[Poochie]

Originally Posted by mothertongue

There is nothing "ultra" about it, that's the non-moot point. Plenty of people have the money it's just an idiotic purchase as far as specs and performance are being communicated.

So why all the bitching about the price and value?

There are tons of vehicles I feel that are overpriced, I don't compare them to my own or I don't lose any sleep over it. It is what it is..

If "Plenty of people have money" then this should be a non-issue and just another purchase decision based on desire, not the dick-measuring contest it has become.

[JCZ5]

Originally Posted by mothertongue

There is nothing "ultra" about it, that's the non-moot point. Plenty of people have the money it's just an idiotic purchase as far as specs and performance are being communicated.

I appreciate your thoughts, this is why I started this thread, just to hear perspective from different enthusiasts.

In my mind, the one thing going for it that the M3CS/M4CS is the manual transmission. BMW have not made a "modern" CS version with a manual. And in the world of driving experience, this is a big deal.

Sure some may argue the bump in HP and carbon bits will not add that much to the experience. But let's see what the people who have the opportunity to drive it say. Most people after driving the M3/4CS said it was much better than the non-CS version.

Last thing I would add, why other vehicles would give you the same driving dynamic and package at $80Kish with an analog approach? I think it fits well into that category

[medphysdave]

If the M2C is ~$63k. How much are folks spending on mperformance exhaust, diffuser, carbon roof, and wheels. My guess is that there is almost $10k in parts/labor being added to some of these cars. Nevermind the carbon hood, trunk, adaptive suspension, tune, seats, marginally nicer interior, and factory warranty.

I'm struggling to see where this is a rip-off if you were interested in these parts on an M2C.

It's certainly not worth it for someone that doesn't see value in a slightly more crisp/refined version of the M2. Same goes for why some folks buy the z06 Corvette, others buy the grandsport, and some are happy with the base z51. I wouldn't consider the z06 folks idiots when the grandsport is almost as good. Or Z06 vs ZR1. Pick your poison.

[chris719]

Originally Posted by medphysdave

If the M2C is ~$63k. How much are folks spending on mperformance exhaust, diffuser, carbon roof, and wheels. My guess is that there is almost $10k in parts/labor being added to some of these cars. Nevermind the carbon hood, trunk, adaptive suspension, tune, seats, marginally nicer interior, and factory warranty.

I'm struggling to see where this is a rip-off if you were interested in these parts on an M2C.

It's certainly not worth it for someone that doesn't see value in a slightly more crisp/refined version of the M2. Same goes for why some folks buy the z06 Corvette, others buy the grandsport, and some are happy with the base z51. I wouldn't consider the z06 folks idiots when the grandsport is almost as good. Or Z06 vs ZR1. Pick your poison.

Not sure the Corvette analogy is a great one.. the GS is not much more than the Z51 and gets actual, tangible performance upgrades, not just tires and trim. The Z06 is a massive leap in performance for a price premium that might be similar to M2C -> M2CS if you keep the trim level low.

[Davil]

So apparently the CS is for an idiot. That's me then. For less than the price of modifying your car to the same spec you get something original from the factory with factory warranty and is actually tested and set up properly.

Disclaimer. I'm a big fan of "unpimp my ride".

Now back to your usual reading about how ugly tiny little entry model Porsches and large throbbing medallion man cars are better than BMW M cars.

[Poochie]

Originally Posted by Davil

So apparently the CS is for an idiot. That's me then. For less than the price of modifying your car to the same spec you get something original from the factory with factory warranty and is actually tested and set up properly.

Disclaimer. I'm a big fan of "unpimp my ride".

Now back to your usual reading about how ugly tiny little entry model Porsches and large throbbing medallion man cars are better than BMW M cars.

Word.. I don't know what's wrong with these people, I'd sell my left nut for a CS.

It looks bitchin' and has a ton of bragging rights.. #Sold

[GimmeanM]

Originally Posted by Poochie

Word.. I don't know what's wrong with these people, I'd sell my left nut for a CS.

It looks bitchin' and has a ton of bragging rights.. #Sold

Haters gotta hate. As said over and over again:
1: it's not light enough? What were you expecting, a whole new car? It's still the F87 chassis. Do you think BMW wants the car to be this heavy? Are other manufacturers also plagued with heavier and heavier vehicles? People complain about it as if BMW is making it heavy by their own volition, and as if BMW "would only do x" then it would be light enough.
2: it's not special enough? Above what has already been added or unique to the car what more would it take to be 'special' enough? Rear seat delete with cage? (Then that's not a CS in the hierarchy) at least offer it with a manual option...oh, wait, they did that.
3: it's too expensive. This is the only valid claim and so far as we know it's only valid for ROW. When the US MSRP comes in in the mid 70's what are people going to complain about then? —->
4: limited production. Yep. This can be valid too.

