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      06-23-2019, 12:24 PM   #89
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Is DCT in m2c on 3 really less aggressive than OG on sport+?
Where you hear this? It should be the same
He made it up as he typed it.

It's the same except the M2C has Drivelogic.
It's not the same. The m2c dct software has been updated and it doesn't slam so hard as the OG does.


The heavy slam when you upshift in the OG ok sport+ is kind of cute. It makes people in the car jump a bit and freak out because it's so abrupt and upsets the car. That makes it fun but..... not sure it's the best thing for going fast or wear and tear. Going just sport mode tones it down a lot, like m2c drive logic 3, but then you're in sport instead of sport+...
The newest version of the software can also be loaded on the OG M2.

It's to aggressive for sure, and will easily destroy the rear tires in short order.
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      06-23-2019, 03:11 PM   #90
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If you think the OG M2 is a better buy/car than the M2C you're lying to yourself it's that simple.
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      06-23-2019, 03:43 PM   #91
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If you think the OG M2 is a better buy/car than the M2C you're lying to yourself it's that simple.
The main difference between the M2 OG and the M2C is the owners.

The former are are embittered and sarcastic.

The latter are smug arseholes.

While I am an M2 LCI owner, you would be a prime example of the latter...

Last edited by M Fifty; 06-23-2019 at 04:27 PM.. Reason: Clarity
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      06-23-2019, 04:28 PM   #92
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The main difference between the M2 OG and the M2C is the owners.

The former are are embittered and sarcastic.

The latter are smug arseholes.

You would be a prime example of the latter...
To be honest, I don’t care which one is better. I love my M2 and haven’t considered the M2C. I plan on keeping this car a long time and I knew newer models will be introduced over the life of my ownership. I am not one that always has to have the “newest and best”.

I still have a iPhone 7.
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      06-23-2019, 04:36 PM   #93
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Good choice. I have a 6S.
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      06-23-2019, 06:53 PM   #94
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Originally Posted by M Fifty View Post
The main difference between the M2 OG and the M2C is the owners.

The former are are embittered and sarcastic.

The latter are smug arseholes.

While I am an M2 LCI owner, you would be a prime example of the latter...
cool story lol
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      06-23-2019, 07:42 PM   #95
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I've driven both now, but with a significant gap in time between them. Engine definitely more powerful in the mid-range and higher on M2C. The seating position is just as bad (high) on both. Rumors that the M seats had you sitting lower were false I believe. The brakes on the M2C are a bit overboosted and very touchy. Replacing the pads with something that has less initial bite would probably take care of it. Steering feel did seem better but I didn't drive them on the same roads so it's hard to make that comparison.
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      06-24-2019, 05:09 AM   #96
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I've driven both now, but with a significant gap in time between them. Engine definitely more powerful in the mid-range and higher on M2C. The seating position is just as bad (high) on both. Rumors that the M seats had you sitting lower were false I believe. The brakes on the M2C are a bit overboosted and very touchy. Replacing the pads with something that has less initial bite would probably take care of it. Steering feel did seem better but I didn't drive them on the same roads so it's hard to make that comparison.
I can't understand "high seating" position comments. I'm 6'2" and taller in the torso, and I have trouble with headroom in a lot of cars and any BMW if I'm wearing a helmet and it has a sunroof....like my E39 M5 - with a helmet on I had immediate full contact with the roof and had to adjust the seating position to a crazy and uncomfortable angle to fit in the car. One of the many reasons I hate sunroofs.

My E90 M3 is a slicktop, so lots of extra headroom, but even in that car with the seat adjusted all the way down, I have about 2 finger widths of room or less.

The M2C slicktop with the new design seat adjusted all the way down yields more than twice that amount of room as the M3. I feel like the M2C seat sits very low in the car in fact. One of the reasons I love the new (well M4) seats. As soon as I get in the M3, I lament the nice low seating available in the M2C.
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      06-24-2019, 07:12 AM   #97
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I guess it all depends on how you define high seating. The M2 does have more headroom than other BMWs that's why you get better clearance with the helmet on, it's a tall car.

