05-19-2018, 11:10 PM | #111 |
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05-19-2018, 11:11 PM | #112 | |
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Maybe? I guess it depends what you mean by perform. They could always replace the V8 with something else but then it's slower and you're going to disappoint some people. They could downsize the brakes too, but then it won't hold up as well over a long session. Some of that metal may be needed to achieve torsional rigidity targets. I think the only people that could really answer your question are the engineers that worked on the chassis. Of course, with more exotic materials you could probably have it all - but at a price. FWIW, the designer of the Nissan GT-R always claimed they actually targeted a relatively high weight. I am not 100% convinced, but there is an argument to be made that - for a non-race car - a very light car may be difficult to handle because you can't count on any effective downforce. Last edited by chris719; 05-19-2018 at 11:23 PM.. |
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05-19-2018, 11:37 PM | #114 | |
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This was following the M2's heft that was unusually high for a car with those dimensions and RWD setup. When owning an M2 it never felt like it needed more power, it always felt like it could lose weight and be an even better car. Seems like BMW could have tackled the emissions issue a lot of different ways they chose power and additional weight, let's see if that is the winning formula? TBD |
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05-19-2018, 11:50 PM | #115 |
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What is your different ways of tackling emissions? Going B58. Certainly not the S58, it would add similar weight. Let’s for argument sake, say they kept the N55 and added an optional Comp pack. The pack added top mount air to water cooling, larger oil coolers, a closed block, larger single turbo to the N55. Along with chassis stiffening via strutbrace and bulkhead bracing. But it added another 100lbs, I’d tick that box instantly. The upgrades easily validate the weight increase. I dont like the ADA and PDC being standard, as those certaintly add up with all the censors, cameras, wiring, etc.
Last edited by M3_WC; 05-19-2018 at 11:57 PM.. |
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05-20-2018, 12:03 AM | #116 | |
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No way the engineers could be happy with this kind of weight on a Competition Model that has been designated as the small, tossable, return to basics M. It now weighs more than an F80 Comp that seats 5. F80 Comp Curb weight 1595-1661 kg (3516-3662 lbs) Dimensions 4.63 m (182 in) long, 1.88 m (74 in) wide, 1.43 m (56 in) high Power / weight 276 ps (272 bhp) / t Torque / weight 337 Nm (249 lb-ft) / |
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05-20-2018, 12:29 AM | #117 | |
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I don't understand the controversy. If you asked M2 owners if they would want these upgrades for free overnight I bet the take rate would be very high indeed. |
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05-20-2018, 12:38 AM | #118 |
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05-20-2018, 12:47 AM | #119 | |
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05-20-2018, 02:06 AM | #120 |
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Same lazy ass people who order DCT instead of manual!
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05-20-2018, 04:10 AM | #121 | |
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Honestly I think when the M2 came out people were just happy there was a smaller and lighter M car than the M3/M4, but most didn't stop and think why is this thing so heavy given its size? Now that the M2C is coming and heavier than the M4 people are suddenly realizing it's heavier than it should be, but most this new weight is the S55 engine which isn't a pig, it's the old weight that is disappointing. Additional standard options like the larger brakes, PDC, electric seats are just going to add weight that won't be on the spec sheet of an M4, but understand most M4s don't come bone stock and all those options on the M4 add up the pounds as well, you just won't find those optional pounds on the base model spec sheet, but these additional feature that may be standard on the M2C, do get added the spec sheet. |
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05-20-2018, 06:31 AM | #122 |
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As an aside, the single biggest contributor to the weight difference between the E90 M3 and the F80 M3 is the battery. The Li battery in the F80 weighs 31lbs less than the "normal" AGM battery in the E90 (same physical dimensions, 1/2 the weight). BMW could have chosen to change over to an Li battery system on the M2C, save 30lbs, etc, but I'm sure many would then (later) be crazy over the fact that the Li-ion replacement cost is $1518 (61218047221, BMWNA MSRP) as opposed to less than $200.
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05-20-2018, 06:40 AM | #123 | |
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Worldwide, approx. 3/4 choses M-DCT for the M2, which further adds around 25 kg to the car. But hey, what's moving around another 25 kg extra when you're already 'sturdy' - the 40 hp power increase will compensate that, no ? And most options add weight too. When the 'average' M2 / M2 Competition is put on scales and also when fuel consumption is measured, you'd be surprised about the real world figures that show up. And adding all those fancy CF M Performance Parts as stock features to reduce weight, would have made its price prohibitively high within its class (except if it's a (very) special model) + would result into less return on investment for BMW for those parts that likely were initially designed for a 'special model' M2. The trouble is, when you raise the weight topic, some allergically react as if you're the allegedly frustrated current M2 owner, trying to steal the M2 Competition thunder, raining on the M2 Competition parade. When it rains, it rains. But let's cherish that it still got a 6-cylinder instead of being reduced to a 4-cyl. So it's about that delicate tipping point when 'a lot' becomes just 'too much'. BMW might as well add 'too heavy' to its 'too much' promo campaign.
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05-20-2018, 07:29 AM | #124 |
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I'll wait for the reviews before I pass further judgement. BMW knows what they are doing and the test mule videos of the S55 variant M2 look fast as hell.
I'm working on dropping my personal weight, so it's a win win.
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05-20-2018, 08:35 AM | #126 |
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05-20-2018, 09:29 AM | #127 |
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BMW is aware of the weight issue but could not include CF body panels and Li battery @60K and to kill F80/2 stock performance. I hoped they'd offer manual seats as an option.
Here is a quick weight reduction estimate for "better" value parts: Est. weight reduction: Light-weight battery -40 (Braile B2618, 18.5 lbs) CF hood -20 (9Kg) CF fender (x2) -35 (?) CF trunk -13 (6Kg) Total: -108 lbs CF roof weight reduction is not included due to potential high installation cost. Lighter wheels are an option also. Stock powered seats are 57.6 lbs each or total 115.2. The manual seats are 5kg (11lbs) lighter (EU model). Aftermarket seats may offer another 60-70 lbs in weight savings. The best weight reduction is sunroof delete and comes stock. That is usually around 40-50 lbs. If anybody has better est. numbers for CF parts please correct it. Last edited by Mavus; 05-20-2018 at 09:58 AM.. |
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05-20-2018, 09:45 AM | #128 | |
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I don’t know if an AGM battery makes sense. Sure it reduces weight, but in the wrong part. The car is nose heavy, trimming off weight in the rear would lead to more wheel spin and oversteer. It needs weight reduced from the front. |
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05-20-2018, 09:46 AM | #129 |
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The brake calipers mutate and change color during track usage; thus, that should be a hint that this car is not a track rat and so the extra weight is negligent on the public streets..
Stop all the bitching already because logically BMW could of made an all aluminum and carbon core car but it would of cost 15k more (M4?) and then everyone would complain about the price and it would not be affordable to BMW's target demographics. I don't like the fact that the M2C is heavier but it's totally justifiable .. Just like mostly everything in this world that I have grievances with, if you sit down and try to figure out why instead of complaining about it ignorantly.. |
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05-20-2018, 09:59 AM | #130 |
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Aren't these weight numbers based on a fully optioned car? I believe the sunroof is approx 30-40lbs.
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05-20-2018, 10:00 AM | #131 | |
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The CF hood and fenders reduce weight on the front axle and would offset battery weight decrease to maintain balance. This is all just to show that there is now OEM option to tackle weight gain. |
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05-20-2018, 10:16 AM | #132 |
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