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      11-30-2020, 01:55 PM   #221
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Grosjean's crash reminded me of when I was competing with Formula SAE back in '14 and watched a university's car catch fire while driving on course. Potential fuel rail failure. The bolt in their harness quick release supposedly had worked its way a little loose, and the driver couldn't release the harness. So the driver was engulfed in flames waving his arms until a course worker got to him with an extinguisher, and someone else cut him free. I heard the driver made it out relatively okay but with some second degree burns. They were wearing nomex suit, gloves, shoes, but man it was really scary to watch.
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      11-30-2020, 02:02 PM   #222
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Originally Posted by Tommysalami View Post
Nice, that sounds like a fun course. Yeah that's why you don't use water on a liquid fire, and why commercial kitchens have wet chemical extinguishers. But for the home, baking soda works as well.

I'm a fire protection engineer so all this is right up my alley.
Awesome mate !
All I can say is : The heat was scary to approach , but I learned at lot of how dangerous a fire can be .
Backdraft fire is the hell's fire !
Meanwhile I know what fire can do , but also what mistakes can do...
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      11-30-2020, 02:47 PM   #223
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Doc Roberts and driver van der Merwe were approaching the inferno with open face helmets (and fortunately balaclavas). Very heroic because the heat must have been insane.
In the aftermath of this crash the protocol will surely be adjusted - full helmets for the guys in the medical car.
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      11-30-2020, 03:40 PM   #224
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The FIA needs to mandate the installation of the same deceleration materials installed at the other corners of the track at T3, the location of the GRO shunt.

The Armco rails run at a 30 degree decreasing radius and make the impact much worse. Another words, the Armco barrier is not parallel with the race track, which creates a significant hazard.

http://www.impactsafetybarriers.com/...Comparison.pdf
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      11-30-2020, 03:58 PM   #225
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tommysalami View Post
You have the right equation, but keep in mind that the mass used in the calc is the mass of fuel vapor. So while there may have been 2kg worth of fuel vapor for combustion in the fireball, the rest of the fuel would still be liquid at the moment of impact. So there very well may have been a rupture of the fuel cell. But this is all just back of the napkin stuff and as you say, we'll know when the investigation is done.



I doubt it. The spray from a handheld extinguisher is fairly puny. The fire will entrain much more air on its own. They were definitely too far away at first, but those guys with the extinguishers didn't appear to be wearing proper face masks/SCBA, and it must have been crazy hot getting towards that fire. So I can't blame them for starting further back and working their way closer. Major props to the medical car guys for getting right in there and helping Grosjean over the fence.
Yes and Thanks!!

We are all worse than Armchair Quarterbacks. We're Armchair Accident Investigators. Has there ever been a more ridiculous thing to be?

Let's wait for the investigation before announcing a conclusion.
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      11-30-2020, 03:59 PM   #226
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You would have thought that the FIA could have found a better barrier than armco by now.
It shouldn't be possible for a nose of an F1 car to be able to get between two layers and separate them.
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      11-30-2020, 04:08 PM   #227
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Verstappens comments on Albon:

“I don’t think that if you are 30 or 40 seconds behind your team-mate, that’s very good,”

Just because something is true doesn't mean you have to be an arrogant douche and say it.
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      11-30-2020, 04:22 PM   #228
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SenorFunkyPants View Post
Verstappens comments on Albon:

ďI donít think that if you are 30 or 40 seconds behind your team-mate, thatís very good,Ē

Just because something is true doesn't mean you have to be an arrogant douche and say it.
Especially when the guy is fighting for his/a seat. That should be kept behind closed doors if it is going to be said at all.
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      11-30-2020, 04:55 PM   #229
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Quote:
Originally Posted by minn19 View Post
Especially when the guy is fighting for his/a seat. That should be kept behind closed doors if it is going to be said at all.
Negative .

MAX says what "everybody has been thinking all season long" But when he says it out loud it's harsh ? This is top sport and Albon simply doesn't perform on a level that's acceptable. It's just not good enough and I see no reason to sugar coat that message when asked !