But relative to other BMWs, (e46 and e86, in my case) and relative to the dashboard/center console, one does feel more "on" than "inside". Personally, it doesn't bother me.

Nice article you wrote in the Roundel!
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      06-24-2019, 08:49 AM   #98
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all it takes if for the M2 seats to tilt back a bit more.
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      06-24-2019, 09:58 AM   #99
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Originally Posted by ssquared View Post
So you find the m2c seats more comfortable? How do they do on longer drives compared to the OG?

I have back issues too and the main reason I didn’t get the OG M2 was the seats didn’t feel right for me, so I ended up in a 530 with multi contour. I’ve sat in the M2c twice but haven’t driven it yet, and I felt like the seats in the m2c were way better than OG, so it surprises me seeing so many people on here saying the OG seats were better
Exactly. But each to their own.

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      06-25-2019, 02:10 AM   #100
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Originally Posted by CSBM5 View Post
I can't understand "high seating" position comments. I'm 6'2" and taller in the torso, and I have trouble with headroom in a lot of cars and any BMW if I'm wearing a helmet and it has a sunroof....like my E39 M5 - with a helmet on I had immediate full contact with the roof and had to adjust the seating position to a crazy and uncomfortable angle to fit in the car. One of the many reasons I hate sunroofs.

My E90 M3 is a slicktop, so lots of extra headroom, but even in that car with the seat adjusted all the way down, I have about 2 finger widths of room or less.

The M2C slicktop with the new design seat adjusted all the way down yields more than twice that amount of room as the M3. I feel like the M2C seat sits very low in the car in fact. One of the reasons I love the new (well M4) seats. As soon as I get in the M3, I lament the nice low seating available in the M2C.
It's not about the headroom, just a feeling that you sit high relative to the cockpit and everything else it feels like. I didn't feel this in the F82. I have no idea on the E9x because I've never been in one. It just doesn't feel like a sports car seating position. I'm sure it's minor and something you will get used to. It might even be beneficial from a vision standpoint, but it feels weird to me.
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      06-25-2019, 03:23 AM   #101
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Originally Posted by ///M TOWN View Post
He made it up as he typed it.

It's the same except the M2C has Drivelogic.
I have no idea what Drivelogic is, but I think my 18 M2 with the DCT has it. It's in the description on the order form " M double-clutch transmission with drivelogic".

As much as I've studied and researched the M2 over the past few years, I remember seeing that description a lot. I enjoy reading you guys discussions, and have no particular interest or care in this debate, other than what I mentioned, just pointing this out.
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      06-25-2019, 03:41 AM   #102
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I have no idea what Drivelogic is, but I think my 18 M2 with the DCT has it. It's in the description on the order form " M double-clutch transmission with drivelogic".

As much as I've studied and researched the M2 over the past few years, I remember seeing that description a lot. I enjoy reading you guys discussions, and have no particular interest or care in this debate, other than what I mentioned, just pointing this out.
Drivelogic is just the shift aggressiveness button as far as I can tell, so you're right.
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      06-25-2019, 04:14 AM   #103
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Drivelogic is just the shift aggressiveness button as far as I can tell, so you're right.
Yeah.I just looked it up. I kind of understand were the poster I quoted was coming from. The OG M2 doesn't have a drivelogic button on the center console. If you're in auto-mode, it just shifts at the most aggressive setting when your accelerating. This can be fun, but a PITA in traffic when other people are around. It seems best suited for track driving. I often find myself upshifted manually because the DCT is winding the gears much longer than I need on the street.

I've since learned how to modulate the throttle and control it a little better, but it still more fun to just shift in manual mode on the streets.
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      06-25-2019, 10:49 AM   #104
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Originally Posted by Bimmer28312 View Post
If you think the OG M2 is a better buy/car than the M2C you're lying to yourself it's that simple.
Errrmmm, no. I drove both,. I had the option to buy both. I preferred the OG M2 so I bought one. It is not that simple, is down to personal requirements and preference and importantly, what the car will be used for.

