[ilovewagons]

Oh dear, I think maybe we all need to calm down a bit. An M2 with an s55, even detuned to 400hp will be a special edition. A stock M2 is pretty much down the line with an M4. With 400hp, it will destroy a CP M4 and probably be closer to an M4 GTS. There is no way this vehicle will be produced in significant numbers. It won't cost the same as an M2 and BMW will have to find plant capacity (what is currently determining M2 numbers) to build the thing. And then there's the marketing problem of letting a 'lesser' car obliterate a 'better' car that has already been received lukewarmly.

What seems to be suggested here, is that M2 production is about to end with a special edition. There will probably be 1-2 more years of production then the CS/L/GTS and that's it. Think about it, if they were going to put this new engine in a chassis for long term serial production, would they pick one that's about to reach the end of its lifecycle? Would it be more likely that we'd have seen spyshots of an F2x replacement first?

The G series replacements for the 5 and 3 series are already getting about and personally I think that BMW are going to abandon their small RWD coupe in favour of a more electric friendly platform and that this is the high water mark for traditional RWD BMW coupes.

Finally, and this is important to me, it is my personal mission to end the S55 engine. I hate that thing like Trump hates illegal immigrants. It is all kinds of wrong for an M-car engine, starting with the awful noise and its lack of engagement as an engine. There's nothing to explore, just power served up like cafeteria sloppy joes. I don't care if it makes 1000hp. I don't want one, and even if my car wasn't on a ship headed to me right now () I wouldn't change.

[yousefnjr]

^^

[jb001]

There's no way base M2 gets S55 engine. And there's no way we re getting one for the same price either. Base M2 with S55? Keep on dreaming. Limited edition cs, csl, etc...perhaps. Maybe what we see is competition package, including exhaust front to back? B58 engine...
Nevertheless, if we do get base M2 with S55, buying my early M235i was the right choice. I'm selling mine get some good value. I won't order an M2 before i know what is what...

[Dante]

What many of the S55 doubters not take into acount is that the M3/M4 will get a power bump. Probably with 4 Series LCI or market start of F90 M5.
So there will be headroom for a standard M2 with 400hp S55.

[///M-pressed]

Originally Posted by bradleyland

Hoooold the phone. BMW haven't even announced anything. You're saying something pretty harsh on nothing but rumor and speculation, and as of right now, that rumor is that the model will be an M2 CS, which you can bet is not going to sell for anywhere close to the MSRP of the base M2.

How about everybody wait for the official announcement, or at least some more solid rumors about what exactly we're looking at here before everyone jumps off a cliff over current model M2 values.

Glad to see someone can think rationally.

[PackPride85]

Originally Posted by Dante

What many of the S55 doubters not take into acount is that the M3/M4 will get a power bump. Probably with 4 Series LCI or market start of F90 M5.
So there will be headroom for a standard M2 with 400hp S55.

Then why would they have even bothered with the N55 in the first place? Knowing their own plans for the next decade, they could have easily dropped the S55 into the base M2 from the beginning and detuned to 370hp.

The M engineers even admitted it was a cost AND marketing decision to not step on the M3/M4 toes too much. Putting an S55 in the base M2 would go against both of those ideas.

[ABPReader]

Some months ago, I remember that M2 fanboys were happy to say that the M235i is an obsolete car. At least, it became obsolete after 2 years...

No joke, I hope that BMW is not as stupid to offer a M2 with a different engine so quickly.

[termigni]

Sounds like inline 4.

[Nine Lives]

Originally Posted by F87LUV

It's funny because everyone that stops me about my car is like OMFG, you love it right?!?! My reaction is "i like it" and they're surprised. It's a quick little car but it's not stupid fast. The M3 i test drove felt significantly faster. I will really regret getting this car over the 911 if this all comes to light next year.

So true

[oolas3]

Originally Posted by Dante

What many of the S55 doubters not take into acount is that the M3/M4 will get a power bump. Probably with 4 Series LCI or market start of F90 M5.
So there will be headroom for a standard M2 with 400hp S55.

+1. Everybody moves up one notch in both power and price leaving room for a 400hp M2.

[auf Deutsch]

Originally Posted by ASAP

Man people are slow on this site... this engine IS NOT going in the regular M2... this would be a death wish on the part of BMW and the resale of the current N55 M2... also how would they price this car? Same as an M3? OK

This is for a specific variant called the CS which I am almost sure will cost 90 to 100K...

Bingo....also, those saying it will impede M4 sales or overlap its price, look at the M4 GTS vs M6 prices as a cross-reference...the GTS (limited like the M2 CS will be) costs $16k more than the M6, and that's before ADM. This CS(L) will be very expensive and even more limited than the M2. Those dealers getting 1 or 2 allocations per year on the M2 won't even sniff the CS. The big dealers in SoCal and SoFla are going to jack the shit out of the price. ASAP is sure it will be 90-100K. I predict a dealer markup in those regions of 20-30k just like the GT350 R. The clients in the market for this car could end up paying $120k+. I think the 2 year Civic M2 production run will enable the car to hold a lot of its value. Those current owners or those in waiting should hold onto the car.

What would be really funny/tragic....the Clubsport doesn't even make it to North America.