But overall people should stop shitting on the car to justify that 1, they can't afford it, or 2 they know they won't get an allocation.

It's going to be a mega car!! And price gouging (by BMW or otherwise) and limited supply don't change that.

[AlpsRider]

I think the CS is a valid choice, the price will dictate how valid. It will be less a valid choice for a M2C owner since it's so expensive to change cars. We'll see how good the adaptive suspension is going to be. I have no doubt that it will make the car more liveable around town over pot holes but I'm not sure how much will be gained on the performance end... we'll see.

[F87 Old Guy]

GimmeanM you said it best. Most of us that would like this car will be out when we see the dealer ADM. Dealers are in the business to make money and that’s what they’re going to do on the CS. My guess is this will be a great car and I would like one but I’m not holding my breath to actually getting one at MSRP. As far as the weight of this car, keep in mind this is a street car that must meet government regulations and I’m sure BMW has kept it as light as it can for fuel mileage numbers. Just my .02.

[SilverScotty]

Originally Posted by Davil

So apparently the CS is for an idiot. That's me then. For less than the price of modifying your car to the same spec you get something original from the factory with factory warranty and is actually tested and set up properly.

Disclaimer. I'm a big fan of "unpimp my ride".

Now back to your usual reading about how ugly tiny little entry model Porsches and large throbbing medallion man cars are better than BMW M cars.

Agree. I'd love to have one just for the exclusivity, aside from the fact that the thing looks Bada$$. I might even try to get over to the dealer just to see it in person.

[chmura]

Originally Posted by F87 Old Guy

GimmeanM you said it best. Most of us that would like this car will be out when we see the dealer ADM. Dealers are in the business to make money and that’s what they’re going to do on the CS. My guess is this will be a great car and I would like one but I’m not holding my breath to actually getting one at MSRP. As far as the weight of this car, keep in mind this is a street car that must meet government regulations and I’m sure BMW has kept it as light as it can for fuel mileage numbers. Just my .02.

If this thing costs $85-90k wait for a few months and you will be able to get one UNDER msrp.

[F87 Old Guy]

chmura I really hope you’re right because I just sold my 2017 M2 and I’m just waiting for a new fun car to come my way. If I can get a deal on a CS that would be great but I’m willing to pay MSRP IF I can get one. Time will tell.

[Hegge]

Originally Posted by GimmeanM

Haters gotta hate. As said over and over again:
1: it's not light enough? What were you expecting, a whole new car? It's still the F87 chassis. Do you think BMW wants the car to be this heavy? Are other manufacturers also plagued with heavier and heavier vehicles? People complain about it as if BMW is making it heavy by their own volition, and as if BMW "would only do x" then it would be light enough.
2: it's not special enough? Above what has already been added or unique to the car what more would it take to be 'special' enough? Rear seat delete with cage? (Then that's not a CS in the hierarchy) at least offer it with a manual option...oh, wait, they did that.
3: it's too expensive. This is the only valid claim and so far as we know it's only valid for ROW. When the US MSRP comes in in the mid 70's what are people going to complain about then? —->
4: limited production. Yep. This can be valid too.

But overall people should stop shitting on the car to justify that 1, they can't afford it, or 2 they know they won't get an allocation.

It's going to be a mega car!! And price gouging (by BMW or otherwise) and limited supply don't change that.

Agreed 100%. This is going to be a great car. As for the weight, new 911 carrera S with PDK is nearly 3,400 pounds so all cars weigh more nowadays.

[///AVM]

This thread has gone from “is the M2C a better buy if M2CS limited or too expensive,” to people saying others are idiots, bitchy, haters . . . and the M2CS is too expensive.

I understand passion behind the topic, but I do not think anyone who desires to own a M2CS is an idiot. I am not bitching about anything, as I would own an M2C if I truly preferred it among other options available, and of which I currently own. I do not hate anyone (or the M2CS), but I do really like the M2C. The M2CS is not too expensive for my budget, nor have I ever stated it is ‘too expensive.’ Just like anything else, the M2CS will be worth what someone is willing to pay for it. Not sure if I would or would not have access to a M2CS if I desired to own one?

