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      06-23-2016, 06:35 PM   #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin_NL View Post
It was a DCT and it was 8:01 on slightly (partly) moist surfaces (sportauto carmag)
8:15 for 1M (also sportauto carmag)

Officially 7:58(BMW) but there also was a 7:52 in it, but because, you know the M3/4 canibalism/marketing they (BMW) kept the official NS time at 7:58. Which is an 'easily' reproducable laptime for M2.

BUT 1M is way more connected and involving as a sportscar than any current normal //M car in the lineup incl M2, it's oldskool, and it's not about dragraces. BMW//M is not about dragracing in the first place.

Fun isn't around the bend, fun IS the bend, or something like that...

Cheers
Robin
Not to mention that just the tires alone probably worth 10 seconds.
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      06-24-2016, 04:50 AM   #68
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Yay... Golf clap. Faster but the car just doesn't have the verve/spirit of the 1-Series M.
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      06-24-2016, 06:38 AM   #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Robin_NL View Post
It was a DCT and it was 8:01 on slightly (partly) moist surfaces (sportauto carmag)
8:15 for 1M (also sportauto carmag)

Officially 7:58(BMW) but there also was a 7:52 in it, but because, you know the M3/4 canibalism/marketing they (BMW) kept the official NS time at 7:58. Which is an 'easily' reproducable laptime for M2.
Here's a video of a 7:55 BTG run by a manual M2 in traffic on a partially damp track. I would say that 7:52 is certainly achievable. I never understand why 1M owners get so upset that there are newer, faster cars available. I have no plans to sell my M2, but considering that over here we got a little over 300 1Ms, and you can currently have one for around half of what they sold for new (with very low mileage), I'm kind of glad I don't think it's a hedge against inflation. Used 1Ms were selling for well over MSRP here only a few years ago, but prices have certainly crashed and I've seen a lot more of them come up for sale since the M2 has hit dealerships.
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      06-24-2016, 08:40 AM   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisK
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jklad View Post
Man, people on here truly have no basic knowledge of even the most basic variables that factor into a drag race. This outcome is purely do to lack of driver, and has very little to do with the cars in question. If you swap drivers in those two cars then the m1 would have readily won. At the end of the day though, I say run what you brung, and if you brung a crappy driver, too bad for you.

But, this outcome in no way reflects what a drag race between these two cars in stock form would look like between two equal drivers.

Seriously? First it's 1M not M1, and the M2 is faster (regardless of the video).

Just look at the Nurburgring time, forget a stupid drag race:

M2: 7:58
1M: 8:12
You completely missed my point - this is a drag race video. Different drivers, different outcome. This video is not an accurate representation of how a qtr mile race would go down between these two cars, with equal drivers.

I'm not debating road course performance here. Still, I personally don't consider the m2 much of an upgrade over the 1m, especially once tuned and modded.
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      06-24-2016, 08:44 AM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jklad View Post
Still, I personally don't consider the m2 much of an upgrade over the 1m, especially once tuned and modded.
In terms of sheer excitement whether driving slow or fast, 1M is not to beat, but in terms of performance M2 beats 1M easily in any discipline(roadholding/speed/braking etc), it even beats M3/4 in many real life disciplines....

Cheers
Robin (ex 1M, E90 M3 and E46 M3 )
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      06-24-2016, 11:11 AM   #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ilovewagons View Post
Here's a video of a 7:55 BTG run by a manual M2 in traffic on a partially damp track. I would say that 7:52 is certainly achievable. I never understand why 1M owners get so upset that there are newer, faster cars available. I have no plans to sell my M2, but considering that over here we got a little over 300 1Ms, and you can currently have one for around half of what they sold for new (with very low mileage), I'm kind of glad I don't think it's a hedge against inflation. Used 1Ms were selling for well over MSRP here only a few years ago, but prices have certainly crashed and I've seen a lot more of them come up for sale since the M2 has hit dealerships.
You might want to check your stats.

I currently saw 19 1Ms for sale in Australia on carsales.com.au with the cheapest car at ~$64k and the average price somewhere in the $70s. Very low mileage examples (which you reference) are easily in the $80s. If I researched correctly, 1Ms were just shy of $100k fully loaded in Australia - I can't seem to find any that are close to $50k (which you also referenced), even high mileage examples.