I did not really notice that much difference in the initial turn in between OG M2 and M2C. M2C maybe a bit stiffer due to the M4 carbon strut brace, but the dampers and springs are the same OG M2 to M2C, despite what BMW said about revised suspension. There are a couple of joints which were changed to rose joints and that is it. I also find this a bit odd as the S55 is heavier and I would have expected the front suspension at least to have been re calibrated for this and changed.

I think it comes down to the fact that BMW had to put the S55 in to keep the M2 going as the N55 was being killed off due to the emissions changes. They maybe did not want to spend the money tuning, testing and redoing all the spring and damper rates as the M2C will not be in production that long anyway. This is a compromise for the M2C though as the suspension was developed, tested and tuned for the OG M2 and the N55.

In terms of the M2C drivelogic with the button to change the shift aggressiveness, I find this to be completely pointless.

In the OG M2 BMW dealer technician technical documentation they explained how the drivelogic had been programmed to automatically select the shift ferocity based on driving parameters, which makes sense and it works really well for me.

If I drive it hard, it shifts harder and faster, when I am pootling about, it shifts slower and calmer. It immediately adapts to how the car is being driven and changes the shift ferocity as appropriate.

In my opinion having a button which I would need to mess around with and change when putting my foot down or going slowly, is a step backwards, not forwards.

But I guess it gives another button and some LED lights for people to get excited about and discuss in the pub.

Last edited by 620turbo; 06-25-2019 at 11:06 AM..
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      06-25-2019, 11:08 AM   #105
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The iDrive behavior sounds like every automatic transmission I've driven. They all hold gears longer when accelerating faster. As far as the button, it's like a sport mode button which is in about half of the cars on the road. There is nothing unique in the setup.
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      06-25-2019, 11:15 AM   #106
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The iDrive behavior sounds like every automatic transmission I've driven. They all hold gears longer when accelerating faster. As far as the button, it's like a sport mode button which is in about half of the cars on the road. There is nothing unique in the setup.
It has nothing to do with idrive.

The drivelogic system on the OG M2 automatically computes and adjusts the change ferocity, which the M2C M3 and M4 have the button behind the gear selector with the LED lights for.
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      06-25-2019, 11:22 AM   #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 620turbo View Post
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Originally Posted by Bimmer28312 View Post
If you think the OG M2 is a better buy/car than the M2C you're lying to yourself it's that simple.
Errrmmm, no. I drove both,. I had the option to buy both. I preferred the OG M2 so I bought one. It is not that simple, is down to personal requirements and preference and importantly, what the car will be used for.

I did not really notice that much difference in the initial turn in between OG M2 and M2C. M2C maybe a bit stiffer due to the M4 carbon strut brace, but the dampers and springs are the same OG M2 to M2C, despite what BMW said about revised suspension. There are a couple of joints which were changed to rose joints and that is it. I also find this a bit odd as the S55 is heavier and I would have expected the front suspension at least to have been re calibrated for this and changed.

I think it comes down to the fact that BMW had to put the S55 in to keep the M2 going as the N55 was being killed off due to the emissions changes. They maybe did not want to spend the money tuning, testing and redoing all the spring and damper rates as the M2C will not be in production that long anyway. This is a compromise for the M2C though as the suspension was developed, tested and tuned for the OG M2 and the N55.

In terms of the M2C drivelogic with the button to change the shift aggressiveness, I find this to be completely pointless.

In the OG M2 BMW dealer technician technical documentation they explained how the drivelogic had been programmed to automatically select the shift ferocity based on driving parameters, which makes sense and it works really well for me.

If I drive it hard, it shifts harder and faster, when I am pootling about, it shifts slower and calmer. It immediately adapts to how the car is being driven and changes the shift ferocity as appropriate.