What I have stated and stand by is that the M2€$ is not a ‘better buy’ than the M2C at the projected $85-90K MRSP. If I wanted to spend $90K on a BMW, I would consider a new 2020 M4 Competition Package a ‘better buy’ than the M2€$. I would not consider the same M4 to be a better buy than the M2C.

///AVM

[JCZ5]

Thank you @///AVM for your perspective. I agree when I started this thread it was not intended to call anyone who wishes to purchase a M2CS as an "idiot". In fact, it's been pretty clear I would like one. However, it is the possibility of me not receiving an allocation that made me rethink what a fantastic value the M2C actually is.

And from that perspective, I wanted to hear thoughts from this wonderful community.

We're all entitled to buy whichever car we desire. Sure, some people may argue it's a waste of money. But waste of money is relative to the individual, and their perceived value.

Just a personal example, I am also a watch lover. Nobody needs a watch, but if I spend 4 to 5 figures on a watch, to a non watch lover, it's an absolute waste of money. But to a watch lover who appreciates the art, craft and mechanics of the piece, it may be money well spent.

[///AVM]

Originally Posted by JCZ5

Thank you @///AVM for your perspective. I agree when I started this thread it was not intended to call anyone who wishes to purchase a M2CS as an "idiot". In fact, it's been pretty clear I would like one. However, it is the possibility of me not receiving an allocation that made me rethink what a fantastic value the M2C actually is.

And from that perspective, I wanted to hear thoughts from this wonderful community.

We're all entitled to buy whichever car we desire. Sure, some people may argue it's a waste of money. But waste of money is relative to the individual, and their perceived value.

Just a personal example, I am also a watch lover. Nobody needs a watch, but if I spend 4 to 5 figures on a watch, to a non watch lover, it's an absolute waste of money. But to a watch lover who appreciates the art, craft and mechanics of the piece, it may be money well spent.

You got it JCZ!

I own an Apple Watch, which I am not even sure qualifies as a watch anymore?

///AVM

[10"]

Originally Posted by chmura

If this thing costs $85-90k wait for a few months and you will be able to get one UNDER msrp.

just like the M3CS....the M4CS....the M4GTS......these will be easily available too. The prices being set by BMW are s simply too high for these cars. Am surprised they are making the same mistakes again.

If the M2CS was $70k there would be a line out the door. $75K they'd sell out. Over $80 becomes a zone of lessened enthusiasm....over $90k becomes an alleyway full of street cats and empty bins.

[chris719]

Originally Posted by 10"

just like the M3CS....the M4CS....the M4GTS......these will be easily available too. The prices being set by BMW are s simply too high for these cars. Am surprised they are making the same mistakes again.

If the M2CS was $70k there would be a line out the door. $75K they'd sell out. Over $80 becomes a zone of lessened enthusiasm....over $90k becomes an alleyway full of street cats and empty bins.

Exactly right.

After thinking about the typical BMW M car release schedule, the best time to buy an M car is 2nd model year of a new platform or the first year of LCI. These late-life models will take an additional depreciation hit once the new M2 on the new chassis comes out.

[MMMBRAP]

Mulligan.

[medphysdave]

I believe it also depends on if you're shopping based upon budget, bargain, or aren't limited.

I suspect that the "not worth it crowd" will be surprised by the reviews when they come out.

There's a YouTube video of a guy comparing the M2CS to the Subaru S209. The viewers get a good view of the M2 interior (I believe the N55 version). That's a very basic looking interior, and imo much improved in the CS. Some of the upgrades seem to be geared towards making the car a nicer place to be every day, and I think that's worth something.

Until the pricing is released we won't know the true premium placed on exclusivity.

[chris719]

Originally Posted by medphysdave

I believe it also depends on if you're shopping based upon budget, bargain, or aren't limited.

I suspect that the "not worth it crowd" will be surprised by the reviews when they come out.

There's a YouTube video of a guy comparing the M2CS to the Subaru S209. The viewers get a good view of the M2 interior (I believe the N55 version). That's a very basic looking interior, and imo much improved in the CS. Some of the upgrades seem to be geared towards making the car a nicer place to be every day, and I think that's worth something.

Until the pricing is released we won't know the true premium placed on exclusivity.

That works for Porsche, but I don’t think there are people willing to pay almost 911 prices for a 2 series. Good car but going to sell very slowly. It’s a CS too, not a CSL.

[GerryM5]

It's a free market with lots of choices. I'm not reading that posters are saying the M2CS is a poor value compare to the M2C. I reading that most posters find the M2C very satisfying. If you want something better you'll pay more. If I see a M2CS, I stop and notice because it's a great rare car. Bravo!