Yes, there are some 1M owners that track their prices like stocks but most just really enjoy the driving engagement they cannot find any most cars these days (especially BMWs). Understanding that Australia, with a population of 23m, got more than 300 1Ms (which means there is a 1M for every 77k people) compared to the North america where population is 320m and only 740 1M (meaning a 1M for every 430k people) - of course demand in Australia is lower and prices are lower - no surprise there
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      06-24-2016, 09:12 PM   #73
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flanast View Post
That tick tick tick sound you hear is the value of the 1M going down fast
That is the funniest thing I've read all day. You do know they only made the 1M for 1 year, right? How exactly is an unlimited production car (M2) going to be worth more than a limited production car (1M) in 10, 15, 20+ years? It won't be.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Haywood View Post
How does the fact that the M2 is faster lower the value of the 1M? A Ford Fiesta ST is probably faster than an e30. I don't think the Ford will ever go for $100k. There were only 800 or so 1M's made. It won't go down in value.
ding ding ding

UR91 (European-spec, LHD): 4,155 produced 3/2011 through 6/2012
UR92 (European-spec, RHD): 1,204 produced 3/2011 through 6/2012
UR93 (North American-spec, LHD): 983 produced 3/2011 through 12/2011
6342 total

M2? To be produced from 2015-2020.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fahrvergnügen View Post
The i3 has all these smoked from 0-30
These two drivers in particular, yes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by doccyber View Post
I never understood the hype about 1M. Funny looking car, funny name b/c couldn't call it M1 and now getting handily beat by M2. Please...
See above, low production number, "one and done" one year, nuff said.

-----

Wow, I haven't missed what still seems to be the typical BMW forum post. "My BMW is better than your BMW because of XYZ" At the end of the day, an M2 will be faster than an 1M, as a purported evolution of the 1M, it has to be, if it were not it would be like an F80 being slower than an e90 M3, it just wouldn't make sense. But the flip side to the coin is the low production volume of the 1M. As I said above 10, 15, 20+ years 1M's will be super rare while M2's will be a dime a dozen. Someone's comparison between an e30 M3 and an e36 M3 is not to far fetched.
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      06-25-2016, 12:42 AM   #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Imola.ZHP View Post
That is the funniest thing I've read all day. You do know they only made the 1M for 1 year, right? How exactly is an unlimited production car (M2) going to be worth more than a limited production car (1M) in 10, 15, 20+ years? It won't be.



ding ding ding

UR91 (European-spec, LHD): 4,155 produced 3/2011 through 6/2012
UR92 (European-spec, RHD): 1,204 produced 3/2011 through 6/2012
UR93 (North American-spec, LHD): 983 produced 3/2011 through 12/2011
6342 total

M2? To be produced from 2015-2020.



These two drivers in particular, yes.



See above, low production number, "one and done" one year, nuff said.

-----

Wow, I haven't missed what still seems to be the typical BMW forum post. "My BMW is better than your BMW because of XYZ" At the end of the day, an M2 will be faster than an 1M, as a purported evolution of the 1M, it has to be, if it were not it would be like an F80 being slower than an e90 M3, it just wouldn't make sense. But the flip side to the coin is the low production volume of the 1M. As I said above 10, 15, 20+ years 1M's will be super rare while M2's will be a dime a dozen. Someone's comparison between an e30 M3 and an e36 M3 is not to far fetched.
And driving a 1M is a blast even at 30 mph. Current M models don't have that. Only when you're going to push them.

But afaik there are est. 20,000 E30 M3s produced through the years, which is not so limited as I was led to believe. E36 M3 in total 35,000?

M2 won't make it to 20,000 not in 20,000 years. Production lines Leipzig and M3/4 which are 'more car' in theory plus 240i etc....

I guess 16,000 maximum from what I read on German forums(insiders or so they say)

Cheers
Robin
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      06-25-2016, 01:15 AM   #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fahrvergnügen View Post
You might want to check your stats.

I currently saw 19 1Ms for sale in Australia on carsales.com.au with the cheapest car at ~$64k and the average price somewhere in the $70s. Very low mileage examples (which you reference) are easily in the $80s. If I researched correctly, 1Ms were just shy of $100k fully loaded in Australia - I can't seem to find any that are close to $50k (which you also referenced), even high mileage examples.
Actual prices were typically a little over $100k, including tax and delivery. I do live here, you know. Here's a 2012 car with 40,000km on the clock for $67,000, close to half of the original purchase price and close to $50k (cheapest is $63k). The $80k cars have been up for sale for ages, with no takers.

What you don't understand is that until recently, they were selling for close to and often above MSRP. The market value for them seems to be descending precipitously and there are a lot more up for sale recently. By Christmas this year, I predict you will be able to get one below $60k, you probably could now, considering I spoke to people who were quite willing to negotiate on their sale price.

By comparison we got a lot more e90 M3s and a comparable car (milage wise, and 1 year older) is going for $82,000. Rarity tends to be a modifier, rather than a predictor of future value.
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      06-25-2016, 07:08 AM   #76
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ilovewagons View Post
Actual prices were typically a little over $100k, including tax and delivery. I do live here, you know. Here's a 2012 car with 40,000km on the clock for $67,000, close to half of the original purchase price and close to $50k (cheapest is $63k). The $80k cars have been up for sale for ages, with no takers.

What you don't understand is that until recently, they were selling for close to and often above MSRP. The market value for them seems to be descending precipitously and there are a lot more up for sale recently. By Christmas this year, I predict you will be able to get one below $60k, you probably could now, considering I spoke to people who were quite willing to negotiate on their sale price.

