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M2 Technical Topics > N55 Engine / Drivetrain / Exhaust / Bolt-ons / Tuning > Bootmod3 Stage 2+ E30 octane maps for N55-M2 are now available!

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      10-15-2020, 08:39 AM   #45
3t3p
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Ok so the sentence content is incorrect, it should read..

The limiting point is the HPFP AND Fuel composition.

Otherwise it reads that for all things being equal, which infers normal pump gas, that what limits the stock turbo is only the HPFP.

Instead of fighting it take it as constructive feedback about correct product statements. Others have agreed similarly so it's not just me
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      10-15-2020, 08:58 AM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3t3p View Post
Ok so the sentence content is incorrect, it should read..

The limiting point is the HPFP AND Fuel composition.

Otherwise it reads that for all things being equal, which infers normal pump gas, that what limits the stock turbo is only the HPFP.

Instead of fighting it take it as constructive feedback about correct product statements. Others have agreed similarly so it's not just me
I’m sure Halim will find more in the Stg 2+ 93 map on the stock turbo, it just won’t be nearly as much as E30 or Race Gas and will still require a HPFP since the Stg 2 93 map is already max’ing out the stock HPFP, so in my book you might as well put some good fuel into the mix to get more power.

I can see how all this could be confusing for anyone new to N55 tuning, but this has been a well developed path over the last several years for anyone that has been paying attention or researched. I think the confusion rests with the minority, but now that this has been aired out, everyone should be on the same page.
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      10-15-2020, 10:29 AM   #47
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Not too sure where the confusion lies with regards too fuel used. The opening sentence states e30, the map is labelled as an e30 map, comparisons were made to the 2h e30 map. Pump fuel for this map doesn’t even come into it.

Glad it’s all sorted though.
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      10-15-2020, 11:16 AM   #48
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I didn't have an issue with the OP, at least not in the last statement I made.I had an issue with zm2 statement of

"In that scenario you would pick up ~25-30whp over the other Stg 2 OTS maps, along with a lot more punch throughout the range, and this map is so much more fun to drive around town."

I'm not saying the statement is incorrect, I don't know, it just doesn't seem to make sense to me.

He is saying you get 25-30hp and more punch throughout the rpm range with the e30 Stg2+ tune, vs the 91, 93, and e30 Stg2 tunes.

And I questioned that because I don't think you are getting 25-30hp more compared to the Stg2 e30 tune. Maybe you are compared to the 93 and 91 tunes, but I'm not sure about the e30 tune.

IIRC the e30 Stg2 tune makes 410-420hp. So a user would have to figure out if adding a new fuel pump is worth another 10-15hp.

And that it's also hard to make that claim and have this argument because no one has tested any of this. zm2, who helped test this, has a non-oem turbo on his car. And the dyno results posted in the op are with a ps2 turbo. All with ethanol.

But, the type of fuel matters. At least to me. Because I only have one e85 pump within at least 100mi of me. So I have to weight the cost/benefits on if the amount of hp is worth swapping to such an inconvenient fuel for me.
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      10-15-2020, 11:23 AM   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anthony1s View Post
But, the type of fuel matters. At least to me. Because I only have one e85 pump within at least 100mi of me. So I have to weight the cost/benefits on if the amount of hp is worth swapping to such an inconvenient fuel for me.
Same here. It's over an hour round trip for me to get E85. I just have a normal 90 map and another for running Boostane.
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      10-15-2020, 11:33 AM   #50
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You are getting 25-30whp over the Stg 2 E30 map with Stg 2+ and the stock turbo. I got 50whp more with my little bit bigger than stock Dinan turbo, so 25-30whp is being pretty conservative. Daleb numbers are as good as mine and he’s stock turbo, but decat, so there are a few variables in play and why 25-30whp is conservative.

You’re also getting a similar jump over the Stg 2 93 map, bc ever since Halim released version 5.8 last year, Stg 2 93 is within spitting distance (5-10whp?) of Stg 2 E30 bc of stock HPFP constraints. Again, this is something that is well known to the BM3 N55 enthusiasts, but not as much to others.

