[HeelToeShift]

Originally Posted by ///M2CS

I didn't like the 458 Italia which I find imperfect which I sold to order my Speciale
what bothers me about the GT4 is the too short wheelbase, the lack of aerodynamic downforce and the limited power of the flat 6

I love the wheelbase as the car feels like a go kart and there is 50% more downforce than the 981 GT4. Also, not sure how closely you follow but the GT4 makes very similar power on a dyno to the 991 GT3 which is rated much higher (per Dundon on their dyno and same conditions). Check out how much power JCR got from their full exhaust (50 WHP). The OPF and restrictive mufflers for Euro requirements have zapped a lot of power.
Ultimately, this car puts a smile on my face that few cars ever have regardless of price. It’s so dynamic and fun which are key to being a great driver’s car. The basically perfect shifter, the flat 6 wail and instant throttle response and manic top end, the steering and of course the looks are all just sublime.

[HeelToeShift]

Originally Posted by ///M2CS

the m2 CS is not perfect but it is homogeneous and gives a lot of driving pleasure it puts a smile on your face and this is rare

There is no “perfect” car and sometimes little things make a car nuanced and fun whereas technical can sometimes be confused for boring like the GT-R. I do think driving pleasure accounts for more than anything as mentioned above.

[jlee]

Originally Posted by ///M2CS

I agree and have owned several GT3s
The M2 CS is truly an exceptional car
As for Porsches, since owning a Speciale and a Pista I feel they are much less desirable

touché again. the next level. that's a level i'm scared of

[///M2CS]

Originally Posted by HeelToeShift

I love the wheelbase as the car feels like a go kart and there is 50% more downforce than the 981 GT4. Also, not sure how closely you follow but the GT4 makes very similar power on a dyno to the 991 GT3 which is rated much higher (per Dundon on their dyno and same conditions). Check out how much power JCR got from their full exhaust (50 WHP). The OPF and restrictive mufflers for Euro requirements have zapped a lot of power.
Ultimately, this car puts a smile on my face that few cars ever have regardless of price. It’s so dynamic and fun which are key to being a great driver’s car. The basically perfect shifter, the flat 6 wail and instant throttle response and manic top end, the steering and of course the looks are all just sublime.

you just have to sit in a Speciale with its 4.5 l V8 screaming at 9000 rpm and developing 605 hp its surgical steering its magic gearbox to realize that the Cayman GT4 is a nice sports car but for which we can't be ecstatic

[///M2CS]

Originally Posted by HeelToeShift

There is no “perfect” car and sometimes little things make a car nuanced and fun whereas technical can sometimes be confused for boring like the GT-R. I do think driving pleasure accounts for more than anything as mentioned above.

I agree

[///M2CS]

Originally Posted by jlee

touché again. the next level. that's a level i'm scared of

do not be afraid to make your childhood dreams come true, it is the most beautiful thing you can achieve

[jlee]

Originally Posted by ///M2CS

do not be afraid to make your childhood dreams come true, it is the most beautiful thing you can achieve

lol..now we are comparing GT4s to Pistas..really??

Its not a matter of making your childhood dreams come true its a matter of being able to stop..I'll want one, then another one then another...

[///M2CS]

Originally Posted by jlee

lol..now we are comparing GT4s to Pistas..really??

Its not a matter of making your childhood dreams come true its a matter of being able to stop..I'll want one, then another one then another...

I don't set myself any limit
I often remember about JFK’s New Frontier*

*
slogan used by U.S. Pres. John F. Kennedy to describe his concept of the challenges facing the United States in the 1960s.
(1960 election at the party’s national convention in the Los Angeles Memorial Coliseum on July 15, 1960)

[MomoM3]

Originally Posted by medphysdave

OP,. I felt that there are a couple unique informative take aways from this thread. A member discusses his enthusiasm for his Targa. By most accounts this is not considered the p-car to have based upon paper performance. However, it's drop dead gorgeous and one of my favorites. This member picked based upon his passion and that is what needs to fuel your choice. The reality is that you aren't down to poor choices. Either will be great is long as you cater to your own desires. Don't pick based upon the desires of others. The choice now doesn't have to be permanent if you change your mind.

Edit: I just connected the dots that you already made the choice.

Thanks for this note. I honestly value both perspectives and it really gave me the context I was looking for.

I love both brands and love this forum, opposing fanboys and all.

[HeelToeShift]

Originally Posted by ///M2CS

you just have to sit in a Speciale with its 4.5 l V8 screaming at 9000 rpm and developing 605 hp its surgical steering its magic gearbox to realize that the Cayman GT4 is a nice sports car but for which we can't be ecstatic

I’ve driven and been in one (have a friend who owns a 458 Spyder and a Speciale) - I still think PDK is a notch above (and you can still get a manual on the GT3) and preferred the steering in those too since I don’t like the ultra quick rack in the Speciale. I will admit, Ferrari has never really excited me and much prefer the dynamics of the GT 911s. That’s my own take and another great reason both are made since we all appreciate different things.

I do think for the price the GT4 is easily the best car under about $175,000 USD. I also didn’t realize until today it won EVO Car of the Year which is one of the only mags I actually read car wise.

[///M2CS]

Originally Posted by HeelToeShift

I do think for the price the GT4 is easily the best car under about $175,000 USD. I also didn’t realize until today it won EVO Car of the Year which is one of the only mags I actually read car wise.