By comparison we got a lot more e90 M3s and a comparable car (milage wise, and 1 year older) is going for $82,000. Rarity tends to be a modifier, rather than a predictor of future value.
Why include tax and delivery? Nobody includes that stuff when comparing prices since all car purchases have it. I was talking just MSRP. Also, I'm not sure what your point is with your 2012 example... 40000km is not a low mileage car as you previously mentioned and $62k is still more than 20% higher than half of the original price... You make it sound like there are tons of them out there. Seems like you just contradict yourself. Your predictions on future prices are irrelevant too unless you're a professional speculator.
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      06-25-2016, 07:17 AM   #77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SabineBimmer View Post
Yay... Golf clap. Faster but the car just doesn't have the verve/spirit of the 1-Series M.
Can I assume that you've driven both cars?
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      06-26-2016, 09:19 PM   #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OrangeCrush
Quote:
Originally Posted by SabineBimmer View Post
Yay... Golf clap. Faster but the car just doesn't have the verve/spirit of the 1-Series M.
Can I assume that you've driven both cars?
Guilty as charged so good question, I've only driven the 1-Series. That said, the curb appeal is where I'm coming from.
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      06-27-2016, 10:41 AM   #79
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fahrvergnügen View Post
Why include tax and delivery? Nobody includes that stuff when comparing prices since all car purchases have it. I was talking just MSRP. Also, I'm not sure what your point is with your 2012 example... 40000km is not a low mileage car as you previously mentioned and $62k is still more than 20% higher than half of the original price... You make it sound like there are tons of them out there. Seems like you just contradict yourself. Your predictions on future prices are irrelevant too unless you're a professional speculator.
Sorry, let me clarify. In this country (Australia) 1Ms are not unobtanium. There are plenty for sale at the moment, at well under MSRP. I could have had one, and I could get one right now with little trouble. I didn't, and I won't, because a 1M is not as good as an M2. Thus endeth my opinion.
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      06-27-2016, 02:15 PM   #80
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ilovewagons View Post
Sorry, let me clarify. In this country (Australia) 1Ms are not unobtanium. There are plenty for sale at the moment, at well under MSRP. I could have had one, and I could get one right now with little trouble. I didn't, and I won't, because a 1M is not as good as an M2. Thus endeth my opinion.
You might want to re-read our banter, I never doubted that you can't get a 1M relatively easily in Australia... I also never said anything about buying them close to MSRP, but at half of MSRP... Sorry if you can't follow the argument.

Also, you would make a great auto journalist if you were ever to compare the 1M and M2... I mean the 1M is just not as good right?
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      06-27-2016, 07:52 PM   #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fahrvergnügen View Post
I mean the 1M is just not as good right?
No, it isn't. You do realise that auto 'journalism' is opinion, right?
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      06-28-2016, 04:47 AM   #82
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Dont 1M's have thier own forum ?
Im sure lording it over 135's is more fun than poking at M2's
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      06-28-2016, 07:47 AM   #83
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Quote:
Originally Posted by koastal View Post
Dont 1M's have thier own forum ?
Im sure lording it over 135's is more fun than poking at M2's
Scared of a little competition?
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      06-29-2016, 05:09 AM   #84
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fahrvergnügen View Post
Scared of a little competition?
Is the prize in this competition a soothing balm for your incredible butthurt over differences of opinion?
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      06-29-2016, 08:51 PM   #85
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fahrvergnügen View Post
Scared of a little competition?
No

e;g The few i have seen on the track were driven very tentatively, like they were scared of thier cars.

They appear to be very good at quoting positive excerpts from any review written tho

Dont get me wrong i like 1m's they are cute as
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      06-30-2016, 09:46 AM   #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by koastal View Post
No

e;g The few i have seen on the track were driven very tentatively, like they were scared of thier cars.

They appear to be very good at quoting positive excerpts from any review written tho

Dont get me wrong i like 1m's they are cute as
Your sample size doesn't seem to be representative of all owners + you could say that about any car...

1M owners are generally proud of their car from what I have seen, most of them are enthusiasts of some sort. What's wrong with quoting excerpts?

1Ms are frumpy imo, Mini is cute
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      06-30-2016, 09:48 AM   #87
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ilovewagons View Post
Is the prize in this competition a soothing balm for your incredible butthurt over differences of opinion?
Based on your comments, you're the butthurt one... I feel like I annoy you with my comments and I laugh at yours
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      07-02-2016, 05:25 AM   #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by koastal View Post
No

e;g The few i have seen on the track were driven very tentatively, like they were scared of thier cars.

They appear to be very good at quoting positive excerpts from any review written tho

Dont get me wrong i like 1m's they are cute as
Had two turn up at the skidpan event I went to, neither of the owners were willing to drive their cars, just parked them and stood next to them while everyone else (in M3s, 4s, e30s etc.) had a go.
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