[RAM_F30_F87]

I'm happy with my 2017 M2 which I've had the pleasure of driving for 4-1/2 years. I'm retired and it's a non-winter daily driver that is not autocrossed or tracked. Every month the dealer sends me a ~$30,000 trade-in offer for a Competition which I have no interest in (yes I can afford it). I kept my 2012 3-series for winter use, bad weather, and occasional long trip. To each his own.

[cptobvious]

Originally Posted by lemetier

Location of Manufacture and Location of Assembly should not be confused.

FWIW, for QC reasons, I'd take a Mexico originating BMW over any other plant.

+1000

Right here, this gentleman lemetier is spot on and genius. In modern manufacturing, location doesn't matter one iota, in terms of quality of the end product. What matters are the processes and procedures associated with manufacture and assembly.

Older plants tend to be saddled with obsolete techniques, ossified management structure, and entrenched labor. Newer plants, then, are able to adopt newer, better techniques, the workforce is more flexible, etc., etc.

That's why Hyundai can offer 10 year / 100,000 mile warranties, while BMW cannot.

I will ONLY purchase a G87 so long as it IS NOT made in any of the existing BMW Western European plants!

[///M TOWN]

Originally Posted by cptobvious

+1000

Right here, this gentleman lemetier is spot on and genius. In modern manufacturing, location doesn't matter one iota, in terms of quality of the end product. What matters are the processes and procedures associated with manufacture and assembly.

Older plants tend to be saddled with obsolete techniques, ossified management structure, and entrenched labor. Newer plants, then, are able to adopt newer, better techniques, the workforce is more flexible, etc., etc.

That's why Hyundai can offer 10 year / 100,000 mile warranties, while BMW cannot.

I will ONLY purchase a G87 so long as it IS NOT made in any of the existing BMW Western European plants!

I will cherish my German built M2 until the wheels fall off

I do however enjoy fine tequila made in Mexico 🇲🇽

[SW19]

Originally Posted by cptobvious

+1000

Right here, this gentleman lemetier is spot on and genius. In modern manufacturing, location doesn't matter one iota, in terms of quality of the end product. What matters are the processes and procedures associated with manufacture and assembly.

Older plants tend to be saddled with obsolete techniques, ossified management structure, and entrenched labor. Newer plants, then, are able to adopt newer, better techniques, the workforce is more flexible, etc., etc.

That's why Hyundai can offer 10 year / 100,000 mile warranties, while BMW cannot.

I will ONLY purchase a G87 so long as it IS NOT made in any of the existing BMW Western European plants!

I’m sure the quality of the Mexican plant will be OK but the Magna Plant in Austria is ranked above other BMW plants in Europe.You wouldn’t have to worry if the G87 was made in that plant.It is a very high quality manufacturing plant.

[lemetier]

Originally Posted by SW19

I’m sure the quality of the Mexican plant will be OK but the Magna Plant in Austria is ranked above other BMW plants in Europe.You wouldn’t have to worry if the G87 was made in that plant.It is a very high quality manufacturing plant.

Graz is Contract Production (Assembly) not manufacturing. All G29 Z4 and J29 Supra come off the line there but they don't have Austrian VINs per rules of origin.

[KevinC]

Originally Posted by swampfox94

It's just called ///Mexican2

[GoneIn4Secs]

Originally Posted by AmooManiak

Sorry, but if you think an M2 sounds intoxicating, then you haven't driven real performance cars. I said this in another thread - the OG M2 is just a less bad version of the S55 M2. Neither sounds GOOD.

Delusional post, n55 M2 is the best sounding bmw

I dont think youve actuslly heard these different cars yourself

[pruettfan]

53,000 miles and about 42 track days and I love my M2OG, don't care what anyone else thinks about my car. I just pass them on the track.

I have also instructed guys in comps and have driven those cars about 20-30 laps at my home track. M2C is a better car, that is just a fact. I can match my best lap times in the M2C with little effort versus what it takes in my M2 OG. Doesn't make my car crap, slow, a non-real M car blah blah. It's progress, it's not personal.

Also, for those who say the M2 is not a real M car just ask them about the 1M. Uses the N54 so I guess it isn't a real M car also.

[AmooManiak]

Originally Posted by GoneIn4Secs

Delusional post, n55 M2 is the best sounding bmw

I dont think youve actuslly heard these different cars yourself

I think you are delusional, but it's understandable since you own the car.

If you think that the M2 (N55) is the best sounding BMW, then you must be new to the brand. May be out of your price range, but you should try driving an S65 or S85 BMW. They actually sound exotic next to an N55 fart can.

[///M TOWN]

Originally Posted by AmooManiak

...If you think that the M2 (N55) is the best sounding BMW, then you must be...