That’s true
Jethro Bovingdon's advice is always relevant for the rest the opinions of EVO magazine are often interesting but quite subjective

[W///]

Originally Posted by kepler

I've owned nearly 20 Porsches, all 911's/GT3's except for one GT4. They are great cars, but I seem to always find myself coming back to an ///M. Undeniably, 911's are huge now, much like current ///M3's. And the styling has gone downhill (the 992 styling is unappealing, to put it politely), much like the G series M3/M4. This is partly why I had to get an ///M2 CS. It's the best ///M2 and will always be the first-ever ///M2 CS. It's the rights size (the size we all wish the M3 remained at) and the aesthetics are off the charts -- dare I say, it looks like a work of art. If you want a 911, just go buy one. They are a dime a dozen with endless good examples on the used market. If you want a new 992, I can't advise you because, as an old-school 911 enthusiast, the styling hurts my eyes and the size hurts my soul.

Originally Posted by jlee

haha here we go. I agree, I'm in the same boat. I've had nearly all the GT cars and Turbos etc. and I think the best word to describe why we come back is nostalgia. most of us started with the Ms. They have a certain feeling of when I was 20 something hopping into my first E36 M3.

The OP opened this thread asking which to pick. I'm down to a Targa GTS now and love it, just drove it this morning to inspect my M2CS which I drove a couple of miles before leaving it for the PPF shop. If you are picking a car to spend your $$ and you can only pick one or the other, you pick the 911. Its fits like a glove, the engine is incredible, the PDK is out of this world. The handling is spot on. It feels like a small sports car. I hopped in the M2 CS. For 3 miles and I couldn't really have any fun with 40 miles on it, it brought me back to my E36 M3. Feels bigger, manual tranny shifts kinda the same, you gotta work it a bit to have some fun but that work is why I got it. Its more comfy than my 911.

so don't mean to come off snooty but a lot of us are coming at it from different points in life. I'm going back and bought a car to remind me where I started. Some are starting and are working their way up. Its all fun!

I agree, the 991.2 is my keeper Porsche, the design of the 992 isn't for me, the front bumper has a gaping wide mouth but a great wide stance too, the rear looks too futuristic but is sexy. What I really can't do is no buttons. Relying on iPads to operate a car is way too complicated. That all said I'm on the list for a GT3 and won't say no when my name comes up..

It's great to hear from guys like you two who have owned both and still enjoy both. I grew up worshipping BMW and Porsche, while only respecting Ferrari and Lambo, but never really crave one (not that I can afford them anyway).

I've been so fortunate to drive a few Porsches and Ferraris. They were spectacularly fun, but I just feel like I'm more of an ///M kind of a guy. I just really enjoy their characters, and for the same price as say a 997 GT3, I have 3 M cars that provide me with all sorts of driving experiences.

Out of all the Porsches I've driven, I still haven't driven a 997 GT3, which is my dream car. The notables were the 991.2 Carrera T and I love the idea of a Boxster Spyder.

The M2CS just seems like an old school M to me, which is a great thing.

P.S. jlee , very cool to see you started off in an E36 M3. I'm debating selling mine for an M2C quite a few people have told me that'd be a mistake.

[jlee]

Originally Posted by W///

P.S. jlee , very cool to see you started off in an E36 M3. I'm debating selling mine for an M2C quite a few people have told me that'd be a mistake.

If you have the space keep it. If not then sell it. I wish I had mine for for kicks and the sentimental value is a lot more than the cash I got.

[Davil]

Originally Posted by W///

P.S. jlee , very cool to see you started off in an E36 M3. I'm debating selling mine for an M2C quite a few people have told me that'd be a mistake.

My e36 M3 was stolen in 1999.

That year I replaced it with a GC8 WRX, which, to be honest was a much better all rounder and way more fun. And my e36 had the proper Euro engine too.

The M2C is in another league, another galaxy. No comparison. The CS will be even more so.

(Interesting side note. That was the era that loads of Porsche club members were buying WRXs to take to track days as they were faster than 911s of the time. Of course, all late 90s cars are pretty slow by today's standards but still lots of fun to drive).

[jlee]

New gt3 is out!!!!! And here we go!!

[medphysdave]

Originally Posted by kepler

I'm a pcar guy through and through, but that wing is horrendous. One of the ugliest I've seen in a long time. It looks like it was installed incorrectly.

It's nasty, but a 50% increase in down force and no added weight is good stuff.

[robopp]

Originally Posted by kepler

I'm a pcar guy through and through, but that wing is horrendous. One of the ugliest I've seen in a long time. It looks like it was installed incorrectly.

Function over fashion.

[medphysdave]

Originally Posted by kepler

The 997 and 991 GT3's accomplished both. For me personally, I just can't spend upwards of 200K on a car I find aesthetically unappealing. I'll go on the record now and predict the take-rate on the touring package option will be very high for the 992 GT3. Most buyers will not want that wing. And let's be honest, the majority of 992 GT3 buyers will not notice or benefit from the added downforce anyway. We learned from the 991 GT3 buyer pool that things have changed -- many (and maybe most) of these cars will never even sniff the track.

I would get the touring. I couldn't look at that wing every day without feeling like a tool.

[jlee]

I have to say I agreed with everyone until that video. the wing doesn't look great but the rest of the car looks spectacular. and I wasn't even a 992 fan. i'm going to have to give it a try, either buy a used 991.2 RS or wait for this i'm guessing performance will be the same. 315 in the rears.. rs grip and rs aero. what more do you need??

[jlee]

Originally Posted by medphysdave

I would get the touring. I couldn't look at that wing every day without feeling like a tool.

I had a touring and while I loved the looks of it. the aero wasn't enough for a fast track, the rear definitely gets loose and the >80 mph drone because of only 6 gears eventually got to me