So, nothing I’ve said isn’t correct. And, it’s not just me not being a mind reader and not knowing your knowledge level of BM3 N55 tuning over the years, but it’s just as much as you guys saying something doesn’t make sense instead of researching or asking the right questions. It’s a two way street and I’ve said to ask all the questions you have and they’d get answered by folks familiar with the platform and tune.
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      10-15-2020, 11:35 AM   #51
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cecaa850 View Post
Same here. It's over an hour round trip for me to get E85. I just have a normal 90 map and another for running Boostane.
The upcoming Stg 2+ Race Gas will be of interest for you to try if you’re able to get your octane up in the high 90’s with the Boostane.
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      10-15-2020, 12:37 PM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZM2 View Post
You are getting 25-30whp over the Stg 2 E30 map with Stg 2+ and the stock turbo. I got 50whp more with my little bit bigger than stock Dinan turbo, so 25-30whp is being pretty conservative. Daleb numbers are as good as mine and he’s stock turbo, but decat, so there are a few variables in play and why 25-30whp is conservative.

You’re also getting a similar jump over the Stg 2 93 map, bc ever since Halim released version 5.8 last year, Stg 2 93 is within spitting distance (5-10whp?) of Stg 2 E30 bc of stock HPFP constraints. Again, this is something that is well known to the BM3 N55 enthusiasts, but not as much to others.

So, nothing I’ve said isn’t correct. And, it’s not just me not being a mind reader and not knowing your knowledge level of BM3 N55 tuning over the years, but it’s just as much as you guys saying something doesn’t make sense instead of researching or asking the right questions. It’s a two way street and I’ve said to ask all the questions you have and they’d get answered by folks familiar with the platform and tune.
Thanks for the information 👍, I will wait stage2 + 93map
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      10-15-2020, 12:57 PM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Leonidm2 View Post
Thanks for the information 👍, I will wait stage2 + 93map
Sounds good.

Just to be clear, you will likely need an aftermarket HPFP to run the Stg 2+ 93 map since Stg 2 93 can already crash the HPFP on some cars in cold weather.

But, we’ll wait for Halim to confirm.
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      10-15-2020, 01:06 PM   #54
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I agree in that it would be nice to have some stock turbo dyno figures however I think ZM2’s e30 vs e30+ delta is what we should really be looking at. Granted he has a Dinan turbo, but realistically it’s not going to change the peak figures massively (5/10whp?) especially considering he runs sports cat vs someone on decat for example.

Basically we need some stock turbo figures which I’m sure will come soon now that the OTS is out.

ZM2 admitted himself that his car generally dyno’s low compared to other cars. We normally see 390/400whp on the 93 OTS, I’ve seen anything from 415-430whp on the e30 OTS. I’d personally like to see someone dyno this map on a DJ where our cars make those mentioned numbers.
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      10-15-2020, 01:19 PM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daleb View Post
I agree in that it would be nice to have some stock turbo dyno figures however I think ZM2’s e30 vs e30+ delta is what we should really be looking at. Granted he has a Dinan turbo, but realistically it’s not going to change the peak figures massively (5/10whp?) especially considering he runs sports cat vs someone on decat for example.

Basically we need some stock turbo figures which I’m sure will come soon now that the OTS is out.

ZM2 admitted himself that his car generally dyno’s low compared to other cars. We normally see 390/400whp on the 93 OTS, I’ve seen anything from 415-430whp on the e30 OTS. I’d personally like to see someone dyno this map on a DJ where our cars make those mentioned numbers.
The other thing to consider with those higher Stg 2 E30 dyno numbers, some guys have stronger stock HPFPs and are able to max that map out.

I always had to run E28 or less and couldn’t run the map below 65F, so that’s probably one reason for the big delta bn Stg 2 and Stg 2+ E30 (with Dorch Stage 1) for me.

As Daleb is saying, car specific impact will differ but anyone that is FBO with stock turbo, has an aftermarket HPFP, and access to ethanol will get a pretty nice bump in power from this new map, regardless of what map they were running previously.

Then once you get bored of it, bolt on a larger turbo, reset adaptations, and hold on!
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      10-15-2020, 02:32 PM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZM2 View Post
Sounds good.

Just to be clear, you will likely need an aftermarket HPFP to run the Stg 2+ 93 map since Stg 2 93 can already crash the HPFP on some cars in cold weather.

But, we’ll wait for Halim to confirm.
Yea, I know , thank you!!!��
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      10-15-2020, 02:47 PM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZM2 View Post
The other thing to consider with those higher Stg 2 E30 dyno numbers, some guys have stronger stock HPFPs and are able to max that map out.

I always had to run E28 or less and couldn’t run the map below 65F, so that’s probably one reason for the big delta bn Stg 2 and Stg 2+ E30 (with Dorch Stage 1) for me.

