[NJ M3cs]

Hi everyone!
Looking to get some information and advice on tuning. I have a 2017 M2 OG completely stock, with an exception of the VRSF chargepipe. Recently upgraded due to burst stock chargepipe. Would like to add a little more power for occasional track use, mostly used as daily. I was thinking to get to BM3 stage 2, and would have to upgrade at least intercooler & downpipe. I’ve had Fabspeed catted downpipe on my list. The only concern I have are those crazy loud “gun shots” , and loud “pops”. Is there a way to get rid off gun shots via BM3?
Or maybe someone can recommend different downpipe? Also, in regards to upgrade into cold air intake, I found mixed reviews regarding this upgrade. Had Dinan or Tuner Motorsport. Most say it doesn’t add any noticeable power, except noise. Any suggestions would be appreciated.

[varooshgog]

Regarding tuning, BM3 is the cheapest and most flexible option. BM3 should let you tone down/remove the burble effect if you load a tune (I think you can also do it with Bimmer code?).

The Fabspeed sport cat is good, and the equivalent is the Remus sport cat (get whichever is cheaper). They should both yield some good power increases regardless of if you tune or not as they both use 200 cell HJS cats.

An Intercooler is a good upgrade regardless of tune since the OG M2 will pull power once IATs start to climb. Which Intercooler is kind of dependent on how you plan to use the car going forward, but most people have had success with the Wagner Evo 2 or the CSF.

Finally, for intakes, they are more so for sound and convenience. Some intakes may yield a slight increase in horsepower high in the rev range as well as boosting some low down torque, but it’s not too significant (<=10 hp and ft/lbs). I found the bigger value was that some of them allow you wash the filter which cuts down the filter replacement cost (they also make a regular washable filter for the stock air box but I had rough idles with it…so ymmv).

[ThreeStripes]

Skip the intake. It’s not worth the MAF bs and doesn’t provide any performance. Overoctane your OTS BM3 tune as they run hot. Run 93 on the 91 tune, or run the ACN tune with 91.

Plan on data-logging to confirm everything is healthy, don’t just slap a OTS S2 93octane tune on and and go to the track.

CSF intercooler is good. I’m perfectly satisfied with mine and it’ll hold IATs within 10* of ambient on the street and works well enough on track. VRSF Race or Wagner Evo3 will out perform it. Skip the Wagner Evo2 it’s overpriced for the performance.

Active Autowerke Catted DP as another alternative to Fabspeed that won’t provide a CEL.

BM3 allows you to fully adjust burble aggressiveness and where in the RPM range they’re produced. From full off, to complete childish dickhead/idiot.

[F87source]

I had MHD before and recently moved over to bm3, and I absolutely recommend getting bm3, here's my review: https://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=2031816


You can run stage 2 or stage 2+ depending depending on your mods. For downpipe if you want catless get the mad catless downpipe.


For intake stock is fine, if you want some more noise I'd recommend: the turner intake (I'm getting one soon and I'll review it), cts turbo intake, and the new infinity design intake (this is crazy expensive but it's top knotch). At this point I'm leaning to the Turner motorsport intake, because that's what I'm getting but I'll have a more conclusive explanation in my final review.


Btw none of the intakes I listed above should have cel or maf sensor issues. This is because they have specifically designed maf housings to prevent a CEL.

[NJ M3cs]

Thanks for all the replies! It is good to know that I can control burbles/aggressiveness of the exhaust with BM3. But it’s not really burbles I was referring to, it’s those crazy pops and what sounds like a gun shots. Is there a way to completely eliminate, and still have stock like burbles with upgraded downpipe? Absolutely love how current stock exhaust/downpipe sounds, though wouldn't mind a little extra aggressiveness.
Didn’t know that I can control burbles via BimmerCode, definitely have to look into that.
Anyone have CSF intercooler? Any fitment issues?

[hihowareyougood]

Originally Posted by NJ M3cs

Thanks for all the replies! It is good to know that I can control burbles/aggressiveness of the exhaust with BM3. But it’s not really burbles I was referring to, it’s those crazy pops and what sounds like a gun shots. Is there a way to completely eliminate, and still have stock like burbles with upgraded downpipe? Absolutely love how current stock exhaust/downpipe sounds, though wouldn't mind a little extra aggressiveness.
Didn’t know that I can control burbles via BimmerCode, definitely have to look into that.
Anyone have CSF intercooler? Any fitment issues?

I have a CSF intercooler paired with a VRSF charge pipe that I installed last year. No major fitment issues noted - the CSF will be a close fit but it's a direct bolt-on otherwise. Getting the pipes to align may be a pain, but you'll have an easier time as long as you follow a proper installation order (youtube guides provide in-depth instructions). The washers and screws that came with my CSF IC were inadequate, and I bought some heavier duty stuff from Home Depot for safe measure. I recall reading a thread where CSF includes new washers, so YMMV.