N55 Sounds Fantastic

You're being a troll

[lemetier]

Originally Posted by GoneIn4Secs

n55 M2 is the best sounding bmw

[///M TOWN]

Originally Posted by lemetier

The n55 actually sounds pretty damn amazing for a turbocharged straight 6

In fact it sounds absolutely epic compared to the twin turbo s55

[JustChris]

N55 sounds way better than the S55 IMO.

OG M2 was a great car for me.

[nelsdvn]

I absolutely love my OG M2. I have also noticed the constant shade thrown on the OG, and I appreciate you starting this thread, but it is a lost cause trying to convince C and CS owners otherwise. I just ignore it but a recent vehicle addition to my fleet has informed a pretty interesting experience in car ownership.

Is the OG an M? This is a ridiculous question and no person on the InTerNet has the authority to crown or dethrone a BMW as an M. One authority is the manufacturer and all BMW M models have VIN numbers that begin with WBS. All other BMW vehicles have VIN numbers that begin with WBA. Black and white. End of discussion.

Over my nearly 40 years of driving and car ownership I have always been a "car guy" and sought "cool" cars and lusted after the aspirational Porsches, Ferrari's, etc. I always thought that a component of ownership of cars like that (or my M2) would engage random folks. Thumbs up, knowing nods, waves, etc. Nope. The only people that notice may be a person that owns a similar car, which by nature is rare, as we seek unique cars. The reality is 90+ % of the public is oblivious.

Now what changed for me? I bought a tricked out Jeep Wrangler as a third vehicle. I have never been flooded with more random waves, thumbs ups, Dads pointing at the Jeep with their little kids, random conversations at gas pumps, etc in my entire life.

Does this mean anything? Maybe we are our worst enemy? The constant diminution and toxicity towards our own, car guys and gals, is ridiculous. It makes us all look like a bunch of arrogant non-blinker using a$$holes. Not approachable, rich snob whatever. We need to get over ourselves. The Jeep community is the polar opposite (mostly). Now there is some of the "OnlY a WraNGLer Is A rEal jEEP" crowd, but the community is much more of a true community than a bunch of guys measuring the length of their units or gals comparing can size.

At the end of the day we should all try to be more welcoming. Motor on.

[SW19]

Originally Posted by lemetier

Graz is Contract Production (Assembly) not manufacturing. All G29 Z4 and J29 Supra come off the line there but they don't have Austrian VINs per rules of origin.

Isn’t there still some G30 production at the Graz plant?My wife’s 2018 540i was produced at the Graz plant and yes in does have a German VIN number.Are you confirming that all G87 production will be in Mexico?

[///MPhatic]

Originally Posted by AmooManiak

Sorry, but if you think an M2 sounds intoxicating, then you haven't driven real performance cars. I said this in another thread - the OG M2 is just a less bad version of the S55 M2. Neither sounds GOOD.

I've driven every performance car you can name, and probably many you can't...from several era's, and I think the OG M2 sounds fantastic (and nothing like the S55 M2C). I also think it's the best sounding BMW to date.

However, I do realize sound is subjective.

I don't flaunt what I do for a living, but if you'd like to know how I've driven and heard all these cars, just PM me.

I'll also say that sound has a lot of personal bias. Like I've never heard a Chevrolet product sound as good as a standard 5.0 Mustang, and as the mods start the Mustang just gets better and better, whereas the Chevy engines just get louder and louder.

I'll also say that I have a soft spot for Ferrari V8's, and the V10 LFA.

[akkando]

Originally Posted by AmooManiak

I think you are delusional, but it's understandable since you own the car.

If you think that the M2 (N55) is the best sounding BMW, then you must be new to the brand. May be out of your price range, but you should try driving an S65 or S85 BMW. They actually sound exotic next to an N55 fart can.

What the fuck man, out of someone's price range? You can still pick up an s65 car for much less than an m2. Less than m235i even. An s85 car is even cheaper because they're basket cases, almost no one likes the SMG, and the SMG trans has a lot of failures. If you want to debate the engine and exhaust sound of bmws fine, to imply these cars are out of the price range of the people perusing the m2 forums just seems to be intended as an insult, or more charitably just ignorance.

[TargaM2]

Originally Posted by nelsdvn

I absolutely love my OG M2. I have also noticed the constant shade thrown on the OG, and I appreciate you starting this thread, but it is a lost cause trying to convince C and CS owners otherwise. I just ignore it but a recent vehicle addition to my fleet has informed a pretty interesting experience in car ownership.

Is the OG an M? This is a ridiculous question and no person on the InTerNet has the authority to crown or dethrone a BMW as an M. One authority is the manufacturer and all BMW M models have VIN numbers that begin with WBS. All other BMW vehicles have VIN numbers that begin with WBA. Black and white. End of discussion.