Albon was very lucky that Perez got bad luck with his blown PU , otherwise he wouldn't finish on P3 anyway ..
And actually Albon is very lucky that 51% of the Red Bull shares are Thai !
Otherwise he wouldn't be any longer in that RB seat ! But the clock is ticking..
Albon got already enough chances to show his performance on the track ..
So , NO excuses are required in this situation ..
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      11-30-2020, 06:00 PM   #230
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      11-30-2020, 06:06 PM   #231
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SenorFunkyPants View Post
Verstappens comments on Albon:

ďI donít think that if you are 30 or 40 seconds behind your team-mate, thatís very good,Ē

Just because something is true doesn't mean you have to be an arrogant douche and say it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by minn19 View Post
Especially when the guy is fighting for his/a seat. That should be kept behind closed doors if it is going to be said at all.
Just when you don't think it can get any worse...it does. Max, just close your mouth, please.

http://www.silverarrows.net/news/ham...h5Mxejk-8AUaVQ
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      11-30-2020, 06:15 PM   #232
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MKSixer View Post
Just when you don't think it can get any worse...it does. Max, just close your mouth, please.

http://www.silverarrows.net/news/ham...h5Mxejk-8AUaVQ
Quite the telling exchange between the two.
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      11-30-2020, 06:25 PM   #233
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fiveohwblow View Post
Quite the telling exchange between the two.
A tale of two drivers...
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      11-30-2020, 06:27 PM   #234
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MKSixer View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by fiveohwblow View Post
Quite the telling exchange between the two.
A tale of two drivers...
Haha that and more.

I believe the Redbull camp to be ran rather authoritarian and see the evidence in this exchange. Albeit I could be perceiving what I want and it merely is Max's opinion, I see helmet and Horner in that response.
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      11-30-2020, 06:29 PM   #235
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Originally Posted by fiveohwblow View Post
Haha that and more.

I believe the Redbull camp to be ran rather authoritarian and see the evidence in this exchange. Albeit I could be perceiving what I want and it merely is Max's opinion, I see helmet and Horner in that response.
Easily the most toxic environment on the grid. As long as they have Darth Marko in a leadership position, they will continue to Dark Side young drivers careers and encourage the kind of drivel that Max spreads around. Sad.
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      11-30-2020, 06:37 PM   #236
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      11-30-2020, 06:39 PM   #237
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      11-30-2020, 06:41 PM   #238
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SenorFunkyPants View Post
Verstappens comments on Albon:

ďI donít think that if you are 30 or 40 seconds behind your team-mate, thatís very good,Ē

Just because something is true doesn't mean you have to be an arrogant douche and say it.
then it can be a nice idea not using Albon as a test driver and build car just a bit less Max biased..
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      11-30-2020, 07:03 PM   #239
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ///M Power-Belgium View Post
Negative .

MAX says what "everybody has been thinking all season long" But when he says it out loud it's harsh ? This is top sport and Albon simply doesn't perform on a level that's acceptable. It's just not good enough and I see no reason to sugar coat that message when asked !

Albon was very lucky that Perez got bad luck with his blown PU , otherwise he wouldn't finish on P3 anyway ..
And actually Albon is very lucky that 51% of the Red Bull shares are Thai !
Otherwise he wouldn't be any longer in that RB seat ! But the clock is ticking..
Albon got already enough chances to show his performance on the track ..
So , NO excuses are required in this situation ..
Plain and simple, HE didn't need to say it or anything. Do you go around your office telling people who sucks and who doesn't publicly?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MKSixer View Post
Just when you don't think it can get any worse...it does. Max, just close your mouth, please.

http://www.silverarrows.net/news/ham...h5Mxejk-8AUaVQ
Hence the d$%!head nickname.
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      11-30-2020, 08:02 PM   #240
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Putting it all into perspective.

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      11-30-2020, 08:15 PM   #241
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Quote:
Originally Posted by minn19 View Post
Plain and simple, HE didn't need to say it or anything. Do you go around your office telling people who sucks and who doesn't publicly?


.
Positive mate .
I have to do it at the company . By quarterly evaluations on paper .And weekly meetings .
If the third evaluation is still bad . They know what will follow ..
Publicly ?
Of course ! The paper will be displayed on the companies information board , why the person in question is fired and will be subject in the next meeting .
Note : Since this year I tolerate more , because the people are working during a damn COVID pandemic !
Quarantines , social distance , mouth masks , gloves, disinfect everything everyday , is no joke !

If "MY" performance is bad at the company .Even I would be fired as well..
The today's life and work performance at the companies is not a charity or a Disneyland !
Same in professional motorsports ...
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      11-30-2020, 08:18 PM   #242
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yco View Post
then it can be a nice idea not using Albon as a test driver and build car just a bit less Max biased..
What do you think Merc is doing mate ?
Testing at NASA ?
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