[Karmic Man]

MY2018 Audi RS3 400hp
MY2018 AMG A45 400hp
Golf R4XX with 400hp+ a possibility
Ford Focus RS500 with 400hp a possibility

How will BMW react? It's always good to lock in customers to purchase before competitors start releasing their cars otherwise there is a potential to lose market share.

Its is cheaper and more reliable to detune the S55 than beefing up the N55 for > 400hp because they have to do R&D to engineer the N55 for greater power without sacrificing response and reliability. The S55 has been proven to be very reliable even in a more aggressive tune (M3/M4).

Most likely when BMW engineered the M2 a few years back, they didn't expect the ferocity of power war instigated from AMG and Audi with their lower range models. Now that the situation has changed and BMW has to respond to maintain market share in that sports car segment.

[ABPReader]

Originally Posted by Karmic Man

MY2018 Audi RS3 400hp
MY2018 AMG A45 400hp
Golf R4XX with 400hp+ a possibility
Ford Focus RS500 with 400hp a possibility

How will BMW react?

Hopefully not by going on the AWD way

[Dante]

Originally Posted by PackPride85

Then why would they have even bothered with the N55 in the first place? Knowing their own plans for the next decade, they could have easily dropped the S55 into the base M2 from the beginning and detuned to 370hp.

Because the competition (Audi/Mercedes) went ahead HP wise. RS3 e.g. is now 400HP. Time to keep up.
Also, the N55 is rumored not beeing able to keep up with future emission levels.

Originally Posted by PackPride85

The M engineers even admitted it was a cost AND marketing decision to not step on the M3/M4 toes too much. Putting an S55 in the base M2 would go against both of those ideas.

Not if they bump the the M3/M4 to 460 - 480HP.

[PackPride85]

Originally Posted by Dante

Because the competition (Audi/Mercedes) went ahead HP wise. RS3 e.g. is now 400HP. Time to keep up.
Also, the N55 is rumored not beeing able to keep up with future emission levels.


Not if they bump the the M3/M4 to 460 - 480HP.

FYI the S55 produces more C02 emissions than the N55.

There's also been zero hints of a power upgrade for the M4 LCI so far.

[gabeyts]

'The S55 Will Not Be in The 2018 M2,’ Says Increasingly Nervous Man For Seventh Time This Thread

[Dante]

Originally Posted by PackPride85

FYI the S55 produces more C02 emissions than the N55.

You mean the M4 produces more C02 than M2, right?
To my knowledge, there is no official comparison of these two engines under the same conditions.
Emission standards incorporate more air pollutants than just C02, and the S55 seems to be the engine with more potential, emissions wise.

Originally Posted by PackPride85

There's also been zero hints of a power upgrade for the M4 LCI so far.

Not officially, right.

But as said before, this is all speculations and market observation.

[Nine Lives]

Originally Posted by PackPride85

FYI the S55 produces more C02 emissions than the N55.

Originally Posted by Dante

You mean the M4 produces more C02 than M2, right?
To my knowledge, there is no official comparison of these two engines under the same conditions.
Emission standards incorporate more air pollutants than just C02, and the S55 seems to be the engine with more potential, emissions wise.

The figures for Co2:

BMW M2: CO2 emissions in g/km 199 [185]

[ ]: automatic transmission

BMW M4: CO2 emissions (g/km)204.0 [194.0]

It's the Co2 that counts,as that is what determines how much we pay in road tax in Europe anyhow.

[Dante]

Originally Posted by Nine Lives

The figures for Co2:

BMW M2: CO2 emissions in g/km 199 [185]

[ ]: automatic transmission

BMW M4: CO2 emissions (g/km)204.0 [194.0]

It's the Co2 that counts,as that is what determines how much we pay in road tax in Europe anyhow.

Different cars with different weight, different HP rating etc. Apples and oranges.

As I already pointed out, emission standards like EU6 refer also to other pollutants, not only CO2.
If N55 doesn't meet coming standards, it's gone. Simple as that.

[Arnold_Powers]

Next car

[bradleyland]

Originally Posted by Zeroblade

I got a feeling the M2's with the N55 engine would be the next must own/rare car in a few years.

Or it could be the next E36 M3. Looked down upon because BMW put a "perfectly fine" engine in a car that should have had something superlative.

All this has me thinking about how positively hilarious it would be if BMW threw everyone a curveball and dropped an S48 derivative of the B48 in the MY2018 M2. Obviously the car on video here isn't powered by an I4t, but I still think it would be hilarious. I think the forum might implode from all the heartache.

[ryem3]

Originally Posted by Karmic Man

MY2018 Audi RS3 400hp
MY2018 AMG A45 400hp
Golf R4XX with 400hp+ a possibility
Ford Focus RS500 with 400hp a possibility

How will BMW react? It's always good to lock in customers to purchase before competitors start releasing their cars otherwise there is a potential to lose market share.

Its is cheaper and more reliable to detune the S55 than beefing up the N55 for > 400hp because they have to do R&D to engineer the N55 for greater power without sacrificing response and reliability. The S55 has been proven to be very reliable even in a more aggressive tune (M3/M4).

Most likely when BMW engineered the M2 a few years back, they didn't expect the ferocity of power war instigated from AMG and Audi with their lower range models. Now that the situation has changed and BMW has to respond to maintain market share in that sports car segment.

You forgot the c63s that has 500hp already. The m4 already doesn't keep up. The cars you referenced are in a lesser market.