Over my nearly 40 years of driving and car ownership I have always been a "car guy" and sought "cool" cars and lusted after the aspirational Porsches, Ferrari's, etc. I always thought that a component of ownership of cars like that (or my M2) would engage random folks. Thumbs up, knowing nods, waves, etc. Nope. The only people that notice may be a person that owns a similar car, which by nature is rare, as we seek unique cars. The reality is 90+ % of the public is oblivious.

Now what changed for me? I bought a tricked out Jeep Wrangler as a third vehicle. I have never been flooded with more random waves, thumbs ups, Dads pointing at the Jeep with their little kids, random conversations at gas pumps, etc in my entire life.

Does this mean anything? Maybe we are our worst enemy? The constant diminution and toxicity towards our own, car guys and gals, is ridiculous. It makes us all look like a bunch of arrogant non-blinker using a$$holes. Not approachable, rich snob whatever. We need to get over ourselves. The Jeep community is the polar opposite (mostly). Now there is some of the "OnlY a WraNGLer Is A rEal jEEP" crowd, but the community is much more of a true community than a bunch of guys measuring the length of their units or gals comparing can size.

At the end of the day we should all try to be more welcoming. Motor on.

Nice post buddy & well said.
I come from a background of 30 years of performance cars ownership & 20 years of motorsport competition (been on most the big forums/still on a few) & I simply don't understand the hatred you find on this site towards fellow enthusiasts. Is it a brand thing ? Is it snobbery ? Is it inexperience ? Is it insecurity ? Is it immaturity ?... I don't know but it's a shame it's tolerated & even encouraged by some on here.
The division between M2, M2C & M2CS owners on this site at times is almost like Ford vs Chev, Which is crazy because they are all versions of the same car !.
Having said that, there are some really nice folk on here so it is worth persisting, best just to try to stay away from the M2CS threads as those people CAN be particularly nasty/sad.
I have recently been spending more time on the M3/4 forum as I'm interested in most new performance cars & I found the owners on there are generally a little older/wiser demographic & as such are more accommodating of others ( just don't mention the grille ).
What's odd is I recently got out of an AMG & you would expect a similar demographic to BMW M owners but it was a much more pleasant group of owners/enthusiasts.
Anyway all the best & be assured we are not all arseholes .

[Dasnub]

Originally Posted by wjones14

Not for me. My first BMW was a 2015 M235i and I absolutely loved it. Until the 2016 M2 came out. I had M2 envy so bad that I fell out of love with the M235i. The two big differences for me were the added bulges and fender flares and the LSD. The M2 was/is a real M car, no doubt.

But I do agree with you that the performance was nearly the same. And that's why I couldn't see spending an additional $25K or so to upgrade. Instead I bought the 1LE Camaro and got a street legal racecar.

I came from an FBO M235i (with LSD) to a stock M2 and they feel and drive like entirely different cars. That’s not hyperbole or exaggeration. I struggle to find a single thing that seems similar about the driving experience.

[AmooManiak]

Originally Posted by ///M TOWN

The n55 actually sounds pretty damn amazing for a turbocharged straight 6

It's not the best sounding BMW engine in history but it sounds absolutely epic compared to the twin turbo s55

Mate, stop contradicting yourself. Just a few posts above you said the N55 is the best sounding BMW. It does not sound "epic" in any way, even compared to a 4 cylinder civic. Please get off your high horse. It sounds a little better than the S55 version, but both are not "good" in any way and far away from "epic." You will need to get into a V8 and V10 BMWs to get anywhere close to Epic. I've owned 3 different SUVs that sound better.

You are doing BMW a disservice by suggesting the N55 is the best sounding BMW. Owners like you who keep lifting their cars up to unrealistic levels is why people think the M brand is washed out.

[stulio2181]

Originally Posted by AmooManiak

Mate, stop contradicting yourself. Just a few posts above you said the N55 is the best sounding BMW. It does not sound "epic" in any way, even compared to a 4 cylinder civic. Please get off your high horse. It sounds a little better than the S55 version, but both are not "good" in any way and far away from "epic." You will need to get into a V8 and V10 BMWs to get anywhere close to Epic. I've owned 3 different SUVs that sound better.

You are doing BMW a disservice by suggesting the N55 is the best sounding BMW. Owners like you who keep lifting their cars up to unrealistic levels is why people think the M brand is washed out.

I love subjectivity arguing against subjectivity. Always leads to an entertaining read, subjectively speaking. Thank you!!!

[pruettfan]

Originally Posted by AmooManiak

I think you are delusional, but it's understandable since you own the car.

If you think that the M2 (N55) is the best sounding BMW, then you must be new to the brand. May be out of your price range, but you should try driving an S65 or S85 BMW. They actually sound exotic next to an N55 fart can.

Delusional is thinking you are the one who is supposed to determine what BMW sounds good to this guy. Last I checked even you have the right to your opinion, why debate a subjective point?