be used for many other things.

So here is my question: what made you decide on your M2C? What else were you considering? Do you have any regrets?

I'm going to come at this from a different angle than other people who have already answered.

You mentioned the APR and how much more money you will be paying. Regardless or not if you can afford it, that tells me that money and overall cost is still something you care about.

I have two question. Will this be a daily driver, and how often do you keep cars forever?

The reason i ask is because BMW has what they call a balloon payment. Now normally this is not recommended at all and only servers to give BMW more money in the long run. Also most of the time people end up upside down.

However, with an M car, and especially one that is regarded as the best modern M car, the balloon payment actually (still a gamble) isnt a terrible idea. If you are someone who only keeps cars a few years, this can be a great way to avoid paying as much.

A few key things, you need to know how much of a balloon payment will be left after 5 years, and a rough estimate of what the car sells for in 5 years based on how much you drive the vehicle. For me, i went with this option, the car balloon payment after 5 years will be 18k. Based on estimates of similar M cars with 60k miles, this car MIGHT sell for between 20k-30k. Since i do not plan on keeping this car forever, at the end of my 5 year payment plan, i will most likley sell the car, and come away with between 2k-12k which i can then use as a down payment on another car. This allows me to "save" between 20k-30k on the car. Thats about 1/2 the MSRP cost of the car. Now yes...its a gamble. Who knows whats going to happen in 5 years. However i'm confident that in 5 years i will be able to sell my car for more than what i owe on it. If i decide i want to keep it, i'm in a place in my life where i'll just pay the rest of the 18k and avoid paying anymore interest. Which means i'll save money overall.

Now i dont know if Ford has a similar payment plan...pretty sure they dont as i've owned 3 in my life, but this could maybe swing your decision at least monetarily in favor of BMW. Normally i would never do this or recommend this especially if you were buying a base model BMW. However M cars tend to hold their value much better and this was also based on the fact that every single reviewer called this the best M car since the E46.


Personally for me though, i'd choose the BMW (obviously). But thats largely due to the fact that i've owned 3 fords and they all gave me issues whether it was Ford service or the car itself all within the first year. My first 4 months with the BMW has been nothing but a dream in both the service department and the car itself.
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      05-27-2020, 11:18 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xxyion View Post
The reason i ask is because BMW has what they call a balloon payment. Now normally this is not recommended at all and only servers to give BMW more money in the long run. Also most of the time people end up upside down.

However, with an M car, and especially one that is regarded as the best modern M car, the balloon payment actually (still a gamble) isnt a terrible idea. If you are someone who only keeps cars a few years, this can be a great way to avoid paying as much.

A few key things, you need to know how much of a balloon payment will be left after 5 years, and a rough estimate of what the car sells for in 5 years based on how much you drive the vehicle. For me, i went with this option, the car balloon payment after 5 years will be 18k. Based on estimates of similar M cars with 60k miles, this car MIGHT sell for between 20k-30k. Since i do not plan on keeping this car forever, at the end of my 5 year payment plan, i will most likley sell the car, and come away with between 2k-12k which i can then use as a down payment on another car. This allows me to "save" between 20k-30k on the car. Thats about 1/2 the MSRP cost of the car. Now yes...its a gamble. Who knows whats going to happen in 5 years. However i'm confident that in 5 years i will be able to sell my car for more than what i owe on it. If i decide i want to keep it, i'm in a place in my life where i'll just pay the rest of the 18k and avoid paying anymore interest. Which means i'll save money overall.
Is this a new lease/finance hybrid of some kind, where they let you buy/finance a portion over 4-5 years to manage to a payment amount, and then at the end you have to pay the balloon payment? Or is there an option to return the car to BMW?

I got financing through BMW, and recall the sales guy proposed something like this to me as an option, and the numbers seemed so ridiculous that I didn't even bother to understand it fully (I was just looking for traditional financing). Curious to know how this works.
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      05-27-2020, 12:34 PM   #22
xxyion
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigKutta View Post
Is this a new lease/finance hybrid of some kind, where they let you buy/finance a portion over 4-5 years to manage to a payment amount, and then at the end you have to pay the balloon payment? Or is there an option to return the car to BMW?

I got financing through BMW, and recall the sales guy proposed something like this to me as an option, and the numbers seemed so ridiculous that I didn't even bother to understand it fully (I was just looking for traditional financing). Curious to know how this works.
a balloon payment is not a combination of the two. Its basically a way to reduce monthly payments. If you decide to keep the car forever, you actually end up paying more in the end, but its a way to make the car affordable for people who lets say dont really have the income to support this sort of financial decision.

However for people like us who can afford to just buy this car, this is a good way to take advantage of the system especially if there are no plans to keep the car longer than a few years.

While you cant exactly return the car like you can with a lease. You can always trade the car in to a dealership and then have the dealership take care of the paperwork as normal. Or you can sell it private party and take care of the payments that way.

Thats my plan. At the end of 5 years i'm going to pay off the remaining 18k. If i decide to keep it then great, i didnt have to pay any interest on 18k worth of the car. However if i decide i dont want to keep it, i can probably sell the car for more than my payoff was and therefor effectively reduce my cost of ownership.

Again i only ever recommend this plan if you dont plan on keeping the car long term and only on a car that will most likley hold its value. Most of the time people do this balloon payment with a really badly depreciating car like a 230i and end up spending way more money in the end. They cant even sell the car at he end of5 years without losing money because the car isnt worth the ending balloon payment. However the M2 should be very desirable once we are a few years into the G platform. Especially one in aMT which is what i have.
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