In my opinion having a button which I would need to mess around with and change when putting my foot down or going slowly, is a step backwards, not forwards.

But I guess it gives another button and some LED lights for people to get excited about and discuss in the pub.
I don't believe that's how drive logic works.

If you are in comfort mode and drive hard the shifts are still lazy, slow, and smooth. It may hold gears longer based on throttle and but that's not all there is to it. When you press the drive logic button to get it to 2 or 3 or in the OG m2 put it in sport or sport+ you'll notice the shifts happening much faster and much harder.

I always know if I'm accidently in the wrong drive logic mode as soon as I shift.
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      06-25-2019, 12:00 PM   #108
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Originally Posted by akkando View Post
I don't believe that's how drive logic works.

If you are in comfort mode and drive hard the shifts are still lazy, slow, and smooth. It may hold gears longer based on throttle and but that's not all there is to it. When you press the drive logic button to get it to 2 or 3 or in the OG m2 put it in sport or sport+ you'll notice the shifts happening much faster and much harder.

I always know if I'm accidently in the wrong drive logic mode as soon as I shift.
It isn't like that on my OG M2. If I drive hard in comfort mode, the shifts are more aggressive and faster. In Sport, they are more aggressive still I agree but it is a lot to do with the drivelogic computer assessing how you are driving using the accelerator pedal position as well as the driving mode you are in.

From the F87 M2 technical training manual:

"In all three modes, the shift points and shift dynamics, among
other things, are influenced by the accelerator pedal position"
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      06-25-2019, 12:02 PM   #109
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Originally Posted by 620turbo View Post
It has nothing to do with idrive.

The drivelogic system on the OG M2 automatically computes and adjusts the change ferocity, which the M2C M3 and M4 have the button behind the gear selector with the LED lights for.
ok, yes I meant to say drive logic, I guess that wasn't obvious?
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      06-25-2019, 12:11 PM   #110
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Originally Posted by 620turbo View Post
Errrmmm, no. I drove both,. I had the option to buy both. I preferred the OG M2 so I bought one. It is not that simple, is down to personal requirements and preference and importantly, what the car will be used for.

I did not really notice that much difference in the initial turn in between OG M2 and M2C. M2C maybe a bit stiffer due to the M4 carbon strut brace, but the dampers and springs are the same OG M2 to M2C, despite what BMW said about revised suspension. There are a couple of joints which were changed to rose joints and that is it. I also find this a bit odd as the S55 is heavier and I would have expected the front suspension at least to have been re calibrated for this and changed.

I think it comes down to the fact that BMW had to put the S55 in to keep the M2 going as the N55 was being killed off due to the emissions changes. They maybe did not want to spend the money tuning, testing and redoing all the spring and damper rates as the M2C will not be in production that long anyway. This is a compromise for the M2C though as the suspension was developed, tested and tuned for the OG M2 and the N55.

In terms of the M2C drivelogic with the button to change the shift aggressiveness, I find this to be completely pointless.

In the OG M2 BMW dealer technician technical documentation they explained how the drivelogic had been programmed to automatically select the shift ferocity based on driving parameters, which makes sense and it works really well for me.

If I drive it hard, it shifts harder and faster, when I am pootling about, it shifts slower and calmer. It immediately adapts to how the car is being driven and changes the shift ferocity as appropriate.

In my opinion having a button which I would need to mess around with and change when putting my foot down or going slowly, is a step backwards, not forwards.

But I guess it gives another button and some LED lights for people to get excited about and discuss in the pub.

Yeah the N55 was def on its last legs due to emissions but it didn't have much left let alone for a competition model. I too owned the OG M2 swapped turbos and all I can still state with ease the M2C is a better car in every aspect well aside from exhaust note lol. As for suspension the parts are different but how much that's how to debate still. On the DCT front I have no clue as I never would buy an M car in automatic. Manual transmission is a must for me as these cars are intended to be driven that way
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