As Daleb is saying, car specific impact will differ but anyone that is FBO with stock turbo, has an aftermarket HPFP, and access to ethanol will get a pretty nice bump in power from this new map, regardless of what map they were running previously.

Then once you get bored of it, bolt on a larger turbo, reset adaptations, and hold on!
This is a good point re the stock HPFP strength, I always ran e20 on that map just to save any hpfp dips. Car still went well.

Taking my 100-200kph data into consideration- On stage 2 e30 I did 9.1 and on E30 stage 2+ I’ve done 7.9, a 1.2 second difference which is massive. Same temp, same road, good DA on both. For reference last year on oem hpfp in almost 0*c my car done 8.7 on 99 Ron pump but running stage 2 racegas map. This e30 stage 2+ map will go quicker in winter.

Can’t beat that performance for a free map!
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      10-15-2020, 10:33 PM   #58
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZM2 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fabre80 View Post
So basically get the stage 2 and call it a day, lol. I will be going Hybrid in a few months but I will be happy with around 500-550hp on the crank really. Is that number achievable with stock turbo?
Definitely not. Add HPFP and this map to get the most you’ll see out of the stock turbo. Add a PS2 or other large turbo with this map to get those kinds of numbers.
Great, I will be getting the stage 1 Dorch then once I add that then all I have to do is change it in the settings and flash it right? I am currently running stage 2 93. I am also full FBO currently minus a few exhaust. I am hoping to gain a little more on the top.

Thanks for the info
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      10-15-2020, 10:39 PM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fabre80 View Post
Great, I will be getting the stage 1 Dorch then once I add that then all I have to do is change it in the settings and flash it right? I am currently running stage 2 93. I am also full FBO currently minus a few exhaust. I am hoping to gain a little more on the top.

Thanks for the info
Yup, that’s right.

However, if you plan to go with one of the larger turbos later like a PS2, I’d recommend a Stage 2 HPFP when running ethanol.

I’m capping my power where it’s at bc my focus is the track, and keeping the car cool becomes the issue vs making big power.
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      10-16-2020, 05:14 AM   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daleb View Post
This is a good point re the stock HPFP strength, I always ran e20 on that map just to save any hpfp dips. Car still went well.

Taking my 100-200kph data into consideration- On stage 2 e30 I did 9.1 and on E30 stage 2+ I’ve done 7.9, a 1.2 second difference which is massive. Same temp, same road, good DA on both. For reference last year on oem hpfp in almost 0*c my car done 8.7 on 99 Ron pump but running stage 2 racegas map. This e30 stage 2+ map will go quicker in winter.

Can’t beat that performance for a free map!
Dale, next is an upgraded turbo. That would make it a complete beast !
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      10-16-2020, 07:54 AM   #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ZM2 View Post
The upcoming Stg 2+ Race Gas will be of interest for you to try if you’re able to get your octane up in the high 90’s with the Boostane.

I don't use BM3 but I appreciate the heads up.
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      10-16-2020, 10:25 AM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Halim@HCP View Post
Dale, next is an upgraded turbo. That would make it a complete beast !
For sure Halim...Let’s see what 2021 brings!

Thanks again for the great support, between this e30+ map and the up coming racegas+ map there’s great options available for the n55 guys now 🙂
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      10-17-2020, 01:47 PM   #63
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Here’s my first log on the OTS map, and in cooler weather with no plug gap issues. All I can say is wow! Incredibly smooth and lots of power!

https://www.bootmod3.net/log?id=5f8b...729b488dc3e100

I’m FBO with the Dinan turbo, which helps more with upper RPM under the curve, and not as much about adding peak power.
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      10-21-2020, 06:16 AM   #64
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Stage 2+ Racegas OTS map is now available per request from users who did not have access to E85.
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      10-21-2020, 07:04 PM   #65
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Halim@HCP - What are your thoughts on running higher ethanol blends on the stock turbo for those that have fuelling systems that support it. Do you feel there's much more power to be had with more timing advancement or E30-40 is the 'sweet spot' for the N55 with stock turbo?
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      10-22-2020, 11:46 AM   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dec540 View Post
Halim@HCP - What are your thoughts on running higher ethanol blends on the stock turbo for those that have fuelling systems that support it. Do you feel there's much more power to be had with more timing advancement or E30-40 is the 'sweet spot' for the N55 with stock turbo?
If stock turbo, going even E30 is more than fine. Sometimes the pumpgas that is used for the blend can be a bad octane, going above 30% is fine. E35-40. Ofcourse on upgraded fuel pump.

Logs are always a great way of figuring it out.
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