[F87source]

Originally Posted by NJ M3cs

Thanks for all the replies! It is good to know that I can control burbles/aggressiveness of the exhaust with BM3. But it’s not really burbles I was referring to, it’s those crazy pops and what sounds like a gun shots. Is there a way to completely eliminate, and still have stock like burbles with upgraded downpipe? Absolutely love how current stock exhaust/downpipe sounds, though wouldn't mind a little extra aggressiveness.
Didn’t know that I can control burbles via BimmerCode, definitely have to look into that.
Anyone have CSF intercooler? Any fitment issues?

Burbles and that gun shot sound are the same. It's just extra fuel being dumped into the exhaust so it can ignite and pop, so you can't eliminate one without the other. If you want it to stay stock then just leave burbles stock and the exhaust will sound just like factory, if you add a down pipe you might have more pops and burbles so you will have to dial it in as you see fit.


Don't mess with burbles on bimmer code, that is not the correct way to do it and you can end up messing with the car in unexpected ways. For example if you disable ASD via bimmer link's active disabling function then you also disable the exhaust flap. If you mess with active sound tuning on bimmer link then you disable burbles. So imo don't mess with any tune related settings on a coding app.

[NJ M3cs]

Don't mess with burbles on bimmer code, that is not the correct way to do it and you can end up messing with the car in unexpected ways. For example if you disable ASD via bimmer link's active disabling function then you also disable the exhaust flap. If you mess with active sound tuning on bimmer link then you disable burbles. So imo don't mess with any tune related settings on a coding app.

F87source
Thanks for letting me know, definitely don’t want to mess with that.

[3t3p]

I'd say the gunshots and burbles are not the same. I think he means the 'AK47' antisocial/small penis tunes that make the car sound like firecrackers are going off. That has to be tuned in and you won't be at risk of that with normal settings on BM3 or MHD.

[NJ M3cs]

Originally Posted by 3t3p

I'd say the gunshots and burbles are not the same. I think he means the 'AK47' antisocial/small penis tunes that make the car sound like firecrackers are going off. That has to be tuned in and you won't be at risk of that with normal settings on BM3 or MHD.

Lol. Yes. Exactly what I meant. Thanks

[AmuroRay]

Intakes will not add any real power without an inlet, something like a CTS will not cause a CEL/MAF issue.

I'd recommend a Race intercooler - VRSF or MAD, but you will need to have a M235i Vbrace installed at the same time. Mine is consistently under 11F during a pull and even as low as 5F.
- Side note, use thermal tape to wrap your chargepipe

BM3 is going to be the best OTS tune you can get, so don't bother looking elsewhere unless you want a custom tune.

Finally, for downpipes only Fabspeed and ActiveAuto offer a no CEL guarantee, so I would stick with them.

[CalAcacian]

Echoing what others have said on here. BM3 is fantastic, safe, and allows full control over pops/burbles (I have them completely turned off and the car still sounds plenty aggressive without being childish). I personally went the CSF intercooler, Fabspeed sport cat, and full Dinan exhaust route. I added the Dinan intake for the noise/ full carbon aesthetics and I enjoy it, but it doesn't make any additional power.

[VGSON]

FYI..IF you're tuning the car to not throw codes for the downpipe. it wont show a CEL for it. Mine has the CTS 200 cell and MHD tune...passed inspections here. No CEL no issue. Theres a check box in MHD and BM3 for aftermarket cat...Dont need to pay $1000 for a sport cat. Get the Cheaper ones.

[3t3p]

Absolute best mods.

Intercooler
Chargepipe (you have)
Sports cat
Turbo inlet
Bm3/MHD stage 2
Good tyres

[///MPhatic]

I was in the same sort of spot, I didn't really want to add much hp, I just wanted to "uncover" what BMW did to stifle the engine in order to preserve M3/M4 sales.

My mod list is (all the most popular stuff):

- Fabspeed sport cat (lower tone, no drone, more exhaust artifacts, no CEL)
- Mad charge pipe (cheap and effective)
- CSF intercooler (top rated)
- BM3 (OTS stage 2 91 octane)
- MST inlet (PITA)
- Turbosmart DV (PITA II)

The car feels vastly faster than it was (maybe 430 at the crank now), though it's not any more fun, if I'm honest, and there is absolutely more turbo lag (regardless of what the fanboi's say). I think I'm pretty light on expense for the mods, just $2660 all in (including installation of the inlet and DV), but if I had it to do over I'd skip all of it except for the downpipe. But I'm weird, I don't race my car, it's all about driving fun and aesthetics.

[NJ M3cs]

Originally Posted by ///MPhatic

I was in the same sort of spot, I didn't really want to add much hp, I just wanted to "uncover" what BMW did to stifle the engine in order to preserve M3/M4 sales.

My mod list is (all the most popular stuff):

- Fabspeed sport cat (lower tone, no drone, more exhaust artifacts, no CEL)
- Mad charge pipe (cheap and effective)
- CSF intercooler (top rated)
- BM3 (OTS stage 2 91 octane)
- MST inlet (PITA)
- Turbosmart DV (PITA II)

The car feels vastly faster than it was (maybe 430 at the crank now), though it's not any more fun, if I'm honest, and there is absolutely more turbo lag (regardless of what the fanboi's say). I think I'm pretty light on expense for the mods, just $2660 all in (including installation of the inlet and DV), but if I had it to do over I'd skip all of it except for the downpipe. But I'm weird, I don't race my car, it's all about driving fun and aesthetics.

Didn’t really want to mod this car, I think BMW have done pretty good job for the most part.
I’ve had a 2020 M4 cs, and I gotta tell you, M2 way more fun to drive, even stock exhaust sounds much better than on M4 cs.
Charge pipe was a must for me, as my stock pipe burst while I was switching from 1st to 2nd gear, at around 2k rpm. I was always wondering and couldn’t understand how people could blow they charge pipes on their stock cars. And here we go, out of nowhere, not even pushing hard. I would expect it to burst while really pushing on it, I guess it’s the friction, the age of the original stock charge pipe and mileage. I was at 65K with original chargepipe. So, what are you saying that you would only upgrade down pipe without tuning it? That turbo lag you are talking about, it got worse with all of those mods?

[ThreeStripes]

Originally Posted by NJ M3cs

That turbo lag you are talking about, it got worse with all of those mods?

Full disclosure that comment is coming from this guy:

Originally Posted by ///MPhatic

I got a bit nutty.

Re: perception of lag, lets just say your mileage may vary.

[varooshgog]

Originally Posted by ThreeStripes

Full disclosure that comment is coming from this guy:




Re: perception of lag, lets just say your mileage may vary.

Haha

Regarding lag, the only item in there that I can foresee adding any "noticeable" lag is the CSF intercooler (which is common for larger intercoolers). Everything else in there should actually improve throttle response and reduce turbo lag because it improves flow/efficiency.

I do agree though that this will be more or less noticeable dependent on how you drive your car.

[///MPhatic]

Originally Posted by NJ M3cs

So, what are you saying that you would only upgrade down pipe without tuning it? That turbo lag you are talking about, it got worse with all of those mods?

I'd do the Fabspeed Sport Cat with a Stage 1 tune. Yes, the lag got worse with all the mods, and yes, they are all installed correctly.

Originally Posted by ThreeStripes

Full disclosure that comment is coming from this guy: Re: perception of lag, lets just say your mileage may vary.

Yes, Mr. OCD, and perception is reality. Can't wait for BM3 to hand me more power with the perception of less lag .

Originally Posted by varooshgog

Haha

Regarding lag, the only item in there that I can foresee adding any "noticeable" lag is the CSF intercooler (which is common for larger intercoolers). Everything else in there should actually improve throttle response and reduce turbo lag because it improves flow/efficiency.

I do agree though that this will be more or less noticeable dependent on how you drive your car.

I just expect it to be as good as stock, or better, and it's not.

I think a lot of guys just aren't as perceptive as I am, and that's not a slag, it's just the fact. I think if they'd go drive a stock car back to back with their modified car, and forget what happens after 3500K rpm's, they'd notice as well.

[varooshgog]

Originally Posted by ///MPhatic

I'd do the Fabspeed Sport Cat with a Stage 1 tune. Yes, the lag got worse with all the mods, and yes, they are all installed correctly.



Yes, Mr. OCD, and perception is reality. Can't wait for BM3 to hand me more power with the perception of less lag .



I just expect it to be as good as stock, or better, and it's not.

I think a lot of guys just aren't as perceptive as I am, and that's not a slag, it's just the fact. I think if they'd go drive a stock car back to back with their modified car, and forget what happens after 3500K rpm's, they'd notice as well.

Not arguing with your experiences (your car, driving style, and environment can impact everything), but did you do these mods all at one time or piece by piece? I did mine in phases and felt (not measured) the following impacts to throttle response/lag:

Stage 1

• 200-cell Sport Cat - IMPROVED

Stage 2

• ER Charge Pipe - NEUTRAL
• ER Boost Pipe - NEUTRAL/SLIGHT IMPROVEMENT
• ER Intercooler - WORSE

Stage 3

• TurboSmart DV (Plumb Back) - IMPROVED
• Pure Turbo Inlet - IMPROVED
• VR Intake - NEUTRAL/SLIGHT IMPROVEMENT

[AmuroRay]

Zero Tubolag with my VRSF Race intercooler and I have the lowest IATs out there.

[c0riolis]

Originally Posted by varooshgog

• ER Charge Pipe - NEUTRAL
• ER Boost Pipe - NEUTRAL/SLIGHT IMPROVEMENT
• ER Intercooler - WORSE

How worse was it? I am about to install this exact setup so I can see if I observe the same thing.

Will check if I can find a way to